Gardai harrasing me?

Spring Onion · 31-01-2014 11:54AM

Valetta wrote: »

Why would you go out of your way to do things you think they "don't like" or "hate"?

That's just childish.

I am talking about harassment - being stopped every week because of "who you are" not "what you did". This advice is for people who are being targeted for whatever reason. We got it sorted in the end, I wouldn't act the prick now if randomly stopped.

Spring Onion · 31-01-2014 11:55AM

SNAKEDOC wrote: »

I dont think anyone should follow that advice.
Firstly if a garda stops you he is doing his job. If he doesnt know you how the hell is he supposed to get to know the area he is working in. They do this by investigating and talking to people. So they stop people for on the spot checks its perfectly legal.
Secondly no need to be rude to them. If you are polite you will find they are polite back. Such as hello garda how ar you,
Instead of wha law have i broken. You dont need to have broken a law to be stopped.
Thirdly if it comes to a point where a garda has to lay a hand on you then you have already pee'd him off and your probably going to be arrested
As for taking photos of the gardai again thats a bit silly all you have to note is his shoulder numbers.
If unsure politely ask him if you can see his warrant card. (Garda id)
If you are being stopped while walking then the garda may have a good reason to stop you so be patient and courtious again their doing their job.
Mentioning the word ombudsman does not scare a garda because the organisation is well trained and will see right through bull claims like that.
As a final remark if you find yourself being stopped often by the gardai ask yourself what the reasons may be. Do you get annoyed and maybe provoke suspicion. Next time you are stopped do as i said above be really nice and polite ask friendly questions not questions likely to tick the garda off and you will find that you wont be stoped as often if at all.

I am talking about harassment - being stopped every week because of "who you are" not "what you did". This advice is for people who are being targeted for whatever reason. We got it sorted in the end, I wouldn't act the prick now if randomly stopped.

steddyeddy · 31-01-2014 11:57AM

SNAKEDOC wrote: »

I dont think anyone should follow that advice.
Firstly if a garda stops you he is doing his job. If he doesnt know you how the hell is he supposed to get to know the area he is working in. They do this by investigating and talking to people. So they stop people for on the spot checks its perfectly legal.
Secondly no need to be rude to them. If you are polite you will find they are polite back. Such as hello garda how ar you,
Instead of wha law have i broken. You dont need to have broken a law to be stopped.
Thirdly if it comes to a point where a garda has to lay a hand on you then you have already pee'd him off and your probably going to be arrested
As for taking photos of the gardai again thats a bit silly all you have to note is his shoulder numbers.
If unsure politely ask him if you can see his warrant card. (Garda id)
If you are being stopped while walking then the garda may have a good reason to stop you so be patient and courtious again their doing their job.
Mentioning the word ombudsman does not scare a garda because the organisation is well trained and will see right through bull claims like that.
As a final remark if you find yourself being stopped often by the gardai ask yourself what the reasons may be. Do you get annoyed and maybe provoke suspicion. Next time you are stopped do as i said above be really nice and polite ask friendly questions not questions likely to tick the garda off and you will find that you wont be stoped as often if at all.

If a gaurd repeatedly harassed you that is how you would act?

cometogether · 31-01-2014 11:57AM

A Garda had a go at me on a night out last summer because I refused to show him ID

Valetta · 31-01-2014 11:59AM

Spring Onion wrote: »

I am talking about harassment - being stopped every week because of "who you are" not "what you did". This advice is for people who are being targeted for whatever reason. We got it sorted in the end, I wouldn't act the prick now if randomly stopped.

So you admit that youe advice earlier amounts to "acting the prick"?

Right.

jimgoose · 31-01-2014 12:01PM

cometogether wrote: »

A Garda had a go at me on a night out last summer because I refused to show him ID

It is a criminal offence to refuse to identify yourself to a Garda when required.

Oops69 · 31-01-2014 12:02PM

Get one of the shiners in your area to talk to Mary Lou and say you want to give evidence at the public accounts committee.

cometogether · 31-01-2014 12:04PM

jimgoose wrote: »

It is a criminal offence to refuse to identify yourself to a Garda when required.

But why did he need to see it? I wasn't doing anything out of the way, wasn't even drunk. How is that 'required'?

jimgoose · 31-01-2014 12:06PM

cometogether wrote: »

But why did he need to see it? I wasn't doing anything out of the way, wasn't even drunk. How is that 'required'?

It is required when the Garda asks you for it. Your name and address will do fine.

cometogether · 31-01-2014 12:07PM

jimgoose wrote: »

It is required when the Garda asks you for it. Your name and address will do fine.

Haha well sorry pal but I ain't gonna hop to it just because some copper fancies flexing his muscle on a nice little power trip. He didn't need my name and address.

jimgoose · 31-01-2014 12:07PM

cometogether wrote: »

Haha well sorry pal but I ain't gonna hop to it just because some copper fancies flexing his muscle on a nice little power trip. He didn't need my name and address.

As you wish.

Spring Onion · 31-01-2014 12:10PM

Valetta wrote: »

So you admit that youe advice earlier amounts to "acting the prick"?

Right.

Oh get over yourself and do an LLB. It takes two to tango!

Michael D Not Higgins · 31-01-2014 12:14PM

cometogether wrote: »

Haha well sorry pal but I ain't gonna hop to it just because some copper fancies flexing his muscle on a nice little power trip. He didn't need my name and address.

If he suspected you of committing an offence, then he has the right to demand your name and address, otherwise you have a right to privacy. If he really needs your name and address, he can take you down to the station.

cometogether · 31-01-2014 12:19PM

Michael D Not Higgins wrote: »

If he suspected you of committing an offence, then he has the right to demand your name and address, otherwise you have a right to privacy. If he really needs your name and address, he can take you down to the station.

He wouldn't tell me what offence I was suspected of committing though

Michael D Not Higgins · 31-01-2014 12:27PM

cometogether wrote: »

He wouldn't tell me what offence I was suspected of committing though

Then you were within your rights not to comply with his request, which is what it was. They can only demand your information when suspected of an offence.

Ray Palmer · 31-01-2014 12:29PM

cometogether wrote: »

He wouldn't tell me what offence I was suspected of committing though

Yeah they like to say they can ask for these details but they can only do so by giving a reason for it.

I never found out if you have to spell your name to them when they ask. Somebody claimed if you don't you are failing to identify yourself.

tipptom · 31-01-2014 02:44PM

Ray Palmer wrote: »

Is that meant to be a joke or something? It stinks of the stereotype that the young culchie Garda believe when they arrived.

Truth of the situation was the Garda couldn't enter the neighbourhood for months. I didn't even live there I was just going up to my girlfriend's house. Both her parents lived there and still do. Because her brother was severely disabled her parents could only afford to live there due to his medical care costs.

The whole situation was caused by the Gardaí being violent thugs. Many perfectly normal families lived there but everybody was treated with suspicion and harassment.

They never caught the guy who rammed the car but everybody knew who it was. The Gardaí were afraid to go after him.

I cant help thinking that your predujuices would be borne out in any conversation with guards that are not born in your neck of the woods and your conversations with the guard would be tainted from the start from your pre-conceived notions.

Ray Palmer · 31-01-2014 03:13PM

tipptom wrote: »

I cant help thinking that your predujuices would be borne out in any conversation with guards that are not born in your neck of the woods and your conversations with the guard would be tainted from the start from your pre-conceived notions.

Yet you ignore what I am telling you of my experience on the prejudicial view that I am somehow responsible. In other words you are victim blaming.

Unless I attack a Gardaí they have no reason to hit me. NO MATTER WHAT! They have no excuse to hitting a child which is what I was.

Do you think it is acceptable for an armed (baton) member of our police force to attack a child even if he was saying something smart (which I didn't do yet you assume I have)?

Because I used the term culchie you are assuming I have a prejudice. That is just a semantics issue there has been a lot worse assumptions made about people who are telling what happens to them. I am not a track suit scumbag as has been suggested and hinted at along with a list of issues raised about people from deprived areas. That is prejudice not the use of one term.

wicklowstevo · 31-01-2014 03:17PM

cometogether wrote: »

He wouldn't tell me what offence I was suspected of committing though

he doesnt have to tell you , he just has to know him self and or be able to justify it later.

there is no requirement to tell you hat you are suspected of doing. how do you know that you didnt match the description of a criminal who was in the area or someone who has a warrant out for them.

its not always personal you know

Gotham · 31-01-2014 03:23PM

biko wrote: »

Carry a book.

I find that playing classical music around Gardai and Police makes their tone change and they usually just leave me alone.
Try bringing a loud mp3 player and playing beethoven loud enough for them to hear.

Then just as there's a crescendo, tell him "Wait a sec..." and swing hands like a conductor.

Nemeses · 31-01-2014 03:25PM

Deny all.

They will never take you ALIVE!!!

Ray Palmer · 31-01-2014 03:40PM

wicklowstevo wrote: »

its not always personal you know

Say if it the same Gardaí stopping you and they know who you are from the times they stopped you without any reason all the other times.

Jonny7 · 31-01-2014 03:42PM

Ray Palmer wrote: »

If somebody punched you would you go to the hospital? Get real

YES - you go to hospital, you log it, and then you ask what options you have

My friend got punched by the police because he was being a ****ing drunk dick - were the police right to do it? no but it's not a perfect world, they are still human and they deal with some amount of ****

If there's an undeserved genuine incident - then report

If someone is being a complete douche - then expect the Gaurds to close ranks around their colleague

Life. Get used to it.

fire_me · 31-01-2014 04:00PM

Michael D Not Higgins wrote: »

If he suspected you of committing an offence, then he has the right to demand your name and address, otherwise you have a right to privacy. If he really needs your name and address, he can take you down to the station.

and you don't have to say anything down at the station either , worst case scenario you get thrown in a cell for 24 hours , no super intendant is going to extend the right to hold you for longer than that

guards often target people for petty reasons and attempt to stitch them up

tipptom · 31-01-2014 04:02PM

Ray Palmer wrote: »

Yet you ignore what I am telling you of my experience on the prejudicial view that I am somehow responsible. In other words you are victim blaming.

Unless I attack a Gardaí they have no reason to hit me. NO MATTER WHAT! They have no excuse to hitting a child which is what I was.

Do you think it is acceptable for an armed (baton) member of our police force to attack a child even if he was saying something smart (which I didn't do yet you assume I have)?

Because I used the term culchie you are assuming I have a prejudice. That is just a semantics issue there has been a lot worse assumptions made about people who are telling what happens to them. I am not a track suit scumbag as has been suggested and hinted at along with a list of issues raised about people from deprived areas. That is prejudice not the use of one term.

There can be victim blaming from both sides,how many guards have had their jaws broken and other injuries from "Children" down through the years?
What is it with "Culchie" guards that you think they could be trained in to bring the up to standard with Dublin Guards for the yoof culture?

Ray Palmer · 31-01-2014 04:06PM

Jonny7 wrote: »

YES - you go to hospital, you log it, and then you ask what options you have

My friend got punched by the police because he was being a ****ing drunk dick - were the police right to do it? no but it's not a perfect world, they are still human and they deal with some amount of ****

If there's an undeserved genuine incident - then report

If someone is being a complete douche - then expect the Gaurds to close ranks around their colleague

Life. Get used to it.

So once you think somebody is being an idiot it is okay to hit them. If you are Gardaí you expect your fellow cops to protect you for doing this. You don't see how that is a problem? Who is making this judgement call it is OK to beat one person over another? What is topping them doing it to people for no reason as they ACTUAL DO.

They aren't Judge Dread and physical punishment is illegal here too.

Utter ridiculousness to suggest somebody goes to A&E and wait however many number of hours for a punch.

So do you approve of the Gardaí involved in the May Day cover up?

Michael D Not Higgins · 31-01-2014 04:27PM

wicklowstevo wrote: »

he doesnt have to tell you , he just has to know him self and or be able to justify it later.

there is no requirement to tell you hat you are suspected of doing. how do you know that you didnt match the description of a criminal who was in the area or someone who has a warrant out for them.

its not always personal you know

In the case where a Garda is demanding your name and address under the provisions of Section 24 of the Public Order Act, then if they are not satisfied with your answer they may arrest you. By arresting you they have to tell you what they are arresting you for.

tipptom · 31-01-2014 05:15PM

Michael D Not Higgins wrote: »

In the case where a Garda is demanding your name and address under the provisions of Section 24 of the Public Order Act, then if they are not satisfied with your answer they may arrest you. By arresting you they have to tell you what they are arresting you for.

Do they not have to tell you why they want to know your name and address?

Ray Palmer · 31-01-2014 05:39PM

tipptom wrote: »

There can be victim blaming from both sides,how many guards have had their jaws broken and other injuries from "Children" down through the years?
What is it with "Culchie" guards that you think they could be trained in to bring the up to standard with Dublin Guards for the yoof culture?

Huge difference here is somebody attacking the Gardaí is doing something wrong. If you took up what I said saying a Gardaí can't defend himself you are way off. I have not heard of one story of the Gardaí having their jaws broken by children.

I didn't say anything resembling Culchie Gardaí being trained in youth culture. I said they have no comprehension of true urban underprivileged environment. They literally don't have the social skills or comprehension to defuse a situation instead they act like storm troopers and make situations worse.

Not seeing any Gardaí victims in what I have described. Does it mean it is OK they attack innocent people because they get attacked? That sounds like saying that a form of psychosis is acceptable in the Gardai. They are allowed attack people because their job is hard.

Saying somebody beaten up by the cops is fair enough because they probably didn't show enough respect as the cops are only human is not acceptable to me and NEVER will be. They should be held to a higher standard than a normal citizen not a lesser one and when on duty that is completely solid no movement they cannot attack people and cover for each other. If you accept this corruption then accept it all from the banks to the politicians.

JohnnyChimpo · 31-01-2014 05:56PM

Ray Palmer wrote: »

I have not heard of one story of the Gardaí having their jaws broken by children.

Tbf I don't think the Gardaí press office are gonna put out a memo when one of the lads takes a bateing off some 15yo scummer amateur boxer.

Sure look how they were with those pictures of the horse trying to ride the Garda in Smithfield. Didn't see the funny side at all.

Gardai harrasing me?

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