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Palestinaisn being slaughtered and a prick with a cowboy hat is on frint page

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Comments

  • #1532
    Archie D Bunker
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 234 ✭✭Archie D Bunker


    Nodin wrote: »
    So those children didn't die?

    Why are UNRWA unreliable? Did those children mentioned not die either?

    Almost forgot - UNRWA...

    Just the last example I can think of - they find rockets in an UNRWA school, and what do they do? Give them back to Hamas. Considering these rockets are fired on Israelis, and this firing of rockets is a war crime, it seems UNRWA are almost participating in a war crime here.


  • #1533
    Archie D Bunker
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 234 ✭✭Archie D Bunker


    FTA69 wrote: »
    Hamas didn't fire rockets for 18 months while Israel maintained a blockade on Gaza.

    My friend, if you want anyone to take what you say seriously you have to watch it for nonsense like that.
    If my memory serves, in the last 14 years or so there wasn't a week without a mortar or rocket attack on Israel.


  • #1534
    yortem
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 25 ✭yortem


    well. its hard for me to argue with you when its not my native language. and its doesnt matter what i say, these discussion never ends.
    good luck all of you. i wish you peaceful life in your peaceful country.


  • #1535
    Nodin
    Closed Accounts Posts: 46,938 ✭✭✭✭Nodin


    Archie D Bunker wrote: »
    ........................

    So, I responded to your sources, now tell me, didn't the Hamas representative in the video specifically encourage Palestinians to stay and serve as human shields stating it's an effective tactic?


    How many 'incidents' does it take for a pattern to emerge?

    No, I don't accept he said that simply because of two things (a) the source and (b) my lack of Arabic.

    One might add a third, in that Israel doesn't give a crap, so its hardly that effective.


  • #1536
    Nodin
    Closed Accounts Posts: 46,938 ✭✭✭✭Nodin


    Archie D Bunker wrote: »
    Almost forgot - UNRWA...

    Just the last example I can think of - they find rockets in an UNRWA school, and what do they do? Give them back to Hamas. Considering these rockets are fired on Israelis, and this firing of rockets is a war crime, it seems UNRWA are almost participating in a war crime here.

    That means that children shot dead in UNRWA schools are not shot dead, should be shot dead...................?


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  • #1537
    Archie D Bunker
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 234 ✭✭Archie D Bunker


    end of the road wrote: »
    look, just admit it, you either haven't a clue, or are so blind to israels actions, or your extremely deluded to the fact that israel do wrong themselves while whining about others doing the same things they do

    Could say the same about you, all I need is to replace "Israel" with "Hamas"


  • #1538
    wes
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 11,749 ✭✭✭✭wes


    yortem wrote: »
    tell me witch country was here before? no country.
    it was property of britian and they gave us the land.

    Your right there wasn't a country there, and that about all your right about. Firstly, it was a class A mandate, and as such it wasn't actually Britain's land to give to anyone, as under the League of Nations mandate system, they were suppose to prepare Palestine to become a state. So again you have no clue what your talking about.
    yortem wrote: »
    i was there. i know what i saw and i know 100% that we dont kill innocent civilians if its up to us but yes. children from gaza were kept as hostages where hamas need them!

    Plenty of evidence that shows you to be wrong. The independent.co.uk also investigated the Israeli claims in regards to Hamas using Human Shields and found not evidence of this. So you are quite frankly lieing.
    yortem wrote: »
    for example:
    before we bomb a house who fire rocket or has ammunition we fire "little rocket" who doesnt damage the house to warn the cilvilans to get out and run away. sometimes hamas take civilians by force and go to the roof of the house and we have to cancel the mission.
    you can search videos but i saw it with my own eyes!!

    Destroying civilian property even with a warning is a war crime, and your claims in regards to Human Shield is a lie. Also, some people may not be able to flee in time, or have anywhere to flee to. What interesting about the "warnings" is that they are an instrument of terror, being used against a civilian population, as they are never valid targets, warning or no.


  • #1539
    Buzz Killington the third
    Closed Accounts Posts: 937 ✭✭✭Buzz Killington the third


    yortem wrote: »
    well. its hard for me to argue with you when its not my native language. and its doesnt matter what i say, these discussion never ends.
    good luck all of you. i wish you peaceful life in your peaceful country.

    Mainly because you wont listen to anyone who's not Jewish.
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5jG6kJm-50k


  • #1540
    wes
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 11,749 ✭✭✭✭wes


    Archie D Bunker wrote: »
    Almost forgot - UNRWA...

    Just the last example I can think of - they find rockets in an UNRWA school, and what do they do? Give them back to Hamas. Considering these rockets are fired on Israelis, and this firing of rockets is a war crime, it seems UNRWA are almost participating in a war crime here.

    You have proof of this claim? UNRWA are denying this btw.........


  • #1541
    Karl Stein
    Closed Accounts Posts: 7,687 ✭✭✭Karl Stein


    yortem wrote: »
    children from gaza were kept as hostages where hamas need them!

    Hamas keep children in Gaza as hostages? I don't believe you. Btw Gaza itself is hostage to Israel.
    sometimes hamas take civilians by force and go to the roof of the house and we have to cancel the mission.

    I don't believe you. If there was proof of this the Israeli PR machine would be all over it like a soup sandwich on a fat man.

    People are probably standing on their roofs as an act of resistance against having their homes demolished as part of a captive population with nowhere else to go.


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  • #1542
    Archie D Bunker
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 234 ✭✭Archie D Bunker


    Nodin wrote: »
    Why do you state these things as fact when its quite evident the opposite is the case?

    "When delivering the verdict Dr Dean said the Ipswich inquest was the only one to consider other deaths in the area.
    He said action needed to be taken "particularly as this was not the first death of a UN worker, but the 13th".
    http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/england/suffolk/4534620.stm

    All by rifle fire. There's only so many accidents that can happen.

    Nodin, that's from 2002. Things have changed considerably in the area since then, and in the way the IDF works.


  • #1543
    Archie D Bunker
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 234 ✭✭Archie D Bunker


    NewCorkLad wrote: »
    So if a sniper sets himself up in a Hospital full of innocent Doctors, Nurses, patients and treatens to kill anyone who leaves and takes some pot shots out the window. You beleive the right action here is to give everyone a warning to leave and then bomb the building.

    No, that's where proportionality comes to play.
    Many people on these forums don't understand the idea behind that either though - they think proportionality means the ratio of dead Israelis to dead Palestinians, but what is meant by proportionality (as far as rules of war are concerned) is the use of proportionate force that is enough to get the job done.

    In the case you specified, an Israeli sniper would be enough to get the job done. If Israel were to bomb the building because of a sniper I would consider it a war crime.


  • #1544
    Archie D Bunker
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 234 ✭✭Archie D Bunker


    bumper234 wrote: »
    You don't seem to have an issue with it.

    And from where did you get this impression?


  • #1545
    bumper234
    Closed Accounts Posts: 10,250 ✭✭✭✭bumper234


    Archie D Bunker wrote: »
    No, that's where proportionality comes to play.
    Many people on these forums don't understand the idea behind that either though - they think proportionality means the ratio of dead Israelis to dead Palestinians, but what is meant by proportionality (as far as rules of war are concerned) is the use of proportionate force that is enough to get the job done.

    In the case you specified, an Israeli sniper would be enough to get the job done. If Israel were to bomb the building because of a sniper I would consider it a war crime.

    So you admit that Israel bombing the hospital today killing women and children is a war crime?


  • #1546
    Archie D Bunker
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 234 ✭✭Archie D Bunker


    wes wrote: »
    You were justifying the collective punishment of the entire populace of Gaza via a siege, so your one to talk.

    A siege is better than killing people, yes. Don't you agree?


  • #1547
    NewCorkLad
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 963 ✭✭✭NewCorkLad


    Archie D Bunker wrote: »
    No, that's where proportionality comes to play.
    Many people on these forums don't understand the idea behind that either though - they think proportionality means the ratio of dead Israelis to dead Palestinians, but what is meant by proportionality (as far as rules of war are concerned) is the use of proportionate force that is enough to get the job done.

    In the case you specified, an Israeli sniper would be enough to get the job done. If Israel were to bomb the building because of a sniper I would consider it a war crime.

    Ok so where is the proof of there being bombs in the hospital. Not that this would justify the bombing of the hospital.


  • #1548
    Archie D Bunker
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 234 ✭✭Archie D Bunker


    NewCorkLad wrote: »
    You dont seem to have any problem trying to justify the bombin of a hospital over the suspicion of terrorists residing there.

    I'm not here to justify anything. I'm sure you don't justify firing thousands of rockets into Israeli civilian areas, or suicide bombings. You just understand why they do it.

    The difference between the two is that every rocket Hamas fires is a war crime, and we are yet to find out (not from the Palestinians) what the scope of Israeli war crimes in this operation is (if there are any). Bombing a hospital used to fire rockets is not a war crime.


  • #1549
    Nodin
    Closed Accounts Posts: 46,938 ✭✭✭✭Nodin


    Archie D Bunker wrote: »
    Nodin, that's from 2002. Things have changed considerably in the area since then, and in the way the IDF works.


    Theres over 500 reasons to suggest that the more things supposedly change, the more they stay the exact same.


  • #1550
    bumper234
    Closed Accounts Posts: 10,250 ✭✭✭✭bumper234


    Archie D Bunker wrote: »
    I'm not here to justify anything. I'm sure you don't justify firing thousands of rockets into Israeli civilian areas, or suicide bombings. You just understand why they do it.

    The difference between the two is that every rocket Hamas fires is a war crime, and we are yet to find out (not from the Palestinians) what the scope of Israeli war crimes in this operation is (if there are any). Bombing a hospital used to fire rockets is not a war crime.

    You have evidence that rockets were fired from inside this hospital? You have just said that firing into a hospital to kill a sniper is a war crime.


  • #1551
    Nodin
    Closed Accounts Posts: 46,938 ✭✭✭✭Nodin


    Archie D Bunker wrote: »
    I'm not here to justify anything...............

    Odd that's what you're doing then so.


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  • #1552
    Archie D Bunker
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 234 ✭✭Archie D Bunker


    Nodin wrote: »
    That means that children shot dead in UNRWA schools are not shot dead, should be shot dead...................?

    Not what I said.
    I said I don't trust UNRWA and I gave an example as to why.


  • #1553
    wes
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 11,749 ✭✭✭✭wes


    Archie D Bunker wrote: »
    A siege is better than killing people, yes. Don't you agree?

    Slowly torturing civilians including children (children suffering malnutrition, stunted growth and other life long problems) via a siege isn't any better actually. Targeting civilians is wrong, regardless of who is doing it, and just because they aren't being murdered, doesn't mean that the slow torture is any better.


  • #1554
    NewCorkLad
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 963 ✭✭✭NewCorkLad


    Archie D Bunker wrote: »
    If rockets were stored in the hospital, or if rockets were fired from it (or the immediate area), or if any other terrorist activity was being performed there, and if sufficient warning was given - the hospital is a legitimate target and it is not a war crime.

    By the way - the fact that the Hamas leadership is hiding under a hospital - that's a war crime.

    To me that sounds like justification, which frankly sickens me.


  • #1555
    Nodin
    Closed Accounts Posts: 46,938 ✭✭✭✭Nodin


    Archie D Bunker wrote: »
    Not what I said.
    I said I don't trust UNRWA and I gave an example as to why.

    They're neutral and non-military.

    Are you saying those children did not die, or are you trying to justify their shooting?


  • #1556
    Archie D Bunker
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 234 ✭✭Archie D Bunker


    bumper234 wrote: »
    So you admit that Israel bombing the hospital today killing women and children is a war crime?

    No, I was so busy posting here (and working :rolleyes:) to read the news today.
    I have no idea why the hospital was bombed,and if it was for no reason then it is a war crime in my opinion.

    To be honest, I can't really understand the logic behind your assumption that Israel wants to kill as many Palestinians as possible, that they want to destroy hospitals and schools and all that.

    The Israelis are not stupid. They know exactly the damage they suffer in the media every time a civilian gets hurt or a hospital is shelled.
    They do throw leaflets and make phone calls and give warnings before bombing - we know that.

    So please, someone enlighten me - what possible reason would Israel have to bomb a hospital for no reason, and why don't they just bomb the hospital the Hamas leadership is hiding under and have the whole conflict over with in 5 minutes?


  • #1557
    wes
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 11,749 ✭✭✭✭wes


    Archie D Bunker wrote: »
    Not what I said.
    I said I don't trust UNRWA and I gave an example as to why.

    You haven't proved that claim, which they deny, earlier false claims were retracted btw by Israeli Channel 2 news:

    Israel Channel Two Retracts False Allegations Against UNRWA


  • #1558
    FTA69
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,252 ✭✭✭FTA69


    Archie D Bunker wrote: »
    My friend, if you want anyone to take what you say seriously you have to watch it for nonsense like that.
    If my memory serves, in the last 14 years or so there wasn't a week without a mortar or rocket attack on Israel.

    In 2013, there were 44 projectiles fired, none of which were fired by Hamas. They killed nobody.

    As for nonsense, considering you were trying to tell me there was no settlement expansion and that the PA controlled Palestinian water, I'll take whatever you say with a large pinch of salt.

    You couldn't even respond to my last post without coming out with some spoof about Wikipedia.


  • #1559
    WakeUp
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,823 ✭✭✭WakeUp


    Archie D Bunker wrote: »
    Again with this "international law" thing?
    I'll repeat myself - there is no such thing.
    There are agreements,contracts & treaties that are signed between sovereign nations. Thats is the entire scope of international law - agreement between nations, and I doubt Hamas is a signatory to any of these treaties.

    No such thing as international law really? actually there is such a thing though it's not surprising to see someone like yourself claim as much .unless of course Israel is a pariah state and has it's own set of rules and does not accept nor respect international recognised rules and norms. That's the entire scope? huh? what are you even talking about. do you know what you're talking about?


  • #1560
    Archie D Bunker
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 234 ✭✭Archie D Bunker


    Nodin wrote: »
    Theres over 500 reasons to suggest that the more things supposedly change, the more they stay the exact same.

    Couldn't agree with you more, although not for the same specific reason.


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  • #1561
    Nodin
    Closed Accounts Posts: 46,938 ✭✭✭✭Nodin


    Archie D Bunker wrote: »
    No, I was so busy (.............)the whole conflict over with in 5 minutes?

    Here you go
    http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=91377307&postcount=1295


This discussion has been closed.
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