The D4 Media/ Posh Boys and Irish Rugby – Spoon feeding the masses

dub_skav · 13-02-2014 12:34PM

HooohRaaah wrote: »

We still compete as only 11 other nations that play the bloody thing. People can't seem to realise that.

Sure Italy and Scotland beat us last year.

Scotland and Italy - ranked 10th and 13th in the world - did beat us last year. We have had very close games against USA (18th) and Canada (15th) over the years.
So, certainly rugby may not be as widespread as soccer, but to say only 10 / 12 teams play it is disingenuous at best, your own observation proves that.
In fact Kenya, who have an excellent 7s team on the world tour, are down in 34th for 15s and wouldn't be a pushover.

Do you think any of the top soccer teams would be scared of the mighty USA ranked 10th in the world. Or the Cape Verde islands in 27th?

By the nature of the games it is harder for a major upset to happen in rugby, but certainly not impossible.

Don't let the fact that we are well down the rankings in soccer and high up the rankings in rugby fool you into thinking one is much easier to be good at.

LorMal · 13-02-2014 12:34PM

HooohRaaah wrote: »

Is the 6 nations not parochial then? People cheering on a place they happen to be from just on a larger scale to GAA

The secret is in the name

Rightwing · 13-02-2014 12:35PM

HooohRaaah wrote: »

That's laughable. So realistically the top 3 Irish provinces have to do very little to qualify for Europe

It's not the qualifying, it's competing in the competition that counts.

No one can deny that Irish have done extremely well (unlike the Scots/Welsh) for instance.

At this point in time, our rugby players are competing on the international stage, unlike our football friends.

Hope this helps.

sullivlo · 13-02-2014 12:37PM

HooohRaaah wrote: »

That's laughable. So realistically the top 3 Irish provinces have to do very little to qualify for Europe

Connacht nearly pushed Munster out of the automatic qualification a few years ago.

The two Italian teams and two Scottish teams in the Rabo all automatically qualify for the HEC so the Irish teams have to do more

There is a shake up in European rugby though so all of this is likely to change.

And hopefully it will all the news readers can talk about

Yamanoto · 13-02-2014 12:39PM

HooohRaaah wrote: »

What's so good about Irish contribution to the British Lions? The Lions represent nothing about being Irish. O'Driscoll got dropped and they went on to hammer Australia without him.

Ah, so you're an attention seeker.

Gotcha.

Strongbow10 · 13-02-2014 12:40PM

Rightwing wrote: »

I've no problem with that, I always put Munster ahead of Ireland.

That's why I can't support football, our football clubs are absolute muck.

You should call yourself a fan rather than a "supporter" then. You fit perfectly into the category of an Irish sports fan.

The team capable of providing the most realistic chance of glory will be the subject of your support.

It changes like the wind in Ireland there's no real loyalty to anything, if the soccer team take off again then the casuals will jump ship to follow Martin O'Neill and co. If Joe Schmidt does the business then they will swear blind rugby is their game until they bomb again and something else gains popularity.

Rinse and repeat.

As I said earlier there's very little hardcore support for either soccer or rugby in Ireland the majority are casuals who will desert either team when support is really needed.

I genuinely applaud and admire any people who have passion for their team be it Leinster, Munster, Bohemians whoever but to claim there is widespread passion for either game in Ireland is a joke, when such passionate fans in the majority can quite simply drop their team/sport whe results don't go their way.

HooohRaaah · 13-02-2014 12:41PM

dub_skav wrote: »

Scotland and Italy - ranked 10th and 13th in the world - did beat us last year. We have had very close games against USA (18th) and Canada (15th) over the years.
So, certainly rugby may not be as widespread as soccer, but to say only 10 / 12 teams play it is disingenuous at best, your own observation proves that.
In fact Kenya, who have an excellent 7s team on the world tour, are down in 34th for 15s and wouldn't be a pushover.

Do you think any of the top soccer teams would be scared of the mighty USA ranked 10th in the world. Or the Cape Verde islands in 27th?

By the nature of the games it is harder for a major upset to happen in rugby, but certainly not impossible.

Don't let the fact that we are well down the rankings in soccer and high up the rankings in rugby fool you into thinking one is much easier to be good at.

USA made the 1/4 Finals of the soccer World Cup so they're quite decent and they drew with England too

HooohRaaah · 13-02-2014 12:42PM

Yamanoto wrote: »

Ah, so you're an attention seeker.

Gotcha.

Care to explain your post? What have i said there that makes me an attention seeker?

HooohRaaah · 13-02-2014 12:43PM

sullivlo wrote: »

Connacht nearly pushed Munster out of the automatic qualification a few years ago.

The two Italian teams and two Scottish teams in the Rabo all automatically qualify for the HEC so the Irish teams have to do more

There is a shake up in European rugby though so all of this is likely to change.

And hopefully it will all the news readers can talk about

Nearly? Ah yes nearly. Didn't do it though did they.

Dyr · 13-02-2014 12:44PM

LorMal wrote: »

The secret is in the name

ireland
england
scotland
wales
france
italy

Only three nations in that list horse

Strongbow10 · 13-02-2014 12:46PM

dub_skav wrote: »

Scotland and Italy - ranked 10th and 13th in the world - did beat us last year. We have had very close games against USA (18th) and Canada (15th) over the years.
So, certainly rugby may not be as widespread as soccer, but to say only 10 / 12 teams play it is disingenuous at best, your own observation proves that.
In fact Kenya, who have an excellent 7s team on the world tour, are down in 34th for 15s and wouldn't be a pushover.

Do you think any of the top soccer teams would be scared of the mighty USA ranked 10th in the world. Or the Cape Verde islands in 27th?

By the nature of the games it is harder for a major upset to happen in rugby, but certainly not impossible.

Don't let the fact that we are well down the rankings in soccer and high up the rankings in rugby fool you into thinking one is much easier to be good at.

I'm sure we will be seeing the Kenyan rugby team ripping it up soon so.

To compare the depth in quality between Rugby and soccer is just a no go area. You know nothing about either game if this is your argument.

And yes some of the big sides in world soccer will fear the US, they are a very good side capable of beating anyone on their day.

geeky · 13-02-2014 12:47PM

I went to a posh boy rugby school and hated the culture of it. I also really hate how, for some people, following rugby is a class statement.

However, Ireland is punching above its weight in the sport - the OP mentions that we're sixth in the world out of about 10 'decent' teams. But I'd argue that there's barely 12 decent international teams (ie: ones who can beat any of the others on their day) in soccer, and we've never been one of them. It's only natural that there'd be some positivity and interest in it.

I think the media in general is disproportionately fixated on all things middle class and South Dublin - that's where the journalists and (more importantly) advertising buyers are socially and culturally rooted. The Rugby overload is just one expression of that. My lecturer in college used to point out how, when the first two quality bus corridors opened in Dublin, RTE spent ages drooling over the South Dublin one - magazine show pieces, vox-pops, etc., it was embarassing. The one in North Dublin got little or no coverage.

Rightwing · 13-02-2014 12:47PM

Strongbow10 wrote: »

You should call yourself a fan rather than a "supporter" then. You fit perfectly into the category of an Irish sports fan.

The team capable of providing the most realistic chance of glory will be the subject of your support.

It changes like the wind in Ireland there's no real loyalty to anything, if the soccer team take off again then the casuals will jump ship to follow Martin O'Neill and co. If Joe Schmidt does the business then they will swear blind rugby is their game until they bomb again and something else gains popularity.

Rinse and repeat.

As I said earlier there's very little hardcore support for either soccer or rugby in Ireland the majority are casuals who will desert either team when support is really needed.

I genuinely applaud and admire any people who have passion for their team be it Leinster, Munster, Bohemians whoever but to claim there is widespread passion for either game in Ireland is a joke, when such passionate fans in the majority can quite simply drop their team/sport whe results don't go their way.

Incorrect. I may be a 'fan' of Irish football, but probably not even that. I'd like them to do well, but I was never at an international and never will be. If I won tickets to one I'd give them to a supporter.

sullivlo · 13-02-2014 12:48PM

HooohRaaah wrote: »

Nearly? Ah yes nearly. Didn't do it though did they.

Yes. Nearly. Which is why I clearly said "nearly".

Rightwing · 13-02-2014 12:50PM

sullivlo wrote: »

Yes. Nearly. Which is why I clearly said "nearly".

And in fairness, it wasn't even that close

Connacht are rubbish, we mustn't be making excuses for them.

Heroditas · 13-02-2014 12:51PM

Micky Dolenz wrote: »

Mod

Grabs coat.

That's our fukkin' goalpost, you b0ll0x! :pac:

dub_skav · 13-02-2014 12:54PM

Strongbow10 wrote: »

I'm sure we will be seeing the Kenyan rugby team ripping it up soon so.

To compare the depth in quality between Rugby and soccer is just a no go area. You know nothing about either game if this is your argument.

And yes some of the big sides in world soccer will fear the US, they are a very good side capable of beating anyone on their day.

It's not my argument, I was merely refuting the fallacious point that there are only 10 decent teams in rugby.

Do keep up old boy

*adjusts monocle*

Chips Lovell · 13-02-2014 12:55PM

Strongbow10 wrote: »

It changes like the wind in Ireland there's no real loyalty to anything, if the soccer team take off again then the casuals will jump ship to follow Martin O'Neill and co. If Joe Schmidt does the business then they will swear blind rugby is their game until they bomb again and something else gains popularity.

Dude, it's sport. Sport. A bit of entertainment, nothing more. Loyalty? It's not like they're off to fight in the trenches.

Rightwing · 13-02-2014 12:56PM

Vladimir Kurtains wrote: »

Dude, it's sport. Sport. A bit of entertainment, nothing more. Loyalty? It's not like they're off to fight in the trenches.

There's a lot of truth here. And the boys in the trenches, you'd have to wonder about the wisdon of loyalty there too.

Shiraz 4.99 · 13-02-2014 01:01PM

Ball carrier
Breakdown
Choke tackle
Turnover
Going forward ball
Rolling maul
Number 10

Now just insert any of the above words in sentences & you qualify as a rugby pundit.

The Pheasant2 · 13-02-2014 01:03PM

Shiraz 4.99 wrote: »

Ball carrier
Breakdown
Choke tackle
Turnover
Going forward ball
Rolling maul
Number 10

Now just insert any of the above words in sentences & you qualify as a rugby pundit.

I'm unfamiliar with this one anyway!

Micky Dolenz · 13-02-2014 01:04PM

Shiraz 4.99 wrote: »

Ball carrier
Breakdown
Choke tackle
Turnover
Going forward ball
Rolling maul
Number 10

Now just insert any of the above words in sentences & you qualify as a rugby pundit.

Don't forget.

Tommmmmmmmmmmy Boooooooooooowe.

Rightwing · 13-02-2014 01:05PM

Shiraz 4.99 wrote: »

Ball carrier
Breakdown
Choke tackle
Turnover
Going forward ball
Rolling maul
Number 10

Now just insert any of the above words in sentences & you qualify as a rugby pundit.

People are pundits of any game they want. I can claim to be a pundit of gaelic football without knowing anything about it.

sullivlo · 13-02-2014 01:06PM

Shiraz 4.99 wrote: »

Ball carrier
Breakdown
Choke tackle
Turnover
Going forward ball
Rolling maul
Number 10

Now just insert any of the above words in sentences & you qualify as a rugby pundit.

Choke tackle being replaced by chop tackle. Keep up

Femme_Fatale · 13-02-2014 01:06PM

FTA69 wrote: »

That having been said, you can't really deny that rugby in Ireland has a pretty prominent involvement from people who are from traditionally priviliged backgrounds. At it's core, schools rugby is still largely dominated by elitist private schools. A lot of people on this thread have been going on about working-class rugby in Cork, something which is news to me. Most rugby players I know in Cork went to Pres, Bandon Grammar, Midleton and Christians; hardly bastions of the working class. The sport also has a traditionally middle-class following of the sort lampooned by Ross O'Carroll Kelly.

No question about it. But I was just refuting someone who seemed to think absolutely zero people from a working-class background play/follow rugby. I found it a rather sheltered, naive thing to say. I know a guy from Knocknaheeny who played rugby - that's about it, but I know there's a following from a small number of working-class people. And I wouldn't agree rugby here in Cork is as "posh" and private-school-centric as it is in Dublin. The sport also seems to be growing in popularity throughout the social spectrum.

Micky Dolenz · 13-02-2014 01:08PM

Femme_Fatale wrote: »

No question about it. But I was just refuting someone who seemed to think absolutely zero people from a working-class background play/follow rugby. I found it a rather sheltered, naive thing to say. I know a guy from Knocknaheeny who played rugby - that's about it, but I know there's a following from a small number of working-class people. And I wouldn't agree rugby here in Cork is as "posh" and private-school-centric as it is in Dublin. The sport also seems to be growing in popularity throughout the social spectrum.

In Limerick, depending on where you lived, there was a high chance of playing rugby at some level. They certainly weren't posh boys neither.

sullivlo · 13-02-2014 01:10PM

Micky Dolenz wrote: »

In Limerick, depending on where you lived, there was a high chance of playing rugby at some level. They certainly weren't posh boys neither.

I'll never forget parking my car the first time I went to Thomand! Rugby in limerick certainly ain't posh.

Rightwing · 13-02-2014 01:10PM

Femme_Fatale wrote: »

No question about it. But I was just refuting someone who seemed to think absolutely zero people from a working-class background play/follow rugby. I found it a rather sheltered, naive thing to say. I know a guy from Knocknaheeny who played rugby - that's about it, but I know there's a following from a small number of working-class people. And I wouldn't agree rugby here in Cork is as "posh" and private-school-centric as it is in Dublin. The sport also seems to be growing in popularity throughout the social spectrum.

No question about that. And it's a good thing, along with GAA/Soccer etc. I don't care what sport people follow, or where they are from. Main thing is enjoyment.

The more kids playing sport be it boxing or whatever the better, it's far better than them getting into crime etc.

Inner City Hedgehog · 13-02-2014 01:12PM

Fratton Fred wrote: »

You'd never get a good Catholic like Sam Maguire playing rugby.

Five Irish winners of the Heineken cup in eight years and people wonder why it is becoming more popular? Success breads success both on and off the pitch. If you're a 15 year old in Dublin, would you rather watch Leinster play Racing metro in the semi of a European cup, or Dublin play Cavan, again.

When was the last time Dublin played Cavan?

Rightwing · 13-02-2014 01:13PM

Micky Dolenz wrote: »

In Limerick, depending on where you lived, there was a high chance of playing rugby at some level. They certainly weren't posh boys neither.

I don't think it really depended on where you lived. You either liked the game or not.

But I know what you are saying.

The D4 Media/ Posh Boys and Irish Rugby – Spoon feeding the masses

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