Mk4s taking over on the Belfast line?

dowlingm wrote: »

IE are already looking at CAWS replacement with a system which can be transitioned (likely slowly as cash trickles in like Dash2 ended up) to ETCS. My annoyance is that for all the messing around with the South offering cash for the A5 and that bridge near Newry (and the latter at least now on the long finger) with a Tiger era cash injection we could have had whole island ETCS like Denmark is doing so that subject to clearance and route knowledge any rail vehicle could go anywhere on signalled lines.

As for your question about subbing out - IE could have planned their fleet to keep the six 22000s Connolly side when not in Laois and move 29000s Heuston side to Kildare commuter. If not, why were the damn things fitted with the gear? Not something NIR can be blamed for. The delay in getting Drogheda sorted for 22s alone was scandalous.

I'd agree about the kitting out the six three piece 22k sets with TPWS - they really should have put more thought into that. It was a waste.


Actually I would disagree about maintenance - I would far rather that the 22k sets had continued to be maintained at Connolly rather than Drogheda. Valuable time is lost every day sending sets to be serviced in Drogheda rather than Connolly. That is partially the reason why 22k sets are not available for certain Intercity services.


Also things changed - the Kildare commuter is no more. It is now an hourly Portlaoise service and is often used to get sets to/from the depot. So using 29k sets on the Heuston side really isn't an option.

yet they can find them for services out of the other side, no way would the local services out of there be expected to endure 29s, also maybe if they weren't sending them on m3 parkway and maynooth services there might be enough. really the maintenence centres should be in cork limerick and dublin, at the end of the journey if you will, because clearly the current places cause to many problems, well of course the people of sligo and wexford are a lot worse for allowing irish rail to subject us to commuter stock, then again they treated us with contempt for years so why bother changing.

Irish Rail maintenance locations were very poorly planned and how the suits in charge came up with the current locations is very questionable. Hundreds of thousands of liters of fuel have being wasted since 2007.

All 22's should be maintained in Portliness, with minor facilities at Heuston and Connolly to carry out general repairs and servicing. They should not of spent thousands or even millions? on the facility in Drogheda. I fail to see the justification of such a facility for around 12-15 units based in Connolly.

I do think the current CEO would not of picked Portlaosie. I know space is an issue around Heuston but really it could be the main servicing point for 22s.

Looking after 29's in Drogheda is fine as most sets will overnight their.

As for your question about subbing out - IE could have planned their fleet to keep the six 22000s Connolly side when not in Laois and move 29000s Heuston side to Kildare commuter. If not, why were the damn things fitted with the gear? Not something NIR can be blamed for. The delay in getting Drogheda sorted for 22s alone was scandalous.

They could do it whenever they like, there could be a few minor issues but its very possible and it would not require 29's to move to Kildare line something which I would never like to see happen. Anyway when DU opens the excuse of 22's on Kildare services will be gone!

29s are better for the kildare local services though, such services are what they are designed for, how many people actually use the service between kildare and portlaoise that couldn't use other services instead?

kc56 wrote: »

DU will only serve Hazelhatch; that's the extent of the proposed electrification. There will still be a need for commuter service beyond there.

One of the reasons for the Portlaoise service rather than Kildare was to avoid Cork services stopping before Portlaoise. 29k's would be too slow for the longer gaps between the stations; as it is the ICRs easily reach 90/100mph between stations after the 'hatch.

KIldare has no turnback facilities and isn't really suitable for a terminus.

Indeed but what will happen is Portlaoise commuter service will see major improvements and its first stop will likely be Hazelhatch or Nass. I think the current commuter set up is doing more harm to traffic because of the very low usage of KRP stations bar hatch.

As for terminating in Kildare, not really an issue as the loop line could be used. Part of the problem before was more IC services used to serve the station and required the terminated train to be moved to free up the platform before returning. There is loads of space to add a turn back if necessary in future.

29s are better for the kildare local services though, such services are what they are designed for, how many people actually use the service between kildare and portlaoise that couldn't use other services instead?

You are right in principal however IMO out of all the main commuter routes (speed aside) Kildare is better with 22's than likes of Maynooth or Dundalk because demand is lower.

Its worth noting that 15 units were purchased for commuter services and if you look at most 22 rosters they operate Intercity-Commuter-servicing-Commuter-Intercity. They should address the Rosslare issues but if they go to Belfast it will be years before they do!

Jamie2k9 wrote: »

Indeed but what will happen is Portlaoise commuter service will see major improvements and its first stop will likely be Hazelhatch or Nass. I think the current commuter set up is doing more harm to traffic because of the very low usage of KRP stations bar hatch.

As for terminating in Kildare, not really an issue as the loop line could be used. Part of the problem before was more IC services used to serve the station and required the terminated train to be moved to free up the platform before returning. There is loads of space to add a turn back if necessary in future.



You are right in principal however IMO out of all the main commuter routes (speed aside) Kildare is better with 22's than likes of Maynooth or Dundalk because demand is lower.

Its worth noting that 15 units were purchased for commuter services and if you look at most 22 rosters they operate Intercity-Commuter-servicing-Commuter-Intercity. They should address the Rosslare issues but if they go to Belfast it will be years before they do!

they will never address the Rosslare issues

corktina wrote: »

what does this mean "KRP stations bar hatch."

Its the section of line/stations between Heuston and Hazelhatch where they doubled form 2 to 4 tracks and its known as the KRP.

corktina wrote: »

Initials of the stations I'm guessing?

Kildare Rail Project I was led to believe.

lxflyer wrote: »

I'm not saying it's the only reason, but frankly the first class business is important to them, and is an integral part of the Enterprise service.

bikeman1 wrote: »

The Belfast service despite what a lot of people is well used and the First Plus is a good product that holds it's own requiring one and two thirds of carriages. Just look at the three morning departures to Dublin. So the companies can't just say we will just throw out a non first class train onto the links for a year or however long it takes.

Actually, it might be better that they did, because when the ICRs first came on stream I got a look at the "First Class" section and I think it's safe to say the Enterprise would lose less wealthy/business customers by simply having no First Class at all, versus subjecting said customers to the utter joke that is "First Class" on the ICRs.

Well perhaps you should address that to the person who used it!

I only translated it for you!!

Dear Lord..children (and anyone who objects to that term may wish to reread this thread over) please be civil, on topic and generally better behaved..

SpaceTime wrote: »

I wonder though what the legalities of moving the MK4 trains off to Northern Ireland would be.

They were part funded for the Cork-Dublin route by EU funding as far as I am aware. They're not just there to be willy nilly removed from service and used elsewhere a few years into use.

Inda will call Angela and say "if a fuss is kicked up I'll need more money" and she'll have the dogs called off.

Why are we even debating it?

As we know, the Mark 4 sets are not going to the Belfast line at all.

It's an irrelevant issue.