Logging a Dead Horse

Itziger · 15-06-2014 10:04AM #1

Finally bit the log bullet. Hopefully the title remains brilliantly witty rather than prophetic.

49 year old male, 6 years a runnin', 5 Full marathons and 6 or 7 Half M.s done. Best times as follows:

10k - 37.07 (2014)
Half - 1.24.02 (2014)
Full - 3.09.06 (2013)

A blind baby could probably figure out that I'm hoping for a sub 3 some day soonish. And you wouldn't want to be much more advanced to figure out that my 10k time is more impressive than my Marathon time. Suggesting that the old favourite 'endurance' is my weak point.

So, first day of Jack Daniels 18 week 2Q 56-70 miles plan done (just!).
If the rest of the Q sessions feel this tough I'll 'walk' the sub 3 in Frankfurt. Whether that walk will be figurative or literal, well, time will tell. I did manage to complete and hit the times of today's workout. One of the things that threw me a little was the conversion to miles; fock they're long!

Q1 1E+6M+1E+6M+2E.

I found I was having to work a bit to keep the M miles on target (6:45) . Anyhooo, will try to be a good boy and keep up the log and, more importantly, the plan.

Finnt · 15-06-2014 11:23AM

Best of luck with it will be following with great interest!!

ThebitterLemon · 15-06-2014 12:09PM

Another auld lad for me to keep an eye on, great stuff

Best of luck with it, I'll be following with my one good eye!

TbL

Pacing Mule · 15-06-2014 12:10PM

Love the title !!

Itziger · 15-06-2014 12:15PM

Pacing Mule wrote: »

Love the title !!

It came to me around the 10th of the 12 MP miles this morning.

It beats the Angela Merkel fantasy I had deep in the last 'fast' mile!

Murph_D · 15-06-2014 05:45PM

Definitely log title of the year alright!

Can you explain that Q formula for those of us not familiar with the plan?

Ososlo · 15-06-2014 05:53PM

Murph_D wrote: »

Definitely log title of the year alright!

Can you explain that Q formula for those of us not familiar with the plan?

and explain the Merkel thing too while you're at it:D

Arthur Beesley · 15-06-2014 05:57PM

Perverted title. Animal necrophilia is no laughing matter.

Itziger · 15-06-2014 06:01PM

Murph_D wrote: »

Definitely log title of the year alright!

Can you explain that Q formula for those of us not familiar with the plan?

Well Murph, there are those on Boards a little more familiar with the whole concept than me, but my understanding of it is that the Q = Quality. In this plan you do 2Q days a week. The rest you make up the weekly total with steady or easy runs, or even steady easy runs.

The Q1 is typically the longest run and the Q2 is a bit more mixture of paces, so for example the Q2 run of this first week is: 8E + 3T (threshold)/3 min rest+2T +2E = 15 miles

He also includes some I (Interval) and R (Rep) pace stuff. Example from week 2: 4E+5 x (1k I w 3 min jog rec) + 4x (400R w/400 jog rec) +2E. How the fook I'm going to remember all of that while I'm doing it is anyone's guess. In the book there are tables where you can establish your paces fairly accurately.

Itziger · 15-06-2014 06:06PM

Ososlo wrote: »

and explain the Merkel thing too while you're at it:D

Ah now, the Merkel thing was probably due to dehydration, like Christy Moore when he was coming off the drink and he seeing Alice Glenn in the jacuzzi. 25 k, I mean 16 miles, without water on a warm day.

ThebitterLemon · 15-06-2014 07:57PM

Alice Glenn, FFS man you're showing your age, it all Little Mix and stuff like that now

TbL

Murph_D · 15-06-2014 08:01PM

Thanks Itziger. Those "double" sessions seem to be the in thing on boards this year, have seen a few references to the likes of 5x1k followed by 4x400 etc. Sounds like fun but you're right, hard to remember. Can be programmed into the Garmin I guess.

The 2Q principle is similar to the plan I'm following myself: Weds session, Sunday LR, everything else easy.

Sounds good. Great times, good luck with the sub-3 if you decide to go for it (I notice you haven't quite laid your cards on the table).

fat to ripped · 15-06-2014 08:02PM

Best of luck with it.

Itziger · 15-06-2014 08:51PM

Murph_D wrote: »

Thanks Itziger. Those "double" sessions seem to be the in thing on boards this year, have seen a few references to the likes of 5x1k followed by 4x400 etc. Sounds like fun but you're right, hard to remember. Can be programmed into the Garmin I guess.

The 2Q principle is similar to the plan I'm following myself: Weds session, Sunday LR, everything else easy.

Sounds good. Great times, good luck with the sub-3 if you decide to go for it (I notice you haven't quite laid your cards on the table).

Ah no, for once I'm coming down from the comfortable fence I've been on for ages. Unless things go pear shaped in training, sub 3 is the aim.

Itziger · 17-06-2014 12:35PM

Question here for the Daniels people. If no-one replies in 24 hours, I'll post it in the Random Questions thread.

In the 2Q a week plan, it states that the rest of the miles should be done at E pace spread through the week. But, there's E pace and there's E pace, right? I mean since my Q1 on Sunday I've done 2 runs. Monday was E (but recovery E) of 8 miles. Though I didn't have a watch I'm guessing it was about 8 minute pace. Today I felt better and the run was more Steady E!!

So, is this ok then. Some of the E days at recovery pace (let's say 8 or 8:20, 1 or 2 at standard or genuine E, let's say 7.40, and 1 or 2 at steady E, let's say 7.10. Does that make any sense? Advice gratefully accepted.

Murph_D · 17-06-2014 01:09PM

This might be of interest (second point, para 5). Sounds complicated to me!

yaboya1 · 17-06-2014 01:13PM

I would guess that going by HR for your easy runs might be good idea, as like you say some days you will find a certain pace more stressful than others. Running at around 70-75% of your HRMax should mean that all these runs should feel easy regardless of the pace. Only my opinion though as I've never followed a Daniels plan.

Itziger · 17-06-2014 01:38PM

Cool folks, thanks. I very, very rarely wear a HRM but I see where you're coming from on effort.

Murph, it's not as complicated as all that. I'm beginning to get my head around it. One of the challenges is finding routes where you can fit in (for example) 8E+3T/w3mins rest+2T+2E or whatever is called for this week.

I'm trying to figure out where I need to be to avoid roads and traffic lights while at the same time not finding yourself 6 miles from home with 2 easy miles of the session left!

Itziger · 19-06-2014 01:09PM

Well the midweek Q session done. Shoot, that's a tough one to do midweek. I'm hoping I can keep this show on the road through the Summer.

Happy enough in the end. Instead of 8E miles I did 7 and then hit the T miles. I was hoping to do these around 6.22 pace but they turned out faster. They mostly had a slight downhill and maybe the T pace was a bit conservative; I'll sit down and think about that soon. The first 3 were 6:19, 6.07 and 6.01. That 3rd one obviously too fast. Then I took my 3 min rest (Thank you Mr Daniels) and headed into miles 4 and 5 at T: these came in at 6.07 and 6.20

The last 2 and a bit E miles were nice and slow (No $hit!).

It's no biggie doing 7 instead of 8 E miles in that session, right? I now have 2 days of the week left and only 4 miles to do!! I might take a day off and do a 6 miler on Saturday.

Itziger · 21-06-2014 10:19AM

First full week of Daniels' done!

Ended up doing 61 miles as opposed to the prescribed 56. 6 days of running, no doubles.

Will do the Q1 tomorrow as planned but then will juggle a bit to fit in a Half next Sunday. This is why I started the plan one week early. A bit naughty I know, but hopefully no damage done.

Itziger · 22-06-2014 03:58PM

Did the planned Q session today. Went ok. It was as follows: 2E+3T+1hour easy+1T+1E.

I spent almost the whole E hour thinking about the upcoming faster mile! Managed to keep the pace as planned and wore a HRM but my Garmin Connect doesn't display charts anymore

The HR was 162 or so during the faster miles and 135 or so for the easy miles. 'Boya, does that make sense??

Itziger · 30-06-2014 12:20PM

Well, I decided to build in a week break from the Daniels plan to do this Half that I had in mind for a while. I was quite happy with the outcome - a 90 sec pb for a respectable 1.22.31 which suggests I should go for the sub 3.

Up to now the Half times were very close to predicted 3.00 but this one says that I should be capable of the holy grail.

No marathon, at least to my knowledge, was ever run on paper though.

Murph_D · 30-06-2014 03:33PM

Nice going. Where was the Half?

Itziger · 30-06-2014 03:48PM

Murph_D wrote: »

Nice going. Where was the Half?

Small German city called Trier. I live in Luxembourg so it was nice and near! I've said it before, but anyone looking for a fast half, look no further than the Route du Vin last Sunday in September. In Remich, on the Lux/German border.

This one I did yesterday was flat too mind, just not the same quality of field. I was 24th!

Itziger · 04-07-2014 07:43AM

Been in the dry dock (if you don't count the beer and wine) since Sunday's race. Maybe it is one of the problems for us old fellas. Carrying a couple of niggles that I wanted to give time to clear up. Lower abdominal thingy (pubalgia?) just about feeling ok now and left calf/achilles on the mend as well. Got in 4 miles easy this morning and hopefully that's the show back on the road. Fortunately this weekend's Q long run is not too demanding.

belcarra · 04-07-2014 11:50AM

Just catching this log now Itzy - Best of luck with it, it's been a while coming!!
Debating about whether to do Frankfurt or Dublin at the moment...If I was flying it (at the moment coming back from injury and 10k is a bit of a struggle!) I'd consider going for Frankfurt but Dublin is the more likely scenario.

Itziger · 04-07-2014 01:38PM

belcarra wrote: »

Just catching this log now Itzy - Best of luck with it, it's been a while coming!!
Debating about whether to do Frankfurt or Dublin at the moment...If I was flying it (at the moment coming back from injury and 10k is a bit of a struggle!) I'd consider going for Frankfurt but Dublin is the more likely scenario.

Well I eventually found your Dusseldorf result and it certainly sounded like something went awry there. Sorry to see that. Are you still on the comeback trail from that or was it posterior?

Yeah, I can understand that if you weren't 100% ready it would make sense to stay in Dublin. Still though, we'll see. Think of the beer in Dirty Ol' Frankfurt.

As for the Log, it had been a while coming. I decided for my first sub 3 effort and first Daniels plan that a log might keep me focused.

Itziger · 06-07-2014 01:08PM

Nursing a groin/pubic strain at the moment. Was able to do the steady 16 miler yesterday but jaysus, the beginning of the rec run this morning was brutal. I had to 'hold' and even massage a little the affected area. Fortunately there were no witnesses to this.

Am typing this with a wine cooler yoke down the shorts. Mrs Itzy says she'll stick to red wine for the foreseeable future.

Itziger · 08-07-2014 07:21PM

Flippin 'ell, those midweek Q sessions are tough on the body.

Delighted to get this one done without hiccups.

http://connect.garmin.com/activity/537344461

Other than the initial 6E being a shade under 5.5E, the workout was done as Sir Daniels prescribes. How a certain Boards member can go rock climbing for 90 minutes after one of these runs is completely beyond me. Here I am feeling 50% smug, 50% sorry for myself.

Finnt · 08-07-2014 08:27PM

I read the same log, he's an animal!

Itziger · 11-07-2014 01:30PM

Going on a long drive tomorrow and don't know what to expect where we're going so decided to squeeze this weekend's Q session in today. I knew it was going to be a tough as I was feeling tired already at the start.

The workout was supposed to be 2E+8M+1E+3M+2E. I tweaked it a little... I know, I know! Instead of the 1E+3M part I did 2E+2M.

For the initial M miles I struggled to get to the pace and when I eventually did I overcompensated a bit but overall I'm happy I did it. Of course, what do I do on the last of the M miles but 6:18 instead of 6:45! Would've been better off doing the initial plan. Next week's Q2 is one of the 'skip this if you like' ones and I just might do that, depending on the roads and surroundings of the village we're staying in.

Logging a Dead Horse

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