Garda Ombudsman offices bugged

dxhound2005 · 11-02-2014 12:00AM

tomwaterford wrote: »

If I had to guess it's in the thread title/track down podcast of journalist involved...at a guess it's political speak for electronic bugging/tapping

Here's another man trying to guess what it all means, and he's not too happy.

http://www.irishexaminer.com/breakingnews/ireland/callinan-claims-gsoc-statement-causes-grave-concern-622312.html

“It is a cause of grave concern that the Garda Siochana Ombudsman Commission’s statement contains a clear indication that An Garda Siochana was in some way suspected of complicity in this matter despite GSOC’s overall finding that the existence of technical and electronic anomalies could not be conclusively explained,” Mr Callinan said.

The Commissioner said he wanted GSOC to clarify four things – the nature and extent of the anomalies identified and whether criminality is suspected.

Mr Callinan also called for an explanation on the basis for the suspicion of Garda misconduct and he also asked whether any matters identified need to be investigated by the Garda.

tomwaterford · 11-02-2014 12:00AM

By right that picture should be on front page of every newspaper in the morning

Phoebas · 11-02-2014 12:01AM

EireGun wrote: »

It's all here: http://cdn1.independent.ie/irish-news/article29994519.ece/ALTERNATES/h342/NWS_2014-02-10_NEW_002_30609700_I1.JPG

The information in that graphic comes from the Sunday Times reporting, not from GSOC. GSOC haven't provided any of this detail.

Grab All Association · 11-02-2014 12:07AM

<snip>

Mod: Don't discuss any infractions/warnings you've gotten elsewhere. If you have a problem with it, then pm the mod in question.

tomwaterford · 11-02-2014 12:07AM

dxhound2005 wrote: »

Here's another man trying to guess what it all means, and he's not too happy.

http://www.irishexaminer.com/breakingnews/ireland/callinan-claims-gsoc-statement-causes-grave-concern-622312.html

“It is a cause of grave concern that the Garda Siochana Ombudsman Commission’s statement contains a clear indication that An Garda Siochana was in some way suspected of complicity in this matter despite GSOC’s overall finding that the existence of technical and electronic anomalies could not be conclusively explained,” Mr Callinan said.

The Commissioner said he wanted GSOC to clarify four things – the nature and extent of the anomalies identified and whether criminality is suspected.

Mr Callinan also called for an explanation on the basis for the suspicion of Garda misconduct and he also asked whether any matters identified need to be investigated by the Garda.

Why is needing explained why guards where suspected (seems whoever did it will get away)..makes you wonder how he got to a senior rank in any policeforce

Sure its obvious they would be first suspects esp when technology involved would be beyond most others in this country
As for guards investing this.if they do you. May give up any hope of GSOC ever taking there work seriously again

That being said he is right to stand up for gaurds reputation...if what is being suspected by many it will be in tatters..bit unfair on ordinary lower ranking honest membera

Shady Tady · 11-02-2014 12:08AM

Surely key stone cops like the gardai could not set up such an elaborate operation? It's probably a UCD computer student

wil · 11-02-2014 12:13AM

I was almost expecting Sam (Vincent) to say this

if a buggy bug bugs buggy buggers but a bug bugger buggers buggy bugs would a buggy bug bugger bugger a buggers buggy bug or a buggy bug bugger buggerer bugger a buggered buggy bug.

Shady Tady · 11-02-2014 12:14AM

Good panal on Vincent Browne but Vincent is missing, I reckon he got a hard on when this story broke and had to go to bed early tonight!

dxhound2005 · 11-02-2014 12:14AM

tomwaterford wrote: »

Why is needing explained why guards where suspected (seems whoever did it will get away)..makes you wonder how he got to a senior rank in any policeforce

Sure its obvious they would be first suspects esp when technology involved would be beyond most others in this country
As for guards investing this.if they do you. May give up any hope of GSOC ever taking there work seriously again

The only source that mentions this sort of technology is the newspaper article. Piggybacking it on to a story about a bug in a speaker phone, which is low level stuff. If the consultants couldn't come up with something more definite than some unexplained technical and electronic anomolies then maybe it is time to call in some good old crime detection expertise.

Phoebas · 11-02-2014 12:17AM

tomwaterford wrote: »

Why is needing explained why guards where suspected (seems whoever did it will get away)..makes you wonder how he got to a senior rank in any policeforce

Sure its obvious they would be first suspects esp when technology involved would be beyond most others in this country
As for guards investing this.if they do you. May give up any hope of GSOC ever taking there work seriously again

GSOC have said that they don't have any evidence that points to the Gardaí, so if they think a crime has been committed then the Gardaí are the now the proper authority to investigate that crime.
GSOC have no business pursuing any criminal investigation where Gardaí aren't suspected and they now have very serious questions to answer about why they chose not to report what may be very serious criminal activity.

renegademaster · 11-02-2014 12:18AM

tomwaterford wrote: »

By right that picture should be on front page of every newspaper in the morning

sure the fcuking anglo tapes were all over the papers for weeks and what good did it do unless people get out onto the streets to demand justice!

taytothief · 11-02-2014 12:24AM

Oh heads will roll! I have no doubt. No doubt at all. At all. Whatsoever.

Also, we'll all be really annoyed, just as soon as we're told wtf is going on. That'll learn the baxtards.

Boombastic · 11-02-2014 12:28AM

Angela Lansbury lives in Cork. I think this is a job for her.

tomwaterford · 11-02-2014 12:29AM

Phoebas wrote: »

GSOC have said that they don't have any evidence that points to the Gardaí, so if they think a crime has been committed then the Gardaí are the now the proper authority to investigate that crime.
GSOC have no business pursuing any criminal investigation where Gardaí aren't suspected and they now have very serious questions to answer about why they chose not to report what may be very serious criminal activity.

To be honest..I hope it's not the gaurds.dangerous thing to be letting them away with...but you could see it's obvious the GSOC don't trust them...easy way to sort this release the security report and have completely independent investigation or tribunal..there enough public confidence lost now that any gaurds report comes up with nothing won't be trusted

dxhound2005 · 11-02-2014 12:43AM

tomwaterford wrote: »

To be honest..I hope it's not the gaurds.dangerous thing to be letting them away with...but you could see it's obvious the GSOC don't trust them...easy way to sort this release the security report and have completely independent investigation or tribunal..there enough public confidence lost now that any gaurds report comes up with nothing won't be trusted

So who would you get to do this completely independent investigation? Whoever it is the obvious first port of call is John Mooney who wrote the ST article. He needs to divulge his sources.

Putin · 11-02-2014 12:46AM

Phoebas wrote: »

GSOC have said that they don't have any evidence that points to the Gardaí, so if they think a crime has been committed then the Gardaí are the now the proper authority to investigate that crime.
GSOC have no business pursuing any criminal investigation where Gardaí aren't suspected and they now have very serious questions to answer about why they chose not to report what may be very serious criminal activity.

They don't have any evidence that proves the Gardaí were involved. Which doesn't necesarliy mean they're innocent. Due to the nature of the security breaches, I'm sure any devices found didn't have a calling card attached. Which naturally makes finding who was behind it difficult to prove. The fact that the GSOC did not report it and called in an outside party to investigate, speaks volumes for the trust and regard they put in the Gardaí. After all, this is a force where fellow Gardaí nailed a rat to the door of a colleague. Just because he spoke out about some members of the force having a disregard for the law. So I think they're capable of anything and shouldn't be trusted.

Busted Flat. · 11-02-2014 12:46AM

dxhound2005 wrote: »

So who would you get to do this completely independent investigation? Whoever it is the obvious first port of call is John Mooney who wrote the ST article. He needs to divulge his sources.

Nice one kill the messenger.

Phoebas · 11-02-2014 12:52AM

Putin wrote: »

They don't have any evidence that proves the Gardaí were involved. Which doesn't necesarliy mean they're innocent. Due to the nature of the security breaches, I'm sure any devices found didn't have a calling card attached. Which naturally makes finding who was behind it difficult to prove. The fact that the GSOC did not report it and called in an outside party to investigate, speaks volumes for the trust and regard they put in the Gardaí. After all, this is a force where fellow Gardaí nailed a rat to the door of a colleague. Just because he spoke out about some members of the force having a disregard for the law. So I think they're capable of anything and shouldn't be trusted.

There's no doubt that GSOC don't have very much trust in the Gardaí, but given that they don't have any evidence that the Gardaí were involved, who else should carry out an investigation into a serious crime?

It looks like the GSOC were willing to let whoever bugged them get away with it rather than reporting it to the proper authorities.

Phoebas · 11-02-2014 12:55AM

Putin wrote: »

They don't have any evidence that proves the Gardaí were involved.

By the by, that's a bit misleading. They don't appear to have any evidence of Gardaí involvement whatsoever.

Phoebas · 11-02-2014 12:57AM

dxhound2005 wrote: »

So who would you get to do this completely independent investigation? Whoever it is the obvious first port of call is John Mooney who wrote the ST article. He needs to divulge his sources.

Wouldn't it be better for GSOC to just release the report. We need to know the content of the information, not the identity of the person who leaked it.

Wacker The Attacker · 11-02-2014 12:57AM

wendell borton wrote: »

A agency dealing with highly confidential info shouldn't be using wifi.

Here's a rather silly question from a technophobe but what are the alternatives and how can they guarantee that this cant happen again?

tomwaterford · 11-02-2014 12:59AM

Busted Flat. wrote: »

Nice one kill the messenger.

To be honest it's not the worst idea..the report he viewed should be released...we are lucky he is from outside the country...if this was an irish journalist there name would be well blacked by now if this story had made it to print...
He has appeared in couple interview today and seems willing to stand over this report

That being said I would support an independent team with international background...these are unreal accusations to be lightly passed off...also investigating team should have the best possible computer/internet security teampossible ..this sshouldn't be left off easily

Phoebas · 11-02-2014 12:59AM

Wacker The Attacker wrote: »

Here's a rather silly question from a technophobe but what are the alternatives and how can they guarantee that this cant happen again?

Wires.
There are no guarantees.

kell1 · 11-02-2014 01:04AM

People need to calm down and not jump to conclusions.There are many agencies/organisations that would benefit from very sensitive information in the possession of GSOC.It would appear to me that GSOC sat on this information as they were certain they had identified the suspect.After they conducted their own investigation it was inconclusive and somebody leaked the story.I have experience and although not a fan of Callinan/Shatter it would have taken a plot of Watergate proportions to carry this operation off.I am 100% satisfied that the Gardai had no hand,act or part in this and I hope that the truth will emerge.

Thank You

dxhound2005 · 11-02-2014 01:06AM

Busted Flat. wrote: »

Nice one kill the messenger.

He said this in the article:

GSOC took the decision to "integrity test" it communications network last summer after concerns were raised about internal security. The Sunday Times is unable to reveal what prompted the concerns for legal reasons.

And this:

Senior security sources last night said that no government agency would mount surveillance on another.

I think anyone with that sort of knowledge and who talks to senior security sources on a Saturday night would be a mine of information for any investigators. No need to shoot him. Or maybe he just made stuff up and using phrases like "concerns were raised" and "senior security sources" just pads out the story with non-information.

Busted Flat. · 11-02-2014 01:10AM

kell1 wrote: »

People need to calm down and not jump to conclusions.There are many agencies/organisations that would benefit from very sensitive information in the possession of GSOC.It would appear to me that GSOC sat on this information as they were certain they had identified the suspect.After they conducted their own investigation it was inconclusive and somebody leaked the story.I have experience and although not a fan of Callinan/Shatter it would have taken a plot of Watergate proportions to carry this operation off.I am 100% satisfied that the Gardai had no hand,act or part in this and I hope that the truth will emerge.

Thank You

Can you give a link to your investigation, or journalistic capabilities, or is your dad retired giving you his stories. Be upfront.

tomwaterford · 11-02-2014 01:12AM

kell1 wrote: »

People need to calm down and not jump to conclusions.There are many agencies/organisations that would benefit from very sensitive information in the possession of GSOC.It would appear to me that GSOC sat on this information as they were certain they had identified the suspect.After they conducted their own investigation it was inconclusive and somebody leaked the story.I have experience and although not a fan of Callinan/Shatter it would have taken a plot of Watergate proportions to carry this operation off.I am 100% satisfied that the Gardai had no hand,act or part in this and I hope that the truth will emerge.

Thank You

Who would you suspect carried it out and has the capacity to carry out said operation...if what is being alleged is true

Also who else possibly would gain from it

Means,motive and opportunity...

I hope your right...il wait for further information.somehow I don't think there will ever be conclusive proof and it will be swept under the carpet

Boombastic · 11-02-2014 01:14AM

kell1 wrote: »

People need to calm down and not jump to conclusions.There are many agencies/organisations that would benefit from very sensitive information in the possession of GSOC.It would appear to me that GSOC sat on this information as they were certain they had identified the suspect.After they conducted their own investigation it was inconclusive and somebody leaked the story.I have experience and although not a fan of Callinan/Shatter it would have taken a plot of Watergate proportions to carry this operation off.I am 100% satisfied that the Gardai had no hand,act or part in this and I hope that the truth will emerge.

Thank You

Thanks for the clarification Minister, I for one believe you

KyussBishop · 11-02-2014 01:14AM

Just a thought that popped into my head: It's amazing how much people care about this, the ombudsman being bugged - and in comparison, how little anyone gives a toss about the NSA and GCHQ, who are spying on pretty much each and every one of us, still to this day.

Boombastic · 11-02-2014 01:16AM

KyussBishop wrote: »

Just a thought that popped into my head: It's amazing how much people care about this, the ombudsman being bugged - and in comparison, how little anyone gives a toss about the NSA and GCHQ, who are spying on pretty much each and every one of us, still to this day.

Attempting to and/or Perverting the course of justice is more serious than listening to Mary and Molly talking about shopping

Garda Ombudsman offices bugged

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