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Israel - Palestine Conflict. **Mod note in OP - updated 1st August**

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Comments

  • #4742
    Ignorant etc.
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 227 ✭✭Ignorant etc.


    WinnyThePoo wrote: »
    Can you explain to me why they are traitors?

    Putting up claptrap like that, calling into question every single thing Israel does. They should support their country in its hour of need, not run it down.


  • #4743
    WinnyThePoo
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,417 ✭✭✭WinnyThePoo


    Ignorant etc. wrote: »
    Putting up claptrap like that, calling into question every single thing Israel does. They should support their country in its hour of need, not run it down.

    No matter if their country acts immoral?

    and by their country I mean their Leaders and Army.


  • #4744
    Ignorant etc.
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 227 ✭✭Ignorant etc.


    WinnyThePoo wrote: »
    No matter if their country acts immoral?

    and by their country I mean their Leaders and Army.

    Who says that Israel is acting immorally? A group of latchycos that support terror?


  • #4745
    WinnyThePoo
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,417 ✭✭✭WinnyThePoo


    Ignorant etc. wrote: »
    Who says that Israel is acting immorally? A group of latchycos that support terror?

    Why is the word terror used for Hamas

    and not used for the IDF?


  • #4746
    Nodin
    Closed Accounts Posts: 46,938 ✭✭✭✭Nodin


    Irish Praetorian wrote: »
    Well I'm not sure centuries of bitterness would result, I mean when you look at it, we manage to 'get over' these acts of outrage pretty quickly, look at Cyprus for example, heck most people would have a hard time mustering up a decent big of hatred for Russia .

    ...you ever talk to people from Greece about Turkey, or Poland and the Baltic states about Russia? Ever see what the 12th Of July looks like up north?


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  • #4747
    dav3
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,671 ✭✭✭dav3


    Ignorant etc. wrote: »
    Traitors.

    As someone who is a british citizen and claims to have no connection to isreal, you're certainly getting quite worked up over this.

    Although I'm not sure I'm talking to the same person that was posting on here this afternoon and announced that they we're leaving 5 hours ago.

    What is your opinion on http://www.breakingthesilence.org.il/

    Are they traitors to your country israel too? Exposing the war crimes committed by the degenerates of the IDF.


  • #4748
    Tuisceanch
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 735 ✭✭✭Tuisceanch


    Edinburgh City Council to fly Palestinian flag

    http://www.edinburghnews.scotsman.com/news/edinburgh-city-council-to-fly-palestinian-flag-1-3517101


    Glasgow Israeli flag councillor David Meikle urged to resign

    http://www.bbc.com/news/uk-scotland-glasgow-west-28742270

    No deal with professor fired for Israel views is on Univ. of Illinois trustees’ table

    http://electronicintifada.net/blogs/ali-abunimah/no-deal-professor-fired-israel-views-univ-illinois-trustees-table


  • #4749
    Ignorant etc.
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 227 ✭✭Ignorant etc.


    Yes, because you can't support Israel if you're not from there. This discussion gets better by the minute.

    What do you suppose happens if Israel is obliterated, as Hamas wants? That everyone can get back to their normal lives and peace will reign? When we're dealing with extreme Islam? Before you all go apopleptic, I said extreme Islam, not Islam. Extreme Islam has already made its intentions towards the west quite clear. I make no apologies for supporting Israel and the IDF. Personally, should Israel fall, I do wonder which country will be next on the agenda, according to extreme Islamists like Hamas, Boko Haram, Al Qaeda and ISIS, as a "terror state that robbed Islamic land".

    Funny how you all give such credence to Jews who speak out against Israel and quote them endlessly, but when I put up a video of a Muslim criticising Hamas you chose to ignore it because it doesn't fit in with you're grand plan for the world.


  • #4750
    Tuisceanch
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 735 ✭✭✭Tuisceanch


    American Jews Speaking Out Against Assault On Gaza




    https://jewishvoiceforpeace.org/blog/growing-movement-of-american-jews-speaking-out-against-assault-on-gaza

    “Every time Israel engages in high-profile repression of civilians, we get inundated. But we have never seen anything like this. Our mailing list grew by 50,000 in 3 weeks and we can’t keep up with the demand for new chapters. This is the final straw for many Jews, who have decided that their silence implies consent,” Said Rabbi Alissa Wise, JVP Co-Director of Organizing and Chair of the JVP Rabbinical Council.:)


  • #4751
    Ignorant etc.
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 227 ✭✭Ignorant etc.


    Tuisceanch wrote: »
    Edinburgh City Council to fly Palestinian flag

    http://www.edinburghnews.scotsman.com/news/edinburgh-city-council-to-fly-palestinian-flag-1-3517101


    Glasgow Israeli flag councillor David Meikle urged to resign

    http://www.bbc.com/news/uk-scotland-glasgow-west-28742270

    No deal with professor fired for Israel views is on Univ. of Illinois trustees’ table

    http://electronicintifada.net/blogs/ali-abunimah/no-deal-professor-fired-israel-views-univ-illinois-trustees-table

    Ah so its OK to fly the Palestinian flag from Edinburgh City Hall, but a Glasgow Councillor who flies the Israeli flag should be sacked? Yep, that's the apopleptic argument you come to expect from pro-Palestinians.

    Interestingly, Israeli tolerates criticism from within its own ranks... ironically, at least for your argument, Hamas executes anyone who opposes its policy... its executed at least thirty so far.


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  • #4752
    Tuisceanch
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 735 ✭✭✭Tuisceanch


    Ignorant etc. wrote: »
    Funny how you all give such credence to Jews who speak out against Israel and quote them endlessly, but when I put up a video of a Muslim criticising Hamas you chose to ignore it because it doesn't fit in with you're grand plan for the world.


    I watched it and he sounds like you and why is he shouting and why so desperate to proof his credentials. What else is there to comment on?


  • #4753
    Ignorant etc.
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 227 ✭✭Ignorant etc.


    Tuisceanch wrote: »
    I watched it and he sounds like you and why is he shouting and why so desperate to proof his credentials. What else is there to comment on?

    Ah, he's not in agreement with your viewpoint so he's to be instantaneously discredited. Maybe he's shouting because he's passionate about the issue. Though, and I discount you in this, pro-Palestinians see no reason to discuss shouting when the words are "from the river to the sea"...


  • #4754
    Tuisceanch
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 735 ✭✭✭Tuisceanch


    Ignorant etc. wrote: »
    Ah so its OK to fly the Palestinian flag from Edinburgh City Hall, but a Glasgow Councillor who flies the Israeli flag should be sacked? Yep, that's the apopleptic argument you come to expect from pro-Palestinians.

    Interestingly, Israeli tolerates criticism from within its own ranks... ironically, at least for your argument, Hamas executes anyone who opposes its policy... its executed at least thirty so far.


    I thought you'd appreciate the balance as you mentioned your fear at going to a GAA match with an Israeli flag. I thought his brave stance might inspire you. Stop being so defensive and so forceful . We understand your love for Israel.


  • #4755
    Ignorant etc.
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 227 ✭✭Ignorant etc.


    Tuisceanch wrote: »
    American Jews Speaking Out Against Assault On Gaza




    https://jewishvoiceforpeace.org/blog/growing-movement-of-american-jews-speaking-out-against-assault-on-gaza

    “Every time Israel engages in high-profile repression of civilians, we get inundated. But we have never seen anything like this. Our mailing list grew by 50,000 in 3 weeks and we can’t keep up with the demand for new chapters. This is the final straw for many Jews, who have decided that their silence implies consent,” Said Rabbi Alissa Wise, JVP Co-Director of Organizing and Chair of the JVP Rabbinical Council.:)

    Ah ok, so Jews opposing Israel are to be listened to, but Muslims opposing Hamas are to be ignored... what a great way to prove a point.


  • #4756
    Ignorant etc.
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 227 ✭✭Ignorant etc.


    Tuisceanch wrote: »
    I thought you'd appreciate the balance as you mentioned your fear at going to a GAA match with an Israeli flag. I thought his brave stance might inspire you. Stop being so defensive and so forceful . We understand your love for Israel.

    Much as I understand your love for terror.


  • #4757
    Tuisceanch
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 735 ✭✭✭Tuisceanch


    Ignorant etc. wrote: »
    Ah, he's not in agreement with your viewpoint so he's to be instantaneously discredited. Maybe he's shouting because he's passionate about the issue. Though, and I discount you in this, pro-Palestinians see no reason to discuss shouting when the words are "from the river to the sea"...


    I just said what was there to comment on. You've already raised the points he made so why go over them again. I watched your other video too and I'm not surprised that their are Jewish supporters of Israel showing their disaproval at the Pro-Palestinian supporters since you're here doing the same thing then what's to comment on?


  • #4758
    Tuisceanch
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 735 ✭✭✭Tuisceanch


    Ignorant etc. wrote: »
    Much as I understand your love for terror.


    You said you loved Israel and I said I oppose terror so why dissimulate when I just acknowledged your heartfelt convictions. You're very easily rattled and a tad paranoid. Lighten up as it's not as if you're in a war zone.


  • #4759
    wes
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 11,749 ✭✭✭✭wes


    Ignorant etc. wrote: »
    Much as I understand your love for terror.

    These accusations are laughable coming from someone who was praising the IDF, a group that has deliberately murdered civilians.

    You will find no praise for Hams from anyone on here, and yet you insist on this fiction, all the while having openly praised the IDF an organization that deliberately murders children.


  • #4760
    wes
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 11,749 ✭✭✭✭wes


    Ignorant etc. wrote: »
    Also, we have no proof whatsoever that this wasn't written by Hamas militants posing as Israelis.

    There is also no proof that it wasn't written by a blessing of Unicorns........ So it must Unicorns, or maybe Aliens......


  • #4761
    WakeUp
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,823 ✭✭✭WakeUp


    Ignorant etc. wrote: »
    Not really, but I do subscribe to the view that Israel is surrounded by, or in the vicinity of, countries that would seek to destroy it. Palestine, Saudi Arabia, Iran, you can't tell me any of those are happy that Israel exists. And to protect yourself in such a situation, a certain expansion from your own territories is necessary. That's not Zionism, its pragmatism. I could equally level at you that your argument seems to be completely based around the idea that the state of Israel should be obliterated.

    wait, what? what are you saying here..that because certain countries might not be happy with Israel this somehow gives them the right to do what exactly? slaughter civilians and take other peoples land..and this is a form of protection how..how does that work?..


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  • #4762
    Tuisceanch
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 735 ✭✭✭Tuisceanch


    Ignorant etc. wrote: »
    Ah ok, so Jews opposing Israel are to be listened to, but Muslims opposing Hamas are to be ignored... what a great way to prove a point.

    I wasn't posting these links for your attention. The purpose of the thread is to provide informative substance for debate. It's not all about you and you don't need to always respond.


  • #4763
    Ignorant etc.
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 227 ✭✭Ignorant etc.


    Tuisceanch wrote: »
    I just said what was there to comment on. You've already raised the points he made so why go over them again. I watched your other video too and I'm not surprised that their are Jewish supporters of Israel showing their disaproval at the Pro-Palestinian supporters since you're here doing the same thing then what's to comment on?

    Except he wasn't Jewish, he was Muslim.

    Accusations of repetitiveness are great from the pro-Palestinian side though... You could sum up the Palestinian argument so simply... "Israel bad, Israel bad, Israel bad, Israel bad, Israel bad, Palestine good, Israel bad, Israel bad, Israel bad, Israel bad, Israel bad, Palestine good, Israel bad, Israel bad, Israel bad, Israel bad, Israel bad, Palestine good, Israel bad, Israel bad, Israel bad, Israel bad, Israel bad, Palestine good, Israel bad, Israel bad, Israel bad, Israel bad, Israel bad, Palestine good, Israel bad, Israel bad, Israel bad, Israel bad, Israel bad, Palestine good, Israel bad, Israel bad, Israel bad, Israel bad, Israel bad, Palestine good, Israel bad, Israel bad, Israel bad, Israel bad, Israel bad, Palestine good" ad nauseum.


  • #4764
    Ignorant etc.
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 227 ✭✭Ignorant etc.


    Tuisceanch wrote: »
    You said you loved Israel and I said I oppose terror so why dissimulate when I just acknowledged your heartfelt convictions. You're very easily rattled and a tad paranoid. Lighten up as it's not as if you're in a war zone.

    You support Palestine, you support Hamas, ergo, you support terror.

    Oh and don't make the mistake of not living in a terror zone. If Israel falls to extreme Islam, we may all too soon live in a war zone.


  • #4765
    Ignorant etc.
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 227 ✭✭Ignorant etc.


    Tuisceanch wrote: »
    I wasn't posting these links for your attention. The purpose of the thread is to provide informative substance for debate. It's not all about you and you don't need to always respond.

    No its not, its a Palestinian propaganda thread.


  • #4766
    Tuisceanch
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 735 ✭✭✭Tuisceanch


    Ignorant etc. wrote: »
    Except he wasn't Jewish, he was Muslim.

    Accusations of repetitiveness are great from the pro-Palestinian side though... You could sum up the Palestinian argument so simply... "Israel bad, Israel bad, Israel bad, Israel bad, Israel bad, Palestine good, Israel bad, Israel bad, Israel bad, Israel bad, Israel bad, Palestine good, Israel bad, Israel bad, Israel bad, Israel bad, Israel bad, Palestine good, Israel bad, Israel bad, Israel bad, Israel bad, Israel bad, Palestine good, Israel bad, Israel bad, Israel bad, Israel bad, Israel bad, Palestine good, Israel bad, Israel bad, Israel bad, Israel bad, Israel bad, Palestine good, Israel bad, Israel bad, Israel bad, Israel bad, Israel bad, Palestine good, Israel bad, Israel bad, Israel bad, Israel bad, Israel bad, Palestine good" ad nauseum.

    I was referring to the second video you posted on the demonstration in New York. So maybe you've just over reacted again or would you disagree?


  • #4767
    Tuisceanch
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 735 ✭✭✭Tuisceanch


    Ignorant etc. wrote: »
    No its not, its a Palestinian propaganda thread.

    Here you go

    http://www.nytimes.com/2014/08/21/opinion/deborah-e-lipstadt-on-the-rising-anti-semitism-in-europe.html?_r=0

    You said you were interested in this discussion but chose not to participate before. Happy now?


  • #4768
    Ignorant etc.
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 227 ✭✭Ignorant etc.


    Tuisceanch wrote: »
    I was referring to the second video you posted on the demonstration in New York. So maybe you've just over reacted again or would you disagree?

    Ah... so you didn't comment on the first video because it didn't fit with your argument... reverting to my first accusation, its clear I was accurate.


  • #4769
    Ignorant etc.
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 227 ✭✭Ignorant etc.


    I'm going to bed, to sleep, perchance to dream... Thankfully, I'm going to bed without fear... pity the same can't be said for millions of Israelis.


  • #4770
    Tuisceanch
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 735 ✭✭✭Tuisceanch


    Ignorant etc. wrote: »
    Ah... so you didn't comment on the first video because it didn't fit with your argument... reverting to my first accusation, its clear I was accurate.

    I already did comment on the first video
    Tuisceanch wrote: »
    I just said what was there to comment on. You've already raised the points he made so why go over them again. I watched your other video too and I'm not surprised that their are Jewish supporters of Israel showing their disaproval at the Pro-Palestinian supporters since you're here doing the same thing then what's to comment on?

    You need to pay more attention as you might be perceived as being truculent and argumentative for the sake of it and this is, in fairness!, a forum for adult conversation and we can't be expected to guide you along like a child because that would be patronizing so it would be better if you had the courtesy to acknowledge when you've misunderstood or to admit that you don't really read anything anybody else writes but just resort to ad hominem attacks. I've told you this before and I don't want to have to repeat myself again. Is that clear?

    And to reiterate my response to your first video which you accused me of not commenting on but as we see that was a false accusation,here is another comment:

    He said Hamas were horrible and didn't represent the Palestinian people. I've posted a facebook page also citing a group of Palestinians who also don't support Hamas and wrote about a Palestinian photographer from the West Bank who also expressed his disdain for Hamas. But you weren't here then as you've only joined us recently. What else did he say that you wish to comment on?


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  • #4771
    Tuisceanch
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 735 ✭✭✭Tuisceanch


    Ignorant etc. wrote: »
    You support Palestine, you support Hamas, ergo, you support terror.

    Yes you keep saying this and it's not very interesting and doesn't make much of a case for your desire to discuss civilly. But I don't mind as only you can make yourself interesting to others.


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