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Iona vs Panti

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Comments

  • #422
    Bannasidhe
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 19,218 ✭✭✭✭Bannasidhe


    PopePalpatine wrote: »
    Such a group reminds me of Samuel L Jackson's character in Django Unchained.

    Haven't seen it :o


  • #423
    robindch
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 24,458 Mod ✭✭✭✭robindch


    Links234 wrote: »
    In short, it's low-hanging fruit.
    "Low-dangling fruits", I'd have thought.


  • #424
    swampgas
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,615 ✭✭✭swampgas


    Bannasidhe wrote: »
    There has been a suggestion that a Gays against Marriage group be formed which will argue against marriage itself and the danger of aping hetro-normative social norms.

    The thinking it is will provide an anti-marriage for gays and straights perspective and cut into Iona's position as 'go-to' opposition spokesperson.

    I was only contacted briefly about it about an hour ago and I am not sure what I think at this point - still trying to sort out a pro/con list (surrounded by dramatic weather just to add atmosphere....)

    What do you guys think?

    I think it could be a disastrous move, to be honest. It would be far too easy for the opposition to twist it into a tool to discredit the very genuine arguments in favour of marriage equality.


  • #425
    david75
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 7,611 ✭✭✭david75


    Bannasidhe wrote: »
    There has been a suggestion that a Gays against Marriage group be formed which will argue against marriage itself and the danger of aping hetro-normative social norms.

    The thinking it is will provide an anti-marriage for gays and straights perspective and cut into Iona's position as 'go-to' opposition spokesperson.

    I was only contacted briefly about it about an hour ago and I am not sure what I think at this point - still trying to sort out a pro/con list (surrounded by dramatic weather just to add atmosphere....)

    What do you guys think?

    The gay community in Ireland is .002 degrees of separation. We'd soon know of these were genuine gays or Iona plants.


  • #426
    J_E
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,734 ✭✭✭J_E


    amdublin wrote: »
    Who's going on sunday?

    My banner is going to say something along the lines of:

    Iona - stop getting your panti's in a twist about other people's lives.

    or else just a simple fek off iona institute!
    I'm gonna be there, although this is the first protest I've been to so I reckon I'll just hide in the groups! I'm more there for the numbers and support than waving banners and shouting.

    Do a "feck off out of my life!" poster :P
    david75 wrote: »
    The gay community in Ireland is .002 degrees of separation. We'd soon know of these were genuine gays or Iona plants.

    Pretty much this. To be honest, there aren't many arguments gay people can make towards marriage either, bar the heteronormative point, but again...they're not forced to get married if that's not what they want.


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  • #427
    Daith
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,247 ✭✭✭Daith


    Bannasidhe wrote: »
    There has been a suggestion that a Gays against Marriage group be formed which will argue against marriage itself and the danger of aping hetro-normative social norms.

    The thinking it is will provide an anti-marriage for gays and straights perspective and cut into Iona's position as 'go-to' opposition spokesperson.

    I was only contacted briefly about it about an hour ago and I am not sure what I think at this point - still trying to sort out a pro/con list (surrounded by dramatic weather just to add atmosphere....)

    What do you guys think?

    A group like that would only work if you had gay people and straight people in one group.

    Marriage is a legal and civil institution. It's not aping hetro norm to want to have the same legal and civil rights that come with it.


  • #428
    robindch
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 24,458 Mod ✭✭✭✭robindch


    Bannasidhe wrote: »
    There has been a suggestion that a Gays against Marriage group be formed which will argue against marriage itself and the danger of aping hetro-normative social norms.
    Humor would work much better. I'd suggest a "Gays against Hetero-sex" group whose purpose is to promote all the kinds of sexual practices not open to Quinn et al.

    Alternatively, if "homophobe" is off-limits, then what about branding them "homophiles"? I'm sure they'd enjoy being called that :cool:


  • #429
    Corkfeen
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,940 ✭✭✭Corkfeen


    Donated 20 to marriage equality, apparently getting tonnes at moment. Backfiring on Iona. :D


  • #430
    Obliq
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,371 ✭✭✭Obliq


    Bannasidhe wrote: »
    There has been a suggestion that a Gays against Marriage group be formed which will argue against marriage itself and the danger of aping hetro-normative social norms.
    ............
    What do you guys think?

    I'm thinking that marriage should be seen more as a human norm than in any way a preserve of heterosexuality, and tbh, that's what it is eh? We humans made it up, within and without religion in our multitude of societies. People still want to get married to declare their committed love for each other (*coughs* dodgy and difficult divorce ongoing, hence current lack of input up here *coughs*) so why take a stand against ANYONE wanting to, from ANY bias?

    If it's only to deflect attention from Iona, that's not a great reason to start such a big bun fight amongst the yays and nays within the LGBT community.
    Bannasidhe wrote: »
    Haven't seen it :o

    Not great IMO :(


  • #431
    Cabaal
    Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators, Regional South East Moderators Posts: 28,569 Mod ✭✭✭✭Cabaal


    Corkfeen wrote: »
    Donated 20 to marriage equality, apparently getting tonnes at moment. Backfiring on Iona. :D

    Must remember to donate something over the weekend,


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  • #432
    SpaceTime
    Closed Accounts Posts: 9,088 ✭✭✭SpaceTime


    Sarky wrote: »
    Didn't realise they had that level of autonomy. Given the amount of brown-nosing RTE does I contend that it's an easy mistake to make.

    Yeah they've a fair bit much like the BBC. Ever notice the BBC news logo is a nice conservative blue during Tory governments and a funky red with a bit of progressive house music when Labour's in :)

    Stick BBC News titles 1990 into YouTube and you'll see how it looked under Thatcherism


  • #433
    PopePalpatine
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,144 ✭✭✭✭PopePalpatine


    I guess we won't see "Lib Dem Yellow" for quite a while. :pac:


  • #434
    SpaceTime
    Closed Accounts Posts: 9,088 ✭✭✭SpaceTime


    PopePalpatine wrote: »
    I guess we won't see "Lib Dem Yellow" for quite a while. :pac:

    Unlikely..


  • #435
    david75
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 7,611 ✭✭✭david75


    Hysterical


  • #436
    Penn
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 35,592 ✭✭✭✭Penn


    david75 wrote: »
    Hysterical
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QzDAZ_kZLzw

    Fixed link


  • #437
    FouxDaFaFa
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,850 ✭✭✭FouxDaFaFa


    david75 wrote: »
    Hysterical
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QzDAZ_kZLzw
    Ha, that's me! Thanks.
    Daith wrote: »
    I'm def going to PantiBar this Saturday :)
    I'd say the place will be insane. I had never heard of it before this.


  • #438
    Nodin
    Closed Accounts Posts: 46,938 ✭✭✭✭Nodin


    amdublin wrote: »
    Who's going on sunday?

    My banner is going to say something along the lines of:

    Iona - stop getting your panti's in a twist about other people's lives.

    or else just a simple fek off iona institute!


    Me, in my first public event since the 90th anniversary of the rising. I will be bringing a disgruntled look, or a possibly more severe glare, depending on what the size of the payout is rumoured to be by sunday.


  • #439
    Brown Bomber
    Site Banned Posts: 8,331 ✭✭✭Brown Bomber


    Sarky wrote: »
    Heh, you're struggling and you know it.
    I always wanted to know what it feels like to be the kid in The Emperor's New Clothes, now, thanks to you I can.


  • #440
    Brown Bomber
    Site Banned Posts: 8,331 ✭✭✭Brown Bomber


    Cabaal wrote: »
    Isn't it nice when less people pay attention to Brown Bombers desperate attempts to justify Iona's position of discrimination against gay people. :)
    What a filthy lie. Quote me where I have done this. If Iona have discriminated against gay people I absolutely condemn it. I'd report the post but it seems pointless as a moderator has thanked your personal abuse. So please at least have the decency of RTE and support your false accusation or withdraw it.


  • #441
    Annasopra
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 41,228 ✭✭✭✭Annasopra


    Cabaal wrote: »
    Pussy Riot;s appearance on the show could really hurt Iona, at the end of the day Pussy Riot will be likely talking about religion taking hold in Russia and how this is crushing people's rights which resulted in jail time for them,

    They'll then cut to a debate with Iona (most likely) debating the rights and wrongs of gay people and no doubt marriage will come into it,

    So religion restricting rights and freedoms in Ireland as well, thats not a good image.

    I wonder if Pussy Riot will be allowed to say Putin is homophobic?

    It was so much easier to blame it on Them. It was bleakly depressing to think that They were Us. If it was Them, then nothing was anyone's fault. If it was us, what did that make Me? After all, I'm one of Us. I must be. I've certainly never thought of myself as one of Them. No one ever thinks of themselves as one of Them. We're always one of Us. It's Them that do the bad things.

    Terry Pratchet



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  • #442
    Nodin
    Closed Accounts Posts: 46,938 ✭✭✭✭Nodin


    Neverending......


  • #443
    Brown Bomber
    Site Banned Posts: 8,331 ✭✭✭Brown Bomber


    Cydoniac wrote: »
    Omitting one word is hardly 'twisting' the facts.
    It was three words, and it is a dictionary definition meaning every single word is important. Clare Daly used an edited version of a definition where the "new" definition better supported her argument. Deception pure and simple and there is no justification for defending it.


  • #444
    Annasopra
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 41,228 ✭✭✭✭Annasopra


    Bannasidhe wrote: »
    There has been a suggestion that a Gays against Marriage group be formed which will argue against marriage itself and the danger of aping hetro-normative social norms.

    The thinking it is will provide an anti-marriage for gays and straights perspective and cut into Iona's position as 'go-to' opposition spokesperson.

    I was only contacted briefly about it about an hour ago and I am not sure what I think at this point - still trying to sort out a pro/con list (surrounded by dramatic weather just to add atmosphere....)

    What do you guys think?
    TBH I think Paddy Manning of preserve marriage does the anti marriage equality side no favours at all.

    It was so much easier to blame it on Them. It was bleakly depressing to think that They were Us. If it was Them, then nothing was anyone's fault. If it was us, what did that make Me? After all, I'm one of Us. I must be. I've certainly never thought of myself as one of Them. No one ever thinks of themselves as one of Them. We're always one of Us. It's Them that do the bad things.

    Terry Pratchet



  • #445
    Delirium
    Moderators Posts: 52,029 ✭✭✭✭Delirium


    Brown Bomber wrote: »
    It was three words, and it is a dictionary definition meaning every single word is important. Clare Daly used an edited version of a definition where the "new" definition better supported her argument. Deception pure and simple and there is no justification for defending it.

    How did she deceive anyone? Instead of saying extremely strong dislike, she said "strong dislike" (aversion).

    If you can read this, you're too close!



  • #446
    Brown Bomber
    Site Banned Posts: 8,331 ✭✭✭Brown Bomber


    Penncil Dick wrote: »
    Xenophobia in the OED is defined as "intense or irrational dislike or fear of people from other countries"

    Islamophobia in the OED is defined as "a hatred or fear of Islam or Muslims, especially as a political force"

    From a post of yours in this forum approx 2 months ago:
    http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=87768021&postcount=514


    "If they have a problem with Middle-Eastern people because they perceive them to be Muslim based on their physical appearance" doesn't equate to "hatred or fear" or an "intense or irrational dislike or fear", so how come that's Islamophobia, but what Clare Daly was referring to isn't homophobia?
    I've read this about ten times now and you aren't making any sense.

    People hating non-Muslims because the haters think they are Muslims fits perfectly into that definition of Islamophobia.

    Is this woman beater not Islamophobic even though the victim was a Christian?

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hkzCxtmA5SE


  • #447
    Brown Bomber
    Site Banned Posts: 8,331 ✭✭✭Brown Bomber


    SW wrote: »
    How did she deceive anyone? Instead of saying extremely strong dislike, she said "strong dislike" (aversion).
    Quote verbatim the actual definition and then quote verbatim the Clare Daly version.

    Then by making reference to her statement tell me if she gave the impression she was giving the full definition or an edited one.


  • #448
    Bannasidhe
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 19,218 ✭✭✭✭Bannasidhe


    swampgas wrote: »
    I think it could be a disastrous move, to be honest. It would be far too easy for the opposition to twist it into a tool to discredit the very genuine arguments in favour of marriage equality.

    I am tending towards that viewpoint but I can see the attraction to providing alternatives to Iona when it comes to presenting the anti side. If nothing else it would cut into the nice little earner they get every time one of them makes a radio/TV appearance.

    There is also the - If we are going to have a adult debate - lets have the bloody adult debate and not stifle the opposition within the Gay community. By wanting to 'silence' that in order to provide a united front are we not also guilty of censoring a minority? This makes me uncomfortable....


  • #449
    Delirium
    Moderators Posts: 52,029 ✭✭✭✭Delirium


    Brown Bomber wrote: »
    Quote verbatim the actual definition and then quote verbatim the Clare Daly version.

    Then by making reference to her statement tell me if she gave the impression she was giving the full definition or an edited one.

    Why don't you answer my question. How did she deceive anyone with the definition she used?

    If you can read this, you're too close!



  • #450
    Daith
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,247 ✭✭✭Daith


    Brown Bomber wrote: »
    If Iona have discriminated against gay people I absolutely condemn it.
    “It is never pleasant to take a stance like this, and it must be a thousand times less pleasant to be the person who is told that important values like equality must take second place to the common good. I would prefer if the conflict could be wished away, but it can’t.”

    Breda O’Brien

    That they actively seek (and campaign against) for gay relationships not to be seen as the same as a hetrosexual couple in marriage and to deny them marriage and equality based on their sexuality is discrimination.

    I'm sick and tired of hearing "oh just because they think marriage is a man and woman doesn't make them homophobes". It doesn't, it's everything else they do.


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  • #451
    Bannasidhe
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 19,218 ✭✭✭✭Bannasidhe


    david75 wrote: »
    The gay community in Ireland is .002 degrees of separation. We'd soon know of these were genuine gays or Iona plants.

    The people who contacted me are very genuine and some are quite high profile in the LGBTQ Community.

    They would be coming from a Feminist anti-marriage in general position. It could detract from Iona in a way as most people would find the idea of abolishing marriage as a legally recognised special entity which must be protected as absurd so that is what they will talk about.

    Yet there is an argument to be made that marriage it is an outmoded relic of patriarchy and no longer needed in an age where over 30% of children born are outside marriage and where women have rights like working, owning property etc etc.


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