Asking A Father's Permission

Pherekydes · 01-10-2014 07:58AM

MRnotlob606 wrote: »

it's not old fashioned, its courtesy.

I think it shows an extreme lack of courtesy:

to the woman herself: she is not her father's property;
to the woman's mother: does she not matter?

As a father, I would refuse to answer. It's not my place. Though I suspect any man who asks my permission is not worthy of my daughter and is too immature for marriage.

GalwayGirl26 · 01-10-2014 08:02AM

If he wants the road frontage he'd better ask....

foreverandever · 01-10-2014 08:05AM

I disagree, I think it is just showing respect to your OH father, it's not about asking permission but only if you have a good relationship with your father.

People saying it's treating the woman like property or it's their relationship- that's not what it's about at all and pretty silly if you think that.

I agree with the poster above who said sometimes the wedding is all about the bride and her mother and this can be a way to include father of the groom- hadn't thought of that before

newport2 · 01-10-2014 08:05AM

Wellyd wrote: »

I had this conversation recently with someone who said they'd be insulted if their husband to be asked her dad for his permission to marry her. Honestly I'd be very disappointed in my boyfriend if he didn't ask my dad.

lazygal wrote: »

My husband didn't ask and I wouldn't have liked it. I was a grown woman and didn't need my father's approval to marry.

Herein lies the problem!

Any women I know either love or hate the idea, not much in between. And if you're going to propose, you can't really ask her without spoiling the moment.

After my wife said yes, I went to my father-in-law to be pretending I hadn't asked yet.

newport2 · 01-10-2014 08:07AM

foreverandever wrote: »

I disagree, I think it is just showing respect to your OH father, it's not about asking permission but only if you have a good relationship with your father.

People saying it's treating the woman like property or it's their relationship- that's not what it's about at all and pretty silly if you think that.

I agree with the poster above who said sometimes the wedding is all about the bride and her mother and this can be a way to include father of the groom- hadn't thought of that before

+1

If he said no, what guy is really going to back off and not propose anyway? It's not asking permission, it's just a tradition. There might be a sexist element to it, but no more so than there is to engagement rings and other traditions.

Shenshen · 01-10-2014 08:12AM

I have to say if my husband had gone and asked my father, I would not have married him.

Not because of that one act, but becasue the act would have communicated to me that he regards me as another man's property that he wishes to acquire. I would not want to marry a man like that.

Luckily, it never came up as I asked him. And no, I never asked his father or mother either. I only met them after we were engaged anyway.

cletus van damme · 01-10-2014 08:17AM

I would ask her dad's permission. It's a respect thing.
I don't get people getting upset saying it turns the girl into property. It doesn't, it's asking for her fathers blessing.
The blessing of the man who reared her, cared and looked after her.
Some posters seem to think once the father approves it's a done deal. As far as I know (in Ireland) the lady still gets to say aye or nay. So i don't get the' property' jibes

Yeah sure it's a little traditional and some people love to piss on tradition and find some level of insult in it. But there is none here.

Shenshen · 01-10-2014 08:19AM

cletus van damme wrote: »

I would ask her dad's permission. It's a respect thing.
I don't get people getting upset saying it turns the girl into property. It doesn't, it's asking for her father blessing.
The blessing of the man who reared her, cared and looked after her.
Some posters seem to think once the father approves it's a done deal. As far as I know (in Ireland) the lady still gets to say aye or nay. So i don't get the' property' jibes

Yeah sure it's a little traditional and some people loves to piss on tradition and find some level of insult in it. But there is none here.

Then why not ask the person that matters first?

As someone pointed out, you don't go and ask the father's permission before you hop into bed with her. Yet you do when you decide you want to spend the rest of your life with her?

Sorry, as a female I would find it highly insulting.

kfk · 01-10-2014 08:21AM

dede12 wrote: »

I wouldn't want a guy to ask my father first at all. I think my da would like it because he is rather the old fashioned, strict, & protective type but I'd find it quite disrespectful, as if I was some sort of property who couldn't make up my own mind on it. The way I see it, if I'm agreeing to marry somebody it's between the two of us, not the business of my parents until we tell them. While I don't have problem w/ most wedding traditions like the father walking the bride down the aisle, the asking for permission or blessing just really strikes me a blatantly old fashioned & sexist. After all, I'm not gonna be there asking his mam for permission to marry her son before saying yes!

If parents having input is important to the couple, a much better way to go about it imo would be for the couple to go both of the parents together, announce they'd like to get engaged & ask for their blessing as a couple. That way the parents are appeased because they've been given special consideration yet makes it clear that it is the couples decision & that they don't need parental permission to get married.

So your husband to be will have to insult either you or your father? He asks your father and insults you or doesnt ask and insults your father! That is a bit selfish on your part IMO. You would be putting the person you love and want to spend the rest of your with in a position where he couldn't win! Nice start!

anncoates · 01-10-2014 08:23AM

I'm marrying his daughter, not buying a horse from him, so no.

tigger123 · 01-10-2014 08:35AM

It would never even be on my radar to ask the woman's father for his permission.

It presupposes that she's his property, but more importantly it's about the two of you, and nobody else. You shouldn't feel like you have to involve either families. Bring them afterwards to celebrate, absolutely, but not until you're ready.

pickarooney · 01-10-2014 08:35AM

Wompa1 wrote: »

You get that it's just a formality...the guy asks for the fathers approval...he still does what he wants even if he doesn't get it.

I don't see how there's any respect involved, for anyone, in that scenario.

Carlos Orange · 01-10-2014 08:38AM

Shenshen wrote: »

Not because of that one act, but becasue the act would have communicated to me that he regards me as another man's property that he wishes to acquire. I would not want to marry a man like that.

Except it would literally have been for one act. If one symbolic act changes a relationship that much then I don't think it can be that solid to begin with.

Gongoozler · 01-10-2014 08:39AM

Shenshen wrote: »

Sorry, as a female I would find it highly insulting.

This is what I would have thought previously. Every relationship is different, and depending on your wife and her family, it can be a really nice respectful thing to do. Even though most women probably wouldn't like the idea, some would know that their father is traditional in that way, and would appreciate appeasing him. It's not always about you!

And I'd you're getting married your partner should know you well enough to know which is you.

tigger123 · 01-10-2014 08:39AM

cletus van damme wrote: »

I would ask her dad's permission. It's a respect thing.
I don't get people getting upset saying it turns the girl into property. It doesn't, it's asking for her father blessing.
The blessing of the man who reared her, cared and looked after her.
Some posters seem to think once the father approves it's a done deal. As far as I know (in Ireland) the lady still gets to say aye or nay. So i don't get the' property' jibes

Yeah sure it's a little traditional and some people loves to piss on tradition and find some level of insult in it. But there is none here.

You make it sound like you're buying livestock from him.

jester77 · 01-10-2014 08:40AM

Probably get a better dowry by asking.

foreverandever · 01-10-2014 08:42AM

My understanding of it was that before a woman used live at home until she was married and her father would take care of her, now your husband to be is saying he's going to take care of you and it's for your father to know his daughter will be cared for.

Not anything about property

sunshine and showers · 01-10-2014 08:43AM

I wouldn't be very impressed if my father was asked for permission, to be honest. My father wouldn't be that impressed either, I don't think. I'd say it'd be really awkward and my dad would make some terrible jokes, then slag the fella til the end of time about it...

Shenshen · 01-10-2014 08:44AM

psinno wrote: »

Except it would literally have been for one act. If one symbolic act changes a relationship that much then I don't think it can be that solid to begin with.

It would throw a massive doubt on my perception of the other person, simple as that.

And I wouldn't marry someone I've got doubts about.

Shakespeare's Sister · 01-10-2014 08:44AM

It's a silly tradition IMO - particularly when they're going to get married anyway. And I agree, why not ask her mother too?
It's true also that it's not required to ask him for permission for anything else with her (which could be all sorts

) so why suddenly when marrying her?

That said, even though I think it's pointless, I think saying "I'd say no to him if he did that" is going too far IMO. It's meant as a nice gesture, it's not really viewing her as the tradition originally did (which was pretty chauvinistic).

If a guy would prefer to do it, what about a compromise: say it to (rather than ask) both parents?

Carlos Orange · 01-10-2014 08:44AM

newport2 wrote: »

If he said no, what guy is really going to back off and not propose anyway? It's not asking permission, it's just a tradition.

I think it matches up quite well with the tradition of the father of the bride paying for the wedding. That one seems well past its sell by date. Do peoples parents still pay for their weddings?

newport2 · 01-10-2014 08:45AM

psinno wrote: »

I think it matches up quite well with the tradition of the father of the bride paying for the wedding. That one seems well past its sell buy date. Do peoples parents still pay for their weddings?

They're not expected to anymore IMO, but ones who have the money sometimes insist I guess. I wish.......

uck51js9zml2yt · 01-10-2014 08:46AM

I was told off my by father in law for not talking to him first.
I let me off due to the distance between us and the language barrier.

In 7 years we've never sat down on our own to have a conversation. We always need a translator.

We paid for our own wedding here and the inlaws flights and hotel and then they threw a party the following week when we went over.

Shenshen · 01-10-2014 08:47AM

Gongoozler wrote: »

This is what I would have thought previously. Every relationship is different, and depending on your wife and her family, it can be a really nice respectful thing to do. Even though most women probably wouldn't like the idea, some would know that their father is traditional in that way, and would appreciate appeasing him. It's not always about you!

And I'd you're getting married your partner should know you well enough to know which is you.

I'm sorry, but if it's about me getting married, it is about me and my future husband and nobody else.
Unless there are children involved, of course.
I would say if anyone outsidethe couple should be involved at all in the decision in any shape or form, it would be their children not their parents.

Esterhase · 01-10-2014 08:49AM

I'd feel insulted if my bf went to my father instead of me first if he was considering getting married. He already knows my feelings on the matter, so if he disregarded those and asked anyway to be 'respectful' or whatever I'd be saying no.
It's my own blessing and acceptance he'll need and my parents don't have to be considered at all. They weren't involved when we first started going out or when we moved in together and they won't be if we decide to have a baby or break up or move to a different country together - why involve them if we get engaged?

I don't give a flying **** about traditions and I don't see how it's a mark of respect towards the father. If the man asking 'permission' is going to go ahead with the proposal regardless of what the father says - where is the respect in that?

newport2 · 01-10-2014 08:51AM

Shakespeare's Sister wrote: »

It's a silly tradition IMO - particularly when they're going to get married anyway. And I agree, why not ask her mother too?
It's true also that it's not required to ask him for permission for anything else with her (which could be all sorts ) so why suddenly when marrying her?

That said, even though I think it's pointless, I think saying "I'd say no to him if he did that" is going too far IMO. It's meant as a nice gesture, it's not really viewing her as the tradition originally did (which was pretty chauvinistic).

I agree. But engagement rings evolved as a level of insurance to the woman, because:

"If the groom-to-be walked out after he and the bride-to-be had sex, that left her in a precarious position. From a social angle, she had been permanently "damaged." From an economic angle, she had lost her market value."
(http://www.theatlantic.com/business/archive/2012/04/the-strange-and-formerly-sexist-economics-of-engagement-rings/255434/)

Pretty chauvinistic tradition too. No objections to engagement rings though.

bee06 · 01-10-2014 08:52AM

My husband asked both my parents "permission" before he proposed. I personally would have preferred he didn't but I understand why he did. The way he saw it was he wasn't just marrying me but into my family as well so he was asking permission for that not that I become his property.

01-10-2014 08:54AM

newport2 wrote: »

I agree. But engagement rings evolved as a level of insurance to the woman, because:

"If the groom-to-be walked out after he and the bride-to-be had sex, that left her in a precarious position. From a social angle, she had been permanently "damaged." From an economic angle, she had lost her market value."
(http://www.theatlantic.com/business/archive/2012/04/the-strange-and-formerly-sexist-economics-of-engagement-rings/255434/)

Pretty chauvinistic tradition too. No objections to engagement rings though.

Plenty of couples buy each other an engagement present or skip it entirely.

I never get how people aren't allowed have their own preferences on this without someone else waving around another activity like a trump card

michellie · 01-10-2014 08:54AM

My fiance asked my father one night when they were in the pub ages ago, but sure my father had forgotten and when we rang him to tell him the news after he proposed he said "why didn't he ask my permission" haha good old daddy

Shenshen · 01-10-2014 08:55AM

newport2 wrote: »

I agree. But engagement rings evolved as a level of insurance to the woman, because:

"If the groom-to-be walked out after he and the bride-to-be had sex, that left her in a precarious position. From a social angle, she had been permanently "damaged." From an economic angle, she had lost her market value."
(http://www.theatlantic.com/business/archive/2012/04/the-strange-and-formerly-sexist-economics-of-engagement-rings/255434/)

Pretty chauvinistic tradition too. No objections to engagement rings though.

Can't speak for anyone else, but I don't really like those, either

Asking A Father's Permission

Comments