Pupils calling a teacher by a first name

Pinkycharm · 04-12-2014 10:05pm #1

We have a sub who is covering a parental leave and we were chatting today about the kids. We have some of the same classes and she has asked students to call her by her first name in class and outside class her Ms. X name.

Is there an actual school policy on it or are teachers free to have students call them by their first name if they want.

Just made me think about it today when she said it. She said that it builds a sense of equality and trust in the classroom. Another teacher sitting with us today said that she wouldnt ever let students call her by her first name and believed the vice principal to be against it also because teachers prefer to be called Ms or Sir.

Just thought it was interesting- What are ye're thoughts on this?

Urethra Franklin · 04-12-2014 10:24pm

Pinkycharm wrote: »

We have a sub who is covering a parental leave and we were chatting today about the kids. We have some of the same classes and she has asked students to call her by her first name in class and outside class her Ms. X name.

Is there an actual school policy on it or are teachers free to have students call them by their first name if they want.

Just made me think about it today when she said it. She said that it builds a sense of equality and trust in the classroom. Another teacher sitting with us today said that she wouldnt ever let students call her by her first name and believed the vice principal to be against it also because teachers prefer to be called Ms or Sir.

Just thought it was interesting- What are ye're thoughts on this?

I'd say it's up to the school's policy! In Gaelscoils and Gaelcholáistí it's typically first name but with Múinteoir prefixed.

seavill · 04-12-2014 10:58pm

Pinkycharm wrote: »

We have a sub who is covering a parental leave and we were chatting today about the kids. We have some of the same classes and she has asked students to call her by her first name in class and outside class her Ms. X name.

Is there an actual school policy on it or are teachers free to have students call them by their first name if they want.

Just made me think about it today when she said it. She said that it builds a sense of equality and trust in the classroom. Another teacher sitting with us today said that she wouldnt ever let students call her by her first name and believed the vice principal to be against it also because teachers prefer to be called Ms or Sir.

Just thought it was interesting- What are ye're thoughts on this?

Only you can answer this as we don't know your school. What policies have you.
I would highly doubt there is an actual policy on this. It is not something that has ever been discussed in any school I have ever been in.

Usually any teacher coming into a school would follow the conventions and norms of that school. I can't see why anyone just in the door would try to do things any differently, particularly when only covering a parental leave, ususally this is only a short term thing.

rainbowtrout · 04-12-2014 11:10pm

Pinkycharm wrote: »

We have a sub who is covering a parental leave and we were chatting today about the kids. We have some of the same classes and she has asked students to call her by her first name in class and outside class her Ms. X name.

Is there an actual school policy on it or are teachers free to have students call them by their first name if they want.

Just made me think about it today when she said it. She said that it builds a sense of equality and trust in the classroom. Another teacher sitting with us today said that she wouldnt ever let students call her by her first name and believed the vice principal to be against it also because teachers prefer to be called Ms or Sir.

Just thought it was interesting- What are ye're thoughts on this?

Policy would be individual to the school. Students wouldn't be on first name terms with their teachers in the vast majority of secondary school I'd imagine.

I wouldn't have a problem with students calling me by my first name rather than Ms. Trout but it's not the norm in my school and it doesn't bother me in the slightest.

To be honest, I think it would be confusing for students to call the teacher by two different names, unless they knew the teacher outside of school for other reasons like they train them for football, is a neighbour etc.

Actually we have PLCs and we go by first names with them, many of our PLC students were our own students previously and many find it takes them ages to start calling us by our first name.

I also don't agree with this teacher's point about equality in the classroom. A teacher is there to teach. Part of that role involves discipline and being an authority figure in the room when necessary. Teachers implement rules in their classroom which are part of school policy. Students are required to follow these rules. Teachers are not bound to the same set of requirements, e.g. dress code. Therefore teachers and students are not equal in the classroom.

Is this teacher just trying to 'be down with the kids'?

evolving_doors · 04-12-2014 11:15pm

Just toe the party line. I worked in both situations and did whatever the norm was, however i think the formality just gives you a little bit of professional distance.
Maybe that's just me and my own upbringing though, i tend to use the Mr. Mrs. title when speaking with parents. When they give their first name and insist I use it it irks me a bit as they invariably end up using my first name.
I do get a bit annoyed when other teachers great me in the corridor and use my first name in the presence of the other students too.
Maybe i just have issues.

implausible · 04-12-2014 11:29pm

She sounds like a bit of an eejit to be honest. If you're subbing, you try to make a good impression, be super efficient and you don't rock the boat, if you hope to be kept on.

My PLCs use my first name as I feel weird having older students especially call me miss and besides, the relationship is different, you're more of a facilitator in further ed.

With mainstream students, it's Ms Implausible, they all know my first name (it's on emails, on my books and equipment and they hear other teachers) sometimes try using it to get a reaction and when I ignore it, it's back to Ms again. I have a very good relationship with the majority of my students, but at the end of the day, we are not equals and I think saying Ms is a handy reminder to the boundary between us.

That said, I know the local Educate Together use first names, some prefixed with 'teacher', but if it's a schoolwide thing, it's probably not that much of an issue.

rainbowtrout · 04-12-2014 11:34pm

I'd agree with the above and I think in primary schools where first name is prefixed with Muinteoir there is still some formality and a recognition of the professional role of the teacher in the classroom, it's not completely casual.

Roquentin · 04-12-2014 11:37pm

calling someone by a first name builds rapport......but given its a school(young people) one could lose respect

Pinkycharm · 05-12-2014 9:00am

Thanks for the replies everyone yeah she'd be fairly well known in the community with a youth club so maybe that's her reason I'm not sure. I don't think it's to be down with the kids because she's huge on discipline, she does extra supervision at lunch time (off her own bat) and my second years are terrified of her. No policy on it like the kids obviously know our first names but just never use them. I'm too used to being called miss to change things but just thought it was something new as she's only a very recent graduate so I was thinking maybe it was something they were being taught to do. I'm sure if the school had an issue she'd have been reprimanded about it already.

happywithlife · 05-12-2014 4:58pm

Personally I'd prefer miss in the classroom even though I'm known outside the school too with coaching etc. Have even taught relatives and spoke to them before starting and told them I'd prefer to be just miss in school. It helps set the boundaries between work and home in my view. I worry sometimes about younger graduates. Was talking to someone recently re Facebook etc and the amount of young teachers "friends" with students etc is frightening. No way would I allow that. I think because some of the younger graduates have grown up with social media they aren't as aware of the boundaries? Even the rellies I taught were long gone from school before I added them as friends on fb. I do tweet school related stuff but it's under my classroom name /school name not my personal account. It's something that ought to be addressed during teacher training IMO

Chancer3001 · 05-12-2014 5:57pm

I called my irish teacher by his first name.

And he was by far the best teacher we had, about 29 As in the class.

implausible · 05-12-2014 8:27pm

Chancer3001 wrote: »

I called my irish teacher by his first name.

And he was by far the best teacher we had, about 29 As in the class.

So therefore, A causes B? (or create A's in this case!)

I don't doubt that there are excellent teachers who are known by their first name, in the same way that there are excellent teachers who don't adhere to a school dress code, but by and large, most teachers would feel that the formality of a title and dressing smartly help to create boundaries. Students are often in dire need of such boundaries too.

05-12-2014 10:31pm

Armelodie wrote: »

When they give their first name and insist I use it it irks me a bit as they invariably end up using my first name.

[...]

Maybe i just have issues.

Maybe you do.

My son's primary school did first names for everyone. His post-primary school doesn't. Sin mar a ritheann an saol, and I expect him to go along with that just like the rest of the school.

But I don't refer to my bank manager as "Ms." in conversation, and the same goes for anyone else I deal with in the public service or in commercial businesses. I'm not going to refer to a teacher in that way, and any notion that I should is seriously misguided and outdated.

implausible · 05-12-2014 10:48pm

Deleted User wrote: »

Maybe you do.

My son's primary school did first names for everyone. His post-primary school doesn't. Sin mar a ritheann an saol, and I expect him to go along with that just like the rest of the school.

But I don't refer to my bank manager as "Ms." in conversation, and the same goes for anyone else I deal with in the public service or in commercial businesses. I'm not going to refer to a teacher in that way, and any notion that I should is seriously misguided and outdated.

I don't think it has anything to do with teachers having "misguided and outdated" notions; it's to do with mutual respect. I don't really mind what name parents use when speaking to me, but I can see how a teacher would see it as a mutual respect issue if s/he calls the parents Mr or Mrs and they, without being advised, start referring to the teacher (who may be practically a stranger) by his/her first name.

Mind you, I still refer to gardaí, doctors or priests as guard, doctor or father when dealing with them, so maybe I have misguided and outdated notions too. If they were friends, or insisted I used their first names, I would use the first name.

evolving_doors · 05-12-2014 11:06pm

Deleted User wrote: »

Maybe you do.

My son's primary school did first names for everyone. His post-primary school doesn't. Sin mar a ritheann an saol, and I expect him to go along with that just like the rest of the school.

But I don't refer to my bank manager as "Ms." in conversation, and the same goes for anyone else I deal with in the public service or in commercial businesses. I'm not going to refer to a teacher in that way, and any notion that I should is seriously misguided and outdated.

Ya fair enough, don't get me wrong I don't insist that parents call me by my title name, I just get on with the meeting in hand, it just feels odd! So in school situations I prefer to go with the formal. In my own mind I'm 'Mr X.' in school and then 'Bob' to my friends/family in informal circumstances. In my own head if I hear people I don't know using my first name in formal circumstances I think "Hey hold on a second I don't know you why are you pretending to be on a 'first name basis' with me". I just think it's a boundary that someone else has taken the decision to cross without permission.

I'm sure we've heard of the showmen/magicians/hypnotists on stage who get a volunteer up and ask for their full name (or take the pi** if the volunteer just gives their first name) then they move swiftly to the phrase "you don't mind if I call you Bob do you" so it puts them in a 'superior position' straight away as they've forced a 'pseudo acquaintance' into the situation when none exists.

So I'm afraid in a parent/pupil/teacher situation then it's the formal I prefer. And for John Smith's mother or father then I always defer to Mr./Mrs Smith, like at the parent teacher meeting there's never any faffing about with "oh please call me by my first name" it's just Hello Mr. X, hello Mr Smith and down to business.
Likewise when I ring up to get car insurance/go to bank/go traveling hotel airport it's Mr. X all the way (from both parties), ya maybe if I build up a rapport with someone on a continuous basis and I meet them lets say once or twice a month then it might move to first name, but using the first name in a formal situation for the first time (or once/twice a year) just reminds me of salesmen trying to make me a pitch.

As I've said I have worked in a first name/no uniform school and really I didn't like the casual informality of it all. I don't think I'm alone in it though!

05-12-2014 11:10pm

implausible wrote: »

....it's to do with mutual respect.

My son's primary school used first names as part of a structured system designed to reinforce mutual respect.

It seems to have little to do with respect and more to do with deference. While that might be acceptable in the classroom, it's not acceptable outside. An argument that a teacher should be able to insist on "Mr" or "Ms" only holds water if everyone else in public and commercial services is insisting on it as well. They aren't.

implausible wrote: »

Mind you, I still refer to gardaí, doctors or priests as guard, doctor or father when dealing with them, so maybe I have misguided and outdated notions too.

Possibly. A common reason why people use those terms is because they regard people in those professions as authority figures. I regard Gardaí as authority figures because they are, although as it happens I do tend to refer to a couple of Gardaí in my local station by their names because I've dealt with them frequently over the years. I generally don't refer to doctors in this way, though I sometimes will on first introduction, and I never regard a religious "official" as an authority figure.

But teachers aren't authority figures. They may well be such in the classroom, but they are aren't when they're talking to the likes of me. How can they be an authority figure to me? How can I be an authority figure to them? That doesn't make sense.

05-12-2014 11:26pm

Armelodie wrote: »

So I'm afraid in a parent/pupil/teacher situation then it's the formal I prefer.

I've occasionally met people (in all sorts of professions) who prefer to call me "Mr....", but it's increasingly uncommon. I have on rare occasions met people who referred to me by my first name and who then clearly bristled when I responded in kind. I don't recall a teacher ever doing that, I should say, and the small number of others who did it were, for want of a better technical term, eejits.

As long as there's mutuality, then it's up to people to sort out how to address each other in a reasonable and respectful way. But this is Ireland, and we do deference reluctantly and grudgingly. I suspect that for most of us our preferred style of dealing with the people who provide our public and commercial services would be the communication equivalent of the "smart casual" dress code.

I do wonder if it's the case that for teachers, especially older teachers, there's a sense of the culture of deference about it. There was a time - and young teachers might be surprised at this - when teachers were almost universally better educated than the parents of the children they were teaching. That gave teachers a considerable status in society and the community, with some degree of deference attached. But that has changed and is continuing to change, and maybe that's not an easy change for some people.

implausible · 05-12-2014 11:37pm

Deleted User wrote: »

My son's primary school used first names as part of a structured system designed to reinforce mutual respect.

It seems to have little to do with respect and more to do with deference. While that might be acceptable in the classroom, it's not acceptable outside. An argument that a teacher should be able to insist on "Mr" or "Ms" only holds water if everyone else in public and commercial services is insisting on it as well. They aren't.

Possibly. A common reason why people use those terms is because they regard people in those professions as authority figures. I regard Gardaí as authority figures because they are, although as it happens I do tend to refer to a couple of Gardaí in my local station by their names because I've dealt with them frequently over the years. I generally don't refer to doctors in this way, though I sometimes will on first introduction, and I never regard a religious "official" as an authority figure.

But teachers aren't authority figures. They may well be such in the classroom, but they are aren't when they're talking to the likes of me. How can they be an authority figure to me? How can I be an authority figure to them? That doesn't make sense.

The mutual respect I referred to was between parent and teacher! I refer to the parents as Mr or Mrs or whatever and they give it back. I do think it's a bit of a liberty to start referring to someone you don't know by their first name, unless they indicate it's the way they prefer it.

You seem to be confusing manners and respect with deference. I know that times have changed, I know that some people have had bad memories of school and this can cloud their opinion of all teachers (the same goes for the gardaí and the church) but there's nothing wrong with a bit of manners towards people, no matter what profession they are in.

Is someone introduces themselves to me as Mr Kelly, regardless of their position, I will call him that and not presume to use his first name.

My name professionally is Ms Implausible, I prefer to decide when people use my first name and it irritates me something rotten when my mother addresses post to me using my husband's name!

evolving_doors · 06-12-2014 12:26am

Deleted User wrote: »

I've occasionally met people (in all sorts of professions) who prefer to call me "Mr....", but it's increasingly uncommon. I have on rare occasions met people who referred to me by my first name and who then clearly bristled when I responded in kind. I don't recall a teacher ever doing that, I should say, and the small number of others who did it were, for want of a better technical term, eejits.

As long as there's mutuality, then it's up to people to sort out how to address each other in a reasonable and respectful way. But this is Ireland, and we do deference reluctantly and grudgingly. I suspect that for most of us our preferred style of dealing with the people who provide our public and commercial services would be the communication equivalent of the "smart casual" dress code.

I do wonder if it's the case that for teachers, especially older teachers, there's a sense of the culture of deference about it. There was a time - and young teachers might be surprised at this - when teachers were almost universally better educated than the parents of the children they were teaching. That gave teachers a considerable status in society and the community, with some degree of deference attached. But that has changed and is continuing to change, and maybe that's not an easy change for some people.

Well at the moment most of the parents I do meet are ever so 'slightly' older than me, so I'd classify myself still in the 'younger teacher' category for now, and as such alot of my 'equals' (even in other schools) do prefer the formal Mr. Mrs.

I don't expect a tugging of a forelock kind of thing but I would like it established that it is a formal situation i.e. the relationship between student and teacher (and teacher and parent). I don't really accept that it is an informal situation where we're all on a 'first name basis'. If I'm meeting John Smith's parents, the greeting is always a handshake (I'll stand up if the parents are standing at a PTM) then it's hello Mr. Smith and away we go. If they insist "oh please call me John" then yes, I'll go with that, but I ain't going t reciprocate with "ah shur you can call me Bob too".

Also, as I teach in a fee paying school then I'm well aware of perceptions of class/societal structure (and how teachers like myself are very much on the bottom rung to some parents and students). So yes, romantic Ireland is dead and gone but If my title is the last indication that I'm supposed to be some type of professional then I'd like to hold on to that at the very least.

But hey that's just me... maybe I shouldn't be greeting with a handshake either.. should I go for the bear-hug/hi-5's at PTM's, or is that just being silly. And if so why... should we be bristled and be eejits for refusing to engage in it?

spurious · 06-12-2014 5:25pm

In my first decade of teaching, we ran an after-school table tennis club, which ran from 6.30 to 9.30 Tuesdays and Thursdays - partly to keep them busy from alternative excitement middle 80s inner-city Dublin offered. During the club, the lads called the teachers by their first names. There was no issue about it. This was in the days when students were often called by their surname alone. The rules were relaxed about food in the school (chips!) and we even had smoke breaks for the lads and teachers out the back (God bless the 80s!).

As both the kids and the teachers were involved in competitive leagues there was occasionally a blue tinge to the air as shots would go awry (and not just from the kids), but none of that was ever mentioned during school time.

Everyone understood there was a time and a place for things and certain behaviours could be acceptable in one context, but not in another. Using teachers' first names or relaxing the language rules slightly only happened in the club. None of them ever pushed the line about it.

They were simpler times I suppose and not one of those lads would have called a teacher by their first name in school - it just wasn't done and they knew that.

That said, I personally would have no issue with students using my first name, though I think in a school where the majority expect Sir, Miss (or the ever hilarious 'Ma') that should be the rule for all.

bearhugs · 06-12-2014 6:39pm

I wouldn't have an issue with students calling me by my first name at all, as long as it was in line with the practices of the school. Our school is traditional and goes with the Sir/Ms which is fine as well. I would never call a parent Mr. or Mrs. Smith unless that's how they introduced themselves. I find so many families are blended or maybe the children have a different surname to the parent. I would feel that it's a little presumptuous nowadays to assume that the family share the same surname. You get to know the same parents year after year, but if I'm not sure I'll wait and see how they introduce themselves and take their lead.

06-12-2014 8:34pm

implausible wrote: »

You seem to be confusing manners and respect with deference.

No, I can tell the difference between them, and Ireland is a country with a culture of interpersonal communication that doesn't involve an excess of formality and stuffiness. I'm not sure why teachers should be a special case in that regard.

implausible wrote: »

Is someone introduces themselves to me as Mr Kelly.....

But they probably won't, for the most part. They'll probably introduce themselves as "Mick Kelly. I'm Dave Kelly's dad.", or something along those lines.

implausible wrote: »

My name professionally is Ms Implausible.....

That's not how it works in most services, whether in the public service or the commercial sector.

06-12-2014 8:48pm

Armelodie wrote: »

....but I would like it established that it is a formal situation i.e. the relationship between student and teacher (and teacher and parent).

It isn't a formal situation. It's a business situation, and as I've already mentioned Ireland has a relatively informal culture of interpersonal communication.

Armelodie wrote: »

Also, as I teach in a fee paying school....

My point stands regardless of what time of school you're teaching in.

Armelodie wrote: »

.. should I go for the bear-hug/hi-5's at PTM's, or is that just being silly.

I think probably the latter. No-one is asking you to behave in a silly fashion. I'm not, at any rate.

Armelodie wrote: »

... should we be bristled and be eejits for refusing to engage in it?

If you re-read my comment, you'll see that I was pointing out that I have on rare occasions met people who referred to me by my first name and who then clearly bristled when I responded in kind. I'm sure you'll agree that such behaviour lacks manners. And in any case, I noted that none of the people I could recall behaving in this way were teachers, so there's no reason for any teacher to be defensive about this.

And I'm not sure what it is you are concerned about engaging in. It's just being suggested that maybe a communication approach that works for people in most walks of life also works for teachers. I don't see what is wrong with Ireland's societal norm for interpersonal engagement and communication.

seavill · 06-12-2014 9:27pm

I don't see what ye are arguing about at this stage, thread has gone bit sideways.

Some people like addressing people by Mr/Mrs etc. that is their right, and they would like that same courtesty back, again their right.

Some people don't see the need in any circumstances, again their right.

The question was in relation to a teacher in a school where this would be the norm, not society in general. In relation to why the thread started, a good majority of the kids know me outside of school from sports and the locality. When we attend school matches some can call me by my first name due to the setting they are used to outside of school. I don't mind this.

It is the norm in my school that everyone is called Ms/Sir etc. Within the school environment the kids generally respect this, bar the odd bit of giddiness early on. If the school changed policy tomorrow I would have no problem either way, however I do find it a helpful way for the kids to separate school life from non school life, particularly in the early days in a new school where the kids would have known you before you arrived there.

Pinkycharm · 06-12-2014 9:58pm

Basically she allows her students to call her "Marie" in class when asking questions etc so instead of "Ms. Maher what does that mean" they would say "Marie, what does that mean". (that's not her name)

A student called her by her first name on the corridor Friday and got detention for it. She told the vice principal that it didnt bother her but he said that the other teachers preferred to be called Ms/Sir in his opinion and that that's what he wanted so guess that ended that. There is no policy in the school about it its just something that's there and always has been. She actually asked him if we had a policy on it and why can't she just do things her own way in her own classroom.

ANYWAYS

She was pretty pissed about it considering she had picked the idea up in another school where it seemingly worked well- teachers were open to it and there were rarely any discipline issues because students and teachers were on a mutual ground. Her theory was that if she knew students first names and everything about them, why shouldnt they at least have her first name.

Didnt get a word in edge ways at lunch on Friday!

think she is fighting a losing battle.

rainbowtrout · 06-12-2014 10:03pm

Pinkycharm wrote: »

Basically she allows her students to call her "Marie" in class when asking questions etc so instead of "Ms. Maher what does that mean" they would say "Marie, what does that mean". (that's not her name)

A student called her by her first name on the corridor Friday and got detention for it. She told the vice principal that it didnt bother her but he said that the other teachers preferred to be called Ms/Sir in his opinion and that that's what he wanted so guess that ended that. There is no policy in the school about it its just something that's there and always has been. She actually asked him if we had a policy on it and why can't she just do things her own way in her own classroom.

ANYWAYS

She was pretty pissed about it considering she had picked the idea up in another school where it seemingly worked well- teachers were open to it and there were rarely any discipline issues because students and teachers were on a mutual ground. Her theory was that if she knew students first names and everything about them, why shouldnt they at least have her first name.

Didnt get a word in edge ways at lunch on Friday!

think she is fighting a losing battle.

She really is making a rod for her own back. She's a sub in your school, she should be following the conventions of the school.

seavill · 06-12-2014 10:13pm

Pinkycharm wrote: »

ANYWAYS

She was pretty pissed about it considering she had picked the idea up in another school where it seemingly worked well- teachers were open to it and there were rarely any discipline issues because students and teachers were on a mutual ground.

Does anyone here believe that a schools discipline problem would be solved by calling teachers by their first name.
I've never heard anything so ridiculous. I think she happened to work in a school with little discipline problems (most likely due to backgrounds) rather than all their problems were solved by calling teachers by their first names.

I get along very well with some of the most troublesome kids in my school. I respect them, they respect me, what they call me has nothing to do with it

lazybones32 · 06-12-2014 10:30pm

If they call me by my first name, why should I refer to them as "Sir" or "Miss" only?
I understand a hierarchy needs to exist for order to be maintained and a learning environment to flourish, but I always found this to be...sort of putting them on a pedestal...like their name is beyond utterance. I always maintained that respect must be earned and not demanded by job title (just by being a teacher; priest; politician; doctor, etc).

I love learning but hated school

happywithlife · 06-12-2014 10:36pm

rainbowtrout wrote: »

She really is making a rod for her own back. She's a sub in your school, she should be following the conventions of the school.

This ^^^ particularly foolish IMO in the era we are in where work is so hard to come by. If a sub barely in the door 5mins almost insists on doing things their way, in contrary to the norm in the school; well I wouldn't be surprised if it's the only time she subs in that particular school.

seavill wrote: »

Does anyone here believe that a schools discipline problem would be solved by calling teachers by their first name.
I've never heard anything so ridiculous. I think she happened to work in a school with little discipline problems (most likely due to backgrounds) rather than all their problems were solved by calling teachers by their first names.

I get along very well with some of the most troublesome kids in my school. I respect them, they respect me, what they call me has nothing to do with it

I think she may be making the mistake of thinking what works well in one school can be repeated anywhere/everywhere else. I made that mistake myself early on but quickly learnt that what works well in one school /with one student /one class etc won't necessarily have the same success with another group. She'll learn 😃 Op is she a young inexperienced sub?

Pinkycharm · 06-12-2014 11:24pm

happywithlife wrote: »

This ^^^ particularly foolish IMO in the era we are in where work is so hard to come by. If a sub barely in the door 5mins almost insists on doing things their way, in contrary to the norm in the school; well I wouldn't be surprised if it's the only time she subs in that particular school.

I think she may be making the mistake of thinking what works well in one school can be repeated anywhere/everywhere else. I made that mistake myself early on but quickly learnt that what works well in one school /with one student /one class etc won't necessarily have the same success with another group. She'll learn &#55357;&#56835; Op is she a young inexperienced sub?

Think she's out about 3 years. Just since September I think myself that she has made a huge effort to be involved in the school- more so than even myself, she's literally involved in EVERYTHING! shes on low enough hours too but its gas i suppose how quickly someone can establish themselves somewhere. I was watching her making out her notes one day and she stamps the originals with her name followed by her letters (qualifications) so that nobody can steal them and her first name is on them too.

i dont know whether its to make a good impression that shes doing it or what, i feel kind of inadequate when i see her because I know i don't put as much effort in my lessons as her like she must plan for hours. but i suppose her subjects are completely different to mine too.

in a way i kind of admire her and even one of the older teachers commented saying she'd probably make a great DP or Principal someday. She has some drive behind her- i know she made a big deal about getting a 1st class honours dip, but to be honest i don't think that makes a difference really.

shes made sure to introduce herself to every member of staff, teaching and non teaching and is trying to start her own extra curricular after Christmas.

i know for a fact the school she came from before this was a great school and no ****e is taken off the students regardless of names. I just think it was something new she wanted to do or a stamp she was trying to put, maybe to validate herself of something.

she's a weird one to make out though. don't know whether to get to know her or to stay away from her!!

evolving_doors · 07-12-2014 12:36am

Deleted User wrote: »

It isn't a formal situation. It's a business situation, and as I've already mentioned Ireland has a relatively informal culture of interpersonal communication.

My point stands regardless of what time of school you're teaching in.

I think probably the latter. No-one is asking you to behave in a silly fashion. I'm not, at any rate.

If you re-read my comment, you'll see that I was pointing out that I have on rare occasions met people who referred to me by my first name and who then clearly bristled when I responded in kind. I'm sure you'll agree that such behaviour lacks manners. And in any case, I noted that none of the people I could recall behaving in this way were teachers, so there's no reason for any teacher to be defensive about this.

And I'm not sure what it is you are concerned about engaging in. It's just being suggested that maybe a communication approach that works for people in most walks of life also works for teachers. I don't see what is wrong with Ireland's societal norm for interpersonal engagement and communication.

Ok I'm clicking 'Follow' on this thread so let us know the outcome next year!

Pupils calling a teacher by a first name

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