Would you support the reintroduction of the death penalty?

Princess Consuela Bananahammock · 12-03-2014 12:30AM

olliesgirl55 wrote: »

I used to support the death penalty however I don't anymore. I think the sentences should be tougher and life sentences should mean whole natural life and not like 20 years.
Some criminals like child sex offenders should never be released back into society because they cannot be rehabilitated.

Someone else tried to pull this one off but failed miserably, so I'll give you the same chance to prove this.

Mr Williams wrote: »

EU handouts what are you talking about ? they took more off us than they ever gave us. Despite what politicians may say Ireland would be far better off outside the EU.

You're serious...?

http://eustructuralfunds.gov.ie/

Amirani · 12-03-2014 06:13AM

I'll just leave this here...

Death row inmate Glenn Ford released 30 years after wrongful conviction

http://gu.com/p/3nen4

Amirani · 12-03-2014 06:18AM

Glenn becomes the 144th death row inmate that was later found to be innocent over the past few decades: http://www.deathpenaltyinfo.org/innocence-list-those-freed-death-row

Shame on the supporters of death on here who would have enjoyed and wallowed in his death.

I Heart Internet · 12-03-2014 01:00PM

NiallSparky wrote: »

I'll just leave this here...

Death row inmate Glenn Ford released 30 years after wrongful conviction

http://gu.com/p/3nen4

Whether Glenn Ford was put to death or spent all his life in prison, a very grave injustice would have (and has) been done to him.

This injustice would have happened whether there was a death penalty or not. But at least, in this case, he hasn't already been killed so he, and the society that would have killed him, get a second chance.

The death penalty is always wrong, in all cases, everywhere. Even where the person is 110% guilty (who can know?) and positively asking to be killed.

OldNotWIse · 12-03-2014 01:03PM

Mr Williams wrote: »

If they are criminals then why cant they be put in a normal criminal jail ?

If they are animals why are they not kept in the zoo?

J_E · 12-03-2014 01:40PM

NiallSparky wrote: »

Glenn becomes the 144th death row inmate that was later found to be innocent over the past few decades: http://www.deathpenaltyinfo.org/innocence-list-those-freed-death-row

Shame on the supporters of death on here who would have enjoyed and wallowed in his death.

Exactly... A lot of people here might enjoy venting their little revenge fantasies on unsuspecting targets but there are real people with lives being thrown around here, and the jury isn't always fair or right.

sinead88 · 15-03-2014 02:40AM

Absolutely not. The death penalty is barbaric. I think that treatment of offenders needs to be based on reformation or at least justice, rather than revenge seeking. Add to that the fact that the death penalty has been proven not to act as a deterrent to crime, and that it's more expensive, given the lengthy appeals process, to put someone to death rather than incarcerate them for life, and there is no logical or ethical reason for the death penalty to be considered viable.

asteroth · 15-03-2014 03:02AM

end of the road wrote: »

really? so if we left the EU how exactly would we fund ourselves? what do we have that other countries don't? oh yes thats right nothing, both ourselves and britain have lost everything that we could use to fund ourselves in a world outside the EU, i agree its far from perfect but better in then out.

really? their are actual problems within the EU, this isn't one of them, countries outside the EU also put sex offenders away from the other prisoners, because their laws require it and the prisons have a duty of care to the prisoners, you don't like that and thats fine but its not going to change so i suggest you get over it

How do other countries in the world that are not in the EU "fund" themselves? How did Austria or Denmark or Portugal survive prior to EU membership? So Norway has a load of oil, fine. What has Iceland got that makes them so able to put food in their mouths without being in the EU?
Were Malta and Cyprus dying of starvation and eating rats before they joined the EU?

Mr Williams · 16-03-2014 12:32AM

asteroth wrote: »

How do other countries in the world that are not in the EU "fund" themselves? How did Austria or Denmark or Portugal survive prior to EU membership? So Norway has a load of oil, fine. What has Iceland got that makes them so able to put food in their mouths without being in the EU?
Were Malta and Cyprus dying of starvation and eating rats before they joined the EU?

Good point the EU has raped us economically yet we still have clowns willing to defend it. By their logic Ireland would not even exist without the EU:rolleyes:

Mr Williams · 16-03-2014 12:34AM

sinead88 wrote: »

Absolutely not. The death penalty is barbaric. I think that treatment of offenders needs to be based on reformation or at least justice, rather than revenge seeking. Add to that the fact that the death penalty has been proven not to act as a deterrent to crime, and that it's more expensive, given the lengthy appeals process, to put someone to death rather than incarcerate them for life, and there is no logical or ethical reason for the death penalty to be considered viable.

Giving someone a lethal injection is not barbaric. It would be too good for a child killer.

Mr Williams · 16-03-2014 12:38AM

NiallSparky wrote: »

I'll just leave this here...

Death row inmate Glenn Ford released 30 years after wrongful conviction

http://gu.com/p/3nen4

I knew some bright spark would bring up this story. I'm talking about sex beasts not murderers. If someone is convicted of rape on multiple occasions what is the chances they are innocent ?

Mr Williams · 16-03-2014 12:41AM

OldNotWIse wrote: »

If they are animals why are they not kept in the zoo?

Thats not a bad idea. They should put them in with the lions.

I think its an insult to criminals to lump them in with sex beasts.

Sex beasts are not criminals they are animals.

Mr Williams · 17-03-2014 11:14PM

Its time we started listening to the victims of crime not the human rights brigade.

djflawless · 17-03-2014 11:32PM

Mr Williams wrote: »

Its time we started listening to the victims of crime not the human rights brigade.

Somebody give this man a medal!

end of the road · 17-03-2014 11:50PM

Mr Williams wrote: »

Its time we started listening to the victims of crime not the human rights brigade.

who are the human rights brigade, another made up organisation like the PC brigade i expect

Holsten · 18-03-2014 12:10AM

Mr Williams wrote: »

Its time we started listening to the victims of crime not the human rights brigade.

No it's not, and it never will be.

If I'm a victim of robbery I'll want TERRIBLE things to happen to the robber, but does he actually deserve that? No, probably not.

Mr Williams · 18-03-2014 12:15AM

Holsten wrote: »

No it's not, and it never will be.

If I'm a victim of robbery I'll want TERRIBLE things to happen to the robber, but does he actually deserve that? No, probably not.

Robbery is not the same as rape or killing a child. No body is calling for the death penalty for robbery.

18-03-2014 12:24AM

but where do you draw the line for the death penalty?

child abuse? but how much abuse? if they rape a child, should they get the death penalty? but what if they only rub up against them? mastrubate on them? digitally rape them?
french kiss them?
orally rape them?

what if someone burgles an elderly person that wont live alone anymore?

what about adults? if someone rapes someone completely sober, drags them off the street?
what if the injured party is hammered? so drunk they dont know what they are doing?

what if someone kills someone in self defence?
what if someone kills someone that killed a member of their family?

what if someone kills someone who raped a member of their family?

all im saying is there is a huge amount of offences from small to large, they all effect the injured party differently.

as it is there is huge inconsistences in sentences being handed down by judges..

how would we decide where to draw the line? what offences are punishable by death? which ones are less that they just deserve life in prison?

Mr Williams · 18-03-2014 12:30AM

bubblypop wrote: »

but where do you draw the line for the death penalty?

child abuse? but how much abuse? if they rape a child, should they get the death penalty? but what if they only rub up against them? mastrubate on them? digitally rape them?
french kiss them?
orally rape them?

what if someone burgles an elderly person that wont live alone anymore?

what about adults? if someone rapes someone completely sober, drags them off the street?
what if the injured party is hammered? so drunk they dont know what they are doing?

what if someone kills someone in self defence?
what if someone kills someone that killed a member of their family?

what if someone kills someone who raped a member of their family?

all im saying is there is a huge amount of offences from small to large, they all effect the injured party differently.

as it is there is huge inconsistences in sentences being handed down by judges..

how would we decide where to draw the line? what offences are punishable by death? which ones are less that they just deserve life in prison?

Heres somebody who would be a good candidate for the death penalty.

Even doctors who have "treated" this beast (at great cost to the tax payer) admit it has been a waste of time.

Would you really want someone like this living beside you ?

http://www.sundayworld.com/top-stories/news/high-risk-paedo-scully-back-on-streets

18-03-2014 12:36AM

Mr Williams wrote: »

Heres somebody who would be a good candidate for the death penalty.

Even doctors who have "treated" this beast (at great cost to the tax payer) admit it has been a waste of time.

Would you really want someone like this living beside you ?

http://www.sundayworld.com/top-stories/news/high-risk-paedo-scully-back-on-streets

im a believer in serious sentences.

send people to prison for life ( meaning actual life, till they die!!)
or else give them good long sentences, 30 40 years kind of sentences.

no-one that gives a victim a life sentence trying to deal with what happened to them, should be allowed out.

keeping them in prison is better than allowing them an escape by death.

Princess Consuela Bananahammock · 18-03-2014 11:45AM

end of the road wrote: »

who are the human rights brigade, another made up organisation like the PC brigade i expect

In fairness, he did answer this. It's the EU apparently.

Princess Consuela Bananahammock · 18-03-2014 11:46AM

Mr Williams wrote: »

Heres somebody who would be a good candidate for the death penalty.

Even doctors who have "treated" this beast (at great cost to the tax payer) admit it has been a waste of time.

Would you really want someone like this living beside you ?

http://www.sundayworld.com/top-stories/news/high-risk-paedo-scully-back-on-streets

Constanntly highlighting people who you think should be executed (not to mention quoting and ignoring entire posts in the process!) is, again, not really how debate works.

You want to tell us why, not who.

Refering to them (or perceived anti-death plently groups) with tabloid rhetoric doesn't help either - it just hides the fact that you haven't actually come up with any arguments in favour of the death peanlty yet - just candidates.

on the river · 18-03-2014 12:04PM

Princess Consuela Bananahammock wrote: »

Constanntly highlighting people who you think should be executed (not to mention quoting and ignoring entire posts in the process!) is, again, not really how debate works.

You want to tell us why, not who.

Refering to them (or perceived anti-death plently groups) with tabloid rhetoric doesn't help either - it just hides the fact that you haven't actually come up with any arguments in favour of the death peanlty yet - just candidates.

COST COST COST

The tax payer would save millions on reintroducing the death penalty.

Overcrowding solved in a shot

Crime rates decrease dramatically

and

Crime gangs would leave the country in fear of their lives.

Princess Consuela Bananahammock · 18-03-2014 12:22PM

on the river wrote: »

COST COST COST

The tax payer would save millions on reintroducing the death penalty.

Overcrowding solved in a shot

Crime rates decrease dramatically

and

Crime gangs would leave the country in fear of their lives.

Sorry - I meant one accurate argument. These are, with all due respect, awful.

Cost? Please outline your economic plan that will deal with the economic consequences of leaving the EU and the costs of reintroducing the punt as currency as well as who you think is going to buy Irish bonds when it happens?

1 - Appeals process costs more than 40 years in jail (and don't go down the line of "we don't need appeals" - if you're embarking on killing someone, you better be damn bloody sure you've got the right person).

2 - What overcrowding?

3 - Where? Why? How?

4 - Crime gangs already have their lives on the line - it's an occupational hazard. They don't seem to be all that scared.

Mal-Adjusted · 18-03-2014 12:31PM

Why do some posters insist that the only two options are either executions or else they'll live next door to us?

Princess Consuela Bananahammock · 18-03-2014 12:33PM

Mal-Adjusted wrote: »

Why do some posters insist that the only two options are either executions or else they'll live next door to us?

Maybe one of them is in the next cell?? :P:pac:

OldNotWIse · 18-03-2014 12:37PM

Mr Williams wrote: »

Heres somebody who would be a good candidate for the death penalty.

Even doctors who have "treated" this beast (at great cost to the tax payer) admit it has been a waste of time.

Would you really want someone like this living beside you ?

http://www.sundayworld.com/top-stories/news/high-risk-paedo-scully-back-on-streets

Still with the beast? You should put down that copy of the Mirror

Edit: Sorry my mistake, the Sunday World

MrPudding · 18-03-2014 12:53PM

Mr Williams wrote: »

The EU says that life sentences breach "human rights".

http://www.theguardian.com/law/2013/jul/09/whole-life-jail-sentences-without-review-breach-human-rights

This is the problem when you read as far as the headline and even then, you don't understand it.

Whole-life jail sentences without any prospect of release amount to inhuman and degrading treatment of prisoners, the European court of human rights has ruled.

The EU has an issue where a person is sentenced to life in prison and is told at the time of sentencing that they will never get out.

The EU has no problem with people that should not be on the streets being kept in prison for the rest of their natural lives, if they continue to pose a threat. All they are saying is there needs to be a mechanism whereby an assessment is made as to whether or not they should be released. If the result of the assessment is that they should remain in prison, then, assuming the decision was correctly made, then that is perfectly ok.

Perhaps you should actually read up on the subject. In fact, why don't you start with the very article you yourself posted, here is an interesting quote from the ECHR:

ECHR wrote:

[...]the finding of a violation in the applicants' cases should not be understood as giving them any prospect of imminent release. Whether or not they should be released would depend, for example, on whether there were still legitimate penological grounds for their continued detention and whether they should continue to be detained on grounds of dangerousness. These questions were not in issue.

Confirmation, then, that the issue is not keeping a personin prison for their entire life, it is simply not giving them the chance of a review that is the issue.

Whilst you may not be willing to accept you are wrong here, and further, whist you may not accept the non-too subtle difference between what you are trying to argue and what was actually held, you are wrong.

MrP

on the river · 18-03-2014 12:56PM

The irish prison system is in shambleshttp://www.rte.ie/news/2013/1204/490756-prisons-interim-report/ it seems some posts on this thread are endorsing prisoners to reoffend. Their is too many loop holes in the

justise system which need to be fixed. Any major crimes murder, rape, mass kllings should with out doubt recieve the

death penalty. victims are entitled to true justice agains their attackers. being on a holiday camp for 20 years is not

justise just expense for the taxpayer and a nice break for the crimnial.

Princess Consuela Bananahammock · 18-03-2014 01:01PM

on the river wrote: »

The irish prison system is in shambleshttp://www.rte.ie/news/2013/1204/490756-prisons-interim-report/ it seems some posts on this thread are endorsing prisoners to reoffend. Their is too many loop holes in the

justise system which need to be fixed. Any major crimes murder, rape, mass kllings should with out doubt recieve the

death penalty. victims are entitled to true justice agains their attackers. being on a holiday camp for 20 years is not

justise just expense for the taxpayer and a nice break for the crimnial.

Another one who can't be bothered to read the argument in the article posted - not only that, you then go on to contradict your own argument.

Would you support the reintroduction of the death penalty?

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