Manchester United Team Talk/Gossip/Rumours Thread - Mod Notes in OP,22/7

keane2097 · 09-07-2014 02:23PM

beno619 wrote: »

Khedira is just an athletic version of Cleverley.

Billy86 · 09-07-2014 02:24PM

beno619 wrote: »

Khedira is just an athletic version of Cleverley.

Yeah, nothing at all special there. Not a bad player and can be a good fit in certain midfield but he is significantly less of a game changer than just about everyone in Germany's midfield, starting or otherwise.

Danye · 09-07-2014 02:25PM

beno619 wrote: »

Khedira is just an athletic version of Cleverley.

Hopefully that's your attempt at a joke?

Danye · 09-07-2014 02:29PM

In regards to Kroos..

I'm one of his biggest fans for quite sometime now and I'd love to see him in a United shirt BUT id rather we address our immediate problem positions first before we would think of going after him.

bangkok · 09-07-2014 02:30PM

Danye wrote: »

In regards to Kroos..

I'm one of his biggest fans for quite sometime now and I'd love to see him in a United shirt BUT id rather we address our immediate problem positions first before we would think of going after him.

what positions might they be? he is actually the perfect player for Utd

Maximus Alexander · 09-07-2014 02:33PM

Danye wrote: »

In regards to Kroos..

I'm one of his biggest fans for quite sometime now and I'd love to see him in a United shirt BUT id rather we address our immediate problem positions first before we would think of going after him.

Kroos is just an athletic version of Djemba Djemba.

Spazdarn · 09-07-2014 02:39PM

Is it greedy to want both Vidal and Kroos?!!

09-07-2014 02:39PM

Mikeyt086 wrote: »

I did a quick mock-up of how I think our kits would look if we go with Adidas or Warrior.

Kroos would look good in that adidas mock up United shirt!

brinty · 09-07-2014 02:41PM

bangkok wrote: »

what positions might they be? he is actually the perfect player for Utd

I never thought i'd see the day i'd say this but Bangkok is right..
MagicIRL will kill me for that one

Midfield is where we need to strenghten, CB thereafter..

Kroos and or vidal and or Strootman are players we need to improve the team

if Hummels can be bought by all means get it done

but we need one of those three signed this window is a bigger priority

Dohnny Jepp · 09-07-2014 02:41PM

bangkok wrote: »

what positions might they be? he is actually the perfect player for Utd

He isn't. He kicked up a fuss in Munich because he was being played too deep. He can play play both a number 10 role and a deeper playmaking role (won't call it defensive midfield because he doesn't actually defend) but he only wants to play the number 10 role and we have a lot of players for that position already. Phenomenal player though.

Vidal / Strootman would be the perfect midfielder for us. Both can play box to box or a holding defensive role. Vidal is especially talented although shorter than Strootman. Deceptively strong and quick. Great range of passing, great positioning and loves to play hard. Vidal is a top player with and without the ball.

In regards to Hummels, he'd be a great buy, lots and lots of talent. Great mind for the game and all the physical traits you'd hope for as well as being very confident on the ball. I watch a lot of the bundesliga and specifically Dortmund. Hummels actually had a very very poor season, the heel injury should be no excuse because he was poor before it and poor after it. It was only in the final 5th of the season that he started playing well. There may be some reasons for his significant drop in standards from the previous year, because he looks to be back at his best in the WC. I'd go so far to say Germany's most important player.

akelly02 · 09-07-2014 02:42PM

if Carrick or Cleverley are still in our midfield this year we can forget about winning anything IMO.

Carrick does nothing, Mr anonymous, in fact i think he hides during games.Doesnt attack well, nor defend well.

Cleverley just cant cut it at this level, i do think he tries though.

We definately need another top class Midfielder to compliment Herrera, Vidal being widely regarded as first choice

beno619 · 09-07-2014 02:42PM

keane2097 wrote: »

Can you elaborate on what makes him so superior ?

He's not a patch on his German teammates and looks really out of place in the Madrid side. He's very average and I was seriously worried by romours of £35M bids being made on deadline day last summer.

keane2097 · 09-07-2014 02:45PM

beno619 wrote: »

Can you elaborate on what makes him so superior ?

He's not a patch on his German teammates and looks really out of place in the Madrid side. He's very average and I was seriously worried by romours of £35M bids being made on deadline day last summer.

What's the point? I'll list the things I think he's great at so you can tell me you think he's bad at them, let's not bother.

You think he's a bit more athletic than TCLEV23, I coooooouldn't care less tbh.

cdb · 09-07-2014 02:45PM

Billy86 wrote: »

Huh, which word?

It would leave us too thin at LB where I would still prefer a more established player than Shaw short term (as much as I doing the signing, long term) but if Evra helps facilitate a Vidal move then Blind or a 5-10mn type signing will more than suffice in the scheme of things.

Bleed in / Bed in - never mind, it was a fairly poor attempt at humour

If Evra leaving helps the Vidal deal then by all means - and if Nani can be included all the better. Evra's experience will be missed but his performances have been on the decline for so long now this window is probably the last chance to recoup some sort of a transfer fee. Plenty of time to bring in backup.

beno619 · 09-07-2014 02:52PM

keane2097 wrote: »

What's the point? I'll list the things I think he's great at so you can tell me you think he's bad at them, let's not bother.

You think he's a bit more athletic than TCLEV23, I coooooouldn't care less tbh.

After posting a condescending gif you could at least explain why you believe my post is so ridiculous.

Besides being taller so naturally more physical and faster I don't see what more he has in the locker in comparison to cleverley, I think there both quite limited.

bangkok · 09-07-2014 02:58PM

beno619 wrote: »

After posting a condescending gif you could at least explain why you believe my post is so ridiculous.

Besides being taller so naturally more physical and faster I don't see what more he has in the locker in comparison to cleverley, I think there both quite limited.

he is technically superior in every single department

Backstreet Moyes · 09-07-2014 02:58PM

beno619 wrote: »

After posting a condescending gif you could at least explain why you believe my post is so ridiculous.

Besides being taller so naturally more physical and faster I don't see what more he has in the locker in comparison to cleverley, I think there both quite limited.

He can run with the ball, he can pass it forward, he can assist and he can score.

Billy86 · 09-07-2014 03:02PM

akelly02 wrote: »

if Carrick or Cleverley are still in our midfield this year we can forget about winning anything IMO.

Carrick does nothing, Mr anonymous, in fact i think he hides during games.Doesnt attack well, nor defend well.

Cleverley just cant cut it at this level, i do think he tries though.

We definately need another top class Midfielder to compliment Herrera, Vidal being widely regarded as first choice

Crazy statement. Carrick is not good covering a lot of round which is why he struggled quite badly last season with Moyes telling the backline to say deep, the attacking players to stay high, and expecting 2/3 CMs to cover the other sixty percent of the pitch. But put him in a tighter system, especially a 3 man midfield, covering the space in front of the backline and he is very effective, and can still be very useful this season while we look to strengthen areas of bigger need (like a combative midfielders along the lines of Vidal, and a CB). There is a reason the season before Moyes came about he was voted the best CM in the league, and it amazes me how quickly people seem to (want to?) forget this. Carrick is far from spectacular with the ball, but he is very efficient and almost never puts us in a sticky situation, while his positioning and reading of the game is top notch and allows him to consistently slow down opposition attacks and limit passing lanes when we have committed players forward.

I reckon is it similar to why a lot of people hated Ferdinand when we were struggling for a while years back (and why some crazy eejits preferred Terry and even Carragher to him for a bit), this odd perception that last ditch tackles and "getting stuck in" are far mote important factors than they actually are.

If we stumble upon some quality replacement for him then sure yeah, we might as well go in and see what happens, but he is far, far from a liability. Vidal/Strootman/etc are not Carrick replacements though, very different players.

TheDoc · 09-07-2014 03:03PM

Anytime I see that Jennifer Lawrence gif I lose total train of thought on what the conversation/topic is

beno619 · 09-07-2014 03:05PM

Nuts102 wrote: »

He can run with the ball, he can pass it forward, he can assist and he can score.

I'd argue so can Cleverley unless were just judging him on last season.

Nobody mentioned his name until Germany met an awful Brazil side last in night.

Backstreet Moyes · 09-07-2014 03:10PM

beno619 wrote: »

I'd argue so can Cleverley unless were just judging him on last season.

Nobody mentioned his name until Germany met an awful Brazil side last in night.

No i am judging him on the last few seasons. He has no vision he runs to receive the ball turns backwards and then runs away from the play.

He can do none of those things and if you think nobody talked about Khedeira until last night you must have been in a cave.

Spazdarn · 09-07-2014 03:10PM

Billy86 wrote: »

Crazy statement. Carrick is not good covering a lot of round which is why he struggled quite badly last season with Moyes telling the backline to say deep, the attacking players to stay high, and expecting 2/3 CMs to cover the other sixty percent of the pitch. But put him in a tighter system, especially a 3 man midfield, covering the space in front of the backline and he is very effective, and can still be very useful this season while we look to strengthen areas of bigger need (like a combative midfielders along the lines of Vidal, and a CB). There is a reason the season before Moyes came about he was voted the best CM in the league, and it amazes me how quickly people seem to (want to?) forget this. Carrick is far from spectacular with the ball, but he is very efficient and almost never puts us in a sticky situation, while his positioning and reading of the game is top notch and allows him to consistently slow down opposition attacks and limit passing lanes when we have committed players forward.

I reckon is it similar to why a lot of people hated Ferdinand when we were struggling for a while years back (and why some crazy eejits preferred Terry and even Carragher to him for a bit), this odd perception that last ditch tackles and "getting stuck in" are far mote important factors than they actually are.

If we stumble upon some quality replacement for him then sure yeah, we might as well go in and see what happens, but he is far, far from a liability. Vidal/Strootman/etc are not Carrick replacements though, very different players.

Carrick has a lot of faults, I don't rate him, but his biggest fault is his inability to receive the ball, turn and bring it forward, he's uncomfortable when put under any pressure and that's why he passes sideways and backwards.

I'll be delighted when he's gone to be honest.

Crimson King · 09-07-2014 03:10PM

TheDoc wrote: »

Anytime I see that Jennifer Lawrence gif I lose total train of thought on what the conversation/topic is

Shows you I have finally turned into my dad when I don't recognise pop icons. I thought that was Taylor Swift :P

Billy86 · 09-07-2014 03:10PM

cdb wrote: »

Bleed in / Bed in - never mind, it was a fairly poor attempt at humour

If Evra leaving helps the Vidal deal then by all means - and if Nani can be included all the better. Evra's experience will be missed but his performances have been on the decline for so long now this window is probably the last chance to recoup some sort of a transfer fee. Plenty of time to bring in backup.

A right, got ya now!

Funny enough one of the biggest upsides of having Evra and Shaw (if we do keep both) in my mind is actually the regression in Evras play for so long, odd as that might sound, at least in terms of how Shaw is treated. I just have a funny feeling if Shaw struggles and Evra is not here there will be a lot of revisionism about Evra over the least 3 years or so to further put Shaw down. Because United fans, and the media, have a tendency to be VERY harsh with our defenders and younger players (not named Phil "free pass" Jones

). With Evra still around Saw we can at least point to Pat and say "hey, at least he is better, and far younger, than that fella who as been here for years." Twisted logic, but there you go.

But if we can get Vidal then lob Evra in by all means! A solid but unspectacular guy for a low enough fee between about 24 and 29 years of age to compete with Shaw for a few seasons will do fine.

Maximus Alexander · 09-07-2014 03:12PM

Crimson King wrote: »

Shows you I have finally turned into my dad when I don't recognise pop icons. I thought that was Taylor Swift :P

Shame on you.

Spazdarn · 09-07-2014 03:12PM

I don't really see the Evra to Juve thing having any affect on getting Vidal..

TheDoc · 09-07-2014 03:12PM

beno619 wrote: »

I'd argue so can Cleverley unless were just judging him on last season.

Nobody mentioned his name until Germany met an awful Brazil side last in night.

That's rubbish...

Khedira had a standout WC campaign alongside Schweinsteiger in South Africa, and was promptly rewarded with a big move to Real Madrid where he has formed a dynamic partnership with Alonso.

He is an excellent midfielder that can play a more discplined role holding or maraud up and down, last night was a rare example of when Khedira has a more free reign, simply because that team smelt blood and he was allowed belt past a totaly inept Brazilian midfield.

Khedira is an outstanding midfielder, and comparing him to Cleverly is the utmost of rubbish, as is to deprive him of compliment and stature in the European game.

LostBoy101 · 09-07-2014 03:14PM

I hope Cleverly just joins Everton so we can all end this agruement.

Pro. F · 09-07-2014 03:17PM

Thecon21 wrote: »

How did you think Khedira got on last night? I thought he was very good, I actually think he has done quite well during this World Cup in his couple of games..

Could be a good option, reasonable price too.

Khedira is another one of these CMs who does lots of good things but is weak at the basic possession stuff that goes unnoticed. He needs to be in a three man CM and then he does a reasonable, but much over-hyped, job. There are a lot of better CMs who could be bought and probably for less money.

Spazdarn · 09-07-2014 03:17PM

Khedira is a very good player but if he's fee is anything more than 20m I wouldn't be interested. There are better options that offer more (Vidal)

Cleverly is nowhere near as good as Khedira, I don't know why that's even being debated.

Manchester United Team Talk/Gossip/Rumours Thread - Mod Notes in OP,22/7

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