Advertisement
Help Keep Boards Alive. Support us by going ad free today. See here: https://subscriptions.boards.ie/.
https://www.boards.ie/group/1878-subscribers-forum

Private Group for paid up members of Boards.ie. Join the club.
Hi all, please see this major site announcement: https://www.boards.ie/discussion/2058427594/boards-ie-2026

Card minimum spend!

2456

Comments

  • #32
    Toto Wolfcastle
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 25,005 ✭✭✭✭Toto Wolfcastle


    deise08 wrote: »
    I thought that minimum spend was not allowed?
    Thought I read somewhere that they have an agreement with the card suppliers, and if they force a minimum spend on customers they are breaking that agreement?

    Yeah, I've read that on Boards before. I found this when I did a search.


  • #33
    ukoda
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,084 ✭✭✭ukoda


    Bobblehead Panda wrote: »
    Yeah, I've read that on Boards before. I found this when I did a search.

    yes thats correct, its also listed as not allowed on the AIB merchant services FAQ's

    http://www.aibms.com/accepting-card-payments/faqs/

    Can I set a minimum transaction value?
    No, you may not set any minimum limit on credit and debit card transactions.


  • #34
    anncoates
    Closed Accounts Posts: 13,925 ✭✭✭✭anncoates


    same ol sh1te wrote: »
    I've done that. Went to a checkout with a roll and coffee, the assistant said 'we don't accept card transactions for less than a tenner'. I said 'i hope you take 2 sugars' and just walked out.

    He/she probably still in counselling to deal with the devastation they feel.


  • #35
    JustAddWater
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,990 ✭✭✭JustAddWater


    The Cunning Linguist wrote: »
    Carry cash too you slaphead. It's bad enough standing in a queue to buy my sunday paper when some bellend pulls out his card to pay a €3.50 bill.

    But (especially with NFC) it's much quicker paying by card, especially over some granny going "€1" ... "€1.20" .... *rummage* "how much did I give you?".... "How much do I owe you?" .... "€1.25" ... "Is that a 5c or a 10c I gave you there?"

    Your logic is on par with those who read Georgia's column in Star Sunday alright


  • #36
    Senna
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,800 ✭✭✭Senna


    ukoda wrote: »
    no i believe thats incorrect, its more like 0.05% capped at a maximum of 20 or 30 cent

    where are you getting that figure from?

    The business I work for is charged 1.5%, I think the figures you are thinking of is the old laser rates, which were definitely lower, but I wouldn't know what they were.
    I know AIB and fexico were both charging 1.5% for visa debit transactions, maybe larger shops get better rates.


  • Advertisement
  • #37
    ukoda
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,084 ✭✭✭ukoda


    Senna wrote: »
    The business I work for is charged 1.5%, I think the figures you are thinking of is the old laser rates, which were definitely lower, but I wouldn't know what they were.
    I know AIB and fexico were both charging 1.5% for visa debit transactions, maybe larger shops get better rates.

    I think it depends on the merchant used

    This article seems to say that debit cards are charged between 11 to 20 cent per transaction - in comparison to laser which was 8 cent per transaction

    http://m.independent.ie/business/personal-finance/debit-card-charges-to-rise-as-laser-checks-out-30051902.html

    They also say that banks have waived fees for contactless payment, altho that's only temporary it appears in order to help them become popular

    I really really don't think debit cards use a % of the transaction.

    Are you sure it's not 1.5% for visa credit?


  • #38
    markpb
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 9,476 ✭✭✭markpb


    Senna wrote: »
    The business I work for is charged 1.5%, I think the figures you are thinking of is the old laser rates, which were definitely lower, but I wouldn't know what they were.
    I know AIB and fexico were both charging 1.5% for visa debit transactions, maybe larger shops get better rates.

    I've never heard of any business being charged a percentage for debit cards, it's usually a fixed amount somewhere between 13 and 25c. Credit cards are all charged a percentage. This isn't an Irish thing, it's pretty common worldwide. I wonder if the person who told you the rates made a mistake between them.
    Bobblehead Panda wrote: »
    Yeah, I've read that on Boards before. I found this when I did a search.

    That's pretty interesting, thanks!
    MadYaker wrote: »
    No. Businesses get charged by the card companies on a per transaction basis. So if you are spending less than a certain amount the cost of the transaction can cancel out the profits of the sale, that is why there are sometimes transaction limits. It's generally in smaller businesses as they have to pay more for card services.

    It's worth remembering that businesses pay for accepting cash too. They have to pay to get change from the bank, they have to pay their staff to count it at the end of the shift, they have to pay to lodge it back into the bank and they have to pay to secure it on-premises. Depending on the size of the business, they may also need to pay to transport it to and from the bank. The difference is that there's no fixed per-transaction charge so businesses can't easily quantify those costs.
    Senna wrote: »
    Remember Laser cards, business paid very little commission on those transactions but banks realised they were losing out so replaced them with visa debit.

    That's a lovely conspiracy theory but it's slightly off the mark. Laser cards only worked in Ireland so they, like all the other national debit card schemes, were made illegal by the first round of SEPA legislation passed by Europe. Visa Debit won out and the banks decided to push up the MSC for handling it, probably because Visa are charging them more than IPSO used to.


  • #39
    Mint Aero
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,570 ✭✭✭Mint Aero


    Only in Ireland


  • #40
    Senna
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,800 ✭✭✭Senna


    markpb wrote: »
    I've never heard of any business being charged a percentage for debit cards, it's usually a fixed amount somewhere between 13 and 25c. Credit cards are all charged a percentage. This isn't an Irish thing, it's pretty common worldwide. I wonder if the person who told you the rates made a mistake between them.



    That's a lovely conspiracy theory but it's slightly off the mark. Laser cards only worked in Ireland so they, like all the other national debit card schemes, were made illegal by the first round of SEPA legislation passed by Europe. Visa Debit won out and the banks decided to push up the MSC for handling it, probably because Visa are charging them more than IPSO used to.

    I see our monthly statment from too different providers, both are 1.5% for visa debit, you can either trust that I know what we are charged or you can assume what ever you like.

    Conspiracy theories? Just so happens the banks make a huge amount more profit out of visa debit than Laser, of course the banks didn't want that.


  • #41
    ukoda
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,084 ✭✭✭ukoda


    Senna wrote: »
    Just so happens the banks make a huge amount more profit out of visa debit than Laser, of course the banks didn't want that.

    Yes they do, it's about twice laser. But I'm sorry, it's not charged at a % it's a fixed fee, as per the article I posted above

    You really must be looking at credit cards

    What you are claiming is a long the lines of "Believe what you want, but I know that in our office water boils at 80 degrees" it's kinda hard to believe....


  • Advertisement
  • #42
    Shakespeare's Sister
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,412 ✭✭✭Shakespeare's Sister


    daveohdave wrote: »
    Leave the goods on the counter and walk out.
    same ol sh1te wrote: »
    I've done that. Went to a checkout with a roll and coffee, the assistant said 'we don't accept card transactions for less than a tenner'. I said 'i hope you take 2 sugars' and just walked out.
    Why the **** blame the counter-assistant? :confused:
    same ol sh1te wrote: »
    If more did the same they'd soon change their policy
    Would they? Soon? It's not in place just to annoy you you know.

    I don't understand people never carrying cash anyway. Seems pretentious. It's hardly risky to have a €20 note in your wallet.
    Mint Aero wrote: »
    Only in Ireland
    It is?


  • #43
    Senna
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,800 ✭✭✭Senna


    ukoda wrote: »
    Yes they do, it's about twice laser. But I'm sorry, it's not charged at a % it's a fixed fee, as per the article I posted above

    You really must be looking at credit cards

    What you are claiming is a long the lines of "Believe what you want, but I know that in our office water boils at 80 degrees" it's kinda hard to believe....

    The difference is, we both know at what temp water boils, but in this case I do know the charges, you are just disagreeing as they sound expensive.

    I'm on the phone here, but below is the first link on Google


    the fees being charged to retailers for using the new Visa debit cards are up to 5,000pc higher than for Laser.

    When you buy something with a Laser card, there is a fixed charge of 15c.

    But the new Visa cards have charges imposed on retailers of up to 1.55pc per transaction.

    On a €500 purchase, this will mean charges for the retailer of 15c for a Laser card, but €7.75 for the new Visa debit cards -- a rise of more than 5,000pc.
    - See more at: http://m.independent.ie/business/personal-finance/latest-news/customers-to-suffer-as-shops-pass-on-hike-in-card-fees-26760577.html#sthash.euS3asbE.dpuf


  • #44
    ukoda
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,084 ✭✭✭ukoda


    Senna wrote: »
    The difference is, we both know at what temp water boils, but in this case I do know the charges, you are just disagreeing as they sound expensive.

    I'm on the phone here, but below is the first link on Google


    the fees being charged to retailers for using the new Visa debit cards are up to 5,000pc higher than for Laser.

    When you buy something with a Laser card, there is a fixed charge of 15c.

    But the new Visa cards have charges imposed on retailers of up to 1.55pc per transaction.

    On a €500 purchase, this will mean charges for the retailer of 15c for a Laser card, but €7.75 for the new Visa debit cards -- a rise of more than 5,000pc.
    - See more at: http://m.independent.ie/business/personal-finance/latest-news/customers-to-suffer-as-shops-pass-on-hike-in-card-fees-26760577.html#sthash.euS3asbE.dpuf

    Well the link I posted says the exact opposite to that. And it's the same paper. The only difference is that mine is more recent article.

    And there are multiple other media sources that back up my claim.

    The link you posted is 2 years old and I think the indo got their facts wrong back then tbh


  • #45
    same ol sh1te
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,837 ✭✭✭same ol sh1te


    Shakespeare's Sister wrote: »
    Why the **** blame the counter-assistant? :confused:

    Would they? Soon? It's not in place just to annoy you you know.

    I don't understand people never carrying cash anyway. Seems pretentious. It's hardly risky to have a €20 note in your wallet.

    It is?

    My visa debit card has been accepted everywhere including the USA and UK for micro transactions in the last few years, only in Ireland have I come across a policy like this and I refuse to accept it. I very often find myself in situations where I have just a card and no cash. How is leaving the stuff behind you and refusing the transaction blaming the shop assistant?


  • #46
    Senna
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,800 ✭✭✭Senna


    Ok don't believe me, about a year ago I asked the accountant to approach other merchant service providers and see if anyone can offer a better rate than 1.5% on debit cards (used in about 80% of transactions), they all came back with the same rates only differing charges for terminals and contracts lengths.


  • #47
    rob316
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 19,696 ✭✭✭✭rob316


    The Purveyor of Truth wrote: »
    I'm more annoyed about the additional fees for phone and ESB top-ups.

    Payzone do not approve of these fees by the way, and so report them when you see them.

    I heard that the shop across Tesco in Crumlin had their Payzone machine taken off them for charging these fees, hopefully this will keep happening until there is an end to shops doing this.

    You should take issue with the phone companies instead who are wholesaling the credit to retailers at a price higher than what you pay. Yes report the retailers because god forbid the corner shop don't make a loss on the service they provide.

    Consumers love to be all high and mighty until they actually run a business themselves.


  • #48
    JustAddWater
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,990 ✭✭✭JustAddWater


    rob316 wrote: »
    You should take issue with the phone companies instead who are wholesaling the credit to retailers at a price higher than what you pay. Yes report the retailers because god forbid the corner shop don't make a loss on the service they provide.

    Consumers love to be all high and mighty until they actually run a business themselves.

    Why should customers take up the issue? The contract is between the retailer and the service provider. If they're wholesaling it for more than its worth, the retailer needs to push back and say NO, and not just pass it to customers

    Customers should not pay €21/€22 or whatever for something with a value of only €20

    Consumer as usual is the only loser


  • #49
    irishgeo
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,024 ✭✭✭✭irishgeo


    cillit_bang wrote: »
    One thing that has f***ING annoyed me to no end in the last few months is business putting a 'minimum spend' on cards.

    It's so infuriating, more and more people are moving to using less cash and they still have this rule, which is wildly variable depending on the business. Why are they refusing business!?

    Most don't even put up a sign to say about the minimum spend.

    Its against both visa and Mastercard merchant rules. Report the various business and Mastercard and visa will come down heavy on them. They dont like it very much.


  • #50
    JustAddWater
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,990 ✭✭✭JustAddWater


    irishgeo wrote: »
    Its against both visa and Mastercard merchant rules. Report the various business and Mastercard and visa will come down heavy on them. They dont like it very much.

    Who do you report them to? Couldn't find much info online!


  • #51
    irishgeo
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,024 ✭✭✭✭irishgeo


    JustAddWater wrote: »
    Who do you report them to? Couldn't find much info online!

    I'll get the info later.


  • Advertisement
  • #52
    enda1
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,165 ✭✭✭enda1


    Surely it costs a lot more to handle cash than card though ultimately.
    having to worry about cash transit costs, robbery, till theft, insurance, counterfeiting, cash-registers, illiquidity, cash-in-hand etc.

    Paying electronically should be encouraged on a national level to cut business costs and lost revenue to the state.


  • #53
    dRNk SAnTA
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 786 ✭✭✭dRNk SAnTA


    JustAddWater wrote: »
    Who do you report them to? Couldn't find much info online!

    I had only just read this article last year about how merchants are breaking the rules and could have their pay facilities removed if they charge a minimum fee - when I found myself faced with a €15 euro minimum charge at a bar in Dublin.

    It meant had to go out and walk 5 minutes down the road to get cash.

    Pissed off, I sent an email of complaint to the Irish Payment Services Organisation Limited (http://www.ipso.ie/)

    The reply that I got said that IPSO doesn't have a direct relationship with retailers but works with the card payment processors and will bring complaints to their attention.

    "We receive reports, from time to time, from consumers about minimum spend limits in stores. This practice is against general terms and conditions for payment card acceptance. Reports of such nature should really be sent directly to the shop’s card processor, but while the information regarding that particular bank is not always apparent to the customer, queries are sent through this office on occasion; where we are in a position to identify the retailer’s bank or card processor and to alert them to the issue or non-compliance with the relevant terms."

    So I sent over the name, address of Pub and a picture that I snapped of the "€15 minimum" sign behind the bar.

    Never heard anything back... must check if the signs are still there. I haven't been back to the pub since.


  • #54
    Hootanany
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,479 ✭✭✭Hootanany


    rob316 wrote: »
    You should take issue with the phone companies instead who are wholesaling the credit to retailers at a price higher than what you pay. Yes report the retailers because god forbid the corner shop don't make a loss on the service they provide.

    Consumers love to be all high and mighty until they actually run a business themselves.


    So phone companies charge more to the retailer than the public?


  • #55
    FTA69
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,252 ✭✭✭FTA69


    This used to break my heart when I worked in a pub. Balls to the wall busy with matches on a Sunday and you have a queue of nobends who are looking to pay for their lemonades separately and on cards. Am I the only one who would be embarrassed to pay for an orange juice on a debit card?


  • #56
    pickarooney
    Moderators, Arts Moderators Posts: 36,496 Mod ✭✭✭✭pickarooney


    FTA69 wrote: »
    This used to break my heart when I worked in a pub. Balls to the wall busy with matches on a Sunday and you have a queue of nobends who are looking to pay for their lemonades separately and on cards. Am I the only one who would be embarrassed to pay for an orange juice on a debit card?

    That's some very payment-method specific form of shame. I can't say In understand it myself.


  • #57
    cillit_bang
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 23 ✭cillit_bang


    Imagine, in a perfect world, where only cards were accepted. Imagine all of the hassle that would be taken away for shops with cashing up. The sheer amount of accounting that would automatically be done by software would be immense. That alone would be a massive saving on man power and thus, costs.


  • #58
    B.A._Baracus
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 11,309 ✭✭✭✭B.A._Baracus


    cillit_bang wrote: »
    Imagine, in a perfect world, where only cards were accepted. Imagine all of the hassle that would be taken away for shops with cashing up. The sheer amount of accounting that would automatically be done by software would be immense. That alone would be a massive saving on man power and thus, costs.

    I wouldn't call that a perfect world :pac:
    We all know the deal with banks ... make money off your money. But no cash? They would cream in their pants.

    Charging a percentage for every transaction and everyone has to pay by card? ... why dont we all just sign our lives away to banks :pac:


  • #59
    nelly17
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,209 ✭✭✭nelly17


    B.A._Baracus wrote: »
    I wouldn't call that a perfect world :pac:
    We all know the deal with banks ... make money off your money. But no cash? They would cream in their pants.

    Charging a percentage for every transaction and everyone has to pay by card? ... why dont we all just sign our lives away to banks :pac:

    Chances are if you have a mortgage you allready have


  • #60
    Lux23
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,134 ✭✭✭Lux23


    It makes sense to use cash, the banks are beginning to charge for every transaction.


  • Advertisement
  • #61
    Irishcrx
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,861 ✭✭✭Irishcrx


    Ah yes , the minimum spend dillema. Best is when they tell you there's an ATM in the back with a smirk on their face....

    But of course the ****ing ATM is out of service...


Advertisement
Advertisement