Manchester United Team Talk/Gossip/Rumours Thread - Read Mod Warning in OP 7/1/15

Pro. F · 20-02-2015 11:55AM

De Jong is of similar quality to Carrick and at his age he is not going to improve much. We should be improving on Carrick, not bringing in another player on his level. Three players (when you add Blind) for one position and all of them lacking in quality is a bad way to build a squad, even if it is cheaper.

Nalz · 20-02-2015 11:57AM

Pro. F wrote: »

De Jong is of similar quality to Carrick and at his age he is not going to improve much. We should be improving on Carrick, not bringing in another player on his level.

Different player though. Chances are we will bring in players to replace Carrick, a new LB and CB, and a new Striker

hashtag HOPE

glued · 20-02-2015 11:58AM

homerjay2005 wrote: »

how is he playing this year???

in one aspect it makes sense, we have lost Fletcher and Ando and need players in the CM squad.

in the other, our problem is not lack of steel in midfield, its creativity and tempo - does De Jong give us this?

i dont think so. id be happy with the signing, if he was complimented with a top class midfielder who can dictate games.

In the past few weeks he hasn't been great but Inzaghi is going to be sacked soon. Nobody is really playing well in that side. He definitely still has a lot to offer.

Mitch Connor · 20-02-2015 12:00PM

Pro. F wrote: »

De Jong is of similar quality to Carrick and at his age he is not going to improve much. We should be improving on Carrick, not bringing in another player on his level.

I would say he is a very different player to carrick. Not the passer Carrick is, but far more physical.

I wouldn't see him as a replacement for Carrick anyway, certainly not like for like. Blind would seem, to me, a far more Carrick-replacement player.

I think Blind could be a very useful addition to the squad, I just don't think he would improve the first 11 game in/game out. A situational player - arguably a replacement for Fletcher.

DM - Carrick, Blind.
CM (combative role) - De Jong, Fellaini
CM (box to box passer) - Herrera, Rooney (sigh)
CM (creative runner) - Di Maria
AM - Mata, Januzaj, Rooney.

Maximus Alexander · 20-02-2015 12:01PM

Lord TSC wrote: »

Provided he's not our only signing, I'd be happy with him. If we're back in Europe next year, we need to expand the squad while also cutting deadwood. He'd be a good addition to the squad at pretty much no financial risk.

Just out of interest, who do you think is dead wood at this point? I was looking at the squad recently and I realized pretty much everyone I'd have liked to see out 12 months ago is gone now. Bar Valencia I suppose.

Headshot · 20-02-2015 12:02PM

Maximus Alexander wrote: »

Just out of interest, who do you think is dead wood at this point? I was looking at the squad recently and I realized pretty much everyone I'd have liked to see out 12 months ago is gone now. Bar Valencia I suppose.

Smalling, Evans and Jones

At one stage, I thought fair enough they can be squad players but I dont feel they'll ever be good enough for utd

keane2097 · 20-02-2015 12:08PM

The squawka article posted yesterday re:Smalling was interesting at the surface level I looked at it.

Anyone happy to agree with the argument that he has been much better than common perception? Equally, anyone cast a more discerning glance over the article in question find any issues with it?

Nalz · 20-02-2015 12:08PM

Headshot wrote: »

Smalling, Evans and Jones

At one stage, I thought fair enough they can be squad players but I dont feel they'll ever be good enough for utd

They're like 3 Wes Browns

bangkok · 20-02-2015 12:11PM

Pro. F wrote: »

De Jong is of similar quality to Carrick and at his age he is not going to improve much. We should be improving on Carrick, not bringing in another player on his level. Three players (when you add Blind) for one position and all of them lacking in quality is a bad way to build a squad, even if it is cheaper.

similar player?! Carrick has much more composure on the ball, better passer, better positional player, technically much better, de jong is a hatchet type player, I would say they are chalk and cheese

Copper_pipe · 20-02-2015 12:11PM

Manchester United @ManUtd · 5m 5 minutes ago
FIXTURES: The Manchester derby (originally Saturday 11 April) has been moved to Sunday 12 April (16:00 BST). #mufc

Manchester United @ManUtd · 5m 5 minutes ago
Please note: this is still subject to Manchester City's possible participation in the Champions League the following Tuesday.

Manchester United @ManUtd · 35s 36 seconds ago
FIXTURES: Chelsea v #mufc is now Saturday 18 April (17:30 BST) but still subject to change should Utd still be in the FA Cup that weekend.

Copper_pipe · 20-02-2015 12:12PM

Further, Everton v #mufc (originally Saturday 25 April) will now be played Sunday 26 April (13:30 BST).

Maximus Alexander · 20-02-2015 12:13PM

Headshot wrote: »

Smalling, Evans and Jones

At one stage, I thought fair enough they can be squad players but I dont feel they'll ever be good enough for utd

I'd probably give you Evans, given that he seems to be going backwards and he's not getting any younger.

Jones I'd give another year at least, he's only 22. Smalling is definitely worth a squad place I'd say.

Copper_pipe · 20-02-2015 12:16PM

Manchester United @ManUtd · now 4 seconds ago
Louis van Gaal tells #MUTV that Robin van Persie and Phil Jones are fit for tomorrow's match at Swansea. #mufc

Pro. F · 20-02-2015 12:20PM

Mitch Connor wrote: »

I would say he is a very different player to carrick. Not the passer Carrick is, but far more physical.

I wouldn't see him as a replacement for Carrick anyway, certainly not like for like. Blind would seem, to me, a far more Carrick-replacement player.

I think Blind could be a very useful addition to the squad, I just don't think he would improve the first 11 game in/game out. A situational player - arguably a replacement for Fletcher.

DM - Carrick, Blind.
CM (combative role) - De Jong, Fellaini
CM (box to box passer) - Herrera, Rooney (sigh)
CM (creative runner) - Di Maria
AM - Mata, Januzaj, Rooney.

I agree that De Jong has different qualities to Carrick. De Jong is like a better version of Blind imo. Blind might improve a bit with age, just like De Jong did. The two Dutch boys may not be as good at passing as Carrick, but they're still best used as DMs. And like Carrick, they're still not of the level we should be looking for.

Having one CM who lacks quality on the ball (Carrick) is bad enough, adding in a second (De Jong) beside him to be combative would be a terrible idea imo.

Pro. F · 20-02-2015 12:21PM

bangkok wrote: »

similar player?! Carrick has much more composure on the ball, better passer, better positional player, technically much better, de jong is a hatchet type player, I would say they are chalk and cheese

No, not similar player. Similar quality and similar level. Also, De Jong isn't really a hatchet player these days.

bangkok · 20-02-2015 12:24PM

Pro. F wrote: »

No, not similar player. Similar quality and similar level.

I don't agree seeing how carrick has better attributes in all area's apart from aggression

Lord TSC · 20-02-2015 12:34PM

Maximus Alexander wrote: »

Just out of interest, who do you think is dead wood at this point? I was looking at the squad recently and I realized pretty much everyone I'd have liked to see out 12 months ago is gone now. Bar Valencia I suppose.

As Headshot said, Evans's time is up. I'm happy to keep Jones as a squad player (can't just have 11 players), and Smalling I'm on the fence between squad and sell.

To add to that, Valencia is not good enough to be getting the games he's getting. Carrick is aging, and while not "deadwood", I think he shouldn't be getting games ahead of Herrera, Felaini, DiMaria and Blind. More so if we bring in another midfielder, be it De Jong and/or someone else.

RVP's form has been off for two seasons now, and while I do believe a better supply would see a better goal return, I think his wages and position would be better served by someone else now.

I also honestly think Rooney affects the "balance" of the team negatively; I'd have zero problems seeing him sold and an attempt made to replace him with other players who'd demand the same wages as him, but probably contribute more to the team.

Headshot · 20-02-2015 12:45PM

Id sell Rooney in a heart beat

bangkok · 20-02-2015 12:46PM

sell rooney? I wouldnt be buying falcao in the summer, sell van persie and sell mata before I would even contemplate selling rooney

20-02-2015 12:47PM

Lord TSC wrote: »

As Headshot said, Evans's time is up. I'm happy to keep Jones as a squad player (can't just have 11 players), and Smalling I'm on the fence between squad and sell.

To add to that, Valencia is not good enough to be getting the games he's getting. Carrick is aging, and while not "deadwood", I think he shouldn't be getting games ahead of Herrera, Felaini, DiMaria and Blind. More so if we bring in another midfielder, be it De Jong and/or someone else.

RVP's form has been off for two seasons now, and while I do believe a better supply would see a better goal return, I think his wages and position would be better served by someone else now.

I also honestly think Rooney affects the "balance" of the team negatively; I'd have zero problems seeing him sold and an attempt made to replace him with other players who'd demand the same wages as him, but probably contribute more to the team.

Rooney isn't being played in a position that he can effect the balance of the team positively. When he is he's the team's best player.

bangkok · 20-02-2015 12:55PM

so that's dani alves and de jong signed in the summer so both on free transfers. Bargain bucket United

keane2097 · 20-02-2015 12:55PM

I don't think Rooney is the best striker at United but would think he'd be the best of the three to keep if you were going to let two go.

Spazdarn · 20-02-2015 12:56PM

RVP isn't contributing half as much as he has been since his arrival. Falcao is too expensive, and hasn't really impressed enough. Rooney shouldn't be sold because in a year or so it'll only be him and Wilson to rely on

Pro. F · 20-02-2015 12:57PM

bangkok wrote: »

I don't agree seeing how carrick has better attributes in all area's apart from aggression

I'd have Carrick ahead in everything important except for athletic ability, but not so far ahead as to be on a different level. Anyway it's hardly that important, the important question is whether either of them are good enough for the first team.

Pro. F · 20-02-2015 12:58PM

Headshot wrote: »

Id sell Rooney in a heart beat

That's only because you dislike Rooney the person.

Mitch Connor · 20-02-2015 01:00PM

Headshot wrote: »

Smalling, Evans and Jones

At one stage, I thought fair enough they can be squad players but I dont feel they'll ever be good enough for utd

Can't see a situation where all 3 are gone any time soon.

Sell all three and we only have one senior CB at the club in Rojo. Personally I don't rate McNair or Blackett as long term prospects at United but that is besides the point.

With all three, and the wider squad in general, you also have to consider home grown (at club or nationally) status with regards to PL and Uefa rules.

I certainly think we need to bring in one top CB this summer to compliment Rojo, and then I can imagine one of the trio being sold off. Not sure who though, I would say Evans is most likely given his age - club might still see potential in Jones or Smalling.

Incipiently, have seen it on Red Issue or UWS, or both, that Rojo and Tuanzebe (i think it was him) as the future United CB pairing, long term. Would back my own opinion of McNair and Blackett not being long term prospects. I think Tuanzebe is only 17 though, so probably a couple of years before he is in first team contention at all - so we have spaces to fill before then.

Spazdarn · 20-02-2015 01:01PM

Pro. F wrote: »

I'd have Carrick ahead in everything important except for athletic ability, but not so far ahead as to be on a different level. Anyway it's hardly that important, the important question is whether either of them are good enough for the first team.

Blind is better at receiving the ball and distributing it down field... transitioning the play quickly has been a real issue for us. Dithering defenders, too prone to passing it backwards to De Gea instead of taking a chance

sky88 · 20-02-2015 01:03PM

Id sell valencia, evans and jones just not good enough for united to me.

id let van persie go as well his all round play has been bad the last two seasons , he just doesnt look like he cares at the minute

Mitch Connor · 20-02-2015 01:05PM

Lord TSC wrote: »

I also honestly think Rooney affects the "balance" of the team negatively; I'd have zero problems seeing him sold and an attempt made to replace him with other players who'd demand the same wages as him, but probably contribute more to the team.

I think m opinion on Rooney has been fairly clear - but I wouldn't sell him now. Looking two years down the line and I see him as a better bet up top than RVP or Falcao (don't see us signing Falcao).

Based on performances this season I would say Falcao won't be signed on, RVP could be allowed to leave (out of contract next summer I think) - so that leaves us with Wilson (who I rate a lot but hasn't done anything for the first team yet) and Rooney. Just can't see how we could sell Rooney out of the four forwards. I'd let RVP and Falcao go first and replace them. Hopefully bring in a top midfielder or two so we don't use Rooney in CM at all and that would improve the balance of the side loads.

Headshot · 20-02-2015 01:06PM

Pro. F wrote: »

That's only because you dis like Rooney the person.

Yes and the player.

We can buy much better CM or striker than Rooney. He's a hinderance at this stage for me. If he's good enough to play striker, why isnt he playing as a stirker? Surely LVG knows he's even a bigger hinderance in CM of late

Manchester United Team Talk/Gossip/Rumours Thread - Read Mod Warning in OP 7/1/15

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