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Woman uploads abortion video - goes viral

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Comments

  • #632
    Malari
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 18,150 ✭✭✭✭Malari


    ryan101 wrote: »
    No, that would involve complete and deliberate knowledge of what their action is.

    That's not the first time you've referred to this. Do you think women who abort don't actually know what is happening?!


  • #633
    steddyeddy
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 27,565 ✭✭✭✭steddyeddy


    Morag wrote: »
    How so?

    The same posters thanking the same posters again and again. It stinks of dogma and precludes a rational argument.


  • #634
    gctest50
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,534 ✭✭✭gctest50


    ryan101 wrote: »
    No, that would involve complete and deliberate knowledge of what their action is......

    So now women who get abortion are all a bit slow or something ?


  • #635
    Turtwig
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 26,578 ✭✭✭✭Turtwig


    Muise... wrote: »
    Well ryan did say he thought there was a case for some women to be punished for it. That's a step beyond private conscience.

    He did but he also drew the distinction firmly on the woman in the OP. And, given his position and I can kind of understand that.
    Morag wrote: »
    It's not as the anti abortion lobby in this country tries to paint themselves as being the majority and the moral majority and they are not.

    But them promoting this has mean people who are pro choice and those of us who have had abortions have been frankly afraid to speak up.

    So that impression needs to be challenged.

    If Ryan thinks something is wrong then they shouldn't do it.

    Most people (again majorities heh) know Youth Defence et al. are full of sh*t. Why are you doing it in this thread. It's sort of soapboxing in a way isn't it? Ryan's the one you're in discussion with. Not the whole of Ireland.Why not just put it in a sig or something. No need to include vague empty rhetoric replies to someone who's opposing your philosophy.


  • #636
    ryan101
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,671 ✭✭✭ryan101


    gctest50 wrote: »
    So now women who get abortion are all a bit slow or something ?

    No, no one knows everything. It doesn't make someone 'slow'


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  • #637
    ryan101
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,671 ✭✭✭ryan101


    Malari wrote: »
    That's not the first time you've referred to this. Do you think women who abort don't actually know what is happening?!

    I would like to think a lot of them don't believe / realise they are killing another human life.


  • #638
    Boombastic
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,496 ✭✭✭Boombastic


    ryan101 wrote: »
    No, no one knows everything. It doesn't make someone 'slow'

    abortion is premeditated and deliberate


  • #639
    Muise...
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,512 ✭✭✭Muise...


    Turtwig wrote: »
    He did but he also drew the distinction firmly on the woman in the OP. And, given his position and I can kind of understand that.


    Most people (again majorities heh) know Youth Defence et al. are full of sh*t. Why are you doing it in this thread. It's sort of soapboxing in a way isn't it? Ryan's the one you're in discussion with. Not the whole of Ireland.Why not just put it in a sig or something. No need to include in a vague empty rhetoric replies to someone who's opposing your philosophy.

    For many women, it is not a philosophy, but a real world issue. YD have an opinion; as a result, thousands of women have a situation. Do you see why that might be galling?


  • #640
    steddyeddy
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 27,565 ✭✭✭✭steddyeddy


    As I said guys I'm pro choice and unashamedly have helped friends of mine in trouble get over to England. However some of the flaming by both sides of this argument is a bit much for me so I'll keep out.


  • #641
    Czarcasm
    Closed Accounts Posts: 10,076 ✭✭✭✭Czarcasm


    Muise... wrote: »
    If you read Morag's previous posts on the subject, you would realise that she has far more understanding than you ever will.


    I don't do pissing contests on the internet, but if you re-read my post (properly this time!), you'll see I was referring to the woman in the video, not Morag.

    The video Morag posted gave a much better understanding of women that they shouldn't just be seen as baby makers, biological incubation vessels, that they aren't all just self-interested self-promoters, that there is more to a woman than just making a name for herself because she looked relaxed while she shot a sultana sized clot from her vagina. I've seen women do that with ping pong balls, and they don't get accolades for it.

    You consider her brave for what she did, she's about as "brave" as the girl that sucked a tampon and thought it was a good idea to put that on youtube too.

    That video is as effective as an educational and informative tool about abortion, as a porn
    starlet's piece to camera before she gets DP'd, is an effective educational and informative tool about sex.


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  • #642
    ryan101
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,671 ✭✭✭ryan101


    Boombastic wrote: »
    abortion is premeditated and deliberate

    It might be, but they might not believe/consider they are taking another human life.


  • #643
    ryan101
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,671 ✭✭✭ryan101


    steddyeddy wrote: »
    However some of the flaming by both sides of this argument is a bit much for me so I'll keep out.

    I wish you wouldn't, there is nothing to be gained by handing over the discussion to the people flaming one another.


  • #644
    Chattastrophe!
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,284 ✭✭✭Chattastrophe!


    ryan101 wrote: »
    I would like to think a lot of them don't believe / realise they are killing another human life.

    No, they're preventing the creation of another human life.

    Big difference.


  • #645
    ryan101
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,671 ✭✭✭ryan101


    Chattastrophe! wrote: »
    No, they're prevention the creation of another human life.

    Big difference.

    When would you say human life is created ?


  • #646
    Dan_Solo
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 10,087 ✭✭✭✭Dan_Solo


    ryan101 wrote: »
    It might be, but they might not believe/consider they are taking another human life.
    Or they have considered it and think it's false.


  • #647
    Turtwig
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 26,578 ✭✭✭✭Turtwig


    Muise... wrote: »
    For many women, it is not a philosophy, but a real world issue. YD have an opinion; as a result, thousands of women have a situation. Do you see why that might be galling?

    Just because you don't like their philosophy or it disgusts you doesn't mean it's not a philosophy. Yes, lives are affected, but can you not see the issue here? Both sides see the rights and lives of others through a different philosophy. You say women are in a situation. They say babies are in a situation. Pointing out vague rhetorics and emotive slants isn't going to help resolve that.

    Thousands of women are pro-life. Pointing out polls and majorities to them isn't exactly going to change their position.


  • #648
    Muise...
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,512 ✭✭✭Muise...


    Czarcasm wrote: »
    I don't do pissing contests on the internet, but if you re-read my post (properly this time!), you'll see I was referring to the woman in the video, not Morag.

    The video Morag posted gave a much better understanding of women that they shouldn't just be seen as baby makers, biological incubation vessels, that they aren't all just self-interested self-promoters, that there is more to a woman than just making a name for herself because she looked relaxed while she shot a sultana sized clot from her vagina. I've seen women do that with ping pong balls, and they don't get accolades for it.

    You consider her brave for what she did, she's about as "brave" as the girl that sucked a tampon and thought it was a good idea to put that on youtube too.

    That video is as effective as an educational and informative tool about abortion, as a porn starlets
    starlet's piece to camera before she gets DP'd, is an effective educational and informative tool about sex.

    If you had not used the word 'you' - I would not have thought you were addressing Morag.

    I still think the video-maker is brave, no matter what I make of her video.

    Did you come up with those analogues for shock value? Like, oh, I don't know, the people you are sneering at?

    Also, you don't do pissing contests on the internet? LOL!


  • #649
    Morag
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,427 ✭✭✭Morag


    Czarcasm wrote: »
    You consider her brave for what she did

    I do think it takes a certain amount of balls to put your name and face out there when you live in a country like the USA were drs get shot, clinics get bombed and some unstable person may decided to shoot her.

    However I agree that it's not a good video in terms of being informative and educational.


  • #650
    Muise...
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,512 ✭✭✭Muise...


    Turtwig wrote: »
    Just because you don't like their philosophy or it disgusts you doesn't mean it's not a philosophy. Yes, lives are affected, but can you not see the issue here? Both sides see the rights and lives of others through a different philosophy. You say women are in a situation. They say babies are in a situation. Pointing out vague rhetorics and emotive slants isn't going to help resolve that.

    Thousands of women are pro-life. Pointing out polls and majorities to them isn't exactly going to change their position.

    I didn't say it's not a philosophy; I said that for women, it is a bit more of a real-world issue.

    What is the issue that I am not seeing? That it's an impossible argument?


  • #651
    ryan101
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,671 ✭✭✭ryan101


    Muise... wrote: »
    I didn't say it's not a philosophy; I said that for women, it is a bit more of a real-world issue.

    It's also a real world issue for the child


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  • #652
    gctest50
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,534 ✭✭✭gctest50


    Boombastic wrote: »
    abortion is premeditated and deliberate

    Its not murder though

    murder is illegal

    abortion is legal ( in a nearby country )


  • #653
    Tasden
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,166 ✭✭✭Tasden


    gctest50 wrote: »
    Its not murder though

    murder is illegal

    abortion is legal ( in a nearby country )

    Capital punishment is legal in some countries. I'd still call it murder


  • #654
    Morag
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,427 ✭✭✭Morag


    http://worldabortionlaws.com/map/

    It's interesting to compare with other countries.


  • #655
    Dan_Solo
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 10,087 ✭✭✭✭Dan_Solo


    ryan101 wrote: »
    It's also a real world issue for the child
    There is no child.


  • #656
    ryan101
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,671 ✭✭✭ryan101


    Dan_Solo wrote: »
    There is no child.

    When is a child created ?


  • #657
    Jerrica
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,813 ✭✭✭Jerrica


    ryan101 wrote: »
    When is a child created ?

    You're asking an unanswerable question, there is no one defined right or wrong answer, it is entirely based on opinion.


  • #658
    ryan101
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,671 ✭✭✭ryan101


    Jerrica wrote: »
    You're asking an unanswerable question, there is no one defined right or wrong answer.

    There is for the child


  • #659
    Muise...
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,512 ✭✭✭Muise...


    ryan101 wrote: »
    When is a child created ?

    When is a teenager created, or an adult, or a geriatric? It's a continuum, not a wave of a magic wand.


  • #660
    ryan101
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,671 ✭✭✭ryan101


    Muise... wrote: »
    When is a teenager created, or an adult, or a geriatric? It's a continuum, not a wave of a magic wand.

    A human life has a beginning


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  • #661
    Muise...
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,512 ✭✭✭Muise...


    ryan101 wrote: »
    Human life has a beginning

    And the beginning is not a child. "Child" is a phase on the continuum of human life.


This discussion has been closed.
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