Rapha - did I miss something?

omri · 13-03-2014 10:39PM

Ok, I'm gonna break the silence - which of the rapha stuff is a must have - wife loves their stuff - lobbying for an early birthday present in progress... might aswell..

mossym · 13-03-2014 10:39PM

Brian? wrote: »

I think it's funny because there really is nothing unique about Rapha gear.

does it really matter? all that matters is can you create the image of uniqueness in the customers mind. everything is branding. Skoda, VW, Audi. does the difference in value come from the few different components, or the perceived value people place on it. the same thing happens everywhere.

in this case, most people who have tried both say rapha gear is as good as assos. both are similarly priced. in that case, are rapha doing something wrong, or are they at the right price point for the quality of their goods. even if they are not unique, they appear to be priced at the same level of their equivalents, which would appear to be fair.

Before i'm accused of being a rapha fanboy, i own none of their gear, save a hat which i bought through here. i wouldn't pay their asking for their shorts, but neither would i pay for assos. that said, i've no issue with their pricing, premium goods are always exponentially, not linearly more expensive than their cheaper equivalents.

Raam · 13-03-2014 10:40PM

omri wrote: »

Ok, I'm gonna break the silence - which of the rapha stuff is a must have - wife loves their stuff - lobbying for an early birthday present in progress... might aswell..

The shoe trees. Where would you be without them?
http://www.rapha.cc/eu/en/shop/shoe-trees/product/STR01

STR01-RaphaShoeTree2.jpg_MEDIUM

Raam · 13-03-2014 10:42PM

mossym wrote: »

in this case, most people who have tried both say rapha gear is as good as assos.

I think Rapha is tailored well, but as cycling kit, nothing beats Assos for me. It definitely trumps Rapha.

omri · 13-03-2014 10:43PM

Raam wrote: »

The shoe trees. Where would you be without them?
http://www.rapha.cc/eu/en/shop/shoe-trees/product/STR01

too cheap.. need a price tag, that will make a statement.

Raam · 13-03-2014 10:44PM

omri wrote: »

too cheap.. need a price tag, that will make a statement.

Do you want urban wear or road bike wear?

mossym · 13-03-2014 10:45PM

Raam wrote: »

I think Rapha is tailored well, but as cycling kit, nothing beats Assos for me. It definitely trumps Rapha.

haven't tried either, but based that on the previous posters in the thread who seemed to rank them close.

omri · 13-03-2014 10:46PM

Raam wrote: »

Do you want urban wear or road bike wear?

Road bike - while in urban enviroment I just drive my car.

ROK ON · 13-03-2014 10:52PM

omri wrote: »

Road bike - while in urban enviroment I just drive my car.

The shoes look likenthey would make a statement.

The White leather gloves.
A combo set - arm warmers/leg warmers/oversocks/cap.
The new pink jersey.
The White gilet.

Raam · 13-03-2014 10:52PM

omri wrote: »

Road bike - while in urban enviroment I just drive my car.

For you, the women's base layer.
http://www.rapha.cc/eu/en/shop/women%27s-base-layer/product/WBL01

It's got sex appeal.

WBL01-Loc-SS14-03.jpg_MEDIUM

Bristolscale7 · 13-03-2014 11:52PM

Rapha, for some reason, brings to mind Positively 4th Street.

Brian? · 14-03-2014 08:29AM

mossym wrote: »

does it really matter? all that matters is can you create the image of uniqueness in the customers mind. everything is branding. Skoda, VW, Audi. does the difference in value come from the few different components, or the perceived value people place on it. the same thing happens everywhere.

in this case, most people who have tried both say rapha gear is as good as assos. both are similarly priced. in that case, are rapha doing something wrong, or are they at the right price point for the quality of their goods. even if they are not unique, they appear to be priced at the same level of their equivalents, which would appear to be fair.

Before i'm accused of being a rapha fanboy, i own none of their gear, save a hat which i bought through here. i wouldn't pay their asking for their shorts, but neither would i pay for assos. that said, i've no issue with their pricing, premium goods are always exponentially, not linearly more expensive than their cheaper equivalents.

I never said Rapha were doing anything wrong. They're very good at what they do and if people buy into it then it's their owns business.

ednwireland · 14-03-2014 09:15AM

omri wrote: »

€150...seriously... http://www.rapha.cc/eu/en/shop/team-sky-gt-gloves/product/GTG05

As worn by the riders and staff of the world’s leading cycling team.

current uci rankings http://www.uciworldtour.com/templates/BUILTIN-NOFRAMES/Template3/layout.asp?MenuId=MTY3Mzc&LangId=1

Rank Prev. Team (Code) Country Points
1 - ORICA GREENEDGE (OGE) AUS 145
2 - BMC RACING TEAM (BMC) USA 88
3 - TEAM SKY (SKY) GBR 86

wonder what they are measuring that by ?

Harrybelafonte · 14-03-2014 09:24AM

Brian? wrote: »

I never said Rapha were doing anything wrong. They're very good at what they do and if people buy into it then it's their owns business.

You imply it's a scam though, no?

Brian? · 14-03-2014 10:06AM

Harrybelafonte wrote: »

You imply it's a scam though, no?

Not at all. It's just good marketing. If it was a scam the gear would be crap, it's very good gear though.

I just think selling it as a "lifestyle choice" is a bit of nonsense.

Lumen · 14-03-2014 10:23AM

I went looking for bib shorts. They're with the trousers. That's what makes the Rapha brand wanky.

Just look at the category list. "Skincare" FFS.

BY CATEGORY
New Arrivals
Jackets
Jerseys
Base Layers
Shirts & T-shirts
Shorts & Trousers
Hats & Caps
Gloves
Footwear
Accessories
Skincare
Prints & Publications
Gift Vouchers
Bundles
Clearance
Travel

Ole Rodrigo · 14-03-2014 10:28AM

I agree, a lot of the lifestyle fluff is awful ( although some of the continental videos are good to watch, even if they are just long adverts ).

dave_o_brien · 14-03-2014 10:41AM

Relax, most people are only wearing rapha sarcastically. Besides, it's older gear, they've had it for years, got in a sale you never heard of before the brand got as big as they are now.

mossym · 14-03-2014 10:43AM

Brian? wrote: »

I just think selling it as a "lifestyle choice" is a bit of nonsense.

Lumen wrote: »

I went looking for bib shorts. They're with the trousers. That's what makes the Rapha brand wanky.

Just look at the category list. "Skincare" FFS.

i can 100% see where that would annoy people. to me though, that says they are doing a good job with their branding. you can try and have a brand that is acceptable to all, but the downside is that it comes across as nothing special(think of all the brands, not just cycling related, where you've no real issue with their stuff but then their range is all a bit blahhhh). or you can have a really strong brand, build strong brand loyalty with customers, drive a legion of brand advocates, but in most cases that is achieved because those that connect with the brand are differentiated in some ways by those that don't. so if you buy into the rapha lifestyle branding, you become a brand advocate, which is a very powerful tool, and you likely become a frequent and repeat customer.

who do you think they want more, those that don't like the lifestyle portion but show up for their 50% off sale to buy a pair of shorts, or those that buy 3 tubs of skincare product on each of their frequent purchases? I think they' be more than happy with those that don't buy their products thinking them wanky, it further drives them into the position of a unique brand rather than mass market appeal

apologies if i am banging on about this, but my interest lies in effective marketing and branding, not anything to do with Rapha specifically. they're just a good case study.

doozerie · 14-03-2014 11:32AM

Brian? wrote:

I think it's funny because there really is nothing unique about Rapha gear.

It has been a while since I’ve checked in other cycling brands but last time I did I couldn’t find any that made a range of good quality merino base layers. And qood quality merino (well, “Sportswool”, to be precise) jerseys were rare too - I think a few brands do those now but I’m not sure of their quality.

Rapha were by no means the first to use merino in high activity kit, it has been in use for a long time for outdoor wear, but I’m not aware of many cycling kit manufacturers using it even now. Whether Rapha are unique is debatable but the quality of the merino they use is, in my experience, very good and that’s at least rare if not actually unique.

Mind you, one of their claimed unique selling points used to be that they made their kit in the UK and that fact almost certainly contributed to their early success. I believe though that they outsourced their manufacturing to China or Taiwan several years back now, certainly any of the kit I have from them was made in one or other of those places, so they’ve lost that element of their “exclusivity” (plus there are newer brands that claim to make kit in the UK, e.g. Shutt VR, so whatever about before it’s certainly no longer a unique selling point). Despite their merino kit being made in a country which some in the clothing industry convincingly claim produces inferior and compromised merino wool, the Rapha merino kit that I have seems of very good quality so they seem to be maintaining good quality in their kit which, in the circumstances, is perhaps even more rare.

At the end of the day though, it hardly matters one way or the other. Lots of cycling clothing manufacturers make some excellent kit (yes, even Pearl Izumi) and lots make rubbish kit instead or as well. Sometimes you get what you pay for, sometimes you don’t, and that applies at both ends of the price range. If a jersey, for example, works well for a person then whether it cost them €2 or €200 doesn’t matter if they themselves consider it good value for money - the rest of us might sneer at them as being ridiculously cheap/extravagant but that’s our own issues coming to the surface, the person wearing the jersey shouldn’t care.

Besides, we’re already busy enough judging the colour (“yellow? D’ya think yer leader of de Tour de France, or wha’?”), the fit (“race fit? Pfft, d’ya think yer a pro, or wha’?”), the branding (“Sky? Did the repression of our ancestors mean nothing, blah, blah, ya bollix!”), etc., of the jersey to have time for the purchase price to be considered. It’s a wonder that we have any energy left to actually pedal our bikes.

rollingscone · 14-03-2014 11:34AM

mossym wrote: »

i can 100% see where that would annoy people. to me though, that says they are doing a good job with their branding. you can try and have a brand that is acceptable to all, but the downside is that it comes across as nothing special(think of all the brands, not just cycling related, where you've no real issue with their stuff but then their range is all a bit blahhhh). or you can have a really strong brand, build strong brand loyalty with customers, drive a legion of brand advocates, but in most cases that is achieved because those that connect with the brand are differentiated in some ways by those that don't. so if you buy into the rapha lifestyle branding, you become a brand advocate, which is a very powerful tool, and you likely become a frequent and repeat customer.

who do you think they want more, those that don't like the lifestyle portion but show up for their 50% off sale to buy a pair of shorts, or those that buy 3 tubs of skincare product on each of their frequent purchases? I think they' be more than happy with those that don't buy their products thinking them wanky, it further drives them into the position of a unique brand rather than mass market appeal

apologies if i am banging on about this, but my interest lies in effective marketing and branding, not anything to do with Rapha specifically. they're just a good case study.

In a sport where you can spend the price of a family holiday on a set of wheels and practice a beauty queen's regime of body hair management can we judge too much?

On the other hand I think the JVA stuff is a hilarious and worthwhile poke at the madness of it all. "Serviette" it's a french word.

mcgratheoin · 14-03-2014 12:17PM

dave_o_brien wrote: »

Relax, most people are only wearing rapha sarcastically. Besides, it's older gear, they've had it for years, got in a sale you never heard of before the brand got as big as they are now.

I wore Rapha once, but everyone else was doing it and I was young and impressionable. To be honest, it made me feel dirty and I only ever wore it once (when I say once, of course I actually mean for the duration of one season) before flushing it down the toilet and letting my natural style carry me against all the other designer-clad riders. Furthermore, it was clearly the UCI's fault for not policing the euro regulations sufficiently at the time. Now that I've freely admitted it in advance of a French court publishing pictures of me sipping a Rapha espresso, I should be hailed as a pioneer in the fight against poseurs in the sport.

PS Buy my book...

omri · 14-03-2014 12:34PM

Lumen wrote: »

Just look at the category list. "Skincare" FFS.

Are you one of these PROs that use mucoff as showergel and chain lube instead of nivea cream???

rollingscone · 14-03-2014 01:05PM

omri wrote: »

Are you one of these PROs that use mucoff as showergel and chain lube instead of nivea cream???

Such a Fred comment.

Every real Rapha rider goes until they are completely covered in nourishing skin healing mud...then they apply the muc off.

Highway_To_Hell · 14-03-2014 02:29PM

Not Rapha but I think Torm jerseys are really comfortable well made and at a reasonable price.

mossym · 14-03-2014 02:30PM

Highway_To_Hell wrote: »

Not Rapha but I think Torm jerseys are really comfortable well made and at a reasonable price.

yeah i have one of those, really like it

Lumen · 14-03-2014 04:14PM

omri wrote: »

Are you one of these PROs that use mucoff as showergel and chain lube instead of nivea cream???

"Instead of nivea cream" I use nothing, because I am a man.

Skin needs to be clean, moist or dry.

For cleaning I use a bar of Tesco value soap.
For moisting I use water that comes out of a tap.
For drying I use a towel.

Harrybelafonte · 14-03-2014 04:40PM

Lumen wrote: »

"Instead of nivea cream" I use nothing, because I am a man.

Skin needs to be clean, moist or dry.

For cleaning I use a bar of Tesco value soap.
For moisting I use water that comes out of a tap.
For drying I use a towel.

Some of us are a little more sensitive dermatoloigallally.

Lumen · 14-03-2014 04:46PM

Harrybelafonte wrote: »

Some of us are a little more sensitive dermatoloigallally.

Pinch Flat · 14-03-2014 04:52PM

Lumen wrote: »

Nothing ruins my day more than a dose of Mastitis after a long cycle....

Rapha - did I miss something?

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