Croke Park residents to seek concert injuctions.....your opinions?

JRant · 05-07-2014 07:53PM

EOTR, Hardluckwoman, SoCal, Madcon, it's_a_Cowgirl, nm, Paraic Duffy, Peter Aiken, your boys took one hell of a beating.

JRant · 05-07-2014 07:55PM

Santa Cruz wrote: »

I wasn't going but if I was I would never go again. Does that make sense?

No

K4t · 05-07-2014 07:56PM

oppenheimer1 wrote: »

The damage to Ireland's reputation for hosting international events would be large. If we can't manage to organise a couple of concerts how could Ireland ever hope to attract major European sports or other events to the country? While this fiasco means nothing to the wider world, its huge for those in event management.

Ireland is playing host to 2 of the biggest rock band sin the world this week (Arcade Fire and Arctic Monkeys) plus one of the most well known rappers in Kanye West. Aswell as lots of msic festivals taking place this summer attracting hundreds of musicians and tourists (Elecric Picnic, Body and Soul etc.) Ireland is doing just fine reputation wise. Don't let one **** up skew things.

ThisRegard · 05-07-2014 07:58PM

oppenheimer1 wrote: »

I'd put money that there will be a judicial review though and the concerts (all five) will go ahead. There is too much money and reputational damage for the tourist industry at stake here for anything other than this to happen. .

Law takes precedence over profit for a select few individuals. The reputational damage is being exaggerated, 3 concerts have been licenced.

What would be more damaging to the state is for a judge attempting to over turn a planning decision against the back drop of blackmail from a millionaire from another continent.

DOCARCH · 05-07-2014 07:58PM

oppenheimer1 wrote: »

If it does happen that no legal way can be found to allow the concerts to go ahead, you can be sure that any new legislation will clip the wings of city managers, with ministers having the final say.

Most of the planning legislation that currently exists came about specifically to stop ministers (i.e. one person) having their say in planning matters (which would include licensing for concerts)! Very much a retrograde step if things went that way again!!!

If the government were to bring in legislation to allow GB play 2 extra concerts, then this country really would be a laughing stock and I think that would do us more damage internationally...makes us look like ejits!!!

slimjimmc · 05-07-2014 07:58PM

end of the road wrote: »

there is no lesson for the promotors to learn, they did what is common practice and has been for years. certainly changing event planning legislation to have the licences granted before tickets are sold is probably the way forward, but the promotors did what they have been doing for years with no issue

Drink driving, driving on a Provisional Licence, bribery are example of other illegal practices were also common practice among certain sections and plenty of people who engaged in that had been doing for years with no issue. Would you advocate the authorities turn a blind eye to those too or would you advocate that those who participate should learn not to do it?

Podge83 · 05-07-2014 07:59PM

P_1 wrote: »

And we enter the infinite loop...

Best post in this thread so far.

Fr_Dougal · 05-07-2014 08:00PM

Can't wait for a few years time when this is on Reeling In the Years. You'll have all the Croke Park Residents in their shellsuit tracksuits, perms and taches out picketing; it will look like something out of Fr.Ted.

Podge83 · 05-07-2014 08:05PM

TheZohan wrote: »

Can't wait for a few years time when this is on Reeling In the Years. You'll have all the Croke Park Residents in their shellsuit tracksuits, perms and taches out picketing; it will look like something out of Fr.Ted.

And we'll have a crazy bunch of culchies in badly fitting jeans, unkempt hair, brogues and cheque shirts crying that their barn-dance was ruined!!

Fr_Dougal · 05-07-2014 08:08PM

Podge83 wrote: »

And we'll have a crazy bunch of culchies in badly fitting jeans, unkempt hair, brogues and cheque shirts crying that their barn-dance was ruined!!

Ha ha! Don't forget the mullets!

oppenheimer1 · 05-07-2014 08:10PM

DOCARCH wrote: »

Most of the planning legislation that currently exists came about specifically to stop ministers (i.e. one person) having their say in planning matters (which would include licensing for concerts)! Very much a retrograde step if things went that way again!!!

If the government were to bring in legislation to allow GB play 2 extra concerts, then this country really would be a laughing stock and I think that would do us more damage internationally...makes us look like ejits!!!

Well at the moment planning decisions are concentrated in the hands of one person, the city manager. I don't expect the government to change the law for this concert but it will effect future laws. The planning laws for large outdoor events are unworkable. In order to submit an application you need to know how many are attending and the structure and layout of your temporary structures. How can anyone know that before the tickets are sold?

Events need some sort of outline planning permission system, so promoters know that there won't be a huge road block in the way for their event.

Fred Swanson · 05-07-2014 08:12PM

This post has been deleted.

ThisRegard · 05-07-2014 08:12PM

oppenheimer1 wrote: »

The amount of money involved for the hotel sector alone is colossal, this single set of concerts is probably worth more to the Dublin hotels than the two years of reduced vat..

It wouldn't be half as bad if they didn't profiteer and double, if not more, their rates for those nights. Many fans are saying their hotels aren't refunding anyway, the hotels aren't innocent victims in all this.

Princess Consuela Bananahammock · 05-07-2014 08:12PM

darkpagandeath wrote: »

Would not be surprised if any previous agreement was ruled null and void, As it does not take into account demand and changing circumstances. Like everything else things change over time and need to be either re negotiated or changed completely.

You can't rule a signed agreement null and void just because times change. There'd be no point in having a contract if that was the case.

mrsbyrne · 05-07-2014 08:14PM

JRant wrote: »

EOTR, Hardluckwoman, SoCal, Madcon, it's_a_Cowgirl, nm, Paraic Duffy, Peter Aiken, your boys took one hell of a beating.

Best post of the thread! You've made my day! Boards gold! I doubt if any of the posters named will recognise the reference though!

Spanish Eyes · 05-07-2014 08:14PM

Well, will all be cancelled or just two?

It's all or nothing I suppose.

Such a fiasco. For the fans, the city, and all the rest of it.

garthie is in high dudgeon... A ploy perhaps?

JRant · 05-07-2014 08:26PM

oppenheimer1 wrote: »

Well at the moment planning decisions are concentrated in the hands of one person, the city manager. I don't expect the government to change the law for this concert but it will effect future laws. The planning laws for large outdoor events are unworkable. In order to submit an application you need to know how many are attending and the structure and layout of your temporary structures. How can anyone know that before the tickets are sold?

Events need some sort of outline planning permission system, so promoters know that there won't be a huge road block in the way for their event.

Why didn't Aiken & Co apply for the licenses required at an earlier stage though? Tickets sold in Jan/Feb of this year, yet they waited for the 10 week limit before submitting.

Promoters can't have it every which way they like. They sit on millions for months at a time, earning interest no doubt, yet can't organise a license application to ensure their customers get what they paid for.

The system you seem to be advocating is more like railroading any applications with as little disruption to the promoter. Why should they get special treatment over other citizens?

Peppa Pig · 05-07-2014 08:26PM

Spanish Eyes wrote: »

It's all or nothing I suppose.

There is absolutely no logic as to why it is 5 or nothing.
Back in January he announced that he would only play 2 concerts - same as 97

Country superstar Garth Brooks will play two comeback gigs at Dublin's Croke Park on July 25 and 26....
...the two July dates are being styled the Garth Brooks Comeback Special Event....
...."Before we go back on tour in the Fall of 2014, I want to challenge myself, the band, and crew...

Link
If he could do his comeback and dvd etc in 2 nights only 5 months ago, why does he suddenly need 5 nights now.

We will see on Tuesday if he allows his toys to be put back into his pram.

Defending him for his all or nothing stance is akin to Uruguay fans defending Chewy Louie Suarez. They thought it was right and the rest of the world thought they were nuts.

Sulla Felix · 05-07-2014 08:28PM

I am usually sympathetic to SF but thought it blataantly populist for Mary Lou to roll into the issue today.

DOCARCH · 05-07-2014 08:32PM

oppenheimer1 wrote: »

Well at the moment planning decisions are concentrated in the hands of one person, the city manager.

The city manager does not make the decision on his own. He signs off on the decision that has been formulated by many departments within the council.

Psychobabble · 05-07-2014 08:35PM

Interesting to note in the Irish Times this evening that Peter Aitken is quoted as saying that works are due to begin on July 12th for the concerts. I have read elsewhere that works have already commenced. Separately, the Public Event Licence application which was submitted to DCC stated that works for the proposed Garth Brooks concerts were due to commence at 1600 on July 20th, after the Leinster football finals.

Jamsiek · 05-07-2014 08:35PM

oppenheimer1 wrote: »

I'm getting tired of this greedy GAA line. Is it really greed when almost all the money raised by the GAA goes back to clubs across the country?

Its not as if the lads in the stadium are pocketing the money themselves.

How do you know the GAA aren't pocketing money?

oppenheimer1 · 05-07-2014 08:36PM

JRant wrote: »

Why didn't Aiken & Co apply for the licenses required at an earlier stage though? Tickets sold in Jan/Feb of this year, yet they waited for the 10 week limit before submitting.

Promoters can't have it every which way they like. They sit on millions for months at a time, earning interest no doubt, yet can't organise a license application to ensure their customers get what they paid for.

The system you seem to be advocating is more like railroading any applications with as little disruption to the promoter. Why should they get special treatment over other citizens?

No, the system I'm advocating is similar to that for housing. You should not be able to sell tickets without outline planning permission. Simply put, you must roughly sketch out the basic details of the event, such as planned dates and times and a rough maximum capacity of the arena. This should give the organiser an idea if the event can go ahead in principle. This would be followed up with a detailed application, which would be submitted any time before the event.

The current system has only the detailed application requiring finalised details. The nature of the business is you can't come up with these details until you know how many exactly are coming, and these plans take time to put together.

JRant · 05-07-2014 08:37PM

Spanish Eyes wrote: »

Well, will all be cancelled or just two?

It's all or nothing I suppose.

Such a fiasco. For the fans, the city, and all the rest of it.

garthie is in high dudgeon... A ploy perhaps?

The only person who is cancelling anything is GB himself. The other 2 concerts never existed in the first place as no license was granted.

Jamsiek · 05-07-2014 08:38PM

oppenheimer1 wrote: »

The damage to Ireland's reputation for hosting international events would be large.

I doubt this very much TBH

secman · 05-07-2014 08:40PM

No cowboy going to dictate to us on our planning laws, picked the wrong guy to have a fight with, keego rules, nobody shot the sherriff, put your tail between your legs Garthy and put your toys back in the pushchair, get a clean dieper and do the 3 gigs and kindly fck back off to the land of the free, well except for the native Indians.

Podge83 · 05-07-2014 08:41PM

mrsbyrne wrote: »

Best post of the thread! You've made my day! Boards gold! I doubt if any of the posters named will recognise the reference though!

"Lord Nelson, Lord Beaverbrook, Sir Winston Churchill, Sir Anthony Eden, Clement Attlee, Henry Cooper, Lady Diana, Maggie Thatcher your boys took a hell of a beating! Your boys took a hell of a beating"

Norwegan Commentator after they beat England (around 1980/81)

OK, I wasn't named, but couldn't resist.

I'm off to google it for another listen - classic

mbur · 05-07-2014 08:42PM

ekimiam wrote: »

lockdown is the week before and the week after when theres 100's of lorrys arriving and unloading. you seem a bit clueless mate, so the shin fein dig is a load of horse.

?? So what is the difference? Three gigs or five? It is a crazy decision to only allow three at this late stage.

oppenheimer1 · 05-07-2014 08:43PM

Jamsiek wrote: »

How do you know the GAA aren't pocketing money?

What a stupid question. The GAA has almost no full-time paid officers, it publishes it's accounts and by and large is run petty well. The money it raises from croke park events can be followed through the accounts as it finds its way to clubs across the country.

The money from croke park does not end up in the hands of private individuals. It's a sporting organisation run for the benefit of the communities in which it exists.

Podge83 · 05-07-2014 08:43PM

Psychobabble wrote: »

Interesting to note in the Irish Times this evening that Peter Aitken is quoted as saying that works are due to begin on July 12th for the concerts. I have read elsewhere that works have already commenced. Separately, the Public Event Licence application which was submitted to DCC stated that works for the proposed Garth Brooks concerts were due to commence at 1600 on July 20th, after the Leinster football finals.

So this is why the Dubs start at 14.00 - jaysas, I'll only get 4 or 5 pints in.... crying shame. Cant believe these gigs were affecting me DIRECTLY - I'm getting my placard out!

Croke Park residents to seek concert injuctions.....your opinions?

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