Parish in debt.

DEFTLEFTHAND · 04-07-2014 02:54PM

mike_ie wrote: »

Church doesn't charge for the use of the graveyard - the Co. council does. I maintain the records for the local graveyard here - they would be fixed charges across the county (possibly country), and cover the price of the plot, graveyard maintenance, etc.

I hear Dublin plot prices are crazy altogether, somebody was telling me you could up to five grand in some cases.

Tokyo · 04-07-2014 02:57PM

Jeefff wrote: »

My local church had a complete restoration, new roof, windows, pews, flooring, the lot.. They chucked perfectly good pews out to buy plastic ones..
They then demanded 3,000 quid from each household in the parish, which is a tiny place, if the payments weren't made to them, you were asked to use another church, which alot of people did..
There's a bigger church not five miles from it, but a different parish..

Absolute arseholes, the vatican is sinking with money, ask them..
I'm a non believer anyway so the letter was chucked away

I'd support the local church as biko mentioned above, not necessarily out of obligation, but out of a sense of the fact that it's a part of the community and it's where many family events have taken place. But the above is taking the piss. Imagine the local pub doing the same.

"right lads, we want €3,000 from everyone for a renovation, we want new windows, bar and barstools. And if you don't like it you can drink at the pub down the road instead...."

:rolleyes:

SterlingArcher · 04-07-2014 02:58PM

Tell them if they officially let me leave the rcc. And allow me not be used as one of their statistics. I'll drop a g on it.

DEFTLEFTHAND · 04-07-2014 02:58PM

Sir Arthur Daley wrote: »

The money counters or the priest are pocketing a percentage of the church collections or in a case i heard a bit back the parish priest had racked up a huge phone bill which was gone in the four figures. It was found out he used watch alot of late night tele and phoning up pretty women.

The collections are for the Priests, that's how they make money, each Parish is supposed to be self sufficient.

Obviously they shouldn't be squandering it on late night chatlines.

P_1 · 04-07-2014 02:59PM

mike_ie wrote: »

I'd support the local church as biko mentioned above, not necessarily out of obligation, but out of a sense of the fact that it's a part of the community and it's where many family events have taken place. But the above is taking the piss. Imagine the local pub doing the same.

"right lads, we want €3,000 from everyone for a renovation, we want new windows, bar and barstools. And if you don't like it you can drink at the pub down the road instead...."

:rolleyes:

To be honest I'd advocate taking the German approach to religious funding

awec · 04-07-2014 02:59PM

Let him know the international calling code for Vatican City is +379.

Sir Arthur Daley · 04-07-2014 03:00PM

DEFTLEFTHAND wrote: »

The collections are for the Priests, that's how they make money, each Parish is supposed to be self sufficient.

So a priest keeps 100% of the weekly collections?

Fr_Dougal · 04-07-2014 03:00PM

Hmmm...wouldn't be surprised if they were expecting farmers to donate the calf too.

dirtyden · 04-07-2014 03:01PM

LexieOnRale wrote: »

My brother is running our farm now, and this morning he recieved a letter from our parish, signed by the parish priest, informing him that the parish was in a lot of debt and in order for them to try clear the debt, they were writing to farmers in the parish to see if they were willing to participate in a scheme where the church buys a young calf and the farmer rears it until its to be sold and then they're given the money for it.

Didn't think things were quite so bad! Maybe it's time the parish priest stopped changing his car every year

Edit: link
http://tinypic.com/r/14cg0hi/8

This priest has it all wrong. Never ask farmers for money as they will never admit to having any. He needs to mobilise the old biddies of the parish they will have the debts cleared double quick with the promise of some time off in purgatory or whatever.

gctest50 · 04-07-2014 03:01PM

Sir Arthur Daley wrote: »

The money counters or the priest are pocketing a percentage of the church collections or in a case i heard a bit back the parish priest had racked up a huge phone bill which was gone in the four figures. It was found out he used watch alot of late night tele and phoning up pretty women.

Thats another reason they should be allow marry - they have someone to give them a hand running affairs n stuff

(*non-believer btw - may not be long "finding religion" if they allow that though - handy number

..............i found her in rags

http://i.imgur.com/rHX3coh.jpg

............ living in an attic

http://i.imgur.com/iv81SMN.jpg

.

KungPao · 04-07-2014 03:02PM

Jeefff wrote: »

My local church had a complete restoration, new roof, windows, pews, flooring, the lot.. They chucked perfectly good pews out to buy plastic ones..
They then demanded 3,000 quid from each household in the parish, which is a tiny place, if the payments weren't made to them, you were asked to use another church, which alot of people did..
There's a bigger church not five miles from it, but a different parish..

Absolute arseholes, the vatican is sinking with money, ask them..
I'm a non believer anyway so the letter was chucked away

They'd be lucky to get a 20 cent coin from me. Two 10c if the basket goes around twice.

DEFTLEFTHAND · 04-07-2014 03:02PM

Sir Arthur Daley wrote: »

So a priest keeps 100% of the weekly collections?

It goes towards the upkeep of church grounds, buildings and priests living costs.

SpaceTime · 04-07-2014 03:02PM

Jeefff wrote: »

My local church had a complete restoration, new roof, windows, pews, flooring, the lot.. They chucked perfectly good pews out to buy plastic ones..
They then demanded 3,000 quid from each household in the parish, which is a tiny place, if the payments weren't made to them, you were asked to use another church, which alot of people did..
There's a bigger church not five miles from it, but a different parish..

Absolute arseholes, the vatican is sinking with money, ask them..
I'm a non believer anyway so the letter was chucked away

3 grand ?!? They must have thought the Celtic Tigre was still in full swing. People don't have that kind of money to be throwing around on pews!

Michael2107 · 04-07-2014 03:03PM

DEFTLEFTHAND wrote: »

I hear Dublin plot prices are crazy altogether, somebody was telling me you could up to five grand in some cases.

And that would be lower end of scale, certain plots are close to twenty grand, a single plot in Kildare is €1250, while a double is €2500. And there is a fee to open aswel to council, and that doesnt cover the physical opening which would be close to an extra €500.

Knasher · 04-07-2014 03:03PM

I'm just glad we don't have anything like the chancel laws they have in the UK, where the churches can legally force some landowners to pay for any repairs the church undergoes.

Tokyo · 04-07-2014 03:04PM

Sir Arthur Daley wrote: »

So a priest keeps 100% of the weekly collections?

It's been a long time since I served mass, but I'm fairly sure that's not true. If I remember correctly a certain amount of that was for the priest to support himself - some was set aside for the local church, and some was deposited in the church's coffers.

Sir Arthur Daley · 04-07-2014 03:05PM

DEFTLEFTHAND wrote: »

It goes towards the upkeep of church grounds, buildings and priests living costs.

Does the priest not lodge the collection money along with station dues and all other monies that he earns into an account that is overseas?

miss no stars · 04-07-2014 03:06PM

LexieOnRale wrote: »

6 months ago we bought a plot in this parishes graveyard. 500 euro for a single plot, and 100 euro to open it. Two more people can be buried in the plot we bought, and everytime it's opened the church charges 100 euro.
Robbing bastards

Good value down your way

The_Minister · 04-07-2014 03:14PM

LexieOnRale wrote: »

6 months ago we bought a plot in this parishes graveyard. 500 euro for a single plot, and 100 euro to open it. Two more people can be buried in the plot we bought, and everytime it's opened the church charges 100 euro.
Robbing bastards

Those all sound like perfectly reasonable fees to me; probably undercharging if anything.

Sleepy · 04-07-2014 03:15PM

That fella really needs to read his bible... Matthew 21:12 springs to mind. Then again, it does any time I think of the Roman Catholic Church or the Vatican...

P_1 · 04-07-2014 03:16PM

LexieOnRale wrote: »

6 months ago we bought a plot in this parishes graveyard. 500 euro for a single plot, and 100 euro to open it. Two more people can be buried in the plot we bought, and everytime it's opened the church charges 100 euro.
Robbing bastards

Compared to Dublin prices they're actually quite reasonable. It's amazing how much it costs to die these days.

qo2cj1dsne8y4k · 04-07-2014 03:17PM

The_Minister wrote: »

Those all sound like perfectly reasonable fees to me; probably undercharging if anything.

If you pay for it then why do you have to pay to open it? It should be a one off payment! Even if its more at the start.

miss no stars · 04-07-2014 03:19PM

LexieOnRale wrote: »

If you pay for it then why do you have to pay to open it? It should be a one off payment! Even if its more at the start.

Eh, because it takes work to open it? It then has to be filled back in properly and tended to for a while afterwards.

Sir Arthur Daley · 04-07-2014 03:19PM

LexieOnRale wrote: »

If you pay for it then why do you have to pay to open it? It should be a one off payment! Even if its more at the start.

That is not how it works, €100 is very small money to reopen a plot, why not reopen a plot yourself with neighbours as alot of country people do when a neighbour dies?

Tokyo · 04-07-2014 03:19PM

LexieOnRale wrote: »

If you pay for it then why do you have to pay to open it? It should be a one off payment! Even if its more at the start.

Would you dig a 6' hole in the ground for free? especially if you run the risk of digging up someone's remains in the process? And a lot of graveyards nowadays pay for a machine to do it. €100 seems reasonable to me.

Sir Arthur Daley wrote: »

That is not how it works, €100 is very small money to reopen a plot, why not reopen a plot yourself with neighbours as alot of country people do when a neighbour dies?

This is common where I'm from. Tradition has it that the family should never be involved with the digging of the grave - neighbours and friends take care of it. Having dug a few myself I can say firsthand that you're getting your money's worth for €100..

Michael2107 · 04-07-2014 03:23PM

mike_ie wrote: »

Would you dig a 6' hole in the ground for free? especially if you run the risk of digging up someone's remains in the process? And a lot of graveyards nowadays pay for a machine to do it. €100 seems reasonable to me.

This is common where I'm from. Tradition has it that the family should never be involved with the digging of the grave - neighbours and friends take care of it. Having dug a few myself I can say firsthand that you're getting your money's worth for €100..

The €100 is just a fee it doesnt cover the cost of opening the grave, this will cost anywhere from €300 to €1000 depending on the area.

qo2cj1dsne8y4k · 04-07-2014 03:23PM

miss no stars wrote: »

Eh, because it takes work to open it? It then has to be filled back in properly and tended to for a while afterwards.

Paying someone to open it and fill it is a seperate charge. Eh.

I Heart Internet · 04-07-2014 03:24PM

Sir Arthur Daley wrote: »

So a priest keeps 100% of the weekly collections?

No. This is a notion believed by people - massgoers and non-massgoers alike.

Parish collections are for running the parish (NOT paying the priest).

A diocesan priest is paid in a number of different ways (depending on his diocese). Typically including - two collections a year - one on Christmas Day, one on Easter Sunday, offerings at weddings, baptisms, etc. Other jobs the priest may hold (e.g. chaplain at a prison).

Some dioceses have mechanisms to ensure that incomes are evened out - that priests in poorer parsishes get some money from wealthier ones.

Some parishes are in debt. Many aren't. For all parishes though, running costs can be surprisingly high. Man has not yet invented, for some reason, a church roof design that will not leak after 20 years.

I have some knowledge of insurance, for example, for a city church - it is eye-wateringly high due to location.

Sir Arthur Daley · 04-07-2014 03:25PM

Michael2107 wrote: »

The €100 is just a fee it doesnt cover the cost of opening the grave, this will cost anywhere from €300 to €1000 depending on the area.

Up to €1000 to dig a grave, drop tools and buy a shovel im in.

qo2cj1dsne8y4k · 04-07-2014 03:31PM

Sir Arthur Daley wrote: »

That is not how it works, €100 is very small money to reopen a plot, why not reopen a plot yourself with neighbours as alot of country people do when a neighbour dies?

That's my gripe with it. Even if your neighbours dig the grave for free, you still have to pay to open it. I have no issue with anyone charging to dig a grave. The hundred euro is a charge to open the grave, it's nothing to do with who digs it, that's a seperate charge.

Parish in debt.

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