Are inequalities in sexes, race or income of family a result of a glass ceiling?

steddyeddy · 28-08-2014 08:05PM #1

I was having the chats earlier with a female colleague about the lack of women in science. She's right there has been a lack of women in science through out the years. The former president of Harvard, Lawrence Summers gave a controversial speech a few years ago suggesting that men might simply be predisposed to be better at math and science.

Other people have made the same comment about various races in relation to explain their relative absence. Other people explain the relative absence of those from poorer families as a result of a correlation between family of birth and intelligence.

Now before people go on the attack I don't think these are a a result of a talent for a particular area but there must be a reason for higher participation among certain groups in college, certain fields ect. Is this due to a glass ceiling? I.E is it due to a self imposed barrier certain groups place on themselves or are there few female CEOs or scientists due to other reasons?

I think it is harder for some groups than others but in a western democracy you can really be anything you want to be.

(Just to note many many women in science were royally screwed over because they were women E.G Rosalind Franklin who discovered the helical nature of DNA)

Adamantium · 28-08-2014 08:09PM

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QhMo4WlBmGM

28-08-2014 08:09PM

Men have a longer tail on both sides of the curve for IQ levels and the like. Men are also more likely to be psychopaths, while can explain a lot of the business stats, along with the more time taken off by women on average.

The Backwards Man · 28-08-2014 08:16PM

Good old-fashioned nepotism should never be underestimated.

Iwasfrozen · 28-08-2014 08:19PM

Has to be self imposed restrictions in college since our CAO system is racial and gender blind.

Sh1tbag OToole · 28-08-2014 08:22PM

People with a glass ceiling in their houses are few and far between so I'd say no.

steddyeddy · 28-08-2014 08:22PM

Iwasfrozen wrote: »

Has to be self imposed restrictions in college since our CAO system is racial and gender blind.

Well even when people get to college few women seem to want to be engineers or research scientists.

The Backwards Man · 28-08-2014 08:23PM

Sh1tbag OToole wrote: »

People with a glass ceiling in their houses are few and far between so I'd say no.

Do you not have a mirror above your bed?

shruikan2553 · 28-08-2014 08:24PM

Im in engineering which makes science look like its full of women. Why there isn't more is quite confusing. Companies want more women, the colleges want more women but they aren't coming into college to do engineering. If a woman goes into engineering she would probably do better than a man of similar skill.

Iwasfrozen · 28-08-2014 08:25PM

steddyeddy wrote: »

Well even when people get to college few women seem to want to be engineers or research scientists.

Right so if we know the CAO is gender blind then the restriction must be self imposed.

steddyeddy · 28-08-2014 08:26PM

Iwasfrozen wrote: »

Right so if we know the CAO is gender blind then the restriction must be self imposed.

Yea pretty much.

House of Blaze · 28-08-2014 08:28PM

When I was studying computer science there was a class of 80+ and two women (one of whom dropped out after first year to do physical therapy) and yet the majority of our lecturers were women. Often women who were much better lecturers than some of the male staff.

It is weird but I think a lot of it comes down to these fields not appearing to be 'creative' enough. Which is rubbish of course but it remains a popular position.

Paperduel · 28-08-2014 08:34PM

shruikan2553 wrote: »

Im in engineering which makes science look like its full of women. Why there isn't more is quite confusing. Companies want more women, the colleges want more women but they aren't coming into college to do engineering. If a woman goes into engineering she would probably do better than a man of similar skill.

It's simply really, women tend not to be as interested in such fields of interest on average.

Czarcasm · 28-08-2014 08:34PM

steddyeddy wrote: »

I think it is harder for some groups than others but in a western democracy you can really be anything you want to be.

I'm beginning to wonder can some people never accept that there are no glass ceilings, there are no barriers that can't be overcome, and that most people don't particularly care about gender imbalances and so on, they just want to as you say eddy - be what they want to be, and should feel free to choose the career that's right for them, rather than the career someone else feels is right for them.

My mother still tries to 'encourage' me into the teaching profession because "they're crying out for male teachers", completely disregarding the fact that I have no interest in going into teaching. It's just not something that interests me, and I imagine that attitude is usually the first factor in many people's career choices, regardless of their gender.

steddyeddy · 28-08-2014 08:37PM

Czarcasm wrote: »

I'm beginning to wonder can some people never accept that there are no glass ceilings, there are no barriers that can't be overcome, and that most people don't particularly care about gender imbalances and so on, they just want to as you say eddy - be what they want to be, and should feel free to choose the career that's right for them, rather than the career someone else feels is right for them.

My mother still tries to 'encourage' me into the teaching profession because "they're crying out for male teachers", completely disregarding the fact that I have no interest in going into teaching. It's just not something that interests me, and I imagine that attitude is usually the first factor in many people's career choices, regardless of their gender.

That's the point C. A glass ceiling is a self imposed limit on what you can become in the absence of real barriers.

House of Blaze · 28-08-2014 08:43PM

I'm also given to understand that men respond more favourably to financial incentives than women, and that this leads to a certain amount of over representation in fields traditionally seen as providing a high level of financial reward but little in the way of meaning or fulfillment in other ways.

So you'll see as many(ish) male med or law students as female, but a significantly higher proportion of males in fields such as finance, IT etc.

Paramite Pie · 28-08-2014 08:48PM

steddyeddy wrote: »

The former president of Harvard, Lawrence Summers gave a controversial speech a few years ago suggesting that men might simply be predisposed to be better at math and science.

When people say women are better at multi-tasking or learning new languages based on the biological structure of their brain, it's not controversial. But when someone speculates that men may be better at something based on the biological structure of their brain, it's controversial indeed.

http://www.scientificamerican.com/article/how-mens-brains-are-wired-differently-than-women/

How much this brain structure difference matters is up to debate. Girls have been outperforming boys in Maths in schools for decades but the differences in brain structure fade in the adult years according to the above link.

Since girls outperform boys in the Leaving Cert (on average), and more girls attend college, then they should dominate all courses. But they don't. It'd be interesting to see a breakdown on CAO choices based on gender (although there's a lot of girls studying science in the last few years!!)

House of Blaze · 28-08-2014 08:54PM

Paramite Pie wrote: »

When people say women are better at multi-tasking or learning new languages based on the biological structure of their brain, it's not controversial. But when someone speculates that men may be better at something based on the biological structure of their brain, it's controversial indeed.

http://www.scientificamerican.com/article/how-mens-brains-are-wired-differently-than-women/

How much this brain structure difference matters is up to debate. Girls have been outperforming boys in Maths in schools for decades but the differences in brain structure fade in the adult years according to the above link.

That whole area is politically frought in fairness.

From what I could gather during the research for my thesis is that women have more connections laterally across the brain, mostly in the 'white matter' of the brain, which is responsible for acting as a relay and coordinating communication between different brain regions whereas men tend to have more neurons in their cerebral cortex which is primarily associated with processing and cognition.

Are inequalities in sexes, race or income of family a result of a glass ceiling?

Comments