Advertisement
If you have a new account but are having problems posting or verifying your account, please email us on hello@boards.ie for help. Thanks :)
Hello all! Please ensure that you are posting a new thread or question in the appropriate forum. The Feedback forum is overwhelmed with questions that are having to be moved elsewhere. If you need help to verify your account contact hello@boards.ie

Croke Park residents to seek concert injuctions.....your opinions?

1…189190192194195…255

Comments

  • #5732
    nxbyveromdwjpg
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,402 ✭✭✭nxbyveromdwjpg


    Peppa Pig wrote: »
    One direction wasn't. There was no need to apply for a licence, nor was it printed on the tickets.

    Of course they had to apply for a licence


  • #5733
    Reformed Character
    Closed Accounts Posts: 710 ✭✭✭Reformed Character


    Peppa Pig wrote: »
    One direction wasn't. There was no need to apply for a licence, nor was it printed on the tickets.

    Yes it was!
    Any event for above 5,000 people is required by law to have a licence.


  • #5734
    Peppa Pig
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,670 ✭✭✭Peppa Pig


    nm wrote: »
    Of course they had to apply for a licence
    They didn't - they just had to get the event management plan approved. They use the planning permission from the 90s which already grants three concerts.

    I got one direction tickets six months before the concert and they do not have "subject to licence" on them.

    I am always happy to be corrected and in this case if I am wrong then the next question is how were they able to licence those concerts so far in advance and not Garth Brooks.
    Phil Hogan wrote:
    I thank the Deputy for raising this matter which is the subject of much media attention. As she may be aware, An Bord Pleanála granted planning permission for the redevelopment of Croke Park stadium on 9 March 1993. Condition No. 11 attached to the planning permission allows for the holding of three special events such as concerts in the stadium each calendar year, subject to the approval of an event management plan which must be submitted by way of compliance submission to the planning department of Dublin City Council. Any additional event proposed to be held in Croke Park in excess of the three events permitted per calendar year must be approved by way of a public event licence application to Dublin City Council under the provisions of section 230 of the Planning and Development Act 2000, as amended.
    This is what EOTR has mention a few hundred times
    Dail debate on 1D concerts interfering with polling stations


  • #5735
    Peppa Pig
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,670 ✭✭✭Peppa Pig


    Larbre34 wrote: »
    Are people thick. ALL events having a crowd exceeding 5,000 have to apply for a licence from the planning authority, i.e. the local Council.
    Presume that's directed at me. No I am not thick and there is a difference between a Public Event Licence and an Event Management Plan.

    As usual happy to be corrected - just point me in the direction of the PEL application for 1D instead of having to result to childish name calling.


  • #5736
    Santa Cruz
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 3,126 ✭✭✭Santa Cruz


    Einhard wrote: »
    I really can't believe the selfishness of those who think that their right to a good time completely overrides the right of others to live in peace and quiet. I've been to Croke Park for matches and one concert and with the people thronging the area it's obvious that there's significant disruption to the local community. And now they're being pilloried for objecting to 400 000 people flooding their area over 5 days? Ridiculous. I mean, who the hell would want 10% of the population thronging through their neighbourhood in a few days? Definitely not the people who demand that the residents put up with it to satisfy their needs. It's completely unreasonable to expect a community to accomodate the desires of others when it causes so much disruption to others, and those who demand it of others need to stop acting like selfish gits, and ask themselves would they want hundreds of thousands of people flowing past their front gardens? I bet the answer would be a definitive NO!

    I think the truth is coming out now about these "residents" It's clear that many down in Ballybough, Drumcondra etc. are in favour of the concerts and many were looking forward to making some income from it.


  • Advertisement
  • #5737
    Sideshow Mark
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,155 ✭✭✭Sideshow Mark


    Peppa Pig wrote: »
    They didn't - they just had to get the event management plan approved. They use the planning permission from the 90s which already grants three concerts.

    I got one direction tickets six months before the concert and they do not have "subject to licence" on them.

    I am always happy to be corrected and in this case if I am wrong then the next question is how were they able to licence those concerts so far in advance and not Garth Brooks.

    This is what EOTR has mention a few hundred times
    Dail debate on 1D concerts interfering with polling stations

    You're confused, please read the answer to the question in your link again. Keep in mind that there is a difference between planning permission (An Bord Pleanála) and the license required to run an event with more than 5000 attendees. (DCC).


  • #5738
    Grayson
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 16,815 ✭✭✭✭Grayson


    Peppa Pig wrote: »
    I got one direction tickets six months before the concert and they do not have "subject to licence" on them.

    I just checked my arcade fire tickets from last weekend and on the front it says "SBJT to Licence"


  • #5739
    jack presley
    Closed Accounts Posts: 13,687 ✭✭✭✭jack presley


    Getting away from who's right and who's wrong and who's fault the whole debacle is, where do you see it going from here?

    I don't think even if they wanted to, the council can't change their ruling and even if they did, I'd imagine a legal challenge with a fairly decent chance of succeeding would be lodged immediately. So I think politicians asking for them to reconsider or come up with a resolution is the usual politician 'wanting to be seen to be doing something' bullsh1t.

    I think the ball is firmly in Aiken/Brooks court and whether they're prepared to put on the permitted concerts.


  • #5740
    Peppa Pig
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,670 ✭✭✭Peppa Pig


    Sideshow Mark wrote: »
    You're confused, please read the answer to the question in your link again. Keep in mind that there is a difference between planning permission (An Bord Pleanála) and the license required to run an event with more than 5000 attendees. (DCC).
    I quite possibly am confused. My understanding is that the 1993 permission grants Croke Park the right (licence) to have 3 non sporting events every year. After that they need to go to DCC for a PEL. That what Phil Hogan says as well.

    Do matches in Croke Park need to have a licence from the local council?. They are outdoor events with more than 5,000 and replays are organised at very short notice. Maybe sports events in a sports stadium are not subject to licence.

    Anyway, the overall point is that Aiken knew fine well that he had to apply for licences but he left it so late in the full expectation that the council would be under so much pressure that they would give them to him. If he did need to apply for a licence for 1D it was granted at least 6 months before the gigs.
    I cannot find any PEL online for 1D.


  • #5741
    Sideshow Mark
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,155 ✭✭✭Sideshow Mark


    Peppa Pig wrote: »
    I quite possibly am confused. My understanding is that the 1993 permission grants Croke Park the right (licence) to have 3 non sporting events every year. After that they need to go to DCC for a PEL. That what Phil Hogan says as well.

    Do matches in Croke Park need to have a licence from the local council?. They are outdoor events with more than 5,000 and replays are organised at very short notice. Maybe sports events in a sports stadium are not subject to licence.

    Anyway, the overall point is that Aiken knew fine well that he had to apply for licences but he left it so late in the full expectation that the council would be under so much pressure that they would give them to him. If he did need to apply for a licence for 1D it was granted at least 6 months before the gigs.
    I cannot find any PEL online for 1D    .

    I agree with that.

    The GAA doesn't need to apply for a license to run each sporting event in Croke Park, because that is what it was designed to do. The same as the operators of the O2 don't need a license for every gig in the O2, the planning Authority and DCC have already given permission for those types of events in those venues.

    I understand that the 1D concert came under the original Bord Plannala "three event rule" so planning permission & the details of how the event was to be run was already established. They still needed an events license which was granted. For the Brooks shows a more detailed license application was required as it needed to include the planning/logistics of the event as well because it was not covered by the three event rule.

    At the time in the Gigs forum, many said it wouldn't be possible to run five consecutive concerts, I don't know why they didn't spread it over two weekends, especially as Garth "loves Ireland". Actually, I do know why, greed!


  • Advertisement
  • #5742
    ninebeanrows
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,780 ✭✭✭✭ninebeanrows


    The concerts will go ahead, 3 this time and 2 more later in the year.


  • #5743
    SeanW
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,425 ✭✭✭SeanW


    Why didn't they just have all the concerts they wanted in the O2?

    https://u24.gov.ua/
    Join NAFO today:

    Help us in helping Ukraine.



  • #5744
    iguana
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,917 ✭✭✭✭iguana


    Why can't the other 2 concerts can't be put on in a different venue? I understand that there would be a lot of hassle involved for the road crew, as they'd have to move and set up all the equipment, etc. But the original plan was for only 2 concerts, iirc, so spending 3 nights in one venue and 2 in another would be fairly standard for a tour like that. They could put the last 2 nights on in Thomond Park or someplace similar on the other side of the country and then Ticketmaster/MCD could help facilitate people swap tickets if they want to change dates in favour of their more local venue.


  • #5745
    Grayson
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 16,815 ✭✭✭✭Grayson


    Sideshow Mark wrote: »
    I agree with that.

    The GAA doesn't need to apply for a license to run each sporting event in Croke Park, because that is what it was designed to do. The same as the operators of the O2 don't need a license for every gig in the O2, the planning Authority and DCC have already given permission for those types of events in those venues.

    I understand that the 1D concert came under the original Bord Plannala "three event rule" so planning permission & the details of how the event was to be run was already established. They still needed an events license which was granted. For the Brooks shows a more detailed license application was required as it needed to include the planning/logistics of the event as well because it was not covered by the three event rule.

    At the time in the Gigs forum, many said it wouldn't be possible to run five consecutive concerts, I don't know why they didn't spread it over two weekends, especially as Garth "loves Ireland". Actually, I do know why, greed!

    And my understanding of the planning is that they pretty much have a load of stakeholders and a load of boxes to tick. So they check for security, ushers, environmental impact etc... If a box isn't ticked, and can't be changed before the event, then the event doesn't go ahead. In this case it was impact to the local residents.

    So there's no way the council could have let the event go ahead.

    is that right?


  • #5746
    Grayson
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 16,815 ✭✭✭✭Grayson


    iguana wrote: »
    Why can't the other 2 concerts can't be put on in a different venue? I understand that there would be a lot of hassle involved for the road crew, as they'd have to move and set up all the equipment, etc. But the original plan was for only 2 concerts, iirc, so spending 3 nights in one venue and 2 in another would be fairly standard for a tour like that. They could put the last 2 nights on in Thomond Park or someplace similar on the other side of the country and then Ticketmaster/MCD could help facilitate people swap tickets if they want to change dates in favour of their more local venue.

    They could even separate them by a couple of weeks if they had to. The shows are going to be generating millions so it might lower profits, but it'll still be generating profit.


  • #5747
    stefan idiot jones
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,518 ✭✭✭stefan idiot jones


    Why don't the band and fans have a two day sit in after the Sunday show? That'll learn em.


  • #5748
    smellmepower
    Closed Accounts Posts: 829 ✭✭✭smellmepower


    iguana wrote: »
    Why can't the other 2 concerts can't be put on in a different venue? I understand that there would be a lot of hassle involved for the road crew, as they'd have to move and set up all the equipment, etc. But the original plan was for only 2 concerts, iirc, so spending 3 nights in one venue and 2 in another would be fairly standard for a tour like that. They could put the last 2 nights on in Thomond Park or someplace similar on the other side of the country and then Ticketmaster/MCD could help facilitate people swap tickets if they want to change dates in favour of their more local venue.

    Takes a mimimum of 10 weeks to grant a license.So the two remaining concerts couldn't happen close to the date of the 3 Croke Park ones,unless the council in charge of whatever alternative venue rushes through an application.Then if someone is injured/killed or a serious incident occurs at one of those concerts the council could be in a tough spot after rushing through issuing a license.


  • #5749
    hynesie08
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,272 ✭✭✭✭hynesie08


    iguana wrote: »
    Why can't the other 2 concerts can't be put on in a different venue? I understand that there would be a lot of hassle involved for the road crew, as they'd have to move and set up all the equipment, etc. But the original plan was for only 2 concerts, iirc, so spending 3 nights in one venue and 2 in another would be fairly standard for a tour like that. They could put the last 2 nights on in Thomond Park or someplace similar on the other side of the country and then Ticketmaster/MCD could help facilitate people swap tickets if they want to change dates in favour of their more local venue.

    1) Any license application has to be applied for a minimum of 10 weeks in advance so it's too late for that.

    2) There's only 1 stage setup and "a lot of hassle" doesn't cover it. It takes 2-4 days to setup and stripdown a venue.


  • #5750
    miju
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 8,483 ✭✭✭miju


    iguana wrote: »
    Why can't the other 2 concerts can't be put on in a different venue? I understand that there would be a lot of hassle involved for the road crew, as they'd have to move and set up all the equipment, etc. But the original plan was for only 2 concerts, iirc, so spending 3 nights in one venue and 2 in another would be fairly standard for a tour like that. They could put the last 2 nights on in Thomond Park or someplace similar on the other side of the country and then Ticketmaster/MCD could help facilitate people swap tickets if they want to change dates in favour of their more local venue.

    In the likes of the O2 stages and lighting can be broken down and put into lorries in about 4-8 hours (depending on setup).

    In the likes of outdoor events it takes between 2-3 days to setup a stage and about 1-1.5 full dayS to break it back down again.

    Not a feasible idea


  • #5751
    Reformed Character
    Closed Accounts Posts: 710 ✭✭✭Reformed Character


    smellmepower wrote: »
    Takes a mimimum of 10 weeks to grant a license.So the two remaining concerts couldn't happen close to the date of the 3 Croke Park ones,unless the council in charge of whatever alternative venue rushes through an application.Then if someone is injured/killed or a serious incident occurs at one of those concerts the council could be in a tough spot after rushing through issuing a license.
    The law is very clear, they cannot "rush through" anything.


  • Advertisement
  • #5752
    jack presley
    Closed Accounts Posts: 13,687 ✭✭✭✭jack presley


    Quote from Aiken which I got from the Journal

    "If I had had any inkling that this [licence] was going to be a problem, I would have flagged it."

    Is he serious? What kind of event organiser is he? Every potential risk should be highlighted and its likelihood/impact of it happening looked at. This comment cements my belief that they were arrogant and very complacent throughout the whole process.


  • #5753
    fta93
    Closed Accounts Posts: 306 ✭✭fta93


    Super piece from Carol Hunt this morning on what the residents have to put up with. Takes apart any of the 'well you knew what you were buying into' argument.

    "A deal is a deal".

    http://m.independent.ie/opinion/comment/carol-hunt-sorry-garth-fans-justice-was-served-for-this-croker-local-30408303.html


  • #5754
    Podge83
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 637 ✭✭✭Podge83


    Ash.J.Williams wrote: »
    All gigs major are subject to license

    I know that, but thanks anyway.


  • #5755
    hynesie08
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,272 ✭✭✭✭hynesie08


    Lord henry speaking a ridiculous amount of sense.

    http://www.independent.ie/opinion/comment/how-a-little-bit-of-conversation-could-restore-harmony-to-the-angry-chorus-in-brooks-row-30408326.html


  • #5756
    Tarzana
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,062 ✭✭✭Tarzana


    Einhard wrote: »
    I really can't believe the selfishness of those who think that their right to a good time completely overrides the right of others to live in peace and quiet. I've been to Croke Park for matches and one concert and with the people thronging the area it's obvious that there's significant disruption to the local community. And now they're being pilloried for objecting to 400 000 people flooding their area over 5 days? Ridiculous. I mean, who the hell would want 10% of the population thronging through their neighbourhood in a few days? Definitely not the people who demand that the residents put up with it to satisfy their needs. It's completely unreasonable to expect a community to accomodate the desires of others when it causes so much disruption to others, and those who demand it of others need to stop acting like selfish gits, and ask themselves would they want hundreds of thousands of people flowing past their front gardens? I bet the answer would be a definitive NO!

    I'd like you to leave the thread. You are talking FAR too much sense.


    :pac:


  • #5757
    jack presley
    Closed Accounts Posts: 13,687 ✭✭✭✭jack presley


    hynesie08 wrote: »
    Lord henry speaking a ridiculous amount of sense.

    http://www.independent.ie/opinion/comment/how-a-little-bit-of-conversation-could-restore-harmony-to-the-angry-chorus-in-brooks-row-30408326.html

    Good article and complete common sense from Henry. It seems it's all about dialogue and getting everyone on board from the start. I wonder would this debacle have happened under Jim Aiken's watch?


  • #5758
    Santa Cruz
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 3,126 ✭✭✭Santa Cruz


    fta93 wrote: »
    Super piece from Carol Hunt this morning on what the residents have to put up with. Takes apart any of the 'well you knew what you were buying into' argument.

    "A deal is a deal".

    http://m.independent.ie/opinion/comment/carol-hunt-sorry-garth-fans-justice-was-served-for-this-croker-local-30408303.html

    Another article by a declared self interest party


  • #5759
    TheQuietFella
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,857 ✭✭✭TheQuietFella


    I was in the area of Marley Park last night & for anyone who has issues in regard
    to the Croke Park residents concerns, they should have been there.
    I couldn't believe the amount of people urinating & defecating in public areas.
    Loads of empty beer cans & bottles strewn along the paths.

    There was not enough toilets or bins in the area which in my view was not acceptable.
    No adequate parking facilities either with cars being clamped & fleets of buses
    parked along the road side.

    Not good enough!


  • #5760
    Grayson
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 16,815 ✭✭✭✭Grayson


    smellmepower wrote: »
    Takes a mimimum of 10 weeks to grant a license.So the two remaining concerts couldn't happen close to the date of the 3 Croke Park ones,unless the council in charge of whatever alternative venue rushes through an application.Then if someone is injured/killed or a serious incident occurs at one of those concerts the council could be in a tough spot after rushing through issuing a license.

    Actually, just reading the article someone else put up, it's 5 weeks. They have to submit at least 10 weeks beforehand, but even if that wasn't the case they have to leave 5 weeks for consultation.


  • Advertisement
  • #5761
    Grayson
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 16,815 ✭✭✭✭Grayson


    smellmepower wrote: »
    Takes a mimimum of 10 weeks to grant a license.So the two remaining concerts couldn't happen close to the date of the 3 Croke Park ones,unless the council in charge of whatever alternative venue rushes through an application.Then if someone is injured/killed or a serious incident occurs at one of those concerts the council could be in a tough spot after rushing through issuing a license.

    Actually, just reading the article someone else put up, it's 5 weeks. They have to submit at least 10 weeks beforehand, but even if that wasn't the case and dcc allowed a late application DCC can't take any less than 5 weeks in deciding. .


This discussion has been closed.
Advertisement