Looks like Revenue are in a spot of bother

Hootanany · 07-06-2014 07:43PM #1

http://m.independent.ie/business/irish/eu-launches-probe-into-revenue-special-deals-for-multinational-firms-30333572.html

How much of encomamy could be solved if these companies paid their tax

Captain Chaos · 07-06-2014 07:45PM

If these Multinationals had to pay all their tax they would pull out of Ireland full stop. They are only here for the tax breaks. If they go we'd have even less revenue income.

My name is URL · 07-06-2014 07:50PM

However, Taoiseach Enda Kenny – who is on a trade mission in Silicon Valley – has indicated that the Government will fight to defend its reputation on the issue.

That's us fcuked then

hatrickpatrick · 07-06-2014 07:50PM

This whole corporation tax business is f*cking ridiculous. If other countries for one reason or another can't compete with Ireland, tough sh!t - there are plenty of strings countries like Germany pull with regard to the ECB which Irish people would love to do something about but we can't. This is something we have control over which they don't, so unless they want to compromise on bank debt and bondholders, they can f*ck right off.

Hootanany · 07-06-2014 07:54PM

But if we even getting 12.5% but we are not false accounting

Mr_Red · 07-06-2014 07:55PM

These companies employee people and the government taxes the employees.

they bring great business into the communities like areas in Cork, Kildare , Dublin, Galway and so on.

The EU can go fcuk themselves

mike65 · 07-06-2014 07:56PM

Mr_Red wrote: »

These companies employee people and the government taxes the employees.

they bring great business into the communities like areas in Cork, Kildare , Dublin, Galway and so on

The EU can go fcuk themselves

fixed your post

My name is URL · 07-06-2014 07:56PM

hatrickpatrick wrote: »

This whole corporation tax business is f*cking ridiculous. If other countries for one reason or another can't compete with Ireland, tough sh!t - there are plenty of strings countries like Germany pull with regard to the ECB which Irish people would love to do something about but we can't. This is something we have control over which they don't, so unless they want to compromise on bank debt and bondholders, they can f*ck right off.

Could they have launched a probe like this or forced companies here to repay taxes if the Lisbon Treaty was not passed?

I mean it seems like FG etc want to have their cake and eat it too. They want closer ties with Europe but don't want to comply with EU tax regulations. Doesn't make a whole lot of sense.

Mr. Incognito · 07-06-2014 07:57PM

There is no special deal or false accounting. It is perfectly legitimate to pay reduced rates using r and d credits.

Companies will always offshore their profits using company structures.

However every employee here is contributing income tax, vat, and services that supply these companies.

Stop spouting propaganda. Unless every OECD country wants to harmonise their rates these companies will hq in Bermuda, the Isle of Man etc.. Compared to them we are actually expensive.

Hootanany · 07-06-2014 08:00PM

Mr. Incognito wrote: »

There is no special deal or false accounting. It is perfectly legitimate to pay reduced rates using r and d credits.

Companies will always offshore their profits using company structures.

However every employee here is contributing income tax, vat, and services that supply these companies.

Stop spouting propaganda. Unless every OECD country wants to harmonise their rates these companies will hq in Bermuda, the Isle of Man etc.. Compared to them we are actually expensive.

Propaganda I think not, what about letting the SMA's gti a bite of that Cherry?

Piliger · 07-06-2014 09:09PM

hatrickpatrick wrote: »

This whole corporation tax business is f*cking ridiculous. If other countries for one reason or another can't compete with Ireland, tough sh!t - there are plenty of strings countries like Germany pull with regard to the ECB which Irish people would love to do something about but we can't. This is something we have control over which they don't, so unless they want to compromise on bank debt and bondholders, they can f*ck right off.

Exactly. And Kenny has held the line under intense pressure all through this government. Bloody great job.

Piliger · 07-06-2014 09:13PM

My name is URL wrote: »

Could they have launched a probe like this or forced companies here to repay taxes if the Lisbon Treaty was not passed?

I mean it seems like FG etc want to have their cake and eat it too. They want closer ties with Europe but don't want to comply with EU tax regulations. Doesn't make a whole lot of sense.

What are you talking about ? There is no evidence whatsoever that Ireland has broken any EU Tax Regulations.
This is all a big blowhard attempt to intimidate Ireland into agreeing to raise our taxes to match those in Germany and France.
Kenny has dug in his heels and said no way. Rightly.
We are on the fringes of the EU. A small island. We need some edge in order to bring business here, otherwise any multinational would prefer to be in the geographical centre of the EU !
FG have stuck to this policy and it is paying dividends for the country in bringing jobs and taxes.

_Brian · 07-06-2014 09:14PM

Mr. Incognito wrote: »

There is no special deal or false accounting. It is perfectly legitimate to pay reduced rates using r and d credits.

Companies will always offshore their profits using company structures.

However every employee here is contributing income tax, vat, and services that supply these companies.

Stop spouting propaganda. Unless every OECD country wants to harmonise their rates these companies will hq in Bermuda, the Isle of Man etc.. Compared to them we are actually expensive.

Interestingly, at least one of the major Multinationals here is actually registered in the Caymen Islands.. I'm fairly sure that's a tax thing.

Bubbaclaus · 07-06-2014 09:18PM

Hootanany wrote: »

How much of encomamy could be solved if these companies paid their tax

What??

The Irish economy would be ****ed and the Irish people would be stuck emigrating thanks to a 20% unemployment rate if the multinationals here suddenly became forced to pay more tax.

emo72 · 07-06-2014 09:18PM

dont you just love the EU? all the horrible **** we have to opt in. and the good **** we have to opt out. **** off EU

ytpe2r5bxkn0c1 · 07-06-2014 09:22PM

mike65 wrote: »

fixed your post

And so on..should stand. PayPal and eBay in Louth for instance and several more. Intel is another!

scallywaggles · 07-06-2014 09:28PM

It's all a bit blown out of proportion really, it's not like the multinationals will suddenly move elsewhere in Europe if the whole of Europe has the same corpo tax rate, unless they establish themselves as French companies, then they can avail of the 0% French corpo tax rate that nobody ever mentions...

Piliger · 07-06-2014 09:29PM

scallywaggles wrote: »

It's all a bit blown out of proportion really, it's not like the multinationals will suddenly move elsewhere in Europe if the whole of Europe has the same corpo tax rate, unless they establish themselves as French companies, then they can avail of the 0% French corpo tax rate that nobody ever mentions...

Except they can and will. Bring in the centre of Europe is a huge advantage for logistics and shipping.

Piliger · 07-06-2014 09:30PM

emo72 wrote: »

dont you just love the EU? all the horrible **** we have to opt in. and the good **** we have to opt out. **** off EU

Best thing Ireland ever did was to get into this great EU.

scallywaggles · 07-06-2014 09:33PM

Piliger wrote: »

Except they can and will. Bring in the centre of Europe is a huge advantage for logistics and shipping.

Majority are s/w and service companies now, little shipping and logistics needed. Ireland also has an abundant supply of other non-corpo tax related benefits that they give to companies so there is more to it than just the 12.5%.

Hootanany · 07-06-2014 09:34PM

Bubbaclaus wrote: »

What??

The Irish economy would be ****ed and the Irish people would be stuck emigrating thanks to a 20% unemployment rate if the multinationals here suddenly became forced to pay more tax.

But we are emigrating in droves.

Akrasia · 07-06-2014 09:37PM

its all about the transfer pricing.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Transfer_pricing

awec · 07-06-2014 09:39PM

Other EU leaders really hate our corp tax structures because it brings money in to Ireland instead of their countries and makes Ireland an attractive prospect when it otherwise wouldn't be able to compete.

My name is URL · 07-06-2014 09:42PM

Piliger wrote: »

What are you talking about ? There is no evidence whatsoever that Ireland has broken any EU Tax Regulations.

How do you know what evidence does not exist? The EC obviously has reason to suspect that regulations may not have been followed.. hence the investigation.

This is all a big blowhard attempt to intimidate Ireland into agreeing to raise our taxes to match those in Germany and France.

Doesn't France have a lower effective tax rate than we do? That's what Enda Kenny has time and time again claimed anyway. Has he been talking through his hole all this time?!

Anyway, from the article -

The commission is not questioning this country's 12.5pc corporation tax rate

So that kind of blows your conspiracy theory out of the water.

jobeenfitz · 07-06-2014 09:44PM

There are loads of big companies paying feck all taxes around the world by laundering their profits through Ireland(and other countries) by just having a head office here.

I don't want them gone but there is two sides to this story.

How many people whinged when Bono an co. moved their biz to save tax.

The less tax these big corporations pay the more the workers will have to pay.

Its not all about putting on the green jersey and singing the soldiers song.

Bubbaclaus · 07-06-2014 11:01PM

Hootanany wrote: »

But we are emigrating in droves.

And you would like to double or maybe even treble that?

Ireland's CT regime is a massive benefit to our economy. I really don't understand why Irish people criticize it. It is a good thing for us.

tayto lover · 07-06-2014 11:05PM

If I employ a few lads can I get a reduced road tax on the auld Merc?

padma · 07-06-2014 11:10PM

Social welfare for big business.

Aidric · 07-06-2014 11:13PM

My name is URL wrote: »

Doesn't France have a lower effective tax rate than we do? That's what Enda Kenny has time and time again claimed anyway. Has he been talking through his hole all this time?!

Effective CT rate of 8.2% according to a recent PWC study.

DanWall · 07-06-2014 11:14PM

Why does the EU not enforce us to stop the vehicle registration tax? because there is no money in it for them

yr one · 07-06-2014 11:20PM

All Europe wants is Ireland to share the multi nationals, they think it's too much for one country and they would rather see them spread through out Europe paying higher taxes.

The jobs and chain effect that multi nationals have in Ireland will cause another collapse, thousands of people are hired directly and indirect by these businesses, fair enough I would like to see them in the correct tax bracket, but if that means jeopardising their future in Ireland I could live with it.

I know approx 12 people who work for these businesses, where would they work if it were to leave Ireland??

Looks like Revenue are in a spot of bother

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