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Julien Blanc gets destroyed in CNN interview

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Comments

  • #482
    volchitsa
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,118 ✭✭✭✭volchitsa


    Dan_Solo wrote: »
    http://www.puatraining.com/blog/pick-up-artist-techniques-you-need-to-master
    First match in Google.
    You're welcome.
    Why did it matter that you have some techniques listed anyway? You claim now to know negging isn't the only PUA technique now, yet you were insisting that was the only one a few pages back. Odd.

    That's actually quite creepy. The one about touching could be seriously bad advice to someone who doesn't actually inspire confidence generally - I'd say it's one that could land some guys in the local Garda station by the end of the night!

    Here's what I found : http://www.theguardian.com/lifeandstyle/2014/nov/23/class-pickup-artist-women-male-anxiety-julien-blanc

    It seems pretty much what I suggested earlier - it will seem to "work", due to a simple "numbers" effect for those guys who already can talk to women, but it is mainly a scam aimed at those who can't. That's where the salesmen make the money.

    "If a woman cannot stand in a public space and say, without fear of consequences, that men cannot be women, then women have no rights at all." Helen Joyce



  • #483
    Dan_Solo
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 10,087 ✭✭✭✭Dan_Solo


    One eyed Jack wrote: »
    What has women wearing make up got to do with men who follow these PUA 'gurus' and use their advice in order to approach women?
    I just explained exactly what! Did you even bother to read my post or just jump straight to "I can't answer... let's pretend he's strawmanning..."?
    If PUAs are being deceitful with their approach then women using make up are also just as deceitful. Unless you are claiming women never approach men except when they've no make up on.
    Is that really just too complicated for you to even understand, nevermind attempt to form a response?
    One eyed Jack wrote: »
    Let's see if you can address the thread topic instead of trying to say "Well if you think X is wrong, rather than me address that, I'll bring up Y instead and tell you what's wrong with that".
    100% explained. You just refuse to get it, presumably as you have no answer.


  • #484
    Dan_Solo
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 10,087 ✭✭✭✭Dan_Solo


    volchitsa wrote: »
    That's actually quite creepy. The one about touching could be seriously bad advice to someone who doesn't actually inspire confidence generally - I'd say it's one that could land some guys in the local Garda station by the end of the night!

    Here's what I found : http://www.theguardian.com/lifeandstyle/2014/nov/23/class-pickup-artist-women-male-anxiety-julien-blanc

    It seems pretty much what I suggested earlier - it will seem to "work", due to a simple "numbers" effect for those guys who already can talk to women, but it is mainly a scam aimed at those who can't. That's where the salesmen make the money.
    Of course it's creepy to read about how you're being played. Nobody likes to be played. Who knows what the success rate is, there's hardly any stats behind any of it.


  • #485
    volchitsa
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,118 ✭✭✭✭volchitsa


    Dan_Solo wrote: »
    Of course it's creepy to read about how you're being played. Nobody likes to be played. Who knows what the success rate is, there's hardly any stats behind any of it.

    I've been married for a good few years now, any "playing" being done now is by or on my teenage children, so no, that isn't why I find it creepy.

    As for the absence of stats behind it, that just proves my point. Men are paying these people small fortunes to learn how to manipulate women into doing what they want - and they don't even realize that if the person is that good at manipulating people, he's just as likely, of not more so, to be using similar mind-game techniques on them to get them to hand over their cash!

    "If a woman cannot stand in a public space and say, without fear of consequences, that men cannot be women, then women have no rights at all." Helen Joyce



  • #486
    Dan_Solo
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 10,087 ✭✭✭✭Dan_Solo


    volchitsa wrote: »
    I've been married for a good few years now, any "playing" being done now is by or on my teenage children, so no, that isn't why I find it creepy.

    As for the absence of stats behind it, that just proves my point. Men are paying these people small fortunes to learn how to manipulate women into doing what they want - and they don't even realize that if the person is that good at manipulating people, he's just as likely, of not more so, to be using similar mind-game techniques on them to get them to hand over their cash!
    Ah, but if you are admitting that he DOES have techniques for manipulating people, then you are also admitting he COULD teach other people those techniques... so there isn't necessarily any scam at all.
    That was the royal "you're" BTW. No need to take it personally.


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  • #487
    One eyed Jack
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 24,926 ✭✭✭✭One eyed Jack


    Dan_Solo wrote: »
    I just explained exactly what! Did you even bother to read my post or just jump straight to "I can't answer... let's pretend he's strawmanning..."?
    If PUAs are being deceitful with their approach then women using make up are also just as deceitful. Unless you are claiming women never approach men except when they've no make up on.
    Is that really just too complicated for you to even understand, nevermind attempt to form a response?

    100% explained. You just refuse to get it, presumably as you have no answer.


    You could only argue that if you knew for a fact that women who wore make up only did so with the intention of making themselves attractive to men. I would contend that the vast majority of women use makeup and bra fillers and spanx and all the rest of it to feel better about themselves, not solely because they want to appear attractive to the opposite sex.

    Men who use PUA only do so with the intention of making themselves appear attractive to women. I would contend that is the sole purpose of pick up artistry - to pick up women. If these men approach women wearing makeup who would not have otherwise shown any interest in them, then you can't say these women are intending to deceive you, but these women can point out your attempts to deceive them.


  • #488
    Dan_Solo
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 10,087 ✭✭✭✭Dan_Solo


    One eyed Jack wrote: »
    Men who use PUA only do so with the intention of making themselves appear attractive to women. I would contend that is the sole purpose of pick up artistry - to pick up women. If these men approach women wearing makeup who would not have otherwise shown any interest in them, then you can't say these women are intending to deceive you, but these women can point out your attempts to deceive them.
    If women wear make up they are attempting to make themselves look better than they really are, whether for themselves or not.
    When they then approach a man they are creating a false impression of their beauty, i.e. deceiving.
    It's really that simple. Unless, as I said, you think women never approach men?


  • #489
    volchitsa
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,118 ✭✭✭✭volchitsa


    Dan_Solo wrote: »
    Ah, but if you are admitting that he DOES have techniques for manipulating people, then you are also admitting he COULD teach other people those techniques... so there isn't necessarily any scam at all.
    That was the royal "you're" BTW. No need to take it personally.

    Of course it was meant personally, since I had said I found it creepy. It makes no sense otherwise. And there is no royal you. It's we. Which I notice you didn't use.

    But the point is that it's a scam because it doesn't work, except with those men who don't really need it in the first place. It "works" (for the seller) because the other men pay him money to let them in on his "secret" too. And that is what it's really about.

    "If a woman cannot stand in a public space and say, without fear of consequences, that men cannot be women, then women have no rights at all." Helen Joyce



  • #490
    One eyed Jack
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 24,926 ✭✭✭✭One eyed Jack


    Dan_Solo wrote: »
    If women wear make up they are attempting to make themselves look better than they really are, whether for themselves or not.
    When they then approach a man they are creating a false impression of their beauty, i.e. deceiving.
    It's really that simple. Unless, as I said, you think women never approach men?


    Of course women approach men, but they're not wearing makeup because they think that particular man will find that particular look attractive. They're not doing any different to a man who takes care of his appearance and wears makeup or a toupee or whatever other physical alterations he makes to his appearance to feel more confident in himself.

    With PUA, the deception is more than just what is presented on the surface. You're trying to pretend you're a different person completely. You're not just trying to make yourself more attractive as a person, you're trying to adopt a personality that you think will make you attractive to women (and not just any women, but 'top tier' women who are interested in 'status').

    That's not only you deceiving yourself by trying to pretend you're someone you're not, but you're also attempting to deceive the object of your desire by trying to pretend you could be someone that you think she could be interested in.

    You're not particularly interested in what's underneath the makeup, as you are in what's underneath her clothes, and you're engaging in deceiving her in order to achieve that aim. I'm not particularly bothered whether you can or can't see what's wrong with that, as I expect that most women are intelligent enough that they don't fall for those immature teenage mentality tactics.

    This is also why I find it quite amusing when I see grown men trying to do this PUA crap with grown women, because I know these women personally, and I know that they appreciate honesty and someone who is genuine. They're respectful to any man provided he isn't behaving like a dick and trying to treat them like they have no minds of their own.

    That's just disrespectful, and that's why despite their claims of success, none of these 'gurus' are able to interact with women in any meaningful way, hence why they spend their time selling their wares to men who are desperate for an immediate solution to what they see as their immediate need. The men they're selling to lack the self awareness to realise that their issues go much deeper than just being able to be addressed by behaving robotically with women and expecting their knickers will drop, as if they just can't help but be charmed by such a lack of any chemistry or otherwise human interaction that PUAs have been unable to quantify and capitalise on.


  • #491
    Foxtrol
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 11,307 ✭✭✭✭Foxtrol


    One eyed Jack wrote: »
    They're not doing it with the intent of deceiving anyone though.

    I'll ask you again seeing as the last time I asked you avoided answering. What are they doing it for then? What do they gain?
    You can't blame a person whom YOU approached, for what you claim is them being deceptive. They didn't set out to deceive you, whereas by employing PUA tactics, you're already approaching them with the intent to deceive them and present a false perception of yourself to them. They haven't approached you, so they are not responsible for your feeling you were deceived.

    So if a woman starts talking to a guy it's ok for them to use PUA techniques because she instigated the conversation?

    If a woman approaches a guy and has altered her appearance (in one of the many, many different ways out there) then is she doing something wrong?
    Names like? There are so many I find it hard to keep track, but to give you an example of some of the nonsense they come out with, their 'students' are fed guff like "women are all whores and sluts, they like to be dominated by alpha males", waffle about evolution and pseudoscience, wrapping psychology up in appealing metaphors, treating both women and men as though there's an arithmetical formula to be cracked that will unlock the secrets of 'the female brain'.

    The poster I was responding to claimed PUA involved 'undermining the other person so as to bring them "down" to their level'. I simply asked them to list these terrible techniques they heard of. If posters want to make claims they need to back them up.

    And there's tonnes of stuff out there directed out there claiming what men like in women. How dare they try to box 'the male brain'!!
    I can't speak for anyone else, but you seem to be asking would it be ok for you to engage in negging? Why, may I ask, would you want to?

    Not sure where you got that from.

    The other poster made a claim that it was ok to hurl uneducated comments about all PUA because of what Blanc did, so I simply asked that because there are extreme elements within the beauty industry is it ok for me to make blanket statements about all women who purchase things from any part of the beauty industry. Funny she never answered.
    Do two wrongs in your opinion make a right? Instead of acknowledging that people find PUA distasteful, you try and justify it on the basis that something else is just as distasteful and expect people to defend that?

    Nope, I don't believe the large majority of either is wrong. I'm pretty consistent with my opinion on both, the extremes are distasteful but that's it.

    I acknowledge that some posters haven't performed any research (outside of reading outraged headlines) and have come to the opinion that PUA is distasteful. I also acknowledge that many of these posters hypercritically deceive and manipulate people as often, if not more, than those using PUA techniques but refuse to admit it.
    That's simply a distraction technique used to divert attention away from what we're actually supposed to be discussing, which is PUA. Women's make-up is another thread entirely. This thread is about men who have appear to have no respect for themselves and no respect for women, and ironically you want to turn it into a thread where you're looking for permission from women to be disrespectful towards women...

    That's attractive.

    Pointing out posters hypocritical opinions is a perfectly fine technique. It's especially the case when the most, if not all, of the posters against the topic refuse to listen to people who have actually done research on the topic while still continuously refuse to carry out their own.

    I'm not actually looking for permission to do that, I'm using those questions as a device to again point out how hypocritical and possibly sexist these posters are. It's a great example of one rule/set of judgments for men while another for women. So much for equality!


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  • #492
    alwald
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,290 ✭✭✭alwald


    I didn't know who was this guy before today, watched few videos on youtube about what he does and then came across this video https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bVrHs4voRB0

    Apologies if it was posted before, I didn't go through the entire 34 pages.


  • #493
    Foxtrol
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 11,307 ✭✭✭✭Foxtrol


    One eyed Jack wrote: »
    Of course women approach men, but they're not wearing makeup because they think that particular man will find that particular look attractive. They're not doing any different to a man who takes care of his appearance and wears makeup or a toupee or whatever other physical alterations he makes to his appearance to feel more confident in himself.

    With PUA, the deception is more than just what is presented on the surface. You're trying to pretend you're a different person completely. You're not just trying to make yourself more attractive as a person, you're trying to adopt a personality that you think will make you attractive to women (and not just any women, but 'top tier' women who are interested in 'status').

    That's not only you deceiving yourself by trying to pretend you're someone you're not, but you're also attempting to deceive the object of your desire by trying to pretend you could be someone that you think she could be interested in.

    You're not particularly interested in what's underneath the makeup, as you are in what's underneath her clothes, and you're engaging in deceiving her in order to achieve that aim. I'm not particularly bothered whether you can or can't see what's wrong with that, as I expect that most women are intelligent enough that they don't fall for those immature teenage mentality tactics.

    This is also why I find it quite amusing when I see grown men trying to do this PUA crap with grown women, because I know these women personally, and I know that they appreciate honesty and someone who is genuine. They're respectful to any man provided he isn't behaving like a dick and trying to treat them like they have no minds of their own.

    That's just disrespectful, and that's why despite their claims of success, none of these 'gurus' are able to interact with women in any meaningful way, hence why they spend their time selling their wares to men who are desperate for an immediate solution to what they see as their immediate need. The men they're selling to lack the self awareness to realise that their issues go much deeper than just being able to be addressed by behaving robotically with women and expecting their knickers will drop, as if they just can't help but be charmed by such a lack of any chemistry or otherwise human interaction that PUAs have been unable to quantify and capitalise on.

    This is actually a hilarious post.

    Your last few posts have bounced between giving out to men who use PUA tactics for boxing all women under 'the female brain' and treating all women the same and then you go on this rant which does that exact same thing. Telling every guy who has looked at PUA techniques what they're all trying to achieve, what all their problems are, why they're all trying to do it, who they're all trying to target, what they're all interested in. It's really laughable, even worse by the total lack of research you've done on the subject!


  • #494
    volchitsa
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,118 ✭✭✭✭volchitsa


    Foxtrol wrote: »
    The poster I was responding to claimed PUA involved 'undermining the other person so as to bring them "down" to their level'. I simply asked them to list these terrible techniques they heard of. If posters want to make claims they need to back them up.

    The other poster made a claim that it was ok to hurl uneducated comments about all PUA because of what Blanc did, so I simply asked that because there are extreme elements within the beauty industry is it ok for me to make blanket statements about all women who purchase things from any part of the beauty industry. Funny she never answered.

    I guess you mean me. I didn't answer because I had already dealt with the problem behind that comparison, in fact a couple of times now. More point in me repeating myself if you aren't going to read what I've already posted.

    And no, I hurled no "uneducated insults". Quite the opposite - I asked questions about what else it might consist of apart from what is on here, and got quite rude aggressive replies for the most part.
    Which is as significant as the eventual link some of the supposed experts finally managed to dig up for me (what I had perhaps naively expected was that some of its proponents might have been able to just, you know, actually express for themselves in a line or two what they thought was positive about it. But apparently the much-vaunted self expression taught in PUA doesn't seem to extend as far as actually expressing oneself, other than by soundbites and posting links.)

    Again, I'd say that tells me a great deal about PUA, certainly as much as the advertising linked to earlier did.

    "If a woman cannot stand in a public space and say, without fear of consequences, that men cannot be women, then women have no rights at all." Helen Joyce



  • #495
    volchitsa
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,118 ✭✭✭✭volchitsa


    Foxtrol wrote: »
    This is actually a hilarious post.

    Your last few posts have bounced between giving out to men who use PUA tactics for boxing all women under 'the female brain' and treating all women the same and then you go on this rant which does that exact same thing. Telling every guy who has looked at PUA techniques what they're all trying to achieve, what all their problems are, why they're all trying to do it, who they're all trying to target, what they're all interested in. It's really laughable, even worse by the total lack of research you've done on the subject!

    So the proponent of PUA earlier who said the men using/learning it would only judge it by whether or not they were "getting the rides" from it, would you say that poster doesn't have a clue about what it's really for?

    "If a woman cannot stand in a public space and say, without fear of consequences, that men cannot be women, then women have no rights at all." Helen Joyce



  • #496
    Foxtrol
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 11,307 ✭✭✭✭Foxtrol


    volchitsa wrote: »
    I guess you mean me. I didn't answer because I had already dealt with the problem behind that comparison, in fact a couple of times now. More point in me repeating myself if you aren't going to read what I've already posted.

    And no, I hurled no "uneducated insults". Quite the opposite - I asked questions about what else it might consist of apart from what is on here, and got quite rude aggressive replies for the most part.
    Which is as significant as the eventual link some of the supposed experts finally managed to dig up for me (what I had perhaps naively expected was that some of its proponents might have been able to just, you know, actually express for themselves in a line or two what they thought was positive about it. But apparently the much-vaunted self expression taught in PUA doesn't seem to extend as far as actually expressing oneself, other than by soundbites and posting links.)

    Again, I'd say that tells me a great deal about PUA, certainly as much as the advertising linked to earlier did.

    What I asked was for you to list out the techniques that brought you to such a dislike for PUA. From my count you've mention Blanc and negging out of the thousands of techniques out there, so yes your opinion is uneducated.

    There's posts throughout the thread listing the positives of PUA and listing many PUA techniques. If you didn't read the thread then I'm not sure what you want.


  • #497
    Dan_Solo
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 10,087 ✭✭✭✭Dan_Solo


    volchitsa wrote: »
    So the proponent of PUA earlier who said the men using/learning it would only judge it by whether or not they were "getting the rides" from it, would you say that poster doesn't have a clue about what it's really for?
    Why are you always speaking in absolutes?
    PUA could be used for getting more than one thing. Claiming it is only used for the thing I gave as an example is disingenuous but transparently so.


  • #498
    ireland.man
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,080 ✭✭✭ireland.man


    About the interview itself, I wouldn't be surprised if his display of nervousness, his upset and his submissive demeanor were all put on to some extent, another attempt at manipulating how others might perceive him.


  • #499
    Foxtrol
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 11,307 ✭✭✭✭Foxtrol


    volchitsa wrote: »
    So the proponent of PUA earlier who said the men using/learning it would only judge it by whether or not they were "getting the rides" from it, would you say that poster doesn't have a clue about what it's really for?

    That's his opinion.

    The 'male mind' shouldn't be boxed just because the opinion of some men, just like it's the case for women.


  • #500
    volchitsa
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,118 ✭✭✭✭volchitsa


    Foxtrol wrote: »
    What I asked was for you to list out the techniques that brought you to such a dislike for PUA. From my count you've mention Blanc and negging out of the thousands of techniques out there, so yes your opinion is uneducated.

    There's posts throughout the thread listing the positives of PUA and listing many PUA techniques. If you didn't read the thread then I'm not sure what you want.

    I have a dislike of any technique that sets out to manipulate other people. I don't like mind games and I don't like people who try to play them. In any domain, not just male-female relationships.

    I have seen pieces of advice from the PUA sites etc in the info posted on here that seem absolutely fine, and I have no problem at all with them - except as a punter : if I had paid hard money for them I'd feel very short changed, as they mostly seem blindingly obvious.

    What I object to is the mind game stuff, and saying that it's only a part of PUA doesn't diminish my objection to that part of it.

    "If a woman cannot stand in a public space and say, without fear of consequences, that men cannot be women, then women have no rights at all." Helen Joyce



  • #501
    volchitsa
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,118 ✭✭✭✭volchitsa


    Dan_Solo wrote: »
    Why are you always speaking in absolutes?
    PUA could be used for getting more than one thing. Claiming it is only used for the thing I gave as an example is disingenuous but transparently so.

    Except you were the one who made that claim, not me. You said that was the only thing the men using it would judge it by. Now you are saying something else are you? It'd be handy if you could decide what though, it's not easy having a discussion with someone who can't make up their mind what their point is.

    "If a woman cannot stand in a public space and say, without fear of consequences, that men cannot be women, then women have no rights at all." Helen Joyce



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  • #502
    pueblo
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 728 ✭✭✭pueblo


    Potatoeman wrote: »
    I'm casually interested in phycology, social interactions and body language. It can be very interesting to watch for once you recognise some of the social tics people have.


    Can you list your top ten tics?


  • #503
    volchitsa
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,118 ✭✭✭✭volchitsa


    Foxtrol wrote: »
    That's his opinion.

    The 'male mind' shouldn't be boxed just because the opinion of some men, just like it's the case for women.

    Like I said right from the start, it isn't just the fact of using it as a way of getting sex that I dislike about it, it's any form of emotional manipulation of other people that I find objectionable. So how am I boxing in the "male mind" (where did I ever say anything like that, btw?) when my objection to men or women using those techniques to get ahead in work, say, would be just the same?

    "If a woman cannot stand in a public space and say, without fear of consequences, that men cannot be women, then women have no rights at all." Helen Joyce



  • #504
    TheBeardedLady
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,086 ✭✭✭TheBeardedLady


    ireland.man wrote: »
    About the interview itself, I wouldn't be surprised if his display of nervousness, his upset and his submissive demeanor were all put on to some extent, another attempt at manipulating how others might perceive him.

    I agree. I don't believe he was sorry or in any way nervous. The guy is a sociopath - sociopaths commonly don't suffer from nerves or feel remorse. The man has all the traits of a sociopath. Truly horrible individual (yes, I've read more on him).


  • #505
    Dan_Solo
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 10,087 ✭✭✭✭Dan_Solo


    volchitsa wrote: »
    Except you were the one who made that claim, not me. You said that was the only thing the men using it would judge it by. Now you are saying something else are you? It'd be handy if you could decide what though, it's not easy having a discussion with someone who can't make up their mind what their point is.
    There's no doubt that some, even most, men are after sex from PUA techniques. So what? That doesn't mean they all are and why would it make any difference anyway?
    Again, your insistence that PUA = X when it can be X, Y or Z means you are incapable of holding a discussion on it.


  • #506
    volchitsa
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,118 ✭✭✭✭volchitsa


    Dan_Solo wrote: »
    There's no doubt that some, even most, men are after sex from PUA techniques. So what? That doesn't mean they all are and why would it make any difference anyway?
    Again, your insistence that PUA = X when it can be X, Y or Z means you are incapable of holding a discussion on it.
    You seem to have difficulty understanding how discussions work, you really do. The insistence that PUA = X, where X= "getting the rides in" was yours. Not mine. So if there is a problem holding a discussion about the possible uses Y and Z (any chance of some examples, by the way?), you shouldn't have started by claiming it was only about X.
    Dan_Solo wrote: »
    The question is, does this get the rides in or not? If it does I doubt he or his customers give two sheets whether the methods are "questionable" or not.
    As an aside, "questionable" means nothing really unless we're told what the question is.
    You just said what the question was, it was about sex. Have you now decided that was a mistake?

    "If a woman cannot stand in a public space and say, without fear of consequences, that men cannot be women, then women have no rights at all." Helen Joyce



  • #507
    Dan_Solo
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 10,087 ✭✭✭✭Dan_Solo


    volchitsa wrote: »
    Like I said right from the start, it isn't just the fact of using it as a way of getting sex that I dislike about it, it's any form of emotional manipulation of other people that I find objectionable.
    What part of any human action isn't a manipulation of some sort? Do you feel such disgust every time you see an advertisement?
    What about artists, priests and psychiatrists? They try to manipulate emotions all the time. Off with their heads!


  • #508
    Dan_Solo
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 10,087 ✭✭✭✭Dan_Solo


    volchitsa wrote: »
    You seem to have difficulty understanding how discussions work, you really do. The insistence that PUA = X, where X= "getting the rides in" was yours. Not mine. So if there is a problem holding a discussion about the possible uses Y and Z (any chance of some examples, by the way?), you shouldn't have started by claiming it was only about X.

    You just said what the question was, it was about sex. Have you now decided that was a mistake?
    Most men would be using PUA to get sex, and judging if they got their money's worth on this.
    Where did I use the word ONLY? Can you quote me on that? Careful now, "implied", "meant", "obviously" and all that other junk will be squashed flat.
    Making stuff up is easy. You're not good enough to get away with it though.


  • #509
    volchitsa
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,118 ✭✭✭✭volchitsa


    Dan_Solo wrote: »
    What part of any human action isn't a manipulation of some sort? Do you feel such disgust every time you see an advertisement?
    What about artists, priests and psychiatrists? They try to manipulate emotions all the time. Off with their heads!

    Can't speak for artists, who are more usually trying to express their own feelings rather than manipulate ours, I'd have thought, but priests and psychiatrists are supposed to be helping people, not using their skills for their own ends, in fact that is why there is a risk of such people becoming abusers, because they could use their skills abusively.

    So your "proof" that this already exists actually tends to indicate that (if it isn't a scam) it is actually quite dangerous for society to allow people to think it is acceptable to use mind manipulation techniques on others for their own ends.

    "If a woman cannot stand in a public space and say, without fear of consequences, that men cannot be women, then women have no rights at all." Helen Joyce



  • #510
    volchitsa
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,118 ✭✭✭✭volchitsa


    Dan_Solo wrote: »
    Most men would be using PUA to get sex, and judging if they got their money's worth on this.
    Where did I use the word ONLY? Can you quote me on that? Careful now, "implied", "meant", "obviously" and all that other junk will be squashed flat.
    Making stuff up is easy. You're not good enough to get away with it though.

    You do understand what the use of the definite article "the" means? As in "The question is"?

    Perhaps you don't really understand the full implications of what you have said yourself, I don't know. But it really was perfectly clear. If it isn't what you meant, you should say so.

    "If a woman cannot stand in a public space and say, without fear of consequences, that men cannot be women, then women have no rights at all." Helen Joyce



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  • #511
    Dan_Solo
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 10,087 ✭✭✭✭Dan_Solo


    volchitsa wrote: »
    Can't speak for artists, who are more usually trying to express their own feelings rather than manipulate ours, I'd have thought, but priests and psychiatrists are supposed to be helping people, not using their skills for their own ends, in fact that is why there is a risk of such people becoming abusers, because they could use their skills abusively.

    So your "proof" that this already exists actually tends to indicate that (if it isn't a scam) it is actually quite dangerous for society to allow people to think it is acceptable to use mind manipulation techniques on others for their own ends.
    Ah, I see you skipped advertising manipulating emotions completely.
    So what if art contains the artist's emotion. It either can or can't affect the viewer's emotion, so if it does you claim to be disgusted by it.
    Priests want you to be pray more, psychiatrists want you to be more psychologically well. These are their own ends.
    You're saying at the same time PUA techniques don't work, yet they can manipulate people for their own ends. Which is it?


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