Liverpool FC Team Talk/Gossip/Rumours Thread 2014 - Mod Warning in OP, 10/12

rob316 · 22-12-2014 01:41PM

garra wrote: »

We know he wanted Sanchez, I'm actually sick of hearing about how he wanted Sanchez. But failing to get your first target should never be an excuse for not having an adequate 2nd choice with the money he had available this summer. People talk about the committee but Rodgers has final veto on any target and he is responsible for our blunt strike-force. End of.

Word on the grapevine is he wanted Bony aswell, but the money men wouldn't pay the fee. Bony would have been a great signing. Who knows what happened with Remy too.

Its ridiculous to think that Rodgers was happy with his strike force going into this season after selling Suarez. He never wanted Balotelli we know that much but it was slim pickings.

22-12-2014 01:43PM

5starpool wrote: »

Our current run of form is barely better than that. We had a decent first half of the season that time though. If Rodgers gets 35 points or so from the last 21 games he can claim there is an improvement but it'll still overall have been a terrible season unless we have some silverware in the cabinet to show for it. 57 points, the league cup and the semi finals of the EL will be enough to see him at the club next season I reckon. 57, lose to Chelsea and nowhere in the other 2 cups might not be.

Yep, it's really up in the air.

Signing strikers in absolutely key. For a manager who plays attacking football and is willing to concede plenty, goalscorers are essential!

Pyjamarama · 22-12-2014 01:47PM

I think people have unrealistic expectations of what 100m gets you these days. Especially when you can't attract the very top level players.

That's not to conpletely excuse our transfer dealings cause only the most blind could say they've been anything more than disappointing. The hope is the glimpses of talent we've seen in the likes of Moreno, marcovich and sakho can come the fore. I happen to think Sakho is given too hard a time by some fans too btw.

Is that good enough? Nope but it's not the only thing you have to judge a manager on. Especially when we know he wanted other players who weren't signed.

BMMachine · 22-12-2014 01:48PM

A lot of the transfers just havent made any sense - He lets Agger and Reina go and now Kolo and Brad Jones are starting. Not exactly Kolo's fault, hes at the end of his career and doing as well as he can.. but he bought Sakho for what, 17 million and he looks headless. Theres a reason PSG sold him, they arent exactly a selling club.
He basically told Andy Carroll to pack his bags as soon as he got to the club, but then he signs Lambert and Borini. Carroll was still quite young and raw, and look at his form now.
He signs Coutinho and plays Sterling, 2 similar players... but then also signs Lallana and Markovic... 2 more lightweight attacking players. He signs Balotelli (which he admitted was a last chance) and yeah, turns out hes actually just a twitter profile and personality rather than an actual good player.
He signs Joe Allen and tries to alienate lucas from the team, a year later and Lucas is once again one of our most valuable players on the pitch whereas Allen is blamed for not being good enough.

To me - none of this makes sense for a 'top' manager. Gerrard again has to carry us but the poor lad is getting on a bit and cant be the player he was for us and without Sturridge we look completely inept when we attack and are reduced to dozens of long shots a game which go nowhere. I would be willing to give some of the young players time of course but there is a pattern here, Rodgers isn't sure what hes doing as regards who he wants to play and I personally think that the ideas he has in his head don't transfer well to the reality of how the game is played on the pitch, far too much of a blue sky thinker.

The solution? I dunno tbh...

Mr Alan · 22-12-2014 01:50PM

Pyjamarama wrote: »

I think people have unrealistic expectations of what 100m gets you these days. Especially when you can't attract the very top level players.

That's not to conpletely excuse our transfer dealings cause only the most blind could say they've been anything more than disappointing. The hope is the glimpses of talent we've seen in the likes of Moreno, marcovich and sakho can come the fore. I happen to think Sakho is given too hard a time by some fans too btw.

Is that good enough? Nope but it's not the only thing you have to judge a manager on. Especially when we know he wanted other players who weren't signed.

See I'm sorry, but this just reads as incredible excuse making to me.

It's closer to £150m spent this summer & while the monies involved in football have gone bananas, that's still an obscene amount to spend. By any standards.

Essentially, our objective this summer should have been to replace Suarez as best as we can & shore up the defense. We spent well over £100m and have not come anywhere close to doing either.

Pilsbury Doughboy · 22-12-2014 01:51PM

Just on the game yesterday I think it showed that Sterling playing up top is only gonna work in away matches, he needs space to run into, he was fairly ineffective yesterday, in home games I'd rather start with Balotelli for the next couple, he's obv more accustomed to playing that role than Sterling.

Markovic is showing some tiny glimpses of why we bought him, I thought Lucas was excellent yesterday, Sakho was pretty good, Skrtel thankfully got the goal but I'm fairly sick of seeing him play at this stage tbh

Edit : This Andy Carroll talk is a bit baffling to me, the lad has been injured for about 2 years , now he has scored about 3 goals and we're lamenting not having him, come on!

garra · 22-12-2014 01:53PM

rob316 wrote: »

Word on the grapevine is he wanted Bony aswell, but the money men wouldn't pay the fee. Bony would have been a great signing. Who knows what happened with Remy too.

Its ridiculous to think that Rodgers was happy with his strike force going into this season after selling Suarez. He never wanted Balotelli we know that much but it was slim pickings.

I don't think Rodgers was happy with his strike-force, and we know he wasn't happy with "last resort man", but that should not excuse his failure to land a decent striker.
Whether he was not pushy enough with the committee for other options or he could not identify the right targets, it all leads back to the man in charge.

I like the style of football Rodgers coaches, so I hope it still comes good for him but lets not be blinkered to his short-comings in the transfer market and in the defensive organisation of his teams.

5starpool · 22-12-2014 01:53PM

rarnes1 wrote: »

Yep, it's really up in the air.

Signing strikers in absolutely key. For a manager who plays attacking football and is willing to concede plenty, goalscorers are essential!

I'm not convinced that we will sign a striker in January. I'm convinced we will sign a keeper, but a striker I reckon is only 50/50, and that includes the bizarre possibility of paying an extra €6m to get a player we already own away from his loan.

If Sturridge breaks down again before the end of the month we might see an incoming player, but other than that I reckon on balance we won't have money to spend on a striker unless Borini leaves, or less likely, Balotelli.

Sir Gallagher · 22-12-2014 01:57PM

smileyj1987 wrote: »

The two games against city , the game at home to city in the league . Beating Everton in the semi final . Then the fa cup final too . It really did look like Kenny was going to get the best of Andy Carroll .

Huh? Pretty sure Carroll was in a decent bit of form, scored late winners against Blackburn and Everton in the semi final then Kenny dropped him for the final against Chelsea who then completely bossed us in that game.

We done well in the cups under Kenny, but after the dismal league run and of course t-shirt gate he was never going to last. It was probably unfair to expect him to take to top flight management again after so many years away.

byrneg28 · 22-12-2014 02:01PM

rob316 wrote: »

Word on the grapevine is he wanted Bony aswell, but the money men wouldn't pay the fee. Bony would have been a great signing. Who knows what happened with Remy too.

Its ridiculous to think that Rodgers was happy with his strike force going into this season after selling Suarez. He never wanted Balotelli we know that much but it was slim pickings.

It's like , in August, he was a big kid with his birthday money and decided to buy FIFA 14 instead of wait until the new one came in a month later.

He had 16 million he settled for Balotelli, why couldn't he have just made do with what he had and bought a better striker in a different window!

brevity · 22-12-2014 02:04PM

https://twitter.com/paddypower/status/546980582681772033

ebbsy · 22-12-2014 02:08PM

The only thing that you can judge a manager on is results.

Turtyturd · 22-12-2014 02:09PM

Gits_bone · 22-12-2014 02:09PM

ebbsy wrote: »

The only thing that you can judge a manager on is results.

No, that's just the most important thing.

byrneg28 · 22-12-2014 02:10PM

ebbsy wrote: »

The only thing that you can judge a manager on is results.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/video/football/video-1109003/Brendan-Rodgers-Liverpool-not-Tottenham.html

I happily judge him on this

Turtyturd · 22-12-2014 02:12PM

Rampage Johnson no longer just stealing toilet seats.

Magico Gonzalez · 22-12-2014 02:13PM

Still comically easy to score goals against, I don't believe it's down to individual ability either.

I would have thought that a smart manager would look at his attacking options, see that they were limited and decide that he better put a system in place which prioritises stopping other teams scoring. Stop the rot, sort out the fundamentals and develop from there.

Gits_bone · 22-12-2014 02:15PM

Why doesn't Skrtl attack the ball the same way he does when he's in the oppositions box?

Iused2likebusts · 22-12-2014 02:15PM

Magico Gonzalez wrote: »

Still comically easy to score goals against, I don't believe it's down to individual ability either.

I would have thought that a smart manager would look at his attacking options, see that they were limited and decide that he better put a system in place which prioritises stopping other teams scoring. Stop the rot, sort out the fundamentals and develop from there.

He tried that against Sunderland stoke and basle it was a disaster.

Pilsbury Doughboy · 22-12-2014 02:18PM

Iused2likebusts wrote: »

He tried that against Sunderland stoke and basle it was a disaster.

Yup, he started Lambert and tried to make us more solid, it worked in a way but came at the cost of absolutely turgid football, I'd rather go about it the way we are at the moment.

klose · 22-12-2014 02:24PM

BMMachine wrote: »

A lot of the transfers just havent made any sense - He lets Agger and Reina go and now Kolo and Brad Jones are starting. Not exactly Kolo's fault, hes at the end of his career and doing as well as he can.. but he bought Sakho for what, 17 million and he looks headless. Theres a reason PSG sold him, they arent exactly a selling club.
He basically told Andy Carroll to pack his bags as soon as he got to the club, but then he signs Lambert and Borini. Carroll was still quite young and raw, and look at his form now.
He signs Coutinho and plays Sterling, 2 similar players... but then also signs Lallana and Markovic... 2 more lightweight attacking players. He signs Balotelli (which he admitted was a last chance) and yeah, turns out hes actually just a twitter profile and personality rather than an actual good player.
He signs Joe Allen and tries to alienate lucas from the team, a year later and Lucas is once again one of our most valuable players on the pitch whereas Allen is blamed for not being good enough.

To me - none of this makes sense for a 'top' manager. Gerrard again has to carry us but the poor lad is getting on a bit and cant be the player he was for us and without Sturridge we look completely inept when we attack and are reduced to dozens of long shots a game which go nowhere. I would be willing to give some of the young players time of course but there is a pattern here, Rodgers isn't sure what hes doing as regards who he wants to play and I personally think that the ideas he has in his head don't transfer well to the reality of how the game is played on the pitch, far too much of a blue sky thinker.

The solution? I dunno tbh...

Don't think I've ever disagreed with a post as much before on here. Agger is on record saying he essentially didn't feel up to it playing in the premiership anymore? The lad is as loyal as they come i get that but you have to question someone who at their peak was happy to take a massive step down career wise.
Reina also, besides him looking like he's carrying a spare tyre around his waist you would also have to questions someones mentality and belief when he left to go to a club knowing full well he would be eternally a number 2 there as they already had the best keeper on the planet playing for.
Sakho was sold for 17 million in the last year of his contract, it was too good a deal for psg to turn down, they've spent over 100 million quid on centre backs he had every right to leave. He is for me our most talented and best defender.
Andy Caroll talk seriously? Not even worth debating, average one dimensional player that was the polar opposite of what Rodgers wanted. Lucas is still a fairly average player for what its worth and there is no way in hell Gerrard is carrying us, he has been a hindrance the last few games if anything. Rodgers would want to stop blindly persisting with him.

Magico Gonzalez · 22-12-2014 02:30PM

Reina had a run of poor form, that's why we bough Mignolet. We're starting to look decent going forward now but still don't have the def sorted.

People dont realise how much we miss Carragher's ability as a motivator and even more so as an organiser in defence. We don't have a leader back there and a weak gk situation is undermining them further.

Pyjamarama · 22-12-2014 02:30PM

Mr Alan wrote: »

See I'm sorry, but this just reads as incredible excuse making to me.

It's closer to £150m spent this summer & while the monies involved in football have gone bananas, that's still an obscene amount to spend. By any standards.

Essentially, our objective this summer should have been to replace Suarez as best as we can & shore up the defense. We spent well over £100m and have not come anywhere close to doing either.

It's not excuse making. I've stated the results of the transfers have not been good enough so far. But it's not as simple as you're making it out to bE either. Tbh I think the biggest stick to beat him with is the Lovern transfer as by all accounts that was who he wanted and tbh he had a very mediocre 2nd half to last season and he's been abysmal for us.

Another poster has commented about sakho looking like a headless chicken but he really isn't one. He's rash at times but that's all centre halves who like to attack the ball. He's been plagued with injuries but he keeps some very good defenders out of that French team on merit.

Also for those lamenting the loss of Agger... He is done. I'd rather Kolo any day of the week at this stage. Agger lost all his athleticism due to injuries. He left because he felt he wasn't up to the standard requires. Sure he even said as much himself. And while I'd love to have reina over Jones do you think Pepe was going to take a big pay cut? Cause he was on a lot of money.

Turtyturd · 22-12-2014 02:36PM

klose wrote: »

Don't think I've ever disagreed with a post as much before on here. Agger is on record saying he essentially didn't feel up to it playing in the premiership anymore? The lad is as loyal as they come i get that but you have to question someone who at their peak was happy to take a massive step down career wise.
Reina also, besides him looking like he's carrying a spare tyre around his waist you would also have to questions someones mentality and belief when he left to go to a club knowing full well he would be eternally a number 2 there as they already had the best keeper on the planet playing for.
Sakho was sold for 17 million in the last year of his contract, it was too good a deal for psg to turn down, they've spent over 100 million quid on centre backs he had every right to leave. He is for me our most talented and best defender.
Andy Caroll take seriously? Not even worth debating, average one dimensional player that was the polar opposite of what Rodgers wanted. Lucas is still a fairly average player for what its worth and there is no way in hell Gerrard is carrying us, he has been a hindrance the last few games if anything. Rodgers would want to stop blindly persisting with him.

Having to shift players around completely rather than making straight forward swap shows how afraid of the Gerrard issue he is, and how farcical the talk of him being dropped a few weeks back was.

22-12-2014 02:42PM

Gits_bone wrote: »

Rodgers tactics rely on pressing high in the first 20 minutes, going all out for goals and winning the game in that period. When teams don't concede in this time then Liverpools press is gone and they knock it around us.

As seen yesterday.

NOT

Milkers · 22-12-2014 02:43PM

5starpool wrote: »

It's not hard to get some facts to back up, or otherwise, your argument these days with decent search. Mr Alan has posted 412 times since the start of this season in the soccer forum, and last season between Christmas day, when we were top, and 26th May he posted 226 times. It is less (and in slightly more time) but to say that there were hardly any posts is blatantly false.

The whole discussion is very petty anyhow.

This discussion is petty and tiresome but it is also annoying to see facts misrepresented. If you want to talk about numbers do it properly. There have been 21 LFC Superthreads since Rodgers was appointed:

end month of thread|number of Mr Alan posts|notes
2012
Jul|168|Rodgers appointed in June
Aug|293|
Sep|184|
Nov|94|
Dec|125|Liverpool struggle badly up to Christmas

2013
Feb|33|Liverpool on a good run
Apr|38|
Jun|127|Season over
Jul|73|
Aug|165|
Sep|153|New (Epic) season starts
Nov|24|

2014
Jan|30|
Feb|47|
Mar|24|
May|37|
Jun|23|
Jul|11|
Aug|69|Season starts
Nov|124|Liverpool on a bad run
Current|202|

Agent Coulson · 22-12-2014 02:53PM

Brad Jones has earned over £7.5m as a Liverpool player playing 26 games not a bad gig if you can get it.

22-12-2014 03:00PM

5starpool wrote: »

I'm not convinced that we will sign a striker in January. I'm convinced we will sign a keeper, but a striker I reckon is only 50/50, and that includes the bizarre possibility of paying an extra €6m to get a player we already own away from his loan.

If Sturridge breaks down again before the end of the month we might see an incoming player, but other than that I reckon on balance we won't have money to spend on a striker unless Borini leaves, or less likely, Balotelli.

If we don't sign at least one striker in Jan, we are toast imo.

Sturridge is spending Christmas in America receiving treatment. I'm guessing we won't see him until near Feb. Tbh, I'd be hoping the club are planning without him considering he has broken down twice already. If he was a car I'd be trading in.

mosstin · 22-12-2014 03:03PM

Milkers wrote: »

This discussion is petty and tiresome but it is also annoying to see facts misrepresented. If you want to talk about numbers do it properly. There have been 21 LFC Superthreads since Rodgers was appointed:

end month of thread|number of Mr Alan posts|notes
2012
Jul|168|Rodgers appointed in June
Aug|293|
Sep|184|
Nov|94|
Dec|125|Liverpool struggle badly up to Christmas

2013
Feb|33|Liverpool on a good run
Apr|38|
Jun|127|Season over
Jul|73|
Aug|165|
Sep|153|New (Epic) season starts
Nov|24|

2014
Jan|30|
Feb|47|
Mar|24|
May|37|
Jun|23|
Jul|11|
Aug|69|Season starts
Nov|124|Liverpool on a bad run
Current|202|

****ing hell, I have seen it all now. Someone actually went to the trouble of researching this? Jesus wept.

mosstin · 22-12-2014 03:04PM

Agent Coulson wrote: »

Brad Jones has earned over £7.5m as a Liverpool player playing 26 games not a bad gig if you can get it.

"playing"

Liverpool FC Team Talk/Gossip/Rumours Thread 2014 - Mod Warning in OP, 10/12

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