Strength & Conditioning for Runners

Sacksian · 10-04-2015 5:03pm #1

How important is it?

Do you do any?

Bodyweight exercises vs. gym work?

To plank or not to plank? Pilates?

Interested to hear people's thoughts and experiences on S&C - and current regimes.

demfad · 10-04-2015 5:09pm

Sacksian wrote: »

How important is it?

Do you do any?

Bodyweight exercises vs. gym work?

To plank or not to plank? Pilates?

Interested to hear people's thoughts and experiences on S&C - and current regimes.

This is what I'm up to at the moment!

https://www.facebook.com/video.php?v=10153793250791110&pnref=story

Djoucer · 10-04-2015 5:15pm

Seems to be a bit of a debate now about the plank. Interesting post here on why you shouldn't do the plank: mile27.com.au/why-runners-shouldnt-do-the-plank/

I do variations of this: runnersworld.com/race-training/video-general-strength-exercises#1

I find reverse lungs/stabilization lunge, calf lifts, planks, hip flexion stretches and deep squats to be quite beneficial.
Looking at any of the elites,

Sacksian · 10-04-2015 5:30pm

I do all of these quite regularly but I guess I always thought of them as "flexibility", rather than "strength" - not sure why!

Djoucer wrote: »

reverse lungs/stabilization lunge, calf lifts, hip flexion stretches

I really should do them even more often because I spend fairly much the whole day sitting in front of a computer and when I've got a deadline, I can almost feel the impending injuries from my whole posterior chain tightening up as I'm hunched over the laptop!

Anyone got any routines to build into my day?

kal7 · 10-04-2015 6:22pm

I would be an advocate of lunges, with or without weight depending on level.

But sometimes more important work your weak points.

Sole of foot or plantars by crawling along carpet with feet scrunching.

Lateral hip muscles (TFL) by calm exercise or side plank.

low level activation (ie. work at 10%) lower abs work to help posture while running. Roll exercise ball forward and back, lying on back, with calves on ball.

Hope these make sense.

dna_leri · 10-04-2015 6:42pm

How important is it?
Not as important as running but next/best thing. Good for maintaining strength/power as you get older. Helps imbalances and running form and therefore probably helps prevent injury but it's not the magic bullet. Although I have only had one week off injured in last 4 years I think, (touch wood) and that was at a time I had reduced my strength work.

Do you do any?
Yes, weights approx 1 per week - stuff like lunges, squats (incl single leg), deadlifts and some combinations. I have never had an S&C coach so maybe I do some of them wrong. I don't lift more than my own body-weight so no heavy stuff which also reduces injury risk.
I do bodyweight exercises for 15-20 mins 2-3 times per week, based on this
http://www.coachjayjohnson.com/2011/12/strength-training-for-runners-part-1-2/

Bodyweight exercises vs. gym work?
Start with bodyweight, progress to free-weights. I prefer exercises that work on running related muscles so not much bench presses or bicep curls. I think free-weights are more suitable than machines that work on one muscle group only.

To plank or not to plank? Pilates?
No planks or pilates. I stopped doing planks a year or so ago based on stuff I read about their lack of benefit for runners. Don't know enough about Pilates but purely on a time v's benefit, I think I would be better running. I would like to try sometime to find out.

Chivito550 · 10-04-2015 9:25pm

Great discussion to open up, and something that isn't discussed enough on the forum.

Coming from a sprinter point of view I believe strength/gym work to be essential. It helps build up power which can then be used on the track, but also, it helps lower the risk of injury. The track training can be brutal on the body, so having a strong body is of huge importance when trying to undertake this.

But I believe strength training should be part of all runner's routines, not just for sprinters. Every programme will differ depending on the distance being trained for, and depending on the person. But make no mistake, it is an important ingredient for any runner.

Take the 800m to start with. The event is about 30% anaerobic. You need to be fast, and have a certain amount of explosive power to do well in it. Obviously not to the extent of a sprinter, but it is important nonetheless. One of the guys I know from Melbourne trains in the club gym I used to train in. He's in his early 40s now, and is still an absolute beast in the gym, and still runs low to mid 1:50s now. Back in his day he was a 1:47 guy and Australian National Champion. He now coaches Alex Rowe, a 1:44 guy, Australian record holder, the best in the business there, and you can bet your bottom dollar that he is passing on his strength and conditioning wisdom to him. The top 800m guys lift weights, so why should it be any different for those operating at club level and lower?

Further up in distance, you have examples of Mo Farah squatting 200lbs as part of his strength training. If it didn't help him, then I doubt Salazar would be wasting his time having him doing it.

One thing I have noticed among distance runners at a non-elite level is that many just don't treat strength training with the importance it deserves. "I try to do it when I can" and "I'll really try to be better with it going forward" are quite common phrases. Many distance runners just don't understand how important having a strong body is when trying to tackle such arduous training. A change in mindset is needed to treating strength work as a proper part of your training, not as an optional extra, whenever you have time. If done correctly it will hugely reduce the risk of injury.

To get the right strength programme to fit in with your goals and distance, it is best to contact a qualified strength and conditioning coach, preferably one with a background in athletics. It's easy to follow stuff on the internet, but without somebody to test out where your weaknesses are, and having an understanding of the event you are training for, you run the risk of targeting the wrong areas. I generally leave my strength work up to my S&C coach as I wouldn't have a breeze what to do, so it's easier having somebody more knowledgeable to inform you. It costs money, but I believe it is worth it. Better than paying out on physio bills trying to recover from an injury.

It's a pity ecoli doesn't post here as I know him to be a distance runner who places strong importance on the gym, and it would have been good to get his insight on this.

conavitzky · 10-04-2015 10:14pm

On what days should you incorporate strength training? Easy or hard?

Pacing Mule · 10-04-2015 10:19pm

This seems like a perfect thread for my questions.

At DCM last year I shredded both my quads on the downhill section from Castleknock to the park. Bit me badly at the canal up to Walkinstown and almost DNF'd me. Other than doing more MP miles on steep downhills what would be the best excercises I could do to strengthen them up ?

Any good tips / exercises for loosening tight calve muscles ?

pconn062 · 10-04-2015 10:21pm

conavitzky wrote: »

On what days should you incorporate strength training? Easy or hard?

Typically you try to make your hard days hard and easy days easy, so I would usually incorporate strength work into my session days and try to avoid doing it on my recovery days. This may mean you go into some of your sessions a little fatigues, but the body usually adapts to it fairly quickly.

conavitzky · 10-04-2015 10:23pm

pconn062 wrote: »

Typically you try to make your hard days hard and easy days easy, so I would usually incorporate strength work into my session days and try to avoid doing it on my recovery days. This may mean you go into some of your sessions a little fatigues, but the body usually adapts to it fairly quickly.

Cheers p. That's what I was figuring. I imagined if you did them on an easy day that it would leave you fatigued for your sessions.

demfad · 10-04-2015 10:56pm

Chivito550 wrote: »

.....
But I believe strength training should be part of all runner's routines, not just for sprinters. ....

I would agree with all that. I would say that its also an ingredient that is missing with distance coaching here perhaps.

The progression of stability, strenght, ballistics, perhaps on to plyos is something that might indeed benefit distance runners.

(I'd put strenght training as least important there for distance runners)

It must be remembered that improvements in economy become more important relative to improvements in maximum force output as the event distance gets longer.

Improvements in economy from explosive strength training are due to neural adaptations rather than muscle hypertrophy.

So if you wanted to use a form of weight training to improve running economy, you'd be better off replacing squats with rapid leg presses.

For a distance runner wishing to start strenght work a combination of fast leg and calf presses (as demonstrated at the start of that video I linked earlier) and uphill strides could be a good start.

(For fast leg presses I mean 20-100 a set.)

The uphill strides would be 20 x 10-12s up a 2-3% slope with full recovery.
The shallow slope is good as it forces the runner to use good form applicable to the flat.

Steep hill sprints are useful all year round. The effect on stroke volume of the left heart ventricle is very significant. We do a lot of exercise to increase aerobic capabilities in the extremities. But all of these capabilities are governed by the MaxHR and the stroke volume, i.e the amount of blood you can get to these exercising muscles. If the amount of oxygen carrying blood goes up per heart beat, your pace at LT should be faster. The heart is the great limiter and enabler for distance runners.

Hill springing is something that distance runners could also use. Lydiard described a little hill springing being used to transition from the conditioning phase to the hill phase. That's all I would use. A sprinking to mix with the other ingredients.

What strenght work for distance runners?

Id say: Rapid leg/calf presses, functional training (think it involves ballistics), body weight exercises, squat/star/rocket jumps etc, uphill strides, hill springs, hill sprints.

Progress from non running specific to specific over a base phase. Reduce as competition phase nears. Hill strides, hill sprints, various flat strides and drills all year round.

They are all quite do-able exercises. A runner should self check or have themselves checked for stability issues first.

Dubgal72 · 10-04-2015 11:08pm

This is a great thread! Now I just have to synthesise all this information into a programme...

pconn062 · 10-04-2015 11:11pm

As demfad mentioned, if people are interested in self checking themselves (oh matron) for weakness in particular areas then I highly recommend Jay Dicharry's book Anatomy for Runners. IMO it is a must read for understanding how we run, why we get injured and how to fix problem areas.

pconn062 · 11-04-2015 1:25pm

Thought I'd post up a rough outline of what I do. I basically have two different sets that I alternate on different days.

Day 1

Squats w/light weight (2x30 reps)
Single leg squats w/light weight (2x10 on each leg)
Eccentric hamstring Single leg RDL (10 reps per leg)
Anterior tibialis stretch against wall (3x15 reps)
Balance exercises, proprioception on wobble cushion

Day 2

Bridge (2x10)
Single leg bridge (10 reps on each leg)
Plank (4x30 secs)
Side plank (2x30 secs per side)
Balance exercises

Stretching and foam rolling on both days as well.

Even with all that I still get regular injuries!

Started a new programme in the gym yesterday which focuses more on heavier weights with less reps so that might help too.

pconn062 · 11-04-2015 4:47pm

Pacing Mule wrote: »

This seems like a perfect thread for my questions.

At DCM last year I shredded both my quads on the downhill section from Castleknock to the park. Bit me badly at the canal up to Walkinstown and almost DNF'd me. Other than doing more MP miles on steep downhills what would be the best excercises I could do to strengthen them up ?

Any good tips / exercises for loosening tight calve muscles ?

Squats would be really good for strengthening up the quads. Start with just body weight squats, something like 3x15. Then you can up the amount, 3x20, 2x30. Once you get comfortable with that you can add some weight, you can use a backpack with some weight in it if you have no weights. Even start with a kettle bell if you have one. I'm not sure about the PM miles on steep downhills, I imagine that would be very tough on the legs and might be something you want to approach carefully.

As for the calves, I find self massage to be really useful. Basically, in a seated position cross one leg onto the other so that the ankle is resting on the other knee. Then feel down the calf with your fingers and see if you can find any hotspots/tight places. Then dig your fingers in and flex your foot up and down to try and work out the knots. This is quite aggressive but the harder you can do it the better. Also, I find the "stick" to be better than a foam roller so you can try that too. Lightly stretch the calf afterwards and apply ice to any of the points you massaged if necessary.

Chivito550 · 11-04-2015 5:32pm

pconn062 wrote: »

Squats would be really good for strengthening up the quads. Start with just body weight squats, something like 3x15. Then you can up the amount, 3x20, 2x30. Once you get comfortable with that you can add some weight, you can use a backpack with some weight in it if you have no weights. Even start with a kettle bell if you have one. I'm not sure about the PM miles on steep downhills, I imagine that would be very tough on the legs and might be something you want to approach carefully.

As for the calves, I find self massage to be really useful. Basically, in a seated position cross one leg onto the other so that the ankle is resting on the other knee. Then feel down the calf with your fingers and see if you can find any hotspots/tight places. Then dig your fingers in and flex your foot up and down to try and work out the knots. This is quite aggressive but the harder you can do it the better. Also, I find the "stick" to be better than a foam roller so you can try that too. Lightly stretch the calf afterwards and apply ice to any of the points you massaged if necessary.

I'm really not sure about the low weight high reps method. Higher weight, lower reps is more beneficial to a runner.

http://running.competitor.com/2014/04/training/relative-strength-for-distance-runners_68173

ultrapercy · 11-04-2015 5:57pm

Chivito550 wrote: »

I'm really not sure about the low weight high reps method. Higher weight, lower reps is more beneficial to a runner.

http://running.competitor.com/2014/04/training/relative-strength-for-distance-runners_68173

I think this is often misunderstood and the relative nature of heavy is ignored. If you are just starting a weight programme any weight is in fact heavy. For a true beginner weight that you can rep 10 to 12 times is probably heavy enough and any heavier is over taxing a weak frame. The basic principles of exercise apply build slowly and easily and progress at a steady pace over a prolonged period of time. Lifting too heavy a weight leads to bad form and is counter productive. For someone who has a strong background in lifting (such as yourself) high weight low rep is probably most beneficial. This may sound obvious but how often do you see people in gyms lifting too heavy a weight with incorrect form. In fact correct form is very rare.

pconn062 · 11-04-2015 6:00pm

Agree with UP here, I was suggesting bodyweight just to start with as squats done with proper form are difficult enough for a beginner. I only use light weights myself at the minute because that's all I have available. Now that I am starting at the gym I will gradually incorporate higher weights.

dna_leri · 11-04-2015 9:39pm

Nice graphic on a recent study here:

Injury%2BPrevention.png

pconn062 · 11-04-2015 9:57pm

Proprioception is a concept I am really getting interested in. A simple text is stand on one leg with shoes on and if you lose your balance in under a minute you have issues. So basically you practice working first of all with shoes on, then progress to bare feet, again standing on one leg with eyes closed. Then as you get better with this you can introduce a wobble board/cushion. You can also introduce some rotation or single leg squats while your eyes remain closed. Or, with your eyes open get someone to throw a ball to you while in single leg balance.

Ososlo · 11-04-2015 10:04pm

pconn062 wrote: »

Proprioception is a concept I am really getting interested in. A simple text is stand on one leg with shoes on and if you lose your balance in under a minute you have issues. So basically you practice working first of all with shoes on, then progress to bare feet, again standing on one leg with eyes closed. Then as you get better with this you can introduce a wobble board/cushion. You can also introduce some rotation or single leg squats while your eyes remain closed. Or, with your eyes open get someone to throw a ball to you while in single leg balance.

Another good one is to brush your teeth while standing on one foot with your eyes closed. I couldn't do it at all to start with and can now do the whole process no problem without falling over and without getting toothpaste all over the place after a few months of practice! Can be messy to start with!

KillianByrne · 11-04-2015 10:07pm

Ososlo wrote: »

Another good one is to brush your teeth while standing on one foot with your eyes closed. I couldn't do it at all to start with and can now do the whole process no problem without falling over and without getting toothpaste all over the place after a few months of practice! Can be messy to start with!

Challenge accepted!

ultraman1 · 11-04-2015 10:51pm

Ososlo wrote: »

Another good one is to brush your teeth while standing on one foot with your eyes closed. I couldn't do it at all to start with and can now do the whole process no problem without falling over and without getting toothpaste all over the place after a few months of practice! Can be messy to start with!

Save uv no teeth?

Dubgal72 · 11-04-2015 10:55pm

ultraman1 wrote: »

Save uv no teeth?

Do your mascara....

Chivito550 · 12-04-2015 9:04am

pconn062 wrote: »

Agree with UP here, I was suggesting bodyweight just to start with as squats done with proper form are difficult enough for a beginner. I only use light weights myself at the minute because that's all I have available. Now that I am starting at the gym I will gradually incorporate higher weights.

Oh absolutely. I wasn't suggesting heavy weights right away. It's the 2 sets of 30 reps I was disagreeing with. Far too many reps.

pconn062 · 21-12-2015 4:31pm

http://www.runnersworld.com/workouts/nikes-strength-workout-for-runners

Good link here to a strength routine from Bowerman Track Club S+C coach, Pascal Dowber. Seen a lot of talk on the goals thread about strength and conditioning and this seems like a good plan for people to start with as it requires no special equipment or a gym.

pconn062 · 21-12-2015 4:48pm

pconn062 wrote: »

Thought I'd post up a rough outline of what I do. I basically have two different sets that I alternate on different days.

Day 1

Squats w/light weight (2x30 reps)
Single leg squats w/light weight (2x10 on each leg)
Eccentric hamstring Single leg RDL (10 reps per leg)
Anterior tibialis stretch against wall (3x15 reps)
Balance exercises, proprioception on wobble cushion

Day 2

Bridge (2x10)
Single leg bridge (10 reps on each leg)
Plank (4x30 secs)
Side plank (2x30 secs per side)
Balance exercises

Stretching and foam rolling on both days as well.

Even with all that I still get regular injuries!

Started a new programme in the gym yesterday which focuses more on heavier weights with less reps so that might help too.

Just reading back on some of the old posts in this thread and I seen my own S+C plan posted from April. Soon after that I did a 3 session course with Colin Griffin in the SSC about strength and conditioning and got a plan put together. Seen as I'm not running at the minute and I have lots of time to think about these things I thought I would post my current plan. This plan was put together for me based on tests we did to determine my specific weak areas (adductors, weak lateral hip stabilisers). The weights posted are current and were less when I started.

Warm up (movement)

Theraband side-step: 2x20 steps
Theraband hip rotation: 2x10 reps
Hip flexor holds: 5x5 secs per leg
Single leg balance reaches: 2x6 per leg
Penguin Steps: 2x20 steps
Clam Shells with theraband: 2x15 per leg
Side lying leg raises w/theraband: 2x15 per leg
Hip hikes: 2x25 per leg

Main session

Goblet squats: 3x8 @ 20kg
Deadlift: 3x4 @ 60kg, 1x4 @ 65kg
Squats: 1x@ 30kg, 2x6 @ 35kg
Step up: 2x6 per leg with Olympic bar
RDL: 2x6 per leg with 15kg
Isometric Quad Hold: 4x10 secs per leg, 20kg
Calf raises on leg press machine: 4x8 per leg @ 30-40kg

Looks like a lot but it only takes about an hour to do. I also do the "Warm up" part at home maybe one other day a week. I was only doing it one day a week, but since I got injured I have been doing it twice a week and have noticed some improvement (although injury is still present). Will know when I get back running if it has helped.

happygoose · 21-12-2015 5:18pm

You can't beat a good Yann Le Meur infographic. He has some great material on the importance of S&C in all sports and a lot of it refers specifically to athletics.

S&C seems to be overlooked by a lot on here. I think there's a fear factor and the thought that it's something that'll be hard to get into, easy to get wrong, something for track and field, something that'll lead to weight gains, something that'll get people injured. It's actually easy to get into and easy to make progress in. You'd need the help and advice of a proper S&C coach though, ideally one who knows athletics and is aware of your goals, one that can spend an hour a month with you addressing technique and spotting weaknesses etc.

A good S&C coach will:

1. Assess functional movement and prescribe some stretching and some movements that will address weaknesses.
2. Carry out some one rep max testing every 8 weeks.
3. Prescribe a periodised programme based on the goals of the individual.

A typical programme will have two different sessions a week.

A periodised programme will consist of -
An anatomical adaptation phase, where you become generally conditioned (maybe 8 exercises per session (16 in total during the week), 3 sets, 10-12 reps at 50-60% 1RM).
A strength phase (6 exercises per session, 3 sets, 5-6 reps at 75%-90% 1RM)
A power phase will more exercises of lesser weights, which coincides with the competition period.

IvoryTower · 21-12-2015 5:57pm

I do my own thing once a week based on a mix of what the internet tells me and exercises I like doing. I always do the leg part, the rest depends on how much time and energy I have

Legs:
Jumping squats &/or weighted Squats
Lunges
Romanian deadlift
calf raises

Core:
Hanging Legs raise, planks, sit ups

Upper body:
pulls ups, press ups, shoulder press, dips

Timmaay · 21-12-2015 6:14pm

S&C is something I've started to take a lot more seriously here, I've got a basic enough session here once a week at the second, some very useful info on this thread that I'll have to read in depth over Xmas!

Lougheee · 21-12-2015 11:05pm

happygoose wrote: »

S&C seems to be overlooked by a lot on here. I think there's a fear factor and the thought that it's something that'll be hard to get into, easy to get wrong, something for track and field, something that'll lead to weight gains, something that'll get people injured. It's actually easy to get into and easy to make progress in. You'd need the help and advice of a proper S&C coach though, ideally one who knows athletics and is aware of your goals, one that can spend an hour a month with you addressing technique and spotting weaknesses etc.

Nice post HG. I have pigeonholed myself as a distance runner who just runs distance. You can become set in your ways. I agree with what you say about how easy it can be to progress at first because a lot of us are starting from scratch. So literally anything I do in the gym is an improvement on the nothing I have been doing all year. Introducing a new component to your training regimen takes a bit of effort, but the excitement drawn from making those gains is great fuel for the fire.

I've done a lot of swimming this year. One thing I've learned is you can get hooked on making those little improvements week on week. I would be giddy driving home from swimming after setting a big PB in training. If I can get that feeling with the gym I know I'll keep coming back. Not sure if that is completely applicable to S&C but that's what I'm trying to tell myself as strength work in the gym is probably where I could make the biggest improvement with the least effort, if I bothered to address them. 'My ambition is handicapped by laziness.'

pconn062 · 22-12-2015 10:34am

Lougheee wrote: »

Nice post HG. I have pigeonholed myself as a distance runner who just runs distance. You can become set in your ways. I agree with what you say about how easy it can be to progress at first because a lot of us are starting from scratch. So literally anything I do in the gym is an improvement on the nothing I have been doing all year. Introducing a new component to your training regimen takes a bit of effort, but the excitement drawn from making those gains is great fuel for the fire.

I've done a lot of swimming this year. One thing I've learned is you can get hooked on making those little improvements week on week. I would be giddy driving home from swimming after setting a big PB in training. If I can get that feeling with the gym I know I'll keep coming back. Not sure if that is completely applicable to S&C but that's what I'm trying to tell myself as strength work in the gym is probably where I could make the biggest improvement with the least effort, if I bothered to address them. 'My ambition is handicapped by laziness.'

That's a great point, and it's one of the things that has kept me at the gym. Runners are competitive and need targets and goals, so it's things like lifting weights PB's that keep me going.

DubOnHoliday · 22-12-2015 11:17am

This is a very good thread. Over the last few months I've developed a big imbalance in my core. One side being much strong than the other resulting in sevaral issues on the weaker side, namely OP and ITB. I've started a gym programme to build back up the strength which I'd largely overlooked after taking up running. Hopefully it won't take to long to sort myself out.

colossus-x · 22-12-2015 7:32pm

Been doing squats for bodybuilding purposes consistently for the last almost 2 years when I would have been running longer than that. Last few months I defiantly feel more power in my legs and my overall running performance. It takes a long time to build significant muscle/strength so it will take quite a while to feel the benefits but they do come afaic.

Timmaay · 23-12-2015 1:22am

http://www.flotrack.org/article/21661-to-make-it-to-the-next-level-strength-training-is-a-must

Myles Splitz · 24-12-2015 2:17pm

A Great thread can't believe I missed it first time around.

I think one of the biggest issues here is that Strength and conditioning is too broad a term and as such is interpreted differently by individuals.

I think this needs to be broken down into following

1) Flexibility and mobility. Core, injury prevention etc is often what people associate with the term

2) Strength (again broken into different parts)
- Anatomical Adaptation
- Hypertrophy
- Max Strength (Force Production)

UP, HG and Chivito all made valid points about different aspects of training. I would even suggest that HG's point about anatomical adaptation even be taken further with a phase of lighter higher rep ranges before the more traditional hypertrophy phase he has mentioned.

For people relatively new to this style of work - Maximise functional range of movement - create muscle mass - Force production (power), you can't have full benefits without all three aspects.

Lastly as demfad mentioned explosive power is just as important. Plyometrics, Complex Training (combination of Power and velocity movements) High Velocity Olympic lifts etc can yield huge benefits coverting power developed from the strength training into tangible performance enhancers

Definitely think that some elements that people often forget about with weight training aside from the injury prevention element.

- Hypertrophy type training can help develop glyocgen stores - increased muscle mass can increase storage capabilities (within reason). This if nothing else should be of interest to Marathon and Half Marathon runners.

- Not all strength training is working on fast twitch. Heavy lifting can be important for fibre recruitment (in particular type II fibres and type IIa) however high rep ranges can help in developing fatigue resistance characteristics which can help develop type one fibre capabilities.

- Running economy can be developed which can yield huge benefits in energy expenditure.

Bottom line is that S & C is just as important an aspect to training as running and if it is incorporated correctly it can yield much higher returns than an extra 45-60 min run as long as the running overall is not being ignored.

pc11 · 25-12-2015 2:10pm

I can't add much to what's been said except:

strength training is very important, particularly as we get older.it maintains muscle mass and balance which are vital. It helps with muscle imbalance, injury prevention, rehab and just running faster.
Don't be afraid to build up steadily to fairly heavy weights. Faffing around wiht little dumbells is a wast of time. Key is to build up carefully.
Don't forget unilateral exercises - squats are superb but don't forget to do lunges and step ups also.
As a general principle, don't be afraid to do intense training. Too many of us, especially older runners and women, just never do intense work, whether it's weights or sprints or intervals. This is a mistake. Once or twice a week, do something hard.
It's worth getting some advice or coaching to do it right. A good physio, personal trainer or coach will get you started.
Take your time, be patient, think long term.

pconn062 · 04-01-2016 6:15pm

Re-reading Magness's Science of Running at the minute and he has a healthy section dedicated to strength training. Regarding reps/weights he says

....start with the complete opposite, higher weight-low reps. The reason is that when lifting heavy for only 1-6 reps, the enhancements in strength are almost entirely neural. The heavy weight challenges the nervous system without having a high total volume to elicit enough of a protein response to trigger changes in muscle size. Therefore, heavy training with low reps is the way to go for neurally induced gains in strength and muscle fiber recruitment.

Essentially, runners (especially long distance runners) are always afraid that lifting heavy weights will cause them to gain weight, but if the reps are kept low there is not enough stimulus to encourage actual changes in the muscle size but strength gains can still be made through changes to the neural response.
It should be said that Magness advises a period of just bodyweight exercises before starting heavy lifting to make sure the body is adapted to some strength work and to ensure correct form is used.

He also has a periodisation plan of how strength training should be incorporated throughout the season. Heavy training like above (deadlifts, lunges, squats) are done in base phase. Then the focus is shifted to power training. These exercises focus on movements that are similar to running, and are not to be confused with plyometrics. He says

The difference is that power training is concerned with a single explosive movement followed by a brief period of rest and then repeating the explosive movement. On the other hand, plyometrics consist of a series of movements one after another with the goal of minimizing the time spent on the ground.

Power training exercises include squat jumps, split jump squats, box jumps and standing long jumps. Also, very steep hill sprints.

Plyo's then are used to improve the shortening of ground contact time and elastic energy storage and release. Examples include single and double support hops or sprinting.

His overall plan for the season looks something like this:

Phase|Main strength workout|Outside strength work
Introduction|Movement based, general strength. Establish balance and movement patterns|
Base|2 days per week of: 2 sets of 4-5 reps progressing w/full rest between full squats and cleans|Hill Sprints
Pre-competition|1-2 days per week of: 2 sets of 6-10 reps of the following-Squat jumps external weight =30% bodyweight, standing long jump (holding dumbells 20% B/W), box jump (weight 10-15% B/W) w/30-90 secs rec, 3-4 mins between sets|Flat sprints and strength endurance circuits
Late Pre-comp|Bodyweight only one day per week of: 1 set of 6-10 reps of standing long jump, box jump for height, single leg squat jump. And 1 set of 5 reps for two plyo exercises (double leg hops, double leg tuck jumps| Flat sprints and high intensity strength endurance circuits
Competition|1 day per week of 1 set of 6-8 reps of 3 plyo exercises: double leg hops, single leg hops, bounding|Specific strength endurance, sprints
Peaking|None or maintenance|Hill sprints/flat sprints for maintenance

Just thought it might be of interest to some.

DubOnHoliday · 06-01-2016 11:29am

Question: If I do a gym session where I do a lot of leg resitence, lets say an 80 min session where I include a cross trainer to break up my sets. Should I forget running that day? Note, I'm on a recovery road (from ITB) so I have to set some perspective there.

pconn062 · 06-01-2016 11:50am

DubOnHoliday wrote: »

Question: If I do a gym session where I do a lot of leg resitence, lets say an 80 min session where I include a cross trainer to break up my sets. Should I forget running that day? Note, I'm on a recovery road (from ITB) so I have to set some perspective there.

In my opinion I would say Yes, for now anyway. That is quite a long session and is putting a lot of stress on the legs. General advice (when not recovering from injury) would be to keep your hard days hard so some coaches would advise doing hard running sessions and gym sessions on the same day, which leaves your easy/recovery days VERY easy. However, in my experience I can't handle that so I do my gym days on easy running days and don't go overboard with the intensity (especially on the run).

HelenAnne · 07-01-2016 3:27pm

I went back to Pilates yesterday after a two-week Xmas break. I definitely feel it in my core today

. Of course I'd said I'd keep it up over the break, but apart from a bit of stretching etc and a few half-hearted push ups, I didn't really. I never push myself as hard at home alone anyway as I do in class, so I'm definitely going to keep it up for 2016.

(I know Pilates doesn't sound as hard as lifting huge weights etc, but I find it pretty tough!)

IvoryTower · 14-01-2016 5:27pm

According to magness, would 2 weeks be pre-competition time? or late pre-competition? I'm doing my first race at the end of the month(I think), should I leave out heavier stuff for jumping squats etc?

it's a pity really cause I'm only getting going!

pconn062 · 14-01-2016 10:50pm

IvoryTower wrote: »

According to magness, would 2 weeks be pre-competition time? or late pre-competition? I'm doing my first race at the end of the month(I think), should I leave out heavier stuff for jumping squats etc?

it's a pity really cause I'm only getting going!

It really depends how long your season is going to be. If you were only going to do a few indoor races then I wouldn't make any drastic changes to your S+C plan, apart from not doing any leg work a few days before the race. Indoor season is usually very short so I would just stick with my normal plan and then aim to periodise it a little more for outdoor season, which is much longer.

rom · 15-01-2016 1:53am

Personally running is a hobby. I like it. I don't like gym work. I did do it a few years back with a 1 to 1 coach twice a week for 6 weeks and it made a huge difference and still have the plan but I hated it. tbh I am going to take up swimming shortly for this reason. I believe Krusty does climbing to build core but again if its something you enjoy then you don't mind doing it.

Chivito550 · 15-01-2016 12:06pm

IvoryTower wrote: »

According to magness, would 2 weeks be pre-competition time? or late pre-competition? I'm doing my first race at the end of the month(I think), should I leave out heavier stuff for jumping squats etc?

it's a pity really cause I'm only getting going!

I'd always do weights on a Monday and Thursday. If the race was on a Saturday I'd do maybe one less set of each leg exercise on the Thursday (but don't drop the weight). If the race was on a Sunday, you could get away with doing the full session. When I was in Australia I'd do my gym work on Monday and Wednesday, and I never adjusted my Wednesday gym session for a Saturday race.

My coach in Melbourne told me that I can't be freshening up for every race. Some races you just have to train through.

The more important races I ease back on the gym work a small bit.

Myles Splitz · 15-01-2016 12:09pm

IvoryTower wrote: »

According to magness, would 2 weeks be pre-competition time? or late pre-competition? I'm doing my first race at the end of the month(I think), should I leave out heavier stuff for jumping squats etc?

it's a pity really cause I'm only getting going!

pconn062 wrote: »

It really depends how long your season is going to be. If you were only going to do a few indoor races then I wouldn't make any drastic changes to your S+C plan, apart from not doing any leg work a few days before the race. Indoor season is usually very short so I would just stick with my normal plan and then aim to periodise it a little more for outdoor season, which is much longer.

Personally I would be inclined to agree with pconn to an extent here.

I would say continue your usual routine but I would decrease the weight on reps, opt for a deloading day where you focus on form instead.

Chivito550 · 15-01-2016 12:11pm

Myles Splitz wrote: »

Personally I would be inclined to agree with pconn to an extent here.

I would say continue your usual routine but I would decrease the weight on reps, opt for a deloading day where you focus on form instead.

Advice I've usually been given has been to never decrease the weight. Keep the intensity, just do less sets. Might be different for a distance runner, but that's what both my previous S&C coaches would tell me.

happygoose · 15-01-2016 12:16pm

http://ylmsportscience.blogspot.ie/2015/05/runners-never-stop-strength-training.html

Myles Splitz · 15-01-2016 12:29pm

Chivito550 wrote: »

Advice I've usually been given has been to never decrease the weight. Keep the intensity, just do less sets. Might be different for a distance runner, but that's what both my previous S&C coaches would tell me.

With sprinters usually that would be the more favorable approach no doubt especially for the more power based (100/200 especially) given the high rep low weight nature of it however given IT's winter background with cross country and the more middle distance sessions (I know he has since changed approach but the athlete background still applies given his previous XC training and the middle distance style sessions he had been doing (5x800 etc) )

Neither is wrong but my personal opinion would be the former in this incidence would yield better feeling of recovery at the moment with the Less volume approach working better in the summer race period.

carlaboi · 17-01-2016 8:07pm

Can anyone recommend a good S&C coach please? Need someone to guide me!

Strength & Conditioning for Runners

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