The amount of misogyny on boards these days is frightening.Mod instruction in OP

Micky Dolenz · 07-11-2014 11:00PM

Deleted User wrote: »

So are there new rules in the works to deal with it - do we get a community say in suggesting how they might work? Or whats the deal? Perhaps we could turn this car crash of a thread into a useful discussion on how to move forward as a community on dealing with it.

We have all the rules in place to deal with it. We need to enforce them better. If we can work together as a community we can make a change, at least in our corner of the internet.

Suggestions are always welcome and useful discussion would be great.

07-11-2014 11:02PM

Micky Dolenz wrote: »

We have all the rules in place to deal with it. We need to enforce them better. If we can work together as a community we can make a change, at least in our corner of the internet.

Suggestions are always welcome and useful discussion would be great.

The OP was somewhat afraid of over reporting and getting banned for it. Perhaps you can speak to that concern because I think in my dealings with the OPs around here - that fear is unfounded.

lm01 · 07-11-2014 11:03PM

Surely people can find something distasteful and comment on that without reporting it? I've read loads of posts here which I found offensive but I would never dream of reporting them unless I thought they were harmful in some way like inciting hate or whatever. People are entitled to their opinions and I've no interest in trying to shut anyone up by getting their posts banned.

That said surely other people are allowed to find those posts irritating and comment on what they see is a general trend developing. I also don't see the point in asking for examples because the OP is not calling out specific people just commenting on a trend. To post examples would be to target individuals directly and while that may be acceptable within the charter I understand why the OP would not want to do it.

As to the issue of people being offended by things they read on the internet... I don't understand the mentality of "its just the internet". Those things were written by people. Either because they believe them or they want to upset people. Both imply a complete lack of respect and empathy for other human beings and I'm baffled by the notion that this isn't a disturbing concept.

The Backwards Man · 07-11-2014 11:03PM

I've noticed a few trolls that seem to be a bit smarter than the average one, staying with the rules themselves but making the balls for others to fire. That's a huge problem imo.

Wompa1 · 07-11-2014 11:03PM

Micky Dolenz wrote: »

We have all the rules in place to deal with it. We need to enforce them better. If we can work together as a community we can make a change, at least in our corner of the internet.

Suggestions are always welcome and useful discussion would be great.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qDL3IofqXFA

pq0n1ct4ve8zf5 · 07-11-2014 11:04PM

RDM_83 again wrote: »

Exactly what I meant by disagreeing with Feminism ≠ Misogyny, I caveatted my post earlier with 3rd wave Feminism, but realistically (apart from maybe the abortion issue in the ROI) we in the west live in a society that aspires to 2nd wave feminism, so for most posters they will equate feminism with the current 1st world 3rd/4th wave.
If its on this forum its fair game to be discussed and disagreed with, if Feminism actually serves its intended purpose for good or ill it will impact society, society includes everyone so its fair enough to allow everyone an opinion on it.

It's not on this forum though, it's on a forum for women. Time and time again mods stepped in to say the validity of feminism was not up for discussion in the thread, time and time again it happened. And disagreeing with certain aspects of feminism, yes, I totally get that, I'm one of those people myself. Fundamentally disagreeing with feminism in all its forms, telling women they don't know what they're talking about because they've been blinded by feminist doctrine, that feminism is inherently misandrist etc., and derailing a thread chock full of good examples of why feminism is still something we should care about by saying we're stupid for caring about it is different. A quick scoot through the history of the posters who pull it usually turns up all sorts of other stuff too. Disagreeing with feminism does not necessarily equal misogyny, no; it's just that an awful lot of the time it's misogynists do it. To put it another way, not all people who disagree with feminism or aspects thereof are misogynists, but all misogynists disagree with feminism.

I can understand why being told no, your wrong, you don;t feel that way would be pretty infuriating. Don't you ever feel that sometimes posters will say the right thing rather than give an honest opinion at times, I've used the thread about the women that had 500+ partners and apparently gave the OP an STD a few times as an example of how the "right" opinion will not match what will be realistically expected in real life. Perhaps that explains at least some of the doubts?

I'm not really sure what you're talking about there, I don't think I read that thread.

Probably a bit of an intellectual point for AH, but is it actually possible for there to be a discussion on a women related thread (sorry inaccurate term) in a forum where its probably 70/80% male, where the discussion isn't going to trend towards mens opinions and woman being discussed as the "object" from a male perspective even if it not in a negative or sexist manner?

Nail on the head there.

07-11-2014 11:05PM

Ronan|Raven wrote: »

What makes me the most concerned is people take the stuff people post seriously.

Why wouldnt they? I know this is a virtual space.... but it is a community none the less. People here have friendships, interests, a society, a character to maintain and socialise with.

I grew up using IRC from a young age and people around me thought virtual friendships and social spaces and the like were the nerdiest saddest things in the world. And perhaps they are right. But when I grew up and gently prodded them to lay out the differences between a virtual society or friendship as they saw it - they failed to be able to do it.

We still have the old attitude of thinking "Ah its on the internet what does it matter - why take it seriously". But when it comes down to it - is an internet community any less valid or subjectively important than a meat space one?

And should we be any less horrified by the dark side of humanity here than there when we see it?

Penny Tration · 07-11-2014 11:05PM

Micky Dolenz wrote: »

We have all the rules in place to deal with it. We need to enforce them better. If we can work together as a community we can make a change, at least in our corner of the internet.

Suggestions are always welcome and useful discussion would be great.

Not a 'rule' that can be enforced, but perhaps a couple of extra mods could be of use, and make it a looe guideline that two mods (if available) keep an eye on the kind of threads you immediately know will be a train wreck?

Just seems like, although the current mods are genuinely doing a stellar job, they could do with some more support. I'd imagine that with the increase in nasty posts, there is also an increase of reports and therefore, mod work.

IrishCule · 07-11-2014 11:06PM

Shrap wrote: »

Well, I for one stopped following this thread <edited out URL> earlier today as I was sick to the stomach from the generalisations and band-wagon jumping about women having a "cvnt gene". I only pop in here to AH till I can take no more, but like others I think it's got worse recently.

Yeah, such outrage. ONE poster passed on a comment made by a friend of his, about a woman who was in fact being a cnut and others agreed that in this instance that woman (see singular, not all women) was a cnut.

Of course you had no problem thanking and responding positively to the post assuming this guy was some kind of deadbeat Dad who doesn't give a toss about his kids:

Do you think he called it babysitting when he had to stay in and mind them himself once in a while

Should I grab my pitchfork about this blatant misandry? The comment was from a mod too, there must be a hidden misandrist agenda on boards rabble rabble rabble!!

johnnyskeleton · 07-11-2014 11:06PM

humanji wrote: »

And just from a mods perspective, the misogyny on Boards has gone through the roof in the last while. And I'm not talking about the odd sexist joke. I'm talking about unadulterated hatred of women, several of those types of posts can even be found on this thread.

Misandry, on the other hand, is down a bit. So maybe the two cancel each other out.

If these trends continue...

Mr. Incognito · 07-11-2014 11:07PM

Can i ask the op what the suggested solution to the perceived general thread should be?

Should all boardsies take a sensitivity questionnaire?

The internet is like the world, people of all views, persuasions, opinions, races, backgrounds etc.

This thread is just a non specific moan with no examples. Both sexes do that in equal measure everywhere.

Micky Dolenz · 07-11-2014 11:08PM

Deleted User wrote: »

The OP was somewhat afraid of over reporting and getting banned for it. Perhaps you can speak to that concern because I think in my dealings with the OPs around here - that fear is unfounded.

We won't be banning people for reporting posts. We never have. I have only heard of things like that when a poster has abused the report function to insult a mod (they knew the mod would read it etc)

Report away.

efb · 07-11-2014 11:08PM

I do think there is a lot of anti-women comments and the term feminazi bandied about far too often

Penny Tration · 07-11-2014 11:11PM

Ronan|Raven wrote: »

What makes me the most concerned is people take the stuff people post seriously.

It's not necessarily a case of taking it 'seriously.' I don't for a second believe that these online women-haters are like that in real life.

But, here's a simple example.

'All black people eat friend chicken and drink kool aid.'

I could be rightly banned for posting something like that, because it's a racist generalisation.

But 'all women will stop giving blow jobs after marriage' is grand, because it's only vaguely sexist.

Going online, as a woman, and seeing stupid, ignorant comments about my gender all the time - it's a pain in the hole.

I log off and I don't think about it.

But it's damn irritating when I log onto boards and can't read through a thread in AH to post, without wading through a load of rubbish about my gender.

DeadHand · 07-11-2014 11:12PM

Undeniable misogynistic undertones present in a lot of the recent threads on AH.

Seems like there's a large cohort of angry young men out there using AH to vent their frustrations regarding women.

In particular, women's experiences of harrassment seem to be dismissed out of hand by certain male posters- "he was just being nice", "you were rude", "girls always do this", "you're too sensitive".... She was there, god damn it, not you.

I have no time for most of modern feminism. It's now a divisive idealology, large sections of which are more concerned with wrapping women in the rags of victimhood and searching out things to be outraged about than true equality. I'm only too delighted to see undemocratic nonsense like gender quotas or the abolition of custodial sentances for women challenged vigourously.

Yet, if you don't notice the usually subtle misognistic feeling that often rears it's ugly head on AH you are either willfully blind to it or unobservant. Threads often devolve into furious male posters arguing with the militant feminists that exist only inside their own heads.

Micky Dolenz · 07-11-2014 11:13PM

Jingle_Balls wrote: »

Not a 'rule' that can be enforced, but perhaps a couple of extra mods could be of use, and make it a looe guideline that two mods (if available) keep an eye on the kind of threads you immediately know will be a train wreck?

Just seems like, although the current mods are genuinely doing a stellar job, they could do with some more support. I'd imagine that with the increase in nasty posts, there is also an increase of reports and therefore, mod work.

We may need a couple of more mods when you see the traffic that passes through here. Even with a bigger team we could never guarantee 100% coverage of even one mod at any one time.

Generally speaking, I think everyone has a responsibility. You see a dickish poster posting something dickish, report it and try not to engage. Things only flair up when people react. I know it's often easier said than done.

Penny Tration · 07-11-2014 11:18PM

Micky Dolenz wrote: »

We may need a couple of more mods when you see the traffic that passes through here. Even with a bigger team we could never guarantee 100% coverage of even one mod at any one time.

Generally speaking, I think everyone has a responsibility. You see a dickish poster posting something dickish, report it and try not to engage. Things only flair up when people react. I know it's often easier said than done.

I totally get that there will never be 100% coverage. Even mods have lives outside of boards

But, the traffic in AH is huge (seems much busier lately tbh), and there have been so many more re-regs than usual lately, that it may do no harm to find a couple of extra mods.

I do tend to report posts if I think - 1. They're out of line, and 2. They're not more than half an hour old (usually bad posts have already been reported by then). The mods are very quick to act on reported posts tbh.

07-11-2014 11:18PM

Micky Dolenz wrote: »

We may need a couple of more mods when you see the traffic that passes through here. Even with a bigger team we could never guarantee 100% coverage of even one mod at any one time.

Generally speaking, I think everyone has a responsibility. You see a dickish poster posting something dickish, report it and try not to engage. Things only flair up when people react. I know it's often easier said than done.

`Thats why I sometimes wish I was a part time Mod on here. I seem to be on at times when no one else is so I think coverage

We had a mod saying that from a mod perspective things have gotten worse. In what way? What are the TYPES of comments that are flaring up?

And more importantly what can we as a community do to help the mods? As you said reacting often makes it worse and makes a harder job for the mods. Which I totally get. But NOT reacting also does not let people establish a kind of "Dude that is not cool what you just siad there" community which is actually what has been shown to help with such things. Peer pressure and validation and all that.

So where is the middle ground there? How can we respond WITHOUT "responding". Do you think pure ignoring of it is the solution? Or is there a tamer way of response that lets such posters know that it is not on?

Mister Vain · 07-11-2014 11:20PM

TheBeardedLady wrote: »

I like posting on Boards generally but I enjoyed it more in the past. It's become nauseating in the last few months.

Which era was better, the Eve Dublin era or the legs.eleven era?

Penny Tration · 07-11-2014 11:20PM

[Deleted User] wrote: »

`Thats why I sometimes wish I was a part time Mod on here. I seem to be on at times when no one else is so I think coverage

We had a mod saying that from a mod perspective things have gotten worse. In what way? What are the TYPES of comments that are flaring up?

And more importantly what can we as a community do to help the mods? As you said reacting often makes it worse and makes a harder job for the mods. Which I totally get. But NOT reacting also does not let people establish a kind of "Dude that is not cool what you just siad there" community which is actually what has been shown to help with such things. Peer pressure and validation and all that.

So where is the middle ground there? How can we respond WITHOUT "responding". Do you think pure ignoring of it is the solution? Or is there a tamer way of response that lets such posters know that it is not on?

The mod wasn't typing in bold, so it could be that it's being posted from a personal, rather than 'professional' perspective.

TheBeardedLady · 07-11-2014 11:22PM

Mister Vain wrote: »

Which era was better, the Eve Dublin era or the legs.eleven era?

The little known, "TheBeardedLeglessDub" era.

Remember the scraps we used to have back in the day?

looksee · 07-11-2014 11:22PM

Our crap feminised secondary school system has been churning out dumbed-down students for the past decade

That's because of our world-class schools full of women teaching kids vital skills like religion and Irish!

Ever wonder why these jobs are impossible to fill? Bet you send your kids to a school full of female teachers? Bet your kids can recite why 'Jesus loves us' and also recite the Lord's prayer in Irish? Bet none of your kids know the difference between c# and c++?

Its difficult to quote examples when it is not permitted to comment on posts from other forums (which is a reasonable rule, and one which I am technically breaking) so I will limit myself to saying that all the above quotes were made by one person in three different posts in one thread. Reported, no apparent action.

FouxDaFaFa · 07-11-2014 11:26PM

I was actually discussing this with another female boardsie (who doesn't really post in AH anymore) a few weeks back. We had both, independently, noticed that Boards has gotten much more hostile and unwelcoming towards female posters recently.

And, like the OP said, it is an atmosphere rather than a single occasion where I can link to a post and say "There it is! There!".

It's not just Boards, it's sites like Reddit too. There's been so much bickering with Gamergate/The "Quinnspiracy" and Sarkeesian debacle, a huge rise in MRA/Red Pill types, stuff like "The Fappening". It's probably just a phase and will pass but yes, it really does make you look back at sandwich jokes with a sense of nostalgia.

TheBeardedLady · 07-11-2014 11:26PM

Macavity. wrote: »

Not really a defence. I just found your comment needless. I think it was good that he admitted he had a problem, and people acting hostile towards something like that isn't exactly going to benefit anyone. He did make an unsavory comment later, which is not what I am referring to.

The issue is with him, not me.

Gits_bone · 07-11-2014 11:28PM

Is there a word for people who has a dislike of men?
Also is there a male equivalent of feminism?

TheBeardedLady · 07-11-2014 11:30PM

Gits_bone wrote: »

Is there a word for people who has a dislike of men?
Also is there a male equivalent of feminism?

Misandry

Masculism

ptee1 · 07-11-2014 11:31PM

I think the opposite in fact.

I see a lot of generalizations about men.

RayM · 07-11-2014 11:32PM

Gits_bone wrote: »

Is there a word for people who has a dislike of men?
Also is there a male equivalent of feminism?

There's no real need for a male equivalent of feminism.

TheBeardedLady · 07-11-2014 11:32PM

Aaaaand here come the re-regs....

J Mysterio · 07-11-2014 11:33PM

I think some people are just too sensitive to be allowed on the internet.

The amount of misogyny on boards these days is frightening.*Mod instruction in OP*

Comments

The amount of misogyny on boards these days is frightening.Mod instruction in OP