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Croke Park residents to seek concert injuctions.....your opinions?

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Comments

  • #4982
    Tarzana
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,062 ✭✭✭Tarzana


    therealme wrote: »
    I meant for all 5.

    Well, the decision's been made so there it is.


  • #4983
    darkpagandeath
    Closed Accounts Posts: 24,461 ✭✭✭✭darkpagandeath


    Tarzana wrote: »
    What are you basing that on? No waffle, please. What concrete happenings are you basing that on?

    Experience of living outside Ireland in other capitals and major cities. I know it may come as a shock but in other cities they accept what goes on in a city, noise concerts cars planes trains.


  • #4984
    Jamsiek
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,426 ✭✭✭Jamsiek


    Kalyke wrote: »
    Look this was an attempt at smash and grab by BOTH sides.. But guess who loses long term? Joe Soap.... as usual.

    Who?


  • #4985
    Tarzana
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,062 ✭✭✭Tarzana


    sioux1977 wrote: »
    I'm just saying that they could let this one slide

    You don't really get it. If they "let this one slide" it sets a precedent and says that CP can walk all over the residents.


  • #4986
    j8wk2feszrnpao
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,438 ✭✭✭j8wk2feszrnpao


    Tarzana wrote: »
    If you're going to change my quote, at least write FYP.
    Apologies Tarzana, correction made.


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  • #4987
    Tarzana
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,062 ✭✭✭Tarzana


    darkpagandeath wrote: »
    Experience of living outside Ireland in other capitals and major cities. I know it may come as a shock but in other cities they accept what goes on in a city, noise concerts cars planes trains.

    You'll need to be more detailed than that. ;)


  • #4988
    hynesie08
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,283 ✭✭✭✭hynesie08


    darkpagandeath wrote: »
    Experience of living outside Ireland in other capitals and major cities. I know it may come as a shock but in other cities they accept what goes on in a city, noise concerts cars planes trains.

    they also build their stadiums with decent road and rail links.


  • #4989
    Amirani
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 12,554 Mod ✭✭✭✭Amirani


    darkpagandeath wrote: »
    Experience of living outside Ireland in other capitals and major cities. I know it may come as a shock but in other cities they accept what goes on in a city, noise concerts cars planes trains.

    How come there's extremely strict limits at Heathrow (and all the UK airports) on what flights and how many take place between 11pm and 7am? There's certainly demand during those hours.


  • #4990
    awec
    Administrators Posts: 55,090 Admin ✭✭✭✭✭awec


    Diego Simeone wrote: »
    How come there's extremely strict limits at Heathrow (and all the UK airports) on what flights and how many take place between 11pm and 7am? There's certainly demand during those hours.

    To be fair Heathrow is a busy transport hub 365 days of the year.


  • #4991
    darkpagandeath
    Closed Accounts Posts: 24,461 ✭✭✭✭darkpagandeath


    hynesie08 wrote: »
    they also build their stadiums with decent road and rail links.

    True but the stadium is were it is can't just move it now.
    Diego Simeone wrote: »
    How come there's extremely strict limits at Heathrow (and all the UK airports) on what flights and how many take place between 11pm and 7am? There's certainly demand during those hours.

    Yes but they don't stop either.


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  • #4992
    Jamsiek
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,426 ✭✭✭Jamsiek


    miju wrote: »
    Same could be said for the residents feeling entitled to tell 160,000 people where they should or shouldnt get their entertainment

    Blame the promoters


  • #4993
    Amirani
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 12,554 Mod ✭✭✭✭Amirani


    awec wrote: »
    To be fair Heathrow is a busy transport hub 365 days of the year.

    There's limits on what flights and how many they can have between those hours though - http://www.heathrowairport.com/static/Heathrow_Noise/Downloads/PDF/Nightflights11.pdf


  • #4994
    Amirani
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 12,554 Mod ✭✭✭✭Amirani


    darkpagandeath wrote: »
    Yes but they don't stop either.

    They famously stopped Springsteen breaking the curfew in Hyde Park a couple of years ago by cutting his electricity mid-song.


  • #4995
    awec
    Administrators Posts: 55,090 Admin ✭✭✭✭✭awec


    Diego Simeone wrote: »
    There's limits on what flights and how many they can have between those hours though - http://www.heathrowairport.com/static/Heathrow_Noise/Downloads/PDF/Nightflights11.pdf

    Yea I know - but would the same limits apply if Heathrow was only busy and loud for 5 days out of 365?

    I get what you're saying but not sure it's a comparable situation.


  • #4996
    Michael2107
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 25 ✭Michael2107


    miju wrote: »
    You said residents have a right. I said 400,000 people have a bigger right to use a building that cost the taxpayer €91 million.

    Point stands

    Yes to use as a sports stadium not as a concert venue, do you really think the taxpayer would of funded €91 million for a concert venue??


  • #4997
    j8wk2feszrnpao
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,438 ✭✭✭j8wk2feszrnpao


    sioux1977 wrote: »
    I understand, but i don't think it's the case that 240,000 people will benefit at the 'expense' of the residents; they are benefiting because they paid for their tickets with their own hard-earned money, as opposed to the goodness of the residents' hearts!
    It was just a response to a previous post. Of course the concert goers have purchased their tickets to the event.
    240,000 people, if GB plays the three gigs, would have a great night; but the residents may not.
    sioux1977 wrote: »
    It's not their fault that residents live nearby, and bought houses right beside a huge, bustling, noisy venue!
    Not all resident bought houses in an area that was due to host 8 concerts a year. Many have been born and grown up in that area; they haven't all bought in.
    It's also not the residents fault that people were sold tickets by the promoters to a 5 concert event that was always going to get objected to and unlikely to get the full 5 nights.
    sioux1977 wrote: »
    i'm just saying i think in this case they are being stubborn for the sake of it, for the principle shall we say, as opposed to them trying to actually find a fair solution (hence why i feel that, after so many other concerts, 2 won't really make that much difference) I'm just saying that they could let this one slide, for the sake of peace and goodwill
    I understand what you a\re saying, and I don't necessarily disagree with all of your points.
    But the way that Aiken/Croker have gone about this, has probably caused concern among the residents.
    Croker and the residents had an agreement that 3 concerts a year would be the limit. Those were the 3 1D concerts. Now they want to add 5 GB concerts on top of that. Not 1 or 2, but 5. Taking the piss more than a little.
    So what faith do the residents have that it won't continue next year?


  • #4998
    Thoie
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,344 ✭✭✭Thoie


    sioux1977 wrote: »
    I understand, but i don't think it's the case that 240,000 people will benefit at the 'expense' of the residents; they are benefiting because they paid for their tickets with their own hard-earned money, as opposed to the goodness of the residents' hearts! It's not their fault that residents live nearby, and bought houses right beside a huge, bustling, noisy venue! I understand that residents should be treated with consideration, i'm just saying i think in this case they are being stubborn for the sake of it, for the principle shall we say, as opposed to them trying to actually find a fair solution (hence why i feel that, after so many other concerts, 2 won't really make that much difference) I'm just saying that they could let this one slide, for the sake of peace and goodwill, and certainly it should'nt happen again..but instead they are taking the power-trip route. All of this is just my opinion, i understand not everyone feels the same!

    Most people (other than those with tickets for the cancelled nights) are saying that a fair solution was reached. You (and a lot of other people) seem to be saying that finding a fair compromise means "allowing all 5 concerts to go ahead as planned". That's not a compromise.

    "Another 2 concerts won't really make that much difference" - they mean the difference between people having 3 or 5 days of disruption. If you had your sleep disturbed for 3 nights running, how happy would you be to say "ah sure, another 2 nights won't make any difference at this stage". If your front garden had been used as a toilet/rubbish dump for a few days, would another few be OK? Are some of the concert goers going to come back and wash the pee off your doorstep each morning?

    After three days of not being able to come and go freely from your house whenever you feel like it, would you not think that three days were more than enough, and now you'd like to be able to get some groceries/have granny over to visit? People keep saying "it's only 5 days out of a whole year". It's 5 days in a row - almost an entire week of disruption to people living in the area if you count set up and take down as well.

    The concert-goers don't teleport home at 11pm when the show finishes. It takes quite some time to disperse a crowd that size. Listening to drunk people singing their favourite Garth Brook's hit as they stagger past your house is probably great fun when you know you have to get up for work in 4 hours.


  • #4999
    Amirani
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 12,554 Mod ✭✭✭✭Amirani


    awec wrote: »
    Yea I know - but would the same limits apply if Heathrow was only busy and loud for 5 days out of 365?

    I get what you're saying but not sure it's a comparable situation.

    Sorry I misinterpreted, I'm not comparing this to Croke Park whatsoever, they're in no way comparable.

    I was just using it in response to darkpagandeath's post that seemed to suggest that other countries don't take noise seriously.


  • #5000
    Frank Lee Midere
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,780 ✭✭✭Frank Lee Midere


    Diego Simeone wrote: »
    They famously stopped Springsteen breaking the curfew in Hyde Park a couple of years ago by cutting his electricity mid-song.

    Was going to mention that.

    Probably most countries have stricter laws than here.


  • #5001
    Muahahaha
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 19,770 ✭✭✭✭Muahahaha


    Stinicker wrote: »
    The Residents are just being NIMBY's. Yes the Planning may state that but the fact is that over 400,000 tickets have been sold and and around 1 in 8 people living on Irish soil have made plans for the event. The proper thing would be to allow it proceed and then ensure that a repeat of 5 nights in a row doesn't happen again.

    That's not true. There are 400,000 tickets sold with 20% sold abroad which means 320,000 people living here had planned to go. The population of Ireland is 4.6m. 320,000 people is not "1 in 8 people", it's nowhere near it.
    end of the road wrote: »
    yes ideally, but the majority is the next best thing

    Now that Garth has thrown his hissy fit it doesn't look like you'll be getting any concerts at all. I'm not hearing you criticise Garth Brooks whatsoever but I'm hearing you lay ALL blame on the residents. Well time to get with the program laddie because the news has moved on and Garth Brooks is now responsible for cancelling the majority, 60%, of the concerts.
    super_furry wrote: »
    Seems obvious to me that Aiken signed a contract with Garth Brooks for him to play five dates here. Now that they're looking to renegotiate it down to three gigs, he's not up for it.

    This will end up in the courts between Brooks and Aiken.

    Big time. Aiken better hope he has a water tight insurance policy against this event happening. I remember Prince had a long running battle with a promoter here, didn't end well for either side but Prince could well afford it.
    Big C wrote: »
    feel sorry for the grotty bed & breakfast on Gardener street that was charging €140 per head for 4 people in one room on the tuesday of Brooks concert, breakfast was extra.

    RTE News gave the Irish Hotels Federation the chance to row their oar in earlier. All we got is the usual waffle, jobs, jobs, jobs. Not a mention about upholding the law or respecting the decisions of a democratic institution. And not once did the interviewer think to ask the IHF guy about how his members were gouging tourists and locals for 3 times the normal price for hotel rooms. Didn't even ask how this might be perceived by people, it wasn't journalism, it was deference.
    Lord Trollington wrote: »
    If you lived in Madrid you have Real and Athletico. Both play in La Liga, the top division in Spain. Both play in Spanish Cups and Champions League.

    Thats 30-40 games a year each. Champions League doesnt start until 9pm local time midweek and isn't over until 11.15PM.

    Croke Park is used May to September. And at that its only every other weekend. 12/13 outings max a year for a €500m stadium.

    That's a really bad comparison. Real Madrid are a global entity with supporters in every country in the world. You're attempting to compare something like the draw of Real Madrid to an Offlay Kildare qualifier at Croker. There is no comparison because the GAA cannot draw the numbers to fill Croke Park. Outside of All Ireland finals and semi finals sell outs at Croker are almost non existent. Even hurling semi finals don't draw 80,000 people. Real Madrid on the other hand have season ticket applications waiting for years. That's people who want to pay to go see 30+ games a year. That's the 80,000 Bernabeau thronging for every game. Dublin are Ireland's biggest GAA team and they get around 15,000 people watch them play at Parnell Park, less if it's raining. Despite the popularity of GAA that stadium is way too big for 95% of the GAA games that are actually held there.
    jack presley wrote: »
    People seem to be forgetting the biggest victims here. What are Shane Filan and Nathan Carter going to do with themselves on those nights now?

    I was just thinking about Shane Filan because part of the reason his €6m property empire in Sligo collapsed was because him and his brother tried to ride roughshot over residents in Sligo by throwing up nursing homes and hotels and not listening to residents objections. It created no end of legal headaches for him. Now here he is 12 months on waiting for his big comeback gig at Croker so he can lift himself out of bankruptcy and what happens ? Aiken/GAA right roughshot over the Croker residents. Croker residents win and Shane Filan gets thwarted yet again. You really couldn't make this stuff up, I bet he is raging like a lunatic tonight and I'll sleep well with that thought in my mind :pac:
    anncoates wrote: »
    Bollocks.

    Just face it. Ireland is changing. Like the church , the GAA can't bully who they want anymore.

    Too true. Sociologists will mark down this whole debacle as further evidence that things are slowly changing here. Gombeen culture has been utterly exposed here. Everyone in the country knows it was gombeen culture that brought about the crash. Now people are fighting back. More power to them I say.

    BoB_BoT wrote: »
    He was down for playing 3 gigs at the start, the 2 were added after the tickets for the first 3 sold out. His original agreements and costings would have been for 3 days, not 5.

    Dead on. They couldn't have known he would sell out three dates until they actually sold out the three dates before adding more. So the turnover for 3 concerts (240,000 x €80) was going to be €19.2m, I'd imagine Garth was getting 50% of that sum. But he wants it all, 5 concerts would generate €32m, with perhaps half going to him. He can have nearly €10m but instead now he is saying sorry dudes, I want my €16m or nothing. It's arrogant and self centered, he couldn't care less about the fans, it's all about the moolah.

    [
    Candie wrote: »

    The very thought of the Taoiseach taking time out from running the country to make sure a few concerts go ahead is cringeworthy in the absolute extreme. I hope Brookes never comes back if it means more of this stuff.

    I agree with you but there is actually a precedent. 2001 at Slane, previous planning permission was for one concert a year. U2 sold out 80,000 tickets in record time. There was uproar as thousands were left disappointed so Bertie Ahern stepped in and, ahem, had a word. 2nd concert was held despite many residents being unhappy about it. Fianna Fáil supporters loved to point to the episode as an example of Bertie's greatness. Look how that all ended....
    miju wrote: »
    Do remind me again how referundums work in this country ??? It's the lowest vote % that wins aint it :rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes:
    miju wrote: »
    I wouldnt call 27,000 getting their way vs 400,000 not getting theirs very democratic would you????

    You clearly do not know what a democracy is or how it functions. It really worries me that people like you have a vote and can use it to cause our nation such damage like we've seen since the crash. People like you using your vote without educating yourself are the reason why this country is on it's knees.
    dloob wrote: »
    Time to CPO the houses around the stadium and turn it into one of those vast car parks American stadiums have, no more resident whining.

    More waffle :rolleyes: It's just never ending on this thread.


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  • #5002
    Frank Lee Midere
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,780 ✭✭✭Frank Lee Midere


    Too true. Sociologists will mark down this whole debacle as further evidence that things are slowly changing here. Gombeen culture has been utterly exposed here. Everyone in the country knows it was gombeen culture that brought about the crash. Now people are fighting back. More power to them I say.

    It was Gombeen culture which brought about the bubble. Now look around you and Dublins property prices?

    Seems gombeenish to me.


  • #5003
    darkpagandeath
    Closed Accounts Posts: 24,461 ✭✭✭✭darkpagandeath


    Diego Simeone wrote: »
    They famously stopped Springsteen breaking the curfew in Hyde Park a couple of years ago by cutting his electricity mid-song.

    And rightly so, Agreement was till 10:30 pm. But the concert went ahead did it not. People living near there would expect a certain noise level till a certain time. Was not cancelled due to people complaining. Same here they have a cut off time.


  • #5004
    Cienciano
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 14,135 ✭✭✭✭Cienciano


    darkpagandeath wrote: »
    Experience of living outside Ireland in other capitals and major cities. I know it may come as a shock but in other cities they accept what goes on in a city, noise concerts cars planes trains.

    Have you ever lived in Germany? If you tried cutting your grass with a lawnmower on a sunday or bank holiday the police would call around to you for breaking noise pollution laws.


  • #5005
    Cienciano
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 14,135 ✭✭✭✭Cienciano


    darkpagandeath wrote: »
    And rightly so, Agreement was till 10:30 pm. But the concert went ahead did it not. People living near there would expect a certain noise level till a certain time. Was not cancelled due to people complaining. Same here they have a cut off time.

    And Springsteen cancelled all his other gigs in the UK and said it was like one of his children had been killed. The entire population of the united kingdom were embarrassed internationally and were ashamed to be British because the power had been cut at his concert


  • #5006
    Frank Lee Midere
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,780 ✭✭✭Frank Lee Midere


    darkpagandeath wrote: »
    And rightly so, Agreement was till 10:30 pm. But the concert went ahead did it not. People living near there would expect a certain noise level till a certain time. Was not cancelled due to people complaining. Same here they have a cut off time.

    Agreement was 3 concerts a year.

    /thread.


  • #5007
    darkpagandeath
    Closed Accounts Posts: 24,461 ✭✭✭✭darkpagandeath


    Cienciano wrote: »
    Have you ever lived in Germany? If you tried cutting your grass with a lawnmower on a sunday or bank holiday the police would call around to you for breaking noise pollution laws.

    Fair enough but I'm guessing they would not call to a stadium and close down the concert. As it would already have permission. Your house is slightly different to a stadium.


  • #5008
    hynesie08
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,283 ✭✭✭✭hynesie08


    darkpagandeath wrote: »
    Fair enough but I'm guessing they would not call to a stadium and close down the concert. As it would already have permission. Your house is slightly different to a stadium.

    And these concerts didn't, so they aren't going ahead.


  • #5009
    hynesie08
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,283 ✭✭✭✭hynesie08


    Cienciano wrote: »
    And Springsteen cancelled all his other gigs in the UK and said it was like one of his children had been killed. The entire population of the united kingdom were embarrassed internationally and were ashamed to be British because the power had been cut at his concert

    And this year hyde park refused to host eminem, National crisis was averted when the prime minister told wembley to have the concerts or else.....


  • #5010
    dirkmeister
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,684 ✭✭✭dirkmeister


    darkpagandeath wrote: »
    And rightly so, Agreement was till 10:30 pm. But the concert went ahead did it not. People living near there would expect a certain noise level till a certain time. Was not cancelled due to people complaining. Same here they have a cut off time.


    Jack White had the power cut in Kilmainham last week at around 10:45 I think it was, he played on without any sound.


    Great gig.


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  • #5011
    Idbatterim
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 18,568 ✭✭✭✭Idbatterim


    Why not let him play and reduce it to one gig next year, from then on in they can have 3 a year or more after consent with residents association...


This discussion has been closed.
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