Extreme radical "feminists" suffering sexual oppression unto them

hatrickpatrick wrote: »

Honest question for those here who are either defending or identifying with the current feminist movement: do you support the censorship / anti free speech drive this movement is currently embedded in?

We can't talk about mainstream feminism without talking about Blurred Lines, violent porn, and offensive Facebook pages, unfortunately. I support any movement which seeks freedom from oppression but I can never support any movement which approves of censorship, and I view this as a massive elephant in the room when people say "if you don't call yourself a feminist you obviously don't believe in equal rights". It's an absolute straw man which ignores very glaring issues such as "I'm not a feminist because I don't believe any dog should be banned from being played regardless of how offensive some may find it." This has nothing to do with not wanting gender equality.

Well here's a reply from someone who doesn't agree with today's feminist movement.

I know I'm probably gonna be in the minority with this, particularly on the Internetzzzz, but I kind of agree with the feminists about porn...well...not ALL porn....but a lot of stuff. About a year ago I seen some porn that was made around the year 2000 and it was cheesy but kind of tasteful. As tasteful as two people humping in a purple upholstered limo can be. Whatever. If you go onto the homepage of PornHub nearly every thumbnail is of chicks being held in a way that suggests a level of force, pinned down etc... It's obviously faked but that's classed as 'normal'. Then there's the weird ****...

Was on a 122 a couple of months ago. Load of lads aged 13/14 get on in school uniforms and immediately begin talking about fisting, deep throating girls etc... Their first encounter is either going to be a reality check or a rape charge. Its not that long since I was in their shoes but we didn't have high speed broadband at home (56k, wooo!), and barely anyone had laptops, the first iPhone was still a year or two away, so porn was a 200x400 pixel set of knockers loading for around a minute while listening for footsteps on the stairs.

I don't agree with censorship though. I can just see where they're coming from. Plus porn is killing the sex drive and mental health an entire generation of men.

ElvisChrist6 wrote: »

I haven't really been keeping up with a lot of the stuff on this thread, but a lot of the MRA stuff you see is the Reddit-going mouth-breather type... morons. Whereas what it SHOULD be and can be is just focusing on things like custody and legal issues, treatment and views of male rape/abuse victims, male body issues etc. Not as a group against feminism or what some people think feminism has taken from anyone, but in parallel with it - as feminists should fight for womens rights, men's rights and wellbeing groups should fight for theirs; there's no point having experts in women's issues trying to tackle men's issues too. Harking back to a much earlier post, these "self-serving" groups are important, as it's much easier to tackle issues that you know about and that are specific than trying to tackle all of them. More groups tailored for their respective causes = more good done, in my view. Though it sometimes seems that way, the decent MRAs aren't acting in defense against feminism, but in defense of male needs as well. The main reason I'd associate with that at all is the completely devastating perspective people have on male abuse victims, how society views them and what it says about them. I can't imagine having been raped just to hear someone say a man can't be raped by a woman as some of the things people say is exactly what women would have been told probably not that long ago, and still sometimes are. So, don't go by those gob****es when viewing it.

Yeah, I know there's a lot of good men fighting for men's rights. Like I said earlier there was a recent controversy about a man (on a father's blog) getting abuse from people (and in his own view it was almost all men abusing him) because he posted a picture of him getting his daughter's ready for school. Which is a level of bat**** insanity that's hard to fathom.

I also think men being raped and abuse is a problem. I don't think the raw numbers are comparable to women being raped but that so many in society even deny the possibility of men being raped is simply disgusting, and I speak of that from personal experience.

Foxhound38 wrote: »

I've noticed that too - I was wondering if it was just my perception of it, but I have found a lot of porn in the last half decade or so getting increasingly and alarmingly rape-y in content. Putting aside the fact that such content that suggests force does absolutely nothing for me except raise my disguist levels, it is concerning that young teens both male and female are getting exposed to that as a representation of what real sex is supposed to be like - and I'm no "won't someone think of the children" type when it comes to the inevitability of teens watching porn.

I mean, I'm only 26 and I don't remember porn being anything near as extreme as your basic pornhub front page video now when I was growing up...

I'm 22, and even I remember when porn was two people having a dramatized shag. It looked fake and was fake.

The way porn is directed today is very degrading to the females. They're normally put in submissive positions and are aggressively handled. It's pretty common in porn to have the females grabbed by their hair and "forced" to go down on the man, or forcibly held in some position or other. Again, its all fake, but the directing and camera usage are all done in such a way so as to appear "amateurish".

Date My Porn Star made for difficult watching on 4OD. There was a part where pornstars were doing a live feed and were having sex with fans who won a competition or something. One girl was physically exhausted (this was going on for hours). She got up and ran off the set and collapsed on the floor. She was crying and said something to the effect of "I cant go back in there. I cant do it anymore". The director forced her back on set. I couldn't believe it. In every job, a very obvious mental breakdown like that would be treated seriously and she obviously was in no mindset to consent but her "boss" was very aggressive.

Then, after the live feed, the "owners" of the studio got to have their "owner" privileges with the girls.

Lyaiera wrote: »

I've seen 70s porn and it's not at all similar to the Erika Lust stuff (of course I'm not familiar with the breadth of 70s or 80s porn.) It's really not just a case of adding a plot, there's a lot more to it than that.

To put it in cliched terms its the difference between a self-serving basic sexual release and seeing sex as a communion of people.

X-Art, along with the "female friendly" section of PH is along these lines. The scenes are cinematic and the sex resembles how people actually have sex in a relationship.

It's fairly indicative of the problem however, that what should be considered normal porn is set aside for the women, whilst men have a constant stream of hardcore content.

Japan pioneered high-speed internet and are a few years ahead of the west when it comes to males and female turning into porn fueled robots. Vice did a piece on it and it's creepy as hell. Men paying for "cuddles" and basic intimacy. Women paying for men to talk to them and listen. The fact that 3D porn is around the corner scares me because this could become a reality in Ireland.

Doctor Jimbob wrote: »

I don't want to have to pay for cuddles. I like cuddles.

Cuddle yourself!

Lyaiera wrote: »

I know a guy who is a big fan of X-Art. I have to say they have some really good photographers.

And yeah, the porn issue is bad for all, not any particular gender. Unfortunately it seems women suffer the extreme results of it. I guess we need more hipster porn fans then. :pac:

I don't think the problems have even begun to be honest. Just based on what I've seen, the past five years has been a turning point. Everyone has broadband now, and kids have laptops. Boys and Girls are watching depraved **** online from the ages of 10. So it'll be another few years until the kids that are teenagers right now, are expected to be sexually healthy adults. I think that's when social issues will emerge from both genders.

If the trend continues, I can't imagine porn in the year 2020 being anything even remotely healthy for a teenager who'll spend a couple of hours each week (if not more) mindlessly watching the stuff in 8000p 3D.

Right now, people only seem outraged about the easy targets. American Apparel is constantly getting crap throw at them about their photography. Their clothes are crap and their CEO is an ass, but they're about the only clothing company that use random people off the street to model their clothes, don't photoshop them and use a pretty basic photography set-up.

A feminist group were outraged when they had a picture of a bikini model with slightly visible public hair. I still cant figure out why. And yet porn, for the most part, where entirely unrealistic bodies and photography is used, is ignored.

Wibbs wrote: »

Break it down please. Take into account hours worked for example.
This is a fallacy. For hours worked in the same positions the salaries are identical. Indeed more and more women are qualifying in the professions than men. How's that inequality?
On abortion you're right with regard to this country, but on other areas of bodily integrity? A helluva lot less so. Far far more research money is aimed at female specific conditions like cancer than is aimed at men specific conditions.

TL;DR? culturally accepted BS unless you can show otherwise. With actual facts. Objective links would be good too.

Tbh Wibbs, there's no point wasting your breath.

A lot of people will accept statistics blindly, without analysing them.

The wage gap exists in statistics, but research debunked it years ago. Abortion is supported by most people in this country and it isn't men holding down women when it comes to progress. There are men and women on both sides of the fence.

But some people love a good oppression story where there is none. If someone isn't going to at least do a little research and critical thinking, you could shove logic down their throats until the cows come home and get nowhere.

efb wrote: »

Can you give me the facts of the wage gap debunking?

Nope. Genuinely couldn't be arsed holding your hand through a fairly well versed subject area that's now accepted by even staunch feminists. There are scientific journals, articles and studies available. Google is your friend.