Would you snitch on a dole cheat?

Fuhrer · 18-11-2014 06:30PM

Idbatterim wrote: »

this is why there should be a financial reward for successful tip offs! Another easy thing the government could have done, but chose not to, and I keep hearing there is no "low" hanging fruit left?

That alone would have likely saved the few hundred million that they are going to get through IW and look at the furore that has caused!!!

Cheaper then employing someone to check compliance,

Someone at the dole office could hand a list of names off to a friend and have them to some sneaky **** after them and find out of they're cheating

rob316 · 18-11-2014 06:34PM

Idbatterim wrote: »

this is why there should be a financial reward for successful tip offs! Another easy thing the government could have done, but chose not to, and I keep hearing there is no "low" hanging fruit left?

That alone would have likely saved the few hundred million that they are going to get through IW and look at the furore that has caused!!!

Great lets give the begrudgers and nosebags even more of a reason to hit the hotlines. I would be strongly against that idea, could you imagine the amount of "tipoffs" then, people would be ringing in if they saw a fella within yards of a PO or SW office that they knew was working.

Bootsy. · 18-11-2014 06:41PM

Do some people not realise that squealing on people is not going to bring your tax bill down, nor is it going to bring government spending on social welfare down, not one bit. It's only people getting into full time work that will do that (and not those bullsh!t "interships" either).
Even if caught, people only pay something like a fiver back a week, they don't get cut off. So it's pointless.

Judging by the tone of some of the posts it's seems like some here think people on the dole are some kind of scrounging underclass who should be locked up in the stocks with all the other ragged peasants!

oceanman · 18-11-2014 06:42PM

Idbatterim wrote: »

this is why there should be a financial reward for successful tip offs! Another easy thing the government could have done, but chose not to, and I keep hearing there is no "low" hanging fruit left?

That alone would have likely saved the few hundred million that they are going to get through IW and look at the furore that has caused!!!

how much would the financial reward be? thirty pieces of silver perhaps...

BetterThanThou · 18-11-2014 07:01PM

Reported an aunt of mine for doing this, her husband works a full time job and is paid under the table, while claiming disability allowance, she claims disability allowance as well, as far as I know, neither has a significant disability, they also get paid for their one child who's still a minor, as well as having three adult children live with them which they take 80 euro each off a week. I wouldn't be surprised if they're "bringing in" nearly 1000 a week, and they also live in a council house. Worst part is, she won't even put any of this towards her kids, hell, they've been screwing over the welfare for as long as I can remember, and my mother has told me stories about her spending all her money on herself and all her sisters needing to pitch in to buy necessities for the kids.

Electric Sheep · 18-11-2014 07:03PM

The language on this thread is interesting - snitch, squeal, etc.

It reminds me of the 80s when a huge number of people were working and signing, and it was seen as socially acceptable to a large sector of the Irish population.

I guess Paddy still loves a stroke puller.

ScumLord · 18-11-2014 07:05PM

Trigger Happy wrote: »

Without batting an eye lid - yes. Sick of paying high income taxes and vat, property charges etc...

Do you honestly believe if they caught all the people abusing the system and everyone was above board that the government would reduce any of those things?

Alun · 18-11-2014 07:08PM

Electric Sheep wrote: »

I guess Paddy still loves a stroke puller.

Unless they're politicians or businessmen, of course, they apparently have to aspire to loftier standards than the other 99.9% of society they themselves are the product of.

oceanman · 18-11-2014 07:10PM

Electric Sheep wrote: »

The language on this thread is interesting - snitch, squeal, etc.

It reminds me of the 80s when a huge number of people were working and signing, and it was seen as socially acceptable to a large sector of the Irish population.

I guess Paddy still loves a stroke puller.

or still hates a grass...

sonofenoch · 18-11-2014 07:17PM

keano_afc wrote: »

Some advice then, please.

Friend of my sister in law, living with her partner. They have 3 kids together. She claims single mothers. My brother told me recently the social called over to the house not so long ago and he had to escape via the back door. She thinks nothing of posting pics on Facebook of all the things she buys the kids. The sitting room last Christmas was unreal, you literally could not see the floor for all the presents. He has a pretty decent job, so they're doing pretty well.

I'm having a hard time not reporting them. She is a very good friend of my brothers wife, but I'm having a hard time not picking the phone up. Report or ignore?

FFS what's it you? deny some kids a few luxuries would you.....whatever it is they're milking the system for (if they are) it's a pittance in comparison to what politicians and bankers milk

it's stories like this remind me of the 'volunteers' in Nazi Europe who turned on their own

endacl · 18-11-2014 07:22PM

Interesting that I should spot this thread...

I'm actually in two minds as to whether or not to do it at the moment. Bear with me...

About 7 months ago a young fella accidentally smashed my wing mirror with a football. I sent him in to get his mother, and explained what had happened. She wasn't local. Visiting a friend (my neighbour). Anyway, she accepted responsibility, and the neighbour asked if I'd work through her. No problem, I said, and assured her I wouldn't take the pi55. This wasn't going to be a €1000 wing mirror. I'd shop around. Anyway, I got it done in a Ford garage for €180. The mirror and casing were grand. It was the expensive electrical bit that was smashed. Since I actually got a cheaper quote of €160, and the decision to go to a main dealer was mine, when I dropped in the invoice to the neighbour I explained that I was happy to take the small hit of €20. I also told her I wasn't expecting a lump sum. If her pal wanted to drop in a tenner a week, that'd do the job. Feck it, if she'd only explained her situation I'd have probably taken the first tenner as a token and left it at that. I like to see grownups taking responsibility. Job done, I thought, and forgot about it...

A couple of months later, having heard nothing I dropped in again. The neighbour had forgotten all about it, having passed on the invoice (I presume). She gave me the lady's name and number, telling me it was probably best to talk to her directly. I rang her, and was met with a conversation more akin to talking to a child that had been caught doing something naughty, than a full grown adult. She promised to drop the money in the following week. Job done, I thought....

The following week, nada. I phoned to check up on it. Her son answered, and managed to get the 'hel..' part of 'hello' out, before the phone was taken off him and disconnected. No answer to my number after that. From any other number, she'd hang up as soon as she realised who was on the line. I'd like to point out at this juncture that I very carefully wasn't 'harassing' her. All calls (3) were during business hours, and exceedingly polite and to the point. And each about a week apart.

So. What's this got to do with reporting welfare fraud? Well, she hasn't made herself particularly private online. She's been on adverts, inquiring about various three-figure items. She also has ads up looking for students to rent beds in her house. 3 beds. At €28 per night. She is of course entitled to rent a room tax free (to €10k) under the rent a room scheme. That income would impact on a means tested welfare payment though. She is on a means rested welfare payment.

So I'm left with the choice. Let this childwoman away with the damage, and suck up the €180 loss, or let her know I'm considering reporting her, and let her make her own mind up.

My nature says don't. It is kinda low and sneaky, and I don't think I could claim any moral high ground. On the other hand, it really fcukin' has rubbed me up the wrong way. Whether or not she can pay for the damage, she won't, because she doesn't want to.

I was raised to accept my responsibilities. I was also raised to mind my own business. If I do threaten to report her, I might get paid, but I wouldn't feel good about it. On the other hand, if I do nothing, she's 'won', and I certainly won't feel good over that. I am left with the option of threatening to 'tell on her' to welfare. I'd be using the reporting system as leverage in a private matter. That's not what it's for, and I'd be using it for selfish reasons. Let's get that out in the open. I get that. I understand her situation too. I have sympathy for her at the same time, bizarrely enough.

Moral dilemma: Good people of boards, what should I do? *

*serious question. I haven't a clue at this point.

Mr_Muffin · 18-11-2014 07:24PM

No i wouldn't. It's not my job to catch people screwing the system.

Fuhrer · 18-11-2014 07:26PM

endacl wrote: »

Moral dilemma: Good people of boards, what should I do? *

*serious question. I haven't a clue at this point.

Sell her out,

She had the opportunity to be respectful and went the other way. Dont treat her with any.

Neamhshuntasach · 18-11-2014 07:26PM

I have. Twice this year and not even an acknowledgement. Mine involved immigration and social welfare fraud. So i reported to both social welfare and the police.

I know a non national that is claiming social welfare on 2 different names while also working with a 3rd pps number. She is married to my friend. Well i suppose more so somebody i know these days as he doesn't be around much now and a lot of peoples opinions changed of him as he would have been so vocal about things like this. But now accepts it.

She spoke fluent English before coming over here. But was going to 'college' pretending to learn English. It is a place that she doesn't actually attend. She just pays money to say she is attending. She also has 3 different names. Each with a pps number. She had 3 different facebook accounts under her different names. Her 'mother' is over here with her. But it's really her sister. She is also pulling a fast one on social welfare.

They are constantly out eating and drinking. Every night they check in somewhere and also have pictures of cocktails up. Big screen tv's, holidays, phones. Any luxury, you name it. She is constantly putting photos of new stuff up on facebook.

How do i know all this? She boasted about it. On more than one occasion. The fella i know also admitted to it with another friend one night.

I provided every bit of detail i knew to both police and social welfare. Addresses, photos, facebook pages, multiple names, screenshots of status's about work. Everything. But so far they still continue to do the same. And i have not received any acknowledgement. So a bit pointless really. Not to mention. 3 other of my friends also reported her.

EazyD · 18-11-2014 07:30PM

endacl wrote: »

Interesting that I should spot this thread...

I'm actually in two minds as to whether or not to do it at the moment. Bear with me...

About 7 months ago a young fella accidentally smashed my wing mirror with a football. I sent him in to get his mother, and explained what had happened. She wasn't local. Visiting a friend (my neighbour). Anyway, she accepted responsibility, and the neighbour asked if I'd work through her. No problem, I said, and assured her I wouldn't take the pi55. This wasn't going to be a €1000 wing mirror. I'd shop around. Anyway, I got it done in a Ford garage for €180. The mirror and casing were grand. It was the expensive electrical bit that was smashed. Since I actually got a cheaper quote of €160, and the decision to go to a main dealer was mine, when I dropped in the invoice to the neighbour I explained that I was happy to take the small hit of €20. I also told her I wasn't expecting a lump sum. If her pal wanted to drop in a tenner a week, that'd do the job. Feck it, if she'd only explained her situation I'd have probably taken the first tenner as a token and left it at that. I like to see grownups taking responsibility. Job done, I thought, and forgot about it...

A couple of months later, having heard nothing I dropped in again. The neighbour had forgotten all about it, having passed on the invoice (I presume). She gave me the lady's name and number, telling me it was probably best to talk to her directly. I rang her, and was met with a conversation more akin to talking to a child that had been caught doing something naughty, than a full grown adult. She promised to drop the money in the following week. Job done, I thought....

The following week, nada. I phoned to check up on it. Her son answered, and managed to get the 'hel..' part of 'hello' out, before the phone was taken off him and disconnected. No answer to my number after that. From any other number, she'd hang up as soon as she realised who was on the line. I'd like to point out at this juncture that I very carefully wasn't 'harassing' her. All calls (3) were during business hours, and exceedingly polite and to the point. And each about a week apart.

So. What's this got to do with reporting welfare fraud? Well, she hasn't made herself particularly private online. She's been on adverts, inquiring about various three-figure items. She also has ads up looking for students to rent beds in her house. 3 beds. At €28 per night. She is of course entitled to rent a room tax free (to €10k) under the rent a room scheme. That income would impact on a means tested welfare payment though. She is on a means rested welfare payment.

So I'm left with the choice. Let this childwoman away with the damage, and suck up the €180 loss, or let her know I'm considering reporting her, and let her make her own mind up.

My nature says don't. It is kinda low and sneaky, and I don't think I could claim any moral high ground. On the other hand, it really fcukin' has rubbed me up the wrong way. Whether or not she can pay for the damage, she won't, because she doesn't want to.

I was raised to accept my responsibilities. I was also raised to mind my own business. If I do threaten to report her, I might get paid, but I wouldn't feel good about it. On the other hand, if I do nothing, she's 'won', and I certainly won't feel good over that. I am left with the option of threatening to 'tell on her' to welfare. I'd be using the reporting system as leverage in a private matter. That's not what it's for, and I'd be using it for selfish reasons. Let's get that out in the open. I get that. I understand her situation too. I have sympathy for her at the same time, bizarrely enough.

Moral dilemma: Good people of boards, what should I do? *

*serious question. I haven't a clue at this point.

I certainly would.

Peist2007 · 18-11-2014 07:31PM

There seems to be people on this thread that believe that begrudgery is a bigger problem in Ireland than our financial deficit. Fools. Would report a dole cheat in a heartbeat. Anyone wanna tip me off so i can go report someone?

Fuhrer · 18-11-2014 07:32PM

Peist2007 wrote: »

There seems to be people on this thread that believe that begrudgery is a bigger problem in Ireland than our financial deficit. Fools. Would report a dole cheat in a heartbeat. Anyone wanna tip me off so i can go report someone?

People who use the word begrudgery seriously in conversation can be immediately dismissed

Timberrrrrrrr · 18-11-2014 07:33PM

oceanman wrote: »

if it was a crime involving violence or physical injury I would report it,
someone drawing the dole and getting a few hours work....then no

So you choose which laws should be followed?

Tinkersbell · 18-11-2014 07:35PM

Foxhound38 wrote: »

Apparently there has been a huge increase in the amount of people reporting dole fraud to the department of social protection in the last year (don't have the source, just heard a segment on the radio about it).

So would you do it? Have you ever done it? Would you be hesitant to do it? Interested in the AH consensus here.

For my part, I don't know. I'd want to be pretty damn sure someone was taking the piss before reporting them.

The last time they came out with figures like this, and it's done whenever the government is going through a rough time, the outcome was that the vast majority of overpayments etc etc were made because if incompetent PS workers being unable to do their job correctly.
Find the figures and go through them, you'll see what I'm talking about.

Electric Sheep · 18-11-2014 07:36PM

sonofenoch wrote: »

FFS what's it you? deny some kids a few luxuries would you.....whatever it is they're milking the system for (if they are) it's a pittance in comparison to what politicians and bankers milk

it's stories like this remind me of the 'volunteers' in Nazi Europe who turned on their own

I wonder what excuse the fraud apologists used in the 80s before the banks went bad and before they knew about the politicians.

Specialun · 18-11-2014 07:36PM

Its lol that some folk say no they wouldnt report as government are as corrupt...sure tis all ok as the boys up in dail eireann are as bad

FFS

Tinkersbell · 18-11-2014 07:36PM

Maybe our mate Beaner1 could do an expose on his facebook page?

sonofenoch · 18-11-2014 07:47PM

Electric Sheep wrote: »

I wonder what excuse the fraud apologists used in the 80s before the banks went bad and before they knew about the politicians.

Blah blah internet speak, do you use such terminology in the real world.....me personally I don't cheat, I don't condone those who do but I mind my own business....what you do in life comes back to you in all ways......and I mean cmon ffs in the above I quoted, someone claiming single parents allowance? why is that such a dilema for him/her whatever .....mind your own bleedin business unless you can finger a few thousand more it won't make a blind bit of difference but for cause some difficulty for a woman with 3 kids .....' all those pictures of presents at Christmas or whatever' on fakebook was it, the shock horror of it :rolleyes:

Red Alert · 18-11-2014 07:49PM

Yes, simply because I'm fed up of funding the never-ending ATM that is social welfare. I work in the public sector and am subject to short-term contracts, increment freezes and many other niceties. Wouldn't have some years ago but would be absolutely 100% behind doing it now.

Steppenwolfe · 18-11-2014 08:04PM

I knew a dole cheat. He was in his late 50's and pretty much unemployable. Sometimes he got the odd night as a night watchman. Got paid a pittance, but was in the hand. He was a lovely quiet man who lived on his own in a bedsit. Would always give you a smile and say hello as he passed. Somebody reported him and they stopped his dole. Hung himself shortly after.

Words can't express the contempt I have for anyone who would report someone for trying to earn a few extra quid to supplement their dole. You can rationalise it all you want. It's a scummy thing to do.

Roquentin · 18-11-2014 08:05PM

endacl wrote: »

Interesting that I should spot this thread...

I'm actually in two minds as to whether or not to do it at the moment. Bear with me...

About 7 months ago a young fella accidentally smashed my wing mirror with a football. I sent him in to get his mother, and explained what had happened. She wasn't local. Visiting a friend (my neighbour). Anyway, she accepted responsibility, and the neighbour asked if I'd work through her. No problem, I said, and assured her I wouldn't take the pi55. This wasn't going to be a €1000 wing mirror. I'd shop around. Anyway, I got it done in a Ford garage for €180. The mirror and casing were grand. It was the expensive electrical bit that was smashed. Since I actually got a cheaper quote of €160, and the decision to go to a main dealer was mine, when I dropped in the invoice to the neighbour I explained that I was happy to take the small hit of €20. I also told her I wasn't expecting a lump sum. If her pal wanted to drop in a tenner a week, that'd do the job. Feck it, if she'd only explained her situation I'd have probably taken the first tenner as a token and left it at that. I like to see grownups taking responsibility. Job done, I thought, and forgot about it...

A couple of months later, having heard nothing I dropped in again. The neighbour had forgotten all about it, having passed on the invoice (I presume). She gave me the lady's name and number, telling me it was probably best to talk to her directly. I rang her, and was met with a conversation more akin to talking to a child that had been caught doing something naughty, than a full grown adult. She promised to drop the money in the following week. Job done, I thought....

The following week, nada. I phoned to check up on it. Her son answered, and managed to get the 'hel..' part of 'hello' out, before the phone was taken off him and disconnected. No answer to my number after that. From any other number, she'd hang up as soon as she realised who was on the line. I'd like to point out at this juncture that I very carefully wasn't 'harassing' her. All calls (3) were during business hours, and exceedingly polite and to the point. And each about a week apart.

So. What's this got to do with reporting welfare fraud? Well, she hasn't made herself particularly private online. She's been on adverts, inquiring about various three-figure items. She also has ads up looking for students to rent beds in her house. 3 beds. At €28 per night. She is of course entitled to rent a room tax free (to €10k) under the rent a room scheme. That income would impact on a means tested welfare payment though. She is on a means rested welfare payment.

So I'm left with the choice. Let this childwoman away with the damage, and suck up the €180 loss, or let her know I'm considering reporting her, and let her make her own mind up.

My nature says don't. It is kinda low and sneaky, and I don't think I could claim any moral high ground. On the other hand, it really fcukin' has rubbed me up the wrong way. Whether or not she can pay for the damage, she won't, because she doesn't want to.

I was raised to accept my responsibilities. I was also raised to mind my own business. If I do threaten to report her, I might get paid, but I wouldn't feel good about it. On the other hand, if I do nothing, she's 'won', and I certainly won't feel good over that. I am left with the option of threatening to 'tell on her' to welfare. I'd be using the reporting system as leverage in a private matter. That's not what it's for, and I'd be using it for selfish reasons. Let's get that out in the open. I get that. I understand her situation too. I have sympathy for her at the same time, bizarrely enough.

Moral dilemma: Good people of boards, what should I do? *

*serious question. I haven't a clue at this point.

threaten her, get your money and then report her

Holsten · 18-11-2014 08:06PM

Nope, none of my business.

endacl · 18-11-2014 08:20PM

Roquentin wrote: »

threaten her, get your money and then report her

It's the 'threaten' part I'm not so comfortable with. I get her situation. Recently separated after an abusive relationship. Single mum. Doing a college course and trying to build something. Life's not easy. I honestly don't want to be adding to somebody's troubles.

On the other hand, I'm down €180...

TheSheriff · 18-11-2014 08:24PM

wouldn't hestitate to report someone .

I remember a taxi man crashed into my car a few years back and disputed the cause of the accident. He basically tried to say it was my fault. my brother in law was a taxi man at the time and said there was /is loads of off the books taxi men claiming the dole as well as working.

I told him I was going to report him to everyone that I possibly could including revenue and sure enough he paid up immediately.

I then reported him to revenue anyway.

anncoates · 18-11-2014 08:25PM

Rats deserve anything they get.

Would you snitch on a dole cheat?

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