Palestinaisn being slaughtered and a prick with a cowboy hat is on frint page

ardle1 · 25-07-2014 04:04AM

http://www.ipsc.ie/event/dundalk

A Dub in Glasgo · 25-07-2014 06:20AM

The amount of mental gymnastics on display from the Israeli apologists to justify slaughter is unreal. They would win every gold medal if this was ever an Olympic sport

keith16 · 25-07-2014 06:39AM

Just hearing the news of the attack on a school. I'm at a loss. How anyone can defend these blatant atrocities is beyond me.

smurgen · 25-07-2014 07:21AM

Deleted User wrote: »

Remember everyone, if you're against the slaughter of innocent people and the destruction of an entire society that makes you an anti-semite!

If you were anti semitic by rights you'd be cheerleading the whole conflict as Palestinian's are semitic also

bumper234 · 25-07-2014 07:22AM

speedboatchase wrote: »

But they're not targeting civilians; they're targeting the entire weapon infrastructure in an area where people are being used to protect weapons. Hamas is targeting civilians. They're just very bad at it.

*Cue mentions of the beach attack.*

That was horrendous and whoever ordered that should be tried and imprisoned for life. But if you honestly think that Israel, with its weaponry, was specifically targeting civilians as its end game, then the death figure would be 60,000+ right now.

You seemed to have missed this so i'l repost in the hope that you might reply to it

bumper234 wrote: »

How can one not? If it was a one of you might say ok it was a mistake but this is EVERY DAY sometimes multiple times! Either the IDF are deliberately targeting innocent children or their gunners/targeters/intel guys are so inept that they consistently hit innocent children. Which one do you think it is?

tayto lover · 25-07-2014 08:36AM

AND the murderous Israeli campaign against the people of Gaza continues unabated with over 850 men, women and children now murdered while the UN and US continue to stand by and watch. Shameful.

fta93 · 25-07-2014 08:55AM

speedboatchase wrote: »

But they're not targeting civilians; they're targeting the entire weapon infrastructure in an area where people are being used to protect weapons. Hamas is targeting civilians. They're just very bad at it.

*Cue mentions of the beach attack.*

That was horrendous and whoever ordered that should be tried and imprisoned for life. But if you honestly think that Israel, with its weaponry, was specifically targeting civilians as its end game, then the death figure would be 60,000+ right now.

Tell me then, why did the Israeli Murder Force order Palestinianas to evacuate to a UN school, but then bomb the UN school?

Oh wait, they probably didn't mean too, they just missed. That's ok isn't it?

fta93 · 25-07-2014 08:57AM

FullblownRose wrote: »

It's highly relevant since the question i responded to asked how many israelis have been killed. the point is they would probably all be dead without their overburdened defense system.

Hypothetical arguments aren't good enough when 700 innocent Palestinians are murdered.

"Oh well we murdered them children cos Hamas want to do the same to us but can't".

fta93 · 25-07-2014 08:59AM

Fiery mutant wrote: »

If It were my children, and I discovered terrorists had burrowed to within 200m of my children's school, I would think it very ****in close.

Anyway, Hamas need to step back.
Israel need to step back.
There is no winner here and it's just an endless cycle of killing that needs to stop.

I don't believe Israel is targeting school or hospitals purposefully. I believe in the fog of war, errors occur. And be it that they are targeting Hamas firing from these areas, or they have made errors in judgement or trajectory calculations, it needs to stop.

Hamas won't stop. They have no regard for life in any way shape or form. So Israel must.

I'm leaving it at that for tonight, and I'll go to bed safe in the knowledge that I won't come under rocket fire in my sleep.(although I'm fairly close to the Ukraine border tonight, so maybe sleep with one eye open)

So Hamas end up 200m from a school and you're sure they're targeting it.

But when Israel bomb a UN school, they weren't trying to. They weren't trying to kill the children. The innocent who'd been evacuated. The UN teachers.

I'm speechless tbh.

fta93 · 25-07-2014 09:01AM

FullblownRose wrote: »

Originally Posted by Fiery mutant View Post
I'd rather neither was a target. But of course my opinion is that Hamas fires from these position because they know the Israelis will then target that area. I also wonder why the school was still populated when they were told by the Israelis last night to have the school cleared before 10am this morning, as that area would be targeted by Israeli forces between 10am and 2pm today.

It's been known for a while that the time would come when israel would need to consider taking the weapons out on the ground. it was pure evil to situate them where they did and it is clear that israel did what could be done to minimise the damage unlie hamas who are as always going to great length to maximise it. if one rocket was launched at the UK never mind the intensity of the attacks aimed at israel all hell would be unleashed and there'd be a sight more collateral damage into the bargain.

If minimised damage is 700 dead civilians, then we've reached a fairly low point here.

WakeUp · 25-07-2014 10:32AM

WakeUp wrote: »

Can you explain the logic behind the Israeli strategy? they claim they give warnings before slamming a missile into a house yet doesn't it stand to reason that if there was someone from Hamas or their intended target in that house , and they were warned, obviously they would leave? so what's the point in blowing up houses to get them if they have already left? why would you do that . it doesn't make much senses unless the actually strategy is the systematic destruction of Palestinian homes and the "we are targeting terrorists yet warning them first??" narrative is just a deception to cover that up. can you shed any light on that...

I put forward this question yesterday to a poster - I heart Internet - and received no response . I'm wondering if there is anyone else including that person willing to come and talk to me today about it? anyone care to explain the logic behind this to me because to me the official line doesn't add up. Overnight another 30 Palestinian homes have been attacked killing one "militant" and two of his sons....

"Israeli aircraft struck 30 houses in the Gaza Strip early Friday, killing a leader of the militant Islamic Jihad group and two of his sons, while ground troops and Hamas gunmen fought intense battles in the north and center of the territory, Palestinian officials said."

"Such strikes have also claimed the lives of a large number of civilians. A Gaza human rights group said earlier this week that close to 500 homes have been damaged or destroyed in direct hits from the air, and that more than 320 people have been killed in their homes as a result of military strikes."

From what I can gather from reports so far is that there has been seven confirmed civllian deaths from the overnight air strikes and shelling along with a five year old kid dead due to being shot in the head. and you can nearly be sure there are more dead civilians buried underneathe the rubble of those houses and adjacent houses/buildings hit overnight and many injured.

If as the IDF are claiming they warn people before blowing up their house what is the point in doing that if that person isn't going to be there? and the militants they do get well they obviously didn't get a warning as if they did logic dictates they would leave as soon as they could before being taken out .what about the civilians then who didn't get a warning too. and the other people in adjacent buildings or on the street who didn't get a warning you can't bomb built up areas and not cause damage to the surrounding buildings. "We are targeting militants yet warning them??" narrative doesn't make sense to me. why would you do that . and if they aren't there why would you still target the house knowing that. The Israeli logic/strategy/excuse does not stand up to scrutiny. is anyone willing to try explain the logic behind this "tactic"???...or is it as I suspect a systematic and deliberate destruction of Palestinian homes and to hell with the civilian consequences.

http://nypost.com/2014/07/25/israeli-airstrikes-hit-30-gaza-strip-homes/
http://www.maannews.net/eng/ViewDetails.aspx?ID=716111

NewCorkLad · 25-07-2014 10:36AM

WakeUp wrote: »

I put forward this question yesterday to a poster - I heart Internet - and received no response . I'm wondering if there is anyone else including that person willing to come and talk to me today about it? anyone care to explain the logic behind this to me because to me the official line doesn't add up. Overnight another 30 Palestinian homes have been attacked killing one "militant" and two of his sons....

"Israeli aircraft struck 30 houses in the Gaza Strip early Friday, killing a leader of the militant Islamic Jihad group and two of his sons, while ground troops and Hamas gunmen fought intense battles in the north and center of the territory, Palestinian officials said."

"Such strikes have also claimed the lives of a large number of civilians. A Gaza human rights group said earlier this week that close to 500 homes have been damaged or destroyed in direct hits from the air, and that more than 320 people have been killed in their homes as a result of military strikes."

From what I can gather from reports so far is that there has been seven confirmed civllian deaths from the overnight air strikes and shelling along with a five year old kid dead due to being shot in the head. and you can nearly be sure there are more dead civilians buried underneathe the rubble of those houses and adjacent houses/buildings hit overnight and many injured.

If as the IDF are claiming they warn people before blowing up their house what is the point in doing that if that person isn't going to be there? and the militants they do get well they obviously didn't get a warning as if they did logic dictates they would leave as soon as they could before being taken out .what about the civilians then who didn't get a warning too. and the other people in adjacent buildings or on the street who didn't get a warning you can't bomb built up areas and not cause damage to the surrounding buildings. "We are targeting militants yet warning them??" narrative doesn't make sense to me. why would you do that . and if they aren't there why would you still target the house knowing that. The Israeli logic/strategy/excuse does not stand up to scrutiny. is anyone willing to try explain the logic behind this "tactic"???...or is it as I suspect a systematic and deliberate destruction of Palestinian homes and to hell with the civilian consequences.

http://nypost.com/2014/07/25/israeli-airstrikes-hit-30-gaza-strip-homes/
http://www.maannews.net/eng/ViewDetails.aspx?ID=716111

I also raised this question a while ago but got no response, it just doesnt make sense to me, I dont see what Israel hope to acheive by it.

Buzz Killington the third · 25-07-2014 10:37AM

WakeUp wrote: »

if they aren't there why would you still target the house knowing that.

Even at the hospital, if there's rockets then why would they allow the hospital to evacuate and then blow it up? If they're giving a warning to evacuate then they should go in on ground and take the missiles instead of levelling a needed building. They're just trying to leave the people of Gaza with no resources!

sid waddell · 25-07-2014 11:13AM

sid waddell wrote: »

Was Russia merely only defending itself when pro-Russian rebels shot down the Malaysian Airlines plane last week?

That's a serious question for Israel supporters, by the way, and while it might seem facetious, the nature of pro-Israeli reaction to what is going on in Gaza means that what you would, under normal circumstances, assume to be ridiculous questions, must in fact be asked in a serious manner.

I'll ask this question again. Now whatever your view of the conflict in Ukraine, I think it's a bit of a stretch to say that the people who shot down the Malaysian Airlines plane deliberately set out to shoot down a civilian aircraft completely unconnected to he conflict, and kill all the passengers.

Nevertheless, it has roundly been described by Western politicians as an act of murder and terrorism, and I think very fairly so.

So why is what Israel is doing, which is very obviously going to lead to civilian deaths on a vast scale, not also described in the same manner by the same Western politicians?

hatrickpatrick · 25-07-2014 11:37AM

Israel doesn't have to be deliberately targeting civilians to be committing war crimes BTW.

I'll give you an analogy here: Some believe that a large conspiracy precipitated the banking crisis. Whenever this comes up for debate, there is often ridicule at the suggestion from some, who say "you honestly believe the banking crisis was caused deliberately?"
Those people are missing the point. There are two possible means by which a conspiracy could have been responsible. They only address the first. The first is that somebody, for whatever reason, actually wanted a crisis and deliberately took steps towards creating one.

But the second, which apologists overlook, is that they wanted what they wanted for themselves, and that they didn't care who they had to hurt in order to get it. It's not that they wanted a crisis, but that the crisis itself was to them an irrelevant side effect of their behavior - they knew what they were doing could easily cause a massive crisis which would hurt millions of people, but because they're self centered twats they said "as long as I can ride the storm, I'll take the risk. Sure other people aren't my problem, if there's a chance I can get rich who cares if a few million people lose their jobs?"

In my view, the second category of conspiracy is far, far more likely - in fact it almost seems a dead certainty at this point. And in my view, that's exactly what's happening in Gaza. They might not be saying "a school, let's bomb it for the craic" (although they easily might be, on the other hand) - but if not, they probably are saying something like "There might be a Hamas guy in there. If there's a chance we can get him, it's worth risking the lives of the thousand innocent people living in the building".

In other words, it's not always about deliberate targeting. It's about the principle that it shouldn't ever be ok to regard the suffering of innocent people as a "side effect" - it should be a priority for military people to avoid this. Some people believe that it's better to let a hundred guilty men walk free than to imprison one innocent man - and that those standards apply in conflict as well as law enforcement.

Akrasia · 25-07-2014 11:55AM

Israel fires a tank shell into a residential area = 'ligitimate military operations'
Hamas fires an unguided rocket in the general area of Israel = 'Deliberately targetting civilians'

Whats the difference?

If you ask any Israeli apologist,they talk about intent. They say that the IDF are intending to kill militants and civilians are unintended victims

They say that Hamas are trying to kill civilians, therefore Hamas are terrorists, and Israel are defending themselves.

Has anyone asked the Hamas militants what their actual intent is when firing the rockets? If the Hamas rockets are intended to strike military infrastructure, but Hamas just haven't got the technology to direct them, then the moral argument used by Israel evaporates. (after all, Israel claim they 'intend' to kill only Militants, but haven't the technology to avoid civilian deaths)

Now, lets talk about human shields. Hamas are accused of using human shields. But nobody ever talks about the radical zionist settlers who deliberately move their families into disputed lands where they know they are at risk of attack. When the settlers move their families into danger, the Israeli security forces move in to defend them and the way they defend them, is by pushing the palestinians out of their homes and creating buffer zones between the settlers and the Palestinians. The israelis are putting their children deliberately into harms way in order to justify the security forces presence in these areas as a way of stealing land from the Palestinians.

The fact that these settlers are moving their own families into danger to further a religious, political and ideological agenda makes them worse than Hamas in my mind, because they are using their families as tools in an act of voluntary aggression, where hamas are using civilians as cover out of desperation and because there are no other options available to them.

To the zionists on here who will claim that Palestinians love killing civilians or make unsubstantiated claims about hamas fighters gluing babies to their clothes to use as human body armour or other such propaganda, answer the following questions.

If you gave Hamas the capacity to accurately target military infrastructure, would they still be firing unguided rockets over the border?

If Hamas had the technology to drop bombs from the air onto specific locations, would they target random israeli citizens, or would they target military infrastructure?

25-07-2014 12:06PM

Not a hope in hell I would move myself and my family into an area where the chances of being killed are significantly increased.

Fecking mad!

paperclip2 · 25-07-2014 12:07PM

There's info on facebook a short time ago saying that a five year old boy was shot in the head by an Israeli sniper. https://www.facebook.com/noorharazeen/posts/658238870916868

5 years old...shot...sniper
That's a combination of words that should NEVER have appear together in a sentence.

:mad:

Nodin · 25-07-2014 12:26PM

paperclip2 wrote: »

There's info on facebook a short time ago saying that a five year old boy was shot in the head by an Israeli sniper. https://www.facebook.com/noorharazeen/posts/658238870916868

5 years old...shot...sniper
That's a combination of words that should NEVER have appear together in a sentence.

:mad:

They were notorious for it in Gaza when it was occupied.

hju6 · 25-07-2014 01:26PM

John Kerry working on a week long truce

http://www.nytimes.com/2014/07/25/world/middleeast/kerry-proposes-weeklong-halt-to-fighting-in-gaza-strip.html

Fiery mutant · 25-07-2014 02:35PM

paperclip2 wrote: »

There's info on facebook a short time ago saying that a five year old boy was shot in the head by an Israeli sniper. https://www.facebook.com/noorharazeen/posts/658238870916868

5 years old...shot...sniper
That's a combination of words that should NEVER have appear together in a sentence.

:mad:

Well holy sh1t, we're now taking facebook stories as gospel. You're making even the Daily Mail seem unbiased with this one.

Exiting this thread for the sake of my sanity.

Buzz Killington the third · 25-07-2014 02:42PM

Fiery mutant wrote: »

Exiting this thread for the sake of my sanity.

I fear that may have happened a long time ago.

FullblownRose · 25-07-2014 03:59PM

Some unsavoury people on this thread. Some on here are motivated by anti semitism and will behave without integrity to further your agenda. You always existed and now you feel safe to air your rather nauseating true opinions and natures. Those with a modicum of intellectual and investigative rigour will hopefully see through it. Thread to be unfollowed now.

Buzz Killington the third · 25-07-2014 04:01PM

FullblownRose wrote: »

Some unsavoury people on this thread. Some on here are motivated by anti semitism and will behave without integrity to further your agenda. You always existed and now you feel safe to air your rather nauseating true opinions and natures. Those with a modicum of intellectual and investigative rigour will hopefully see through it. Thread to be unfollowed now.

No they're really not. They just don't agree with the level of disregard Israel has for non-Jewish life.

Tony EH · 25-07-2014 04:03PM

FullblownRose wrote: »

Some unsavoury people on this thread. Some on here are motivated by anti semitism and will behave without integrity to further your agenda. You always existed and now you feel safe to air your rather nauseating true opinions and natures. Those with a modicum of intellectual and investigative rigour will hopefully see through it. Thread to be unfollowed now.

Ah, the old antisemitism card again...

You've failed. Good bye.

25-07-2014 04:11PM

FullblownRose wrote: »

Some unsavoury people on this thread. Some on here are motivated by anti semitism and will behave without integrity to further your agenda. You always existed and now you feel safe to air your rather nauseating true opinions and natures. Those with a modicum of intellectual and investigative rigour will hopefully see through it. Thread to be unfollowed now.

You're off your head!

the majority on here are of the opinion that killing babies and children is wrong. You call that nausiating? Sorry, m'dear, but you are the sick one.

fta93 · 25-07-2014 04:15PM

Strawberry Milkshake wrote: »

You're off your head!

the majority on here are of the opinion that killing babies and children is wrong. You call that nausiating? Sorry, m'dear, but you are the sick one.

You're wasting the time. The argument of the pro-child murderers is always to reference you being pro-Hamas or anti-Semitic.

They've no other argument. I suppose you can't tho when you're murdering children.

fta93 · 25-07-2014 04:18PM

Surely the mods can intervene here and stop the slandering of people as anti-Semitic without any proof.

I take great offence to bein labelled anti-Semitic for having the balls to criticise the killing of children.

A Dub in Glasgo · 25-07-2014 04:20PM

Fiery mutant wrote: »

Exiting this thread for the sake of my sanity.

Your sanity was well gone before you came into this thread

A Dub in Glasgo · 25-07-2014 04:22PM

FullblownRose wrote: »

Some unsavoury people on this thread. Some on here are motivated by anti semitism and will behave without integrity to further your agenda. You always existed and now you feel safe to air your rather nauseating true opinions and natures. Those with a modicum of intellectual and investigative rigour will hopefully see through it. Thread to be unfollowed now.

The first sentence is correct, the 2nd wrong. The less said about the rest the better

Palestinaisn being slaughtered and a prick with a cowboy hat is on frint page

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