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796 children buried in Septic Tank in Galway - ### Mod Warning in 1st Post

12467…66

Comments

  • #92
    RobertKK
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 33,772 ✭✭✭✭RobertKK


    bumper234 wrote: »
    A bit different to what happened to the 800 i think.

    Not really, in that one unnatural death is one too many, we had 115 during a boom times, one would expect a higher mortality rate in the past when mortality in society was higher in general and poverty was far more common.

    The story about the dead talks of neglect but that some died of measles, pneumonia and TB. How many is the question, TB was a huge problem back then, there was no vaccine for measles and anyone can get pneumonia.
    There needs to be an investigation and the truth to be aired, how many of these deaths were unnatural and how many of them were from very poor care.


  • #93
    RobertKK
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 33,772 ✭✭✭✭RobertKK


    shruikan2553 wrote: »
    We can't condemn 800 deaths when 115 died due to the state? Both can from disadvantaged backgrounds but I don't see many drugs and suicides being involved in Tuam.

    That is twisting what I posted.

    I was talking about the government being quiet, unless the 'we' you talk about is the government?


  • #94
    the culture of deference
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 2,196 ✭✭✭the culture of deference


    Records indicate that the former Tuam workhouse's septic tank was converted specifically to serve as the body disposal site for the orphanage.

    http://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/local-national/republic-of-ireland/mass-grave-of-796-babies-found-in-septic-tank-at-former-catholic-church-orphanage-in-tuam-galway-30327483.html


    same old same old

    The Irish government has declined to comment. The Republic of Ireland has already published four major investigations into child abuse and its cover-up in Catholic parishes and a network of children's industrial schools, the last of which closed in the 1990s.


    FOUR MAJOR investigations, and people still support the church. Madness


  • #95
    bumper234
    Closed Accounts Posts: 10,250 ✭✭✭✭bumper234


    RobertKK wrote: »
    That is twisting what I posted.

    I was talking about the government being quiet, unless the 'we' you talk about is the government?

    Hardly being quiet when they have only just received the report, Should they just throw it straight out there or maybe read it first?


  • #96
    shruikan2553
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,113 ✭✭✭shruikan2553


    Plazaman wrote: »
    What? Are you saying the State had no part to play? If I remember correctly Patrick Galvins book, Song for a Raggy Boy, documented a incident of a young boy escaping from one of the workhouses to a Garda Station and outlining the physical and sexual abuse to the Guard only to be dragged back to the same place by him. Just sayin there more ba5tards hangin round back then than just priests and nuns.

    The church was in charge of the schools and taught from a very young age that these people were less than human. The children were told they would be put beside them if they didn't behave.
    Then we get to the past where nobody told the church how to run these places. Everything they did was of their own decisions.
    Society and the state do bare some blame but the vast majority of it lies with the people who committed the actions themselves. Society and the state did not tell them to do it. Seeing how some people react to this I would not be surprised if some people would have been all for this back then without needing any interference but there are assholes everywhere. The problem is when they have power over people.


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  • #97
    RobertKK
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 33,772 ✭✭✭✭RobertKK


    the culture of deference wrote: »
    Records indicate that the former Tuam workhouse's septic tank was converted specifically to serve as the body disposal site for the orphanage.

    http://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/local-national/republic-of-ireland/mass-grave-of-796-babies-found-in-septic-tank-at-former-catholic-church-orphanage-in-tuam-galway-30327483.html


    same old same old

    The Irish government has declined to comment. The Republic of Ireland has already published four major investigations into child abuse and its cover-up in Catholic parishes and a network of children's industrial schools, the last of which closed in the 1990s.


    FOUR MAJOR investigations, and people still support the church. Madness

    Where in the teachings of the church does it say abuse is right?

    I think you will find it is people who committed and allowed wrong to happen that are responsible, not Jesus Christ...to blame the church is to excuse the actual people who did wrong. The church is it's people, not all people committed the wrongs.


  • #98
    RobertKK
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 33,772 ✭✭✭✭RobertKK


    bumper234 wrote: »
    Hardly being quiet when they have only just received the report, Should they just throw it straight out there or maybe read it first?

    Are they slow readers?

    I see a lot of people here have already made up their minds...


  • #99
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    Amazed it took this long to be reported. There was a thread about it in the County Galway forum on the 25th of May, which I believe was when the Irish Daily Mail/Galway Advertiser first reported it.

    It is still utterly shocking how it took so long for the Irish media to report on it, especially since the International Media caught it quicker. And it happened. right. on. our. front. door.

    You have to wonder- had it happened in or around Dublin, would RTE/the other news outlets have made it a bigger deal? Happened in a small town in the West of Ireland, nobody cares.


  • #100
    RobertKK
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 33,772 ✭✭✭✭RobertKK


    Deleted User wrote: »
    Amazed it took this long to be reported. There was a thread about it in the County Galway forum on the 25th of May, which I believe was when the Irish Daily Mail/Galway Advertiser first reported it.

    It is still utterly shocking how it took so long for the Irish media to report on it, especially since the International Media caught it quicker. And it happened. right. on. our. front. door.

    You have to wonder- had it happened in or around Dublin, would RTE/the other news outlets have made it a bigger deal? Happened in a small town in the West of Ireland, nobody cares.

    1995 when it first came to light...
    The skeletons of the children were discovered by two boys who were playing in a field in 1995.

    http://www.thejournal.ie/800-babies-tuam-home-1497779-Jun2014/


  • #101
    zl1whqvjs75cdy
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,042 ✭✭✭zl1whqvjs75cdy


    There is very little reporting of the story in the Times/Indo from what I can see. The front page story seems to Noonan's cancer scare. Now fair play to the man and I'm glad he's ok but I would have thought the death of 800 kids in the care of the church was the bigger story. Very few of my (non boards) work colleagues seem to know about it either.


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  • #102
    steddyeddy
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 27,565 ✭✭✭✭steddyeddy


    Delighted this is getting international attention. Hopefully some diplomat will ring up the minister for justice and tell them killing babies is illegal.


  • #103
    the culture of deference
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 2,196 ✭✭✭the culture of deference


    RobertKK wrote: »
    1995 when it first came to light...



    http://www.thejournal.ie/800-babies-tuam-home-1497779-Jun2014/

    Records suggest the home's septic tank was converted especially for the purpose of disposing of bodies, and bones were first found in 1975 when cement covering the tank was pulled away.


  • #104
    RobertKK
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 33,772 ✭✭✭✭RobertKK


    steddyeddy wrote: »
    Delighted this is getting international attention. Hopefully some diplomat will ring up the minister for justice and tell them killing babies is illegal.

    She as minister for children voted for the abortion legislation, are they only suppose to care if you can see the life in question?


  • #105
    Spring Onion
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,087 ✭✭✭Spring Onion


    RobertKK wrote: »
    1995 when it first came to light...

    My understanding from talking to a local is that they knew there were some skeletal remains in 1995 but not 800 babies.

    Petition to investigate here;

    https://secure.avaaz.org/en/petition/Frances_Fitzgerald_Irish_Minister_for_Justice_and_Equality_A_full_Gardai_investigation_into_the_mass_grave_in_Tuam_Co_Ga/?fbss

    Please support.


  • #106
    steddyeddy
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 27,565 ✭✭✭✭steddyeddy


    I take it the gaurds will investigate this? Because if they don't they are complicit too.


  • #107
    bumper234
    Closed Accounts Posts: 10,250 ✭✭✭✭bumper234


    RobertKK wrote: »
    1995 when it first came to light...



    http://www.thejournal.ie/800-babies-tuam-home-1497779-Jun2014/

    Easier to cover up back then when the Catholic church had it's boot on the throat of this country.


  • #108
    Resonator75
    Closed Accounts Posts: 258 ✭✭Resonator75


    the culture of deference wrote: »
    Records suggest the home's septic tank was converted especially for the purpose of disposing of bodies, and bones were first found in 1975 when cement covering the tank was pulled away.


    Now that has horrific connotations .This was clearly a planned course of action going into the future.

    Akin to Nazi atrocities, i.e. the efficient (for them) disposal of bodies.

    Who signed off on this? Who made the decisions? Why?

    All dead and unaccountable now now doubt.


  • #109
    dharma200
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 998 ✭✭✭dharma200


    RobertKK wrote: »
    She as minister for children voted for the abortion legislation, are they only suppose to care if you can see the life in question?

    No, i think that particular legislation is an attempt to stop women from dying.
    I would say there has been an uptake of around zero women who are seeking elective terminations...
    Also , there is a difference to letting disabled babies starve to death, or terminating a foetus in the womb. duh


  • #110
    RobertKK
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 33,772 ✭✭✭✭RobertKK


    the culture of deference wrote: »
    Records suggest the home's septic tank was converted especially for the purpose of disposing of bodies, and bones were first found in 1975 when cement covering the tank was pulled away.

    I wonder who the builders were.


  • #111
    humanji
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 19,976 ✭✭✭✭humanji


    RobertKK wrote: »
    She as minister for children voted for the abortion legislation, are they only suppose to care if you can see the life in question?
    Mod: Don't start! That's not what this thread is about.


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  • #112
    RobertKK
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 33,772 ✭✭✭✭RobertKK


    bumper234 wrote: »
    Easier to cover up back then when the Catholic church had it's boot on the throat of this country.

    Really? We knew back then that Annie Murphy was the former bishop's Casey's trocaire box.


  • #113
    steddyeddy
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 27,565 ✭✭✭✭steddyeddy


    RobertKK wrote: »
    She as minister for children voted for the abortion legislation, are they only suppose to care if you can see the life in question?

    Considering the Catholic church are after carrying out late stage abortions of 800 children they don't have a leg to stand on in the issue.


  • #114
    nelly17
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,210 ✭✭✭nelly17


    snaphook wrote: »
    This is one of the most significant discoveries in the history of the state.

    Kudos to historian Catherine Corless on her work here.
    It is our national holocaust.

    Sadly this could be the tip of the Iceberg - who knows what we are still to discover throughout the country


  • #115
    josip
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 14,760 ✭✭✭✭josip


    We need an Irish Simon Wiesenthal


  • #116
    Resonator75
    Closed Accounts Posts: 258 ✭✭Resonator75


    nelly17 wrote: »
    Sadly this could be the tip of the Iceberg - who knows what we are still to discover throughout the country


    Stephen Kings darkest work has nothing on what may lie hidden in our soil.


  • #117
    Spring Onion
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,087 ✭✭✭Spring Onion


    What I don't understand is this - does anyone in the Catholic church have any cop on? I am not including that vile man Sean Brady in that question.
    But the rest of them know that now is the time to come clean about all their "crimes" and try to salvage something from the ruins of their organisation. There must be many people in the church hierarchy that knew they had children buried in mass graves with no recognition - surely that kept them awake at night? Why didn't they admit it and apologise and then fix it?
    Are they dumb animals or what?


  • #118
    Irish Halo
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,500 ✭✭✭Irish Halo


    SEPT 23 1989 wrote: »
    I would call for an international team of experts who have dealt with genocide and mass graves to come over and investigate these atrocities fully.
    We actually have this expertise in Ireland too, I know one researcher who gets calls to go abroad (Australia, Germany) and look at very similar stiff to this i.e. old but not ancient deaths/graves.


  • #119
    RobertKK
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 33,772 ✭✭✭✭RobertKK


    Spring Onion wrote: »
    What I don't understand is this - does anyone in the Catholic church have any cop on? I am not including that vile man Sean Brady in that question.
    But the rest of them know that now is the time to come clean about all their "crimes" and try to salvage something from the ruins of their organisation. There must be many people in the church hierarchy that knew they had children buried in mass graves with no recognition - surely that kept them awake at night? Why didn't they admit it and apologise and then fix it?
    Are they dumb animals or what?
    Archbishop Diarmuid Martin of the Dublin Archdiocese said there should either be a public inquiry into “outstanding issues of concern” at the mother and baby homes or else, where appropriate, a social history project to get an accurate picture of what happened at the homes.

    http://www.thejournal.ie/800-babies-tuam-home-1497779-Jun2014/

    That is the best that can be done, really, along with a proper burial. We don't know the truth to accuse others of knowing.


  • #120
    iDave
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,750 ✭✭✭iDave


    Just so I'm clear on this and not blinded by the emotion of it but can someone confirm if the Catholic Church or a Catholic institution is directly responsible for these deaths? Is there any other scenario that could absolve the church?


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  • #121
    steddyeddy
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 27,565 ✭✭✭✭steddyeddy


    iDave wrote: »
    Just so I'm clear on this and not blinded by the emotion of it but can someone confirm if the Catholic Church or a Catholic institution is directly responsible for these deaths? Is there any other scenario that could absolve the church?

    And the gaurds and the attitudes towards single mothers in this country.


This discussion has been closed.
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