Manchester United Team Talk/Gossip/Rumours Thread - Mod Note in OP, 13/8

PARlance · 06-08-2014 08:12AM

Deiseboy01 wrote: »

Ive a question, playing devil's advocate here, are there any posters who do not favour a move for Vidal?

Usually when I see an overwhelming concensus I run the other way! Vidal has been nearly universally lauded, is he that good? Juve have been dominant but how good is the competition? Does having thelikes of Pirlo in the team alongside him allow to look better than he is?

Finally any injury worries surely has to be a major concern given the huge fee and past experience with the likes of Hargreaves.

So when you see the overwhelming consensus that we need a CM'er you run away too?

Personally I'd consider having giving Hargreaves some crutches and getting him back, so no, I've no issue with paying big bucks for Vidal.
Even if he has been overhyped slightly, he's still going to add an awful lot in a position we've lacked quality in for years.

weisses · 06-08-2014 08:22AM

Pro. F wrote: »

Two nil-nil draws at the business end of the tournament. Scoring was a problem for them and ultimately cost them.

You seem to forget how lucky Costa Rica was during that match.

bangkok · 06-08-2014 08:53AM

as I said here before 40m plus on a 27 year old with a bad knee is a huge risk especially for the type of game he plays. I have a feeling van gaal, the united board and medical staff feel the same. also if van gaal gets the players he wants he will play 4-3-3 with mata behind rvp and rooney.

Backstreet Moyes · 06-08-2014 09:03AM

Pro. F wrote: »

I wouldn't agree that Argentina had better quality, but regardless that was two games where they set up defensively and failed to score. They also cut it extremely fine by playing defensively against Mexico.

RVP lacking fitness doesn't change that fact either. What Liam said about them having a lot of defenders and a lack of goals is undeniable.

Let;s have a look at both starting line ups.

Holland starting XI: Cillessen, Kuyt, Blind, Vlaar, De Vrij, Martins Indi, De Jong, Wijnaldum, Sneijder, Robben, Van Persie

Argentina starting XI: Romero, Zabaleta, Demichelis, Garay, Rojo, Enzo Pérez, Biglia, Mascherano, Lavezzi, Messi, Higuaín

Now tell me how many players you would have known about from the dutch team before the world cup as top class players. At this stage Robben and a half fit Van Persie.

Let's look at the Argentina team. Zabaleta, Mascherano, Messi and Higuain all world class or very close to it. Demichelis, Garay and Lavezzi all very well known as top class players.

To say that Argentina had not got better quality is wrong it's not even up for discussion, Argentina have far more quality. Also how can you dismiss their only world class striker being not fit. Of course that's going to make a huge difference to scoring goals.

They scored 15 goals in 7 games in the world cup so 1 in 2 goal ratio. In qualifying they scored 34 in 10 games just over 3 goals a game. I am not exactly seeing your proof for this lack of goals.

The fact is against teams of equal of worse quality they win and score heavily. Against teams with better quality they can set up to frustrate and get a result against. That is perfect for United this season to get back in the top 4.

The Moldy Gowl · 06-08-2014 09:10AM

Nuts102 wrote: »

Let;s have a look at both starting line ups.

Holland starting XI: Cillessen, Kuyt, Blind, Vlaar, De Vrij, Martins Indi, De Jong, Wijnaldum, Sneijder, Robben, Van Persie

Argentina starting XI: Romero, Zabaleta, Demichelis, Garay, Rojo, Enzo Pérez, Biglia, Mascherano, Lavezzi, Messi, Higuaín

Now tell me how many players you would have known about from the dutch team before the world cup as top class players. At this stage Robben and a half fit Van Persie.

Let's look at the Argentina team. Zabaleta, Mascherano, Messi and Higuain all world class or very close to it. Demichelis, Garay and Lavezzi all very well known as top class players.

To say that Argentina had not got better quality is wrong it's not even up for discussion, Argentina have far more quality. Also how can you dismiss their only world class striker being not fit. Of course that's going to make a huge difference to scoring goals.

They scored 15 goals in 7 games in the world cup so 1 in 2 goal ratio. In qualifying they scored 34 in 10 games just over 3 goals a game. I am not exactly seeing your proof for this lack of goals.

The fact is against teams of equal of worse quality they win and score heavily. Against teams with better quality they can set up to frustrate and get a result against. That is perfect for United this season to get back in the top 4.

This is what Fergie had been doing for years.

weisses · 06-08-2014 09:14AM

Nuts102 wrote: »

You mean the dutch side who were the 2nd highest scorers in the world cup and the 2nd highest scorers in the qualifiers?

Just to be fair ... They played two different systems in qualifying and the WC mainly because Strootman's injury ... That alone shows how important LvG thinks Strootman is for the team

beakerjoe · 06-08-2014 09:22AM

bangkok wrote: »

as I said here before 40m plus on a 27 year old with a bad knee is a huge risk especially for the type of game he plays. I have a feeling van gaal, the united board and medical staff feel the same. also if van gaal gets the players he wants he will play 4-3-3 with mata behind rvp and rooney.

Will he yeah ? Did he tell you that?

You dont know that.

Macca07 · 06-08-2014 09:23AM

Regarding the discussion about Vidal and who would partner him if he was signed, it would have to be Herrera for me. You don't need a holding defensive midfielder when playing 3 at the back. I think Carrick will get more games this season in the middle of CB rather than midfield. 2 box-to-box players in CM is perfect when playing 3-5-2 (5-3-2).

MagicIRL · 06-08-2014 09:26AM

Macca07 wrote: »

Regarding the discussion about Vidal and who would partner him if he was signed, it would have to be Herrera for me. You don't need a holding defensive midfielder when playing 3 at the back. I think Carrick will get more games this season in the middle of CB rather than midfield. 2 box-to-box players in CM is perfect when playing 3-5-2 (5-3-2).

Does that not open your back 3 to any counter with pace?

bangkok · 06-08-2014 09:27AM

beakerjoe wrote: »

Will he yeah ? Did he tell you that?

You dont know that.

its been his preferred system most of his career so I would imagine he will want to continue that with united

Backstreet Moyes · 06-08-2014 09:29AM

Gowlasauras Rex wrote: »

This is what Fergie had been doing for years.

Yes and unless we get a top class cb and cm we will need to do it in big games again.

bangkok · 06-08-2014 09:30AM

imo van gaal will want his team set up like this in the near future
when he gets the players he needs to play this formation

de gea

Rafael

new cb

evans

Shaw

new Holding Midfielder or carrick

Strootman

Herrera

Mata

----Rvp

Rooney

Maximus Alexander · 06-08-2014 09:33AM

I have to say lads, it's such a zen experience expecting no more signings with 3 and a half weeks left in the window. All the transfer talk just washes over me like a calm breeze while I look forward to the league kicking off next week. It's quite liberating, you should all come join me.

Giggsy11 · 06-08-2014 09:35AM

MagicIRL wrote: »

Does that not open your back 3 to any counter with pace?

Not really as both won't be making runs at the same time. One attacks and one stays back all the time.

beakerjoe · 06-08-2014 09:37AM

bangkok wrote: »

its been his preferred system most of his career so I would imagine he will want to continue that with united

It doesnt mean he will use it again though.

beakerjoe · 06-08-2014 09:40AM

Maximus Alexander wrote: »

I have to say lads, it's such a zen experience expecting no more signings with 3 and a half weeks left in the window. All the transfer talk just washes over me like a calm breeze while I look forward to the league kicking off next week. It's quite liberating, you should all come join me.

Im not happy about it, but Ive come to expect it and Im dealing with it. Hoping we hit the ground running in 2 weeks time

06-08-2014 09:42AM

Barca bid for vermalen...kind of glad

We need a better defender...

The Moldy Gowl · 06-08-2014 09:45AM

Nuts102 wrote: »

Yes and unless we get a top class cb and cm we will need to do it in big games again.

Sorry I meant to add we have done alright for ourself in those years.

But yes we do need a cm and cb

Giggsy11 · 06-08-2014 09:46AM

Cleverley wrote:

"Under the new manager we are being told to think of things as a team but personally it has gone well. I definitely think I can fit into the way he plays. I don’t think I have got to make much adaptation because he likes passers, movers, and people who understand the game."

He rates him way toooooo highly..

bangkok · 06-08-2014 09:47AM

beakerjoe wrote: »

It doesnt mean he will use it again though.

no but its been tried and tested and it has brought him a lot of success. He only played with wing backs at the world cup as he lost strootman and is only doing the same now at united as he is not happy about he defender options but as long as we keep winning I doubt many people will mind

MagicIRL · 06-08-2014 09:48AM

Giggsy11 wrote: »

Originally Posted by Cleverley
"Under the new manager we are being told to think of things as a team but personally it has gone well. I definitely think I can fit into the way he plays. I don’t think I have got to make much adaptation because he likes passers, movers, and people who understand the game."

He rates him way toooooo highly..

Tom can literally do none of those things.

bangkok · 06-08-2014 09:48AM

M!Ck^ wrote: »

Barca bid for vermalen...kind of glad

We need a better defender...

sad thing is good defenders are few and far between now

06-08-2014 09:50AM

Just reading there, Rodgers taking first shots at lvg...ooo its on

bucketybuck · 06-08-2014 09:52AM

Originally Posted by Cleverley
"Under the new manager we are being told to think of things as a team but personally it has gone well. I definitely think I can fit into the way he plays. I don’t think I have got to make much adaptation because he likes passers, movers, and people who understand the game."

Wonder if he likes people who hide from the ball?

MagicIRL · 06-08-2014 09:53AM

M!Ck^ wrote: »

Just reading there, Rodgers taking first shots at lvg...ooo its on

It'll end with Rodgers embarrassing himself on SSN screaming "I would luv' ih if we beat 'em, luv ih." after United cruise to the title. :cool:

RasTa · 06-08-2014 09:56AM

I did laugh at that Rodgers crap, he really has a high opinion of himself.

Average-Ro · 06-08-2014 09:57AM

What did Rodgers say?

Giggsy11 · 06-08-2014 09:58AM

MagicIRL wrote: »

Tom can literally do none of those things.

Best part is.

I definitely think I can fit into the way he plays. I don’t think I have got to make much adaptation because he likes passers, movers, and people who understand the game.

He doesn't need to adapt much as he is Van Gaal type player. Shame last year he was La Liga type player.

Giggsy11 · 06-08-2014 10:00AM

bucketybuck wrote: »

Wonder if he likes people who hide from the ball?

Well he did say "Movers" which means moving away from the ball as much as possible.

v3ttel · 06-08-2014 10:00AM

MagicIRL wrote: »

Tom can literally do none of those things.

I want to tell you, I might aswell do, about a boy who can't do anything....

Manchester United Team Talk/Gossip/Rumours Thread - Mod Note in OP, 13/8

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