My back light is too bright

beauf · 10-12-2014 01:29AM

Kalman wrote: »

Nonsense! it's better to be seen than not! I have flashing L.E.D's and high visibility jacket>>>I'm concerned about me!>>not a bus driver.

Thing is you won't be seen, the driver will be blinded, and not see you at all if the light is too strong.

There's a reason cars don't drive around with full main beams on its because it literally blinds the oncoming drivers.

I've 4 lights on the bicycle. Two on the front because I needed something brighter on unlit roads. I generally have one on a slow flash and one on steady. Front and rear. When I hit a dark stretch I put the two front front on steady.

But there a few people with lights that are brighter than car head lights. They literally blind you. Bad if you are cycling. But in a car, they just appear from nowhere and hit the mirrors and you are instantly blind. Not good at all.

10-12-2014 06:13AM

As a driver I have noticed quite a few extra bright front lights on some cyclists bikes. Something I didn't notice a few years ago.
Last week the person in the car and I both commented on one cyclist coming towards us who's light was far too bright, almost like a camera flash going off repeatedly,
made it hard to judge exactly where he was due to the blinding brightness. I think the angle of the light was wrong too, needed to be adjusted down.

If you ask me, the flashing light is unnecessary. If it was a solid light, and half the brightness he would have been more visible to me.

Here's a video from a cyclist of how stupidly bright and incorrectly adjusted a cyclists lights can be

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tprm7BjQOD4

braddun · 10-12-2014 07:25AM

point it down more

Mefistofelino · 10-12-2014 09:00AM

ford2600 wrote: »

Moon Shield low setting 16 lux
Moon Shield high setting 42 lux

Rear car lights 3 lux
Brake lights 8 lux

You'd better get a dimmer switch on that yoke before next year's Fleche...

(Were you able to get a measurement on the B&M Secula?)

TonyStark · 10-12-2014 09:24AM

Del2005 wrote: »

It's better to respect other road users. Having lights that blinds other road users isn't respectful and can lead to road rage. All that's needed is a white light to the front and red to the rear if other road users can't see them sticking more lights, having them flashing etc doesn't stop the SMIDSY brigade crashing into you but just annoys other road users.

Road rage isn't brought on whether another person has a light or not.

Road rage is a result of an emotional weakness on part of the person who can't cope with certain types of situations when cocooned inside the bubble of their motor vehicle. These people need to find better coping mechanism. If they feel its dangerous report it to the cops and just move on.

I've new dazzled by oncoming cars with full headlights on before. Do I try to run them off the road? Do I lose the plot and verbally assault them?

I simply just get on with my life, and leave the rest to the Parish Council!

ford2600 · 10-12-2014 09:44AM

Mefistofelino wrote: »

You'd better get a dimmer switch on that yoke before next year's Fleche...

(Were you able to get a measurement on the B&M Secula?)

Well warned, it's not really suitable for group riding even on lowest setting

No but I will check secula the next time I'm on bike and remember to leave light meter out. It stays lit for a few minutes.

alcyst · 11-12-2014 10:44PM

ford2600 wrote: »

OP what setting do you use it on. Top setting is 80 lumens I think.

I use a moon shield 60 on lowest setting and it is plenty.

A lot will depend on how light is diffused by lens of course so comparing lights on lumens alone isn't very useful

I think I have it on max at the moment.

alcyst · 11-12-2014 10:45PM

07Lapierre wrote: »

maybe its the Angle that your light is at?

I mean to blind a bus driver, the light may be angled too high?

It has one direction setting.

alcyst · 11-12-2014 10:47PM

Leroy42 wrote: »

There is no doubt that the advent of the really strong lights are causing issues. Whether it is the wrong angle, the wrong diffusion or whatever, even as a cyclist there are some people with lights that seem, to me, to be too bright.

Of course it does it's primary job of making that person visable but it also can be distracting and in some cases blinding (although that would normally be the front light).

Instead of taking the bus driver as someone to be smart at and ridiculed, maybe we take on board the advice! This 'Well I'm alright Jack, that your problem" attitude doesn't help anybody.

Seems to me that the bus driver was polite and simply passing on their feelings about the light.

I believe in Germany they have limits on back lights. I took the remark as delivered, she was polite. Oncoming cars do have pretty bite lights at times

alcyst · 11-12-2014 10:49PM

pprendeville wrote: »

What are the lights on Dublinbike like in terms of output I wonder. They dazzle if you look straight at them but have a very good focused beam.

The dublinbike front lights are good. The back ones have a nice spread.

NiallBoo · 12-12-2014 01:02AM

ford2600 wrote: »

Ok quick test with a light meter to get lux level of]

All measurements at 3m from light source any level given is highest recording.

Moon Shield low setting 16 lux
Moon Shield high setting 42 lux

Rear car lights 3 lux
Brake lights 8 lux

Fair play for going and measuring that, I think the figures speak for themselves.

I think it's common sense to see that sometimes lights can be too bright, can dazzle another road user and are thus less safe. I've certainly noticed this being increasingly the case while driving and cycling over the last few years as LEDs have become more popular (this also applies to LEDs in some cars and the odd obnoxious shop display).

so, more important than my opinion, here's what the law says

The Man wrote:

Every lamp to which this sub-article applies shall be so fitted and constructed as to be incapable of dazzling a person who is on the same horizontal plane as the vehicle

I could be wrong, but I believe this would apply to all vehicles on the road.

I couldn't find rules setting precise limits, for either cars or bikes, has anyone else come across them?

tomasrojo · 12-12-2014 08:26AM

alcyst wrote: »

The dublinbike front lights are good. The back ones have a nice spread.

The front ones are very conspicuous, even during the day.

alcyst · 12-12-2014 09:13AM

Was coming in this morning and saw a cyclist with 4 red and one white rear lights, all flashing. Clothing and cycling manner suggested an experienced cyclist.

Perhaps some lights can be too bright, but the fact that some cyclist believes the alternative is to have 5 lights is troubling.

peneau · 12-12-2014 10:38AM

Deleted User wrote: »

As a driver I have noticed quite a few extra bright front lights on some cyclists bikes. Something I didn't notice a few years ago.
Last week the person in the car and I both commented on one cyclist coming towards us who's light was far too bright, almost like a camera flash going off repeatedly,
made it hard to judge exactly where he was due to the blinding brightness. I think the angle of the light was wrong too, needed to be adjusted down.

If you ask me, the flashing light is unnecessary. If it was a solid light, and half the brightness he would have been more visible to me.

Here's a video from a cyclist of how stupidly bright and incorrectly adjusted a cyclists lights can be
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tprm7BjQOD4

Human eye will pick up a flashing light quicker than a static light particularly in the urban environment.

Lumen · 12-12-2014 11:03AM

peneau wrote: »

Human eye will pick up a flashing light quicker than a static light particularly in the urban environment.

Yes, which is why flashing dim lights are better than steady dim lights.

But since bicycle light brightness is a solved problem, having a gazillion lumen strobe is completely unnecessary.

ghogie91 · 12-12-2014 11:13AM

Is the light not as bright as a break light?

If so is the bus driver going to stop everyone who who has to use the brakes and tell them their lights are too bright.

Gimpy fool no nothing in people carrier bus

Wishbone Ash · 12-12-2014 11:38AM

ghogie91 wrote: »

Is the light not as bright as a break light?

If so is the bus driver going to stop everyone who who has to use the brakes and tell them their lights are too bright...

Brake lights are not on continuously although there is a very large percentage of motorists out there who fail to exercise the common courtesy to the driver behind by applying the parking brake when stopped at traffic lights during lighting up hours.

Lumen · 12-12-2014 12:19PM

ghogie91 wrote: »

Is the light not as bright as a break light?

If so is the bus driver going to stop everyone who who has to use the brakes and tell them their lights are too bright.

Gimpy fool no nothing in people carrier bus

Did you read the whole thread?

clod71 · 13-12-2014 12:10AM

I use three red lights: one on the bike, one on the bag and a LIDL flashing strap on my right ankle.
And two white front lights.
A mix of fix and flashing...
I like my lights.
In the dark, you've got to ride defensively and light up.

martyc5674 · 13-12-2014 10:31AM

clod71 wrote: »

I use three red lights: one on the bike, one on the bag and a LIDL flashing strap on my right ankle.
And two white front lights.
A mix of fix and flashing...
I like my lights.
In the dark, you've got to ride defensively and light up.

Don't point them up though... That was my point in other thread

your light is going to blind people at that angle.
Marty.

galwaycyclist · 13-12-2014 11:13AM

NiallBoo wrote: »

Fair play for going and measuring that, I think the figures speak for themselves.

I think it's common sense to see that sometimes lights can be too bright, can dazzle another road user and are thus less safe. I've certainly noticed this being increasingly the case while driving and cycling over the last few years as LEDs have become more popular (this also applies to LEDs in some cars and the odd obnoxious shop display).

so, more important than my opinion, here's what the law says
I could be wrong, but I believe this would apply to all vehicles on the road.

I couldn't find rules setting precise limits, for either cars or bikes, has anyone else come across them?

Yes, as I recall, there are maximum mounting heights above ground level specified in the Irish legislation. At one time I recall wondering if head torches or helmet mounted lamps were technically illegal.

On phone now so difficult to dig out the legislation or find quotes.

Wishbone Ash · 13-12-2014 11:34AM

Post deleted - brain not in gear!

Jawgap · 13-12-2014 12:38PM

^^^^^^^only a matter of time before someone quotes that entire post.......

galwaycyclist · 13-12-2014 12:55PM

We are nearly there

What we need is
PART IV. OBLIGATORY LIGHTING OF OTHER CLASSES OF VEHICLES.

(I think part III is actually for motorbikes - eg mechanically propelled bicycles - Ive been caught by that myself before)

Wishbone Ash · 13-12-2014 01:34PM

galwaycyclist wrote: »

(I think part III is actually for motorbikes - eg mechanically propelled bicycles - Ive been caught by that myself before)

Doh!

I thought they seemed a bit extreme!

Here's Part IV:

Pedal cycles.
29. (1) Every pedal cycle shall at all times while ridden, or wheeled by a person on foot, in a public place during lighting-up hours be equipped with and, subject to sub-article (2) of this article, show duly lit a front lamp complying with the provisions of sub-article (3) of this article and a rear lamp complying with the provisions of sub-article (4) of this article.

(2) The requirement in sub-article (1) of this article that the front and rear lamps be shown duly lit shall not apply if and so long as the cycle is stopped in course of traffic or is being wheeled by a person on foot as near as possible to the left hand edge of the roadway.

(3) A front lamp fitted to a cycle shall—

(a) when lit, show to the front of the cycle a white or yellow light visible during lighting-up hours for a reasonable distance,
(b) be fitted on the centre line of the vehicle or to the right of that line,
(c) be fitted so that no part of the illuminated surface of the lamp is more than 5 feet from the ground.
(4) A rear lamp fitted to a cycle shall—

(a) when lit, show to the rear of the cycle a red light visible during lighting-up hours for a reasonable distance,
(b) have an illuminated area of at least 2 square inches and of such a shape that a circle of 1 inch in diameter may be inscribed therein,
(c) be fitted—
(i) on the centre line of the cycle or to the right of that line,
(ii) so that no part of the illuminated surface of the lamp is more than 3 feet or less than 12 inches from the ground,
(iii) so that it is not more than 20 inches from the extreme rear of the cycle.

galwaycyclist · 13-12-2014 04:22PM

So max height for the front lamp is 5ft and for the rear is 3ft. I wonder if the five foot rule had penny farthings or something in mind?

Interesting thing about the 20inches from rear rule for the rear light is that it suggests many of these seat post mounted lights don't actually conform to the legal requirements.

Wishbone Ash · 13-12-2014 11:30PM

I wonder if the 'main' light is on the bike at a normal height, is it permitted to place an auxiliary light at a higher level?

Probably not though. An example would be the auxiliary lights often fitted on the cab roof on trucks which come on with the full beam. They're illegal as they are above the maximum permitted height so when owners bring their trucks for the DOE, they simply disconnect them for the duration of the test. Bit of a farce!

galwaycyclist wrote: »

...Interesting thing about the 20inches from rear rule for the rear light is that it suggests many of these seat post mounted lights don't actually conform to the legal requirements.

It can't be more than 20 inches from the extreme rear of the cycle - so presumably anything under 20 inches is legit.

My back light is too bright

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