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Oliver Reed

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2

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    #32
    porsche959
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,499 ✭✭✭porsche959


    Saipanne wrote: »
    If the mirror said you were a paedophile, you'd probably doubt yourself.
    Saipanne wrote: »
    Of course the IRA never committed such acts.

    Ahem.

    :) If the Sindo said...etc, etc.


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    #33
    Saipanne
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,882 ✭✭✭Saipanne


    porsche959 wrote: »
    :) If the Sindo said...etc, etc.

    Its the mirror. The mirror.


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    #34
    porsche959
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,499 ✭✭✭porsche959


    Saipanne wrote: »
    Its the mirror. The mirror.

    What of it? You realise one of the writers is the guy that did the Savile expose for ITV?

    I know it's a tabloid but it's not in the Sunday Sport mode.


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    #35
    KungPao
    Registered Users Posts: 4,781 ✭✭✭KungPao


    porsche959 wrote: »
    That might be the definition, but in common parlance today it is used for attraction to anyone under AOC.
    Still, it doesn't make it right.


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    #36
    The Diabolical Monocle
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 2,618 ✭✭✭The Diabolical Monocle


    You don't unmask anyone who's alleged.


    Trial by media bull****.




    allegation doesn't equal guilty.


    unless your a tabloid (alleged) scumbag.


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    #37
    porsche959
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,499 ✭✭✭porsche959


    KungPao wrote: »
    Still, it doesn't make it right.

    Words change their meaning over time.

    Jimmy Savile is commonly spoken of as a peadophile, but in reality he was probably a predatory ebebophile, as most of his alleged victims were well over 12, on average round 16 I think.

    But bottom line, if it's true that Reed was paying 15 year old prostitutes when in his fifties, I think most people would regard that as immoral and certainly it was and still is illegal.


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    #38
    FloatingVoter
    Registered Users Posts: 6,133 ✭✭✭FloatingVoter


    porsche959 wrote: »
    I truly doubt that he was targetted specifically because of these allegations. I'd say they got lucky. He was lax about his personal security because he believed he got on well with locals and would not be targetted.

    Yeah, getting the PIRA, the Guards and the British establishment to agree on the time of day is hard but that is the truth - a high profile "target" in an easily accessible place at a predictable time (same time every year...Classiebawn). Don't believe a randomer on the net, pop down to Mullaghmore yourself and ask any local over the age of 50.
    The fact Mountbatten was sympathetic towards a united Ireland at the height of the 1970s came out later. If they hadn't blown him up, those high value connections of his might have been part of ending the violence up north a good ten years earlier.....instead the IRA got bad publicity worldwide.


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    #39
    Saipanne
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,882 ✭✭✭Saipanne


    porsche959 wrote: »
    What of it?

    Never mind. Here's another sterling periodical.

    COVER_BF_love-slave.jpg


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    #40
    jungleman
    Closed Accounts Posts: 803 ✭✭✭jungleman


    porsche959 wrote: »
    I truly doubt that he was targetted specifically because of these allegations. I'd say they got lucky. He was lax about his personal security because he believed he got on well with locals and would not be targetted.

    I've heard from a few different people that the alleged activities were behind his death. I've heard a few other things about it too that are definitely unrepeatable, especially on a public forum. It could all be a load of bull, not denying that, I'm just saying what I've heard.


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    #41
    porsche959
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,499 ✭✭✭porsche959


    Saipanne wrote: »
    Never mind. Here's another sterling periodical.

    Blocked. Good luck.


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    #42
    Littlekittylou
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,357 ✭✭✭Littlekittylou


    FloatingVoter wrote: »
    The shock revelation that Oliver Reed may have been sighted in a brothel with a 15 year old girl.
    Is this the same upstanding gent who flashed his upstanding member on national TV any chance he got ?
    Pissed on bar counters when no ashtrays were to hand ?
    Dry humped Susan George live on the Late Late Show ?

    I am stunned at this display of bad manners and degeneracy. Ollie probably was too when he sobered up.
    He was lauded and applauded as a drunk baffoon. There are a lot of lindsay lohan's and Brittany Spears now who don't realize they are clowns for the media

    Awful story.


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    #43
    KungPao
    Registered Users Posts: 4,781 ✭✭✭KungPao


    porsche959 wrote: »
    Words change their meaning over time.

    Jimmy Savile is commonly spoken of as a peadophile, but in reality he was probably a predatory ebebophile, as most of his alleged victims were well over 12, on average round 16 I think.
    I don't think the word has changed meaning for most people.

    It is what it is.

    Let's be honest, there is a world of difference to say, molesting a 1 year old and having sex with a 15/16 year old.


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    #44
    Saipanne
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,882 ✭✭✭Saipanne


    porsche959 wrote: »
    Blocked. Good luck.

    Awww, Porsche...


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    #45
    porsche959
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,499 ✭✭✭porsche959


    KungPao wrote: »
    I don't think the word has changed meaning for most people.

    It is what it is.

    Look at a smattering of articles or even social media posts about Savile, then look at age profile of his alleged victims, and tell me the word hasn't gradually changed meaning in eyes of media/general public.

    KungPao wrote: »
    Let's be honest, there is a world of difference to say, molesting a 1 year old and having sex with a 15/16 year old.

    Of course, but equally there is world of difference to having sex with a 15, or say a 30 year old prostitute.

    I find the choice of wording here - "having sex with a 15/16 year old" - somewhat troubling, as we are talking about an allegation (unproven, granted) of committing an offense against a minor, and one likely, statistically, to come from a troubled background and to be a vulnerable person.


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    #46
    FloatingVoter
    Registered Users Posts: 6,133 ✭✭✭FloatingVoter


    I'm not defending Reed here. But walking into a brothel and having sex with a seemingly consenting "overage" 15 year old is one situation. One a man of Reed's profile should never have gotten into, no matter how drunk he was or wasn't.
    Visiting a hospital and raping a patient whatever their age is quite another.
    On those simple grounds alone Reed and Savile differ.


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    #47
    Saipanne
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,882 ✭✭✭Saipanne


    FloatingVoter wrote: »
    I'm not defending Reed here. But walking into a brothel and having sex with a seemingly consenting "overage" 15 year old is one situation. One a man of Reed's profile should never have gotten into, no matter how drunk he was or wasn't.
    Visiting a hospital and raping a patient whatever their age is quite another.
    On those simple grounds alone Reed and Savile differ.

    Some would disagree. Eh, Porsche?


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    #48
    porsche959
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,499 ✭✭✭porsche959


    FloatingVoter wrote: »
    I'm not defending Reed here. But walking into a brothel and having sex with a seemingly consenting "overage" 15 year old is one situation. One a man of Reed's profile should never have gotten into, no matter how drunk he was or wasn't.
    Visiting a hospital and raping a patient whatever their age is quite another.
    On those simple grounds alone Reed and Savile differ.

    I take your point but I believe all of these factors are taken into account in sentencing guidelines. I am still troubled by use of phrases like 'consenting' and 'overage' in respect of a fifteen year old prostitute. I assume when you say 'overage' you mean someone that looked overage? Fair enough, that's a possibility. But under the eyes of the law, statutory rape would apply here, if allegation is true.


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    #49
    FloatingVoter
    Registered Users Posts: 6,133 ✭✭✭FloatingVoter


    porsche959 wrote: »
    I take your point but I believe all of these factors are taken into account in sentencing guidelines. I am still troubled by use of phrases like 'consenting' and 'overage' in respect of a fifteen year old prostitute. I assume when you say 'overage' you mean someone that looked overage? Fair enough, that's a possibility. But under the eyes of the law, statutory rape would apply here, if allegation is true.

    True, that's what I meant when I said Reed should have known better. A professional actor with his talents / experience might be expected to know that people in brothels are inclined to tell lies.
    My point is, strolling into a hospital (sometimes mental institutions of which you're a patron), and raping patients is in another field of morality altogether.
    The lawyers can crunch laws and phrases - I'll stick with a situation I could understand someone for being in and a deed for which I'd happily kill the perpetrator.


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    #50
    porsche959
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,499 ✭✭✭porsche959


    FloatingVoter wrote: »
    True, that's what I meant when I said Reed should have known better. A professional actor with his talents / experience might be expected to know that people in brothels are inclined to tell lies.
    My point is, strolling into a hospital (sometimes mental institutions of which you're a patron), and raping patients is in another field of morality altogether.
    The lawyers can crunch laws and phrases - I'll stick with a situation I could understand someone for being in and a deed for which I'd happily kill the perpetrator.

    I agree, and certainly wasn't attempting to argue to the contrary. I only brought Savile into the discussion because another poster was talking about how the allegation against Reed wouldn't suggest he was a paedophile, given the girl was allegedly 15. But Savile was possibly also not a peadophile but an ebebophile of a particularly pedatory nature - something approaching a psychopath, perhaps.


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    #51
    DEFTLEFTHAND
    Registered Users Posts: 16,500 ✭✭✭✭DEFTLEFTHAND


    Ollie would be boozed up in these situations, not a good man to make a judgement call on age I'd imagine. If 16 is the age of consent its reality that many 15 year olds will pass for it.

    Reed was different to any vanilla celeb around today, his world was full of excess and madness, the guy allegedly swung both ways and lived it up every way imaginable. I don't believe the guy was a dirty nonce.


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    #52
    FloatingVoter
    Registered Users Posts: 6,133 ✭✭✭FloatingVoter


    porsche959 wrote: »
    I agree, and certainly wasn't attempting to argue to the contrary. I only brought Savile into the discussion because another poster was talking about how the allegation against Reed wouldn't suggest he was a paedophile, given the girl was allegedly 15. But Savile was possibly also not a peadophile but an ebebophile of a particularly pedatory nature - something approaching a psychopath, perhaps.

    Savile is in the same locked room as Hitler or Stalin in terms of psychopathy. Power based, sex mad, evil. They don't have the box to put him in. In internet terms, all three have become "as bad as..." stereotypes. In truth, Hitler and Stalin committed mass murder across continents and are black and white bad guys to a modern audience. Savile was in our living rooms making wishes come true. He truly is "the ghost in the wardrobe".
    Most of us weren't abused by a priest but most of us watched a few episodes of "Jim'll Fix It". As someone said above, Ollie Reed was a drunken buffoon. I'll meet five of them before the week is out.


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    #53
    Nodin
    Closed Accounts Posts: 46,938 ✭✭✭✭Nodin


    porsche959 wrote: »
    is the latest celeb alleged paedo to be unmasked. :(

    http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/ex-cop-claims-royal-paedophile-ring-5379159#ICID=sharebar_twitter


    It's the mirror. I'll bide me time waiting for a news source to report on it.


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    #54
    Buona Fortuna
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,507 ✭✭✭Buona Fortuna


    KungPao wrote: »
    15.

    Isn't the definition of paedophilia the sexual attraction to pre-pubescents?
    porsche959 wrote: »
    That might be the definition, but in common parlance today it is used for attraction to anyone under AOC.

    And by going along with the common parlance do we not reduce the rightful stigma against paedophiles?

    The AOC in Spain used to be 13. If Mr Reed was still alive, he could almost have claimed a navigation error.

    I think the media do a huge disservice to victims by lumping in AOC offenders with paedophiles.


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    #55
    Saipanne
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,882 ✭✭✭Saipanne


    Nodin wrote: »
    It's the mirror. I'll bide me time waiting for a news source to report on it.

    Oh, you'll be blocked for that.


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    #56
    porsche959
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,499 ✭✭✭porsche959


    Buona Fortuna wrote: »
    And by going along with the common parlance do we not reduce the rightful stigma against paedophiles?

    The AOC in Spain used to be 13. If Mr Reed was still alive, he could almost have claimed a navigation error.

    I think the media do a huge disservice to victims by lumping in AOC offenders with paedophiles.

    Possibly the French system makes the most sense, AOC of 15 but:-

    " Article 227-27 prohibits sexual relations with minors over age 15 (aged 15, 16 or 17) " 1° where they are committed by an ascendant or by any other person having authority over the victim; 2° where they are committed by a person abusing the authority conferred by his functions."[27]"

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ages_of_consent_in_Europe#France

    Remember the recent case where the English teacher was extradited from France, he had relations with a 15 year old which would not have been offense under French law ordinarily but was in this case because he was her teacher?


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    #57
    Quazzie
    Registered Users Posts: 28,876 ✭✭✭✭Quazzie


    Did he know the girl was 15 or did he ask for a hooker and the madame gave him a 15 year old and he done the deed under the assumption she was of age if she was working as a hooker.


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    #58
    Hans Bricks
    Registered Users Posts: 850 ✭✭✭Hans Bricks


    A known hellraiser like Reed going to a brothel most likely stocious drunk and ending up with a 15 year old who most likely could pass for the AOC ?

    I wouldn't lynch the poor ****er just yet.


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    #59
    porsche959
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,499 ✭✭✭porsche959


    Nodin wrote: »
    It's the mirror. I'll bide me time waiting for a news source to report on it.

    I suppose in that case you are not interested in the expose into the unsolved murder of Jill Dando, which Mark Williams-Thomas in conjunction with the Mirror will be reporting on in coming days.

    Tick, tock.


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    #60
    NIMAN
    Registered Users Posts: 33,216 ✭✭✭✭NIMAN


    John Peel was technically a paedo too then. Did you know that?
    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/debate/article-2794855/by-honouring-sex-predator-like-john-peel-bbc-shows-s-learnt-jimmy-savile-says-stephen-glover.html
    Why not the same hate towards him?

    And I would guess that many of the top music stars from the 50s, 60, 70, 80s probably have a past they'd like to hide from the news, as I am sure many would have found it hard to turn down the advances of their young female fan base.


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    #61
    Heckler
    Registered Users Posts: 3,324 ✭✭✭Heckler


    A pedophile is someone attracted to pre-pubescent children.

    I'll try to find a link but a recent survey showed men pictures of full body females with the heads blurred out . The results ? something like 80% of those surveyed were attracted to the 14-17 year old body shape.


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