Rangers FC On Field Gossip & Rumour Thread 2017 Mod Note in OP(Updated 14/08)

Dempsey · 17-01-2014 04:48PM

Jelle1880 wrote: »

That is with all reserves, U20, U17,... included.

Ye have 56 professional & youth professional players. Celtic only have 50 despite the higher demands. Why even try to downplay that its a problem?

RoryMac · 17-01-2014 04:59PM

Jelle1880 wrote: »

That is with all reserves, U20, U17,... included.

3 or 4 decent players on top of your U20 & U17 squads would be more than enough to see you promoted, there is no need for the number of players on your books.

Jelle1880 · 17-01-2014 05:05PM

Dempsey wrote: »

Ye have 56 professional & youth professional players. Celtic only have 50 despite the higher demands. Why even try to downplay that its a problem?

Because it's already been mentioned that player wages are only a small part of the problem.

Is it too big ? Definitely.
Is it the reason for a possible new administration ? Not even close.

Let's say Rangers are bleeding around £1m/month, how will player wages being cut change much ? 15% of the £6-7m number that is being mentioned comes down to around £1m.

That will mean the club will break about even, but only for a time until the rest of the money runs out.

Will they gamble on a massive season ticket sale to get new cash in ?

Dempsey · 17-01-2014 05:17PM

Jelle1880 wrote: »

Because it's already been mentioned that player wages are only a small part of the problem.

Is it too big ? Definitely.
Is it the reason for a possible new administration ? Not even close.

Let's say Rangers are bleeding around £1m/month, how will player wages being cut change much ? 15% of the £6-7m number that is being mentioned comes down to around £1m.

That will mean the club will break about even, but only for a time until the rest of the money runs out.

Will they gamble on a massive season ticket sale to get new cash in ?

Sweet Jesus!

Your wage bill is the 2nd highest in Scotland despite being 2 divisions below the top flight. It is a significant contributing factor to the IPO being bled out of the club.

The 15% wage bill reduction isnt going to sort the issue by itself but if ye didnt have such a high wage bill in the 1st place, would ye heading for administration just over 1 year after an IPO that was suppose to last you to the top division!

Depending on future season tickets to keep the club afloat.....sounds familiar :rolleyes:

Jelle1880 · 17-01-2014 08:34PM

Dempsey wrote: »

Sweet Jesus!

Your wage bill is the 2nd highest in Scotland despite being 2 divisions below the top flight. It is a significant contributing factor to the IPO being bled out of the club.

The 15% wage bill reduction isnt going to sort the issue by itself but if ye didnt have such a high wage bill in the 1st place, would ye heading for administration just over 1 year after an IPO that was suppose to last you to the top division!

Depending on future season tickets to keep the club afloat.....sounds familiar :rolleyes:

Nobody is denying that the wage structure is too high, but this whole thing sounds more like a deflection of the actual issue, namely the fact that pretty much all the money from the IPO and season tickets has gone.

And it hasn't gone all to player wages.
Not even close.

bobbysands81 · 17-01-2014 09:05PM

Jelle1880 wrote: »

That is with all reserves, U20, U17,... included.

You have to PAY to use your youth players, you don't own them... unless NewCo changed that.

LiamoSail · 17-01-2014 10:49PM

Jelle1880 wrote: »

Nobody is denying that the wage structure is too high, but this whole thing sounds more like a deflection of the actual issue, namely the fact that pretty much all the money from the IPO and season tickets has gone.

And it hasn't gone all to player wages.
Not even close.

Similar sentiments from the worlds best paid cheer leader today at his press conference.

Keeping McCoist happy for so long was key to the whole sale and leaseback swindle IMO. He endorsed spiv after spiv after spiv. He got the fans onside, helped sell thousands of season tickets and millions worth of shares, all the while getting his own little piece for pittance. At least he'll eventually walk away a wealthy man, while all those who invested their hard earned money in their club, will be left only with a fraction of their investment, and the knowledge that it was their investment that was loaned to the club by RIFC, thereby facilitating RIFC's claim to the assets (Ibrox and Murray Park).

Deprived of Ibrox, rangers can never again hope to compete IMO

Hagar the Nice. · 18-01-2014 01:26AM

A fool,well 2 actually,and their money is easily parted.lol.
If Rangers fans honestly believe this article from the Express then they need certified.

EXCLUSIVE: Easdale brothers to plough £20m into Rangers

JAMES and Sandy Easdale are poised to plough around £20million into cash-strapped Rangers.

By: Graham ClarkPublished: Fri, January 17, 2014

0Comments
James and Sandy Easdale are set to give Rangers a well-needed cash boost [WILLIE VASS]

The Greenock businessmen, already significantly involved in the Ibrox club as shareholders and directors, are edging closer to selling their bus firm and are considering investing massively in the stricken League One leaders.

The brothers are already understood to have knocked back approaches for McGill’s Buses amid rumours that one £80m offer wasn’t enough and that they’re holding out for £100m.

If they succeed in getting a buyer at that price, the speculation is they will aim to increase their stake at Ibrox by investing about £20m.

James, on the club’s plc board, and Sandy, who is chairman of the football board, have been building up their shareholding in recent months as they look to tighten their grip on the club.

They are now generally recognised to be the powers behind the throne at Ibrox.

The Easdales took over McGill’s in 2001 and, after moving back into the black by posting profits of £659,404 compared with a loss of more than £550,000 the year before, their turnover has almost doubled from £15m to £28m following the takeover of rival Arriva Scotland West nearly two years ago.

These figures have made McGill’s an attractive proposition and it is a business the Easdales are prepared to offload as they have other interests, including taxi firms and private rental and commercial property.

The jury remains out on the Gers’ board simply because little or no information is passed the supporters’ way and stories like yesterday’s in Express Sport that players had rejected chief executive Graham Wallace’s suggestion they take a 15 per cent cut in wages has done little to quell their concerns over the club’s financial position.

Wallace, in fact, has declared there is no chance of a second administration but conceded the club can’t continue to run the way it is amid suggestions it is losing around £1m a month.

And, even if the Easdales were to splash their cash, there would still be a need to rein in the general costs.

But, if the Greenock pair put up around £20m, it would go a long way to easing the near-critical state at the club and, of course, help appease and win over worried fans.

Dempsey · 18-01-2014 01:36AM

....and lamb is on the menu today for breakfast, lunch & dinner!

Hagar the Nice. · 18-01-2014 01:54AM

.......and you can bet they will be doing cartwheels........until the wheels fall off again.

Coillte_Bhoy · 18-01-2014 04:18AM

Genuinely, i do feel sorry for EB and BBE and even Jellie, i logged on tonight to take the piss but sure what's left to say? Hey don't get me wrong, i'll enjoy the soap opera thats going to unfold but lads, hey i genuinely feel for ye, ye're ****ed and it's going to be a long road back. I am of course going to post any gifs etc

Jelle1880 · 18-01-2014 04:30AM

LiamoSail wrote: »

Similar sentiments from the worlds best paid cheer leader today at his press conference.

Keeping McCoist happy for so long was key to the whole sale and leaseback swindle IMO. He endorsed spiv after spiv after spiv. He got the fans onside, helped sell thousands of season tickets and millions worth of shares, all the while getting his own little piece for pittance. At least he'll eventually walk away a wealthy man, while all those who invested their hard earned money in their club, will be left only with a fraction of their investment, and the knowledge that it was their investment that was loaned to the club by RIFC, thereby facilitating RIFC's claim to the assets (Ibrox and Murray Park).

Deprived of Ibrox, rangers can never again hope to compete IMO

That's not as simple as it sounds, they don't just get the claim.

LiamoSail · 18-01-2014 11:24AM

Jelle1880 wrote: »

That's not as simple as it sounds, they don't just get the claim.

If the club run out of cash, as their only major creditor what's to prevent RIFC getting the assets?

As the club are wholly owned by RIFC, there isn't an issue in transferring the assets (in terms of cheating shareholders), the issue arises with the creditors of the club. Once they're paid, I don't see what can prevent RIFC taking them

Dempsey · 18-01-2014 12:44PM

LiamoSail wrote: »

If the club run out of cash, as their only major creditor what's to prevent RIFC getting the assets?

As the club are wholly owned by RIFC, there isn't an issue in transferring the assets (in terms of cheating shareholders), the issue arises with the creditors of the club. Once they're paid, I don't see what can prevent RIFC taking them

England+v+West+Indies+1st+NatWest+ODI+LAHeL-Xx9XDl.jpg

/cough :pac:

LiamoSail · 18-01-2014 01:01PM

Dempsey wrote: »

/cough :pac:

The ownership of the assets is nothing to do with Regan or Doncaster.

Duff & Phellps hardly acted in the fans interests previously. I see no reason why, if the club were to go into admin, they would act any differently this time

Dempsey · 18-01-2014 01:14PM

LiamoSail wrote: »

The ownership of the assets is nothing to do with Regan or Doncaster.

Duff & Phellps hardly acted in the fans interests previously. I see no reason why, if the club were to go into admin, they would act any differently this time

It was tongue in cheek but you come across abit naive tbh. Those are pictures of people with their own agendas despite the rules governing football and have questionable ethics when it comes to doing business deals. They'll swing it whatever way makes the most money for them and makes them look good in the media, a crippled Rangers doesnt suit Regan or Doncaster at all so they'll side with the fans and whoever wants to keep the club and assets together and do whatever they can behind the scenes to get what they want to happen to happen like they have done already. Administrators will do whatever to protract the process of doing what they are suppose to do because they like money aswell which gives opportunities to things that shouldnt happen like 5 way agreements that all the parties didnt want made public.

LiamoSail · 18-01-2014 01:26PM

Dempsey wrote: »

It was tongue in cheek but you come across abit naive tbh. Those are pictures of people with their own agendas despite the rules governing football and have questionable ethics when it comes to doing business deals. They'll swing it whatever way makes the most money for them and makes them look good in the media, a crippled Rangers doesnt suit Regan or Doncaster at all so they'll side with the fans and whoever wants to keep the club and assets together and do whatever they can behind the scenes to get what they want to happen to happen like they have done already. Administrators will do whatever to protract the process of doing what they are suppose to do because they like money aswell which gives opportunities to things that shouldnt happen like 5 way agreements that all the parties didnt want made public.

Regan can only assist the club in matters relating to their licence etc. the transfer of assets from the club to the company that owns the club is absolutely nothing to do with him

I don't dispute your point about the administrators, but they're appointed by the club. RIFC, much as Whyte did, will make sure they appoint administrators that act in accordance with their agenda

Assuming the club are eventually put into administration, in what way can Regan or Doncaster possibly influence what happens Ibrox and Murray Park?

I'm not disputing that they have an agenda, but the ownership of the assets is far removed from their scope

Dempsey · 18-01-2014 01:37PM

LiamoSail wrote: »

Regan can only assist the club in matters relating to their licence etc. the transfer of assets from the club to the company that owns the club is absolutely nothing to do with him

I don't dispute your point about the administrators, but they're appointed by the club. RIFC, much as Whyte did, will make sure they appoint administrators that act in accordance with their agenda

Assuming the club are eventually put into administration, in what way can Regan or Doncaster possibly influence what happens Ibrox and Murray Park?

I'm not disputing that they have an agenda, but the ownership of the assets is far removed from their scope

Ibrox & Murray Park are worthless without a club & club licence...

Did you ever think you'd ever see a new club getting passed off as the old one? It happened in Scotland and all the above helped facilitate that scam on the Rangers supporters for their own agenda/benefit. If you think that their influence is limited to the scope of their job description then you are sadly mistaken.

LiamoSail · 18-01-2014 01:55PM

Dempsey wrote: »

Ibrox & Murray Park are worthless without a club & club licence...

Did you ever think you'd ever see a new club getting passed off as the old one? It happened in Scotland and all the above helped facilitate that scam on the Rangers supporters for their own agenda/benefit. If you think that their influence is limited to the scope of their job description then you are sadly mistaken.

I'm not necessarily disagreeing with your view on Regan & co.

I'm of the belief that the club will run out if money, RIFC will get Ibrox and the club will be taken over, or a new club started,by Rangers men. The club will then have to rent Ibrox off RIFC. I don't see how Regan or Doncaster can prevent the transfer of the assets, and their form would suggest they will facilitate the Rangers men.

I don't believe there will be a doomsday scenario. Rangers won't cease to exist, they'll just be confined to a future starved of revenue without a ground

Dempsey · 18-01-2014 02:05PM

LiamoSail wrote: »

I'm not necessarily disagreeing with your view on Regan & co.

I'm of the belief that the club will run out if money, RIFC will get Ibrox and the club will be taken over, or a new club started,by Rangers men. The club will then have to rent Ibrox off RIFC. I don't see how Regan or Doncaster can prevent the transfer of the assets, and their form would suggest they will facilitate the Rangers men.

I don't believe there will be a doomsday scenario. Rangers won't cease to exist, they'll just be confined to a future starved of revenue without a ground

"Rangers Men" failed to step up and be counted on when the club went into administration the last time and were ultimately liquidated whilst they kept their hands and money in their pockets. TBH, I dont think the current incarnation will run out of money before the season ticket renewals comes along. Rangers fans have already voted with their feet & money, I dont see that changing.

A Dub in Glasgo · 18-01-2014 02:07PM

'McCoist admitted to being in the dark as to the possible consequences should significant cuts not be made. "That's a question I am unable to answer thankfully. We can all interpret in our own ways what might happen. But I have been told that [a second] administration effectively will not happen. We are looking for pluses and that has got to be a plus. But in terms of what would happen if things don't happen I can't tell you because I am ignorant of that."'

http://www.heraldscotland.com/sport/football/wallace-assures-no-administration-but-mccoist-fearful-of-player-sales.23208413

WTF?

LiamoSail · 18-01-2014 02:11PM

Dempsey wrote: »

"Rangers Men" failed to step up and be counted on when the club went into administration the last time and were ultimately liquidated whilst they kept their hands and money in their pockets. TBH, I dont think the current incarnation will run out of money before the season ticket renewals comes along. Rangers fans have already voted with their feet, I dont see that changing.

The last time they didn't step in because the prerequisite was putting their hands in their pockets. I don't think that will be necessary next time, in that there will nobody else looking for it or wanting it. The club will have no value

I agree the current incarnation still have some way to go. The advantages to them in prolonging events are that they'll milk even more from the club, and reduce the price of a complete takeover of RIFC, which at present would be expensive on the basis of the previous share price

Dempsey · 18-01-2014 02:13PM

A load of nonsence from McCoist. He doesnt have a clue how the cuts are going to be made, the 15% pay cut rejection "effectively" put the squad up for sale whether they admit that in public or not, but the board have planned a way to ensure that administration "effectively" will not happen??

McCoist's loyalty to what the club was is being used and abused by the boardroom

weldoninhio · 18-01-2014 02:39PM

Dempsey wrote: »

A load of nonsence from McCoist. He doesnt have a clue how the cuts are going to be made, the 15% pay cut rejection "effectively" put the squad up for sale whether they admit that in public or not, but the board have planned a way to ensure that administration "effectively" will not happen??

McCoist's loyalty to what the club was is being used and abused by the boardroom

From what i've seen over the past few years, McCoists loyalty is to Ally McCoist and ££££££££. Backed spiv after spiv, while taking an extortionate pay cheque and a million penny shares to sweeten the deal.

Hagar the Nice. · 18-01-2014 05:54PM

weldoninhio wrote: »

From what i've seen over the past few years, McCoists loyalty is to Ally McCoist and ££££££££. Backed spiv after spiv, while taking an extortionate pay cheque and a million penny shares to sweeten the deal.

That's it in an nutshell,he may have been one of their best ever goalscorers but he's robbing them blind,thing is,its down to the guys who gave him the contract.
Its been a long 2 years for their fans,much worse than we were put through that's for sure,

weldoninhio · 18-01-2014 05:59PM

Thats because we mobilized as fans and ran the spivs out of Celtic Park. The rangers fans have buried their heads in the sand time after time after time. With David Murray, Craig Whyte, Charles Green. They were warned and warned again and they came back with "obsessed" "the celts are worried now" etc. whenever anyone told them that they were being fed bullshit.

Its coming up to the end-game now. More and more hedge-funds buying stakes in the club, i can only guess that they can see what we can see and that a sale and leaseback is the main outcome, and their clients will get a nice yearly payout from the rental paid on Ibrox. With no money going back into the actual club, if the club survives.

Jelle1880 · 18-01-2014 06:58PM

weldoninhio wrote: »

Thats because we mobilized as fans and ran the spivs out of Celtic Park. The rangers fans have buried their heads in the sand time after time after time. With David Murray, Craig Whyte, Charles Green. They were warned and warned again and they came back with "obsessed" "the celts are worried now" etc. whenever anyone told them that they were being fed bullshit.

Its coming up to the end-game now. More and more hedge-funds buying stakes in the club, i can only guess that they can see what we can see and that a sale and leaseback is the main outcome, and their clients will get a nice yearly payout from the rental paid on Ibrox. With no money going back into the actual club, if the club survives.

You waited for McCann to step in with his money and then backed him.

That's not 'running spivs out of Celtic Park'.
The protests against the board by the Celtic fans resulted in the same as those at Ibrox: Not much.

http://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/sport/football/football-news/fergus-mccanns-battle-save-celtic-3013568

He pretty much did the same as what some of the Rangers groups attempted now (Blue Knights, McColl's group,...), with the difference that the board of Celtic back then completely misread his intentions. The ones at Ibrox are fully aware of how to keep other people out.

The 'obsessed' thing is not exactly because we were warned, it's because of what's clearly visible in this thread.

weldoninhio · 18-01-2014 07:32PM

When he took over at Celtic, there were 7000 season ticket holders and when he left, there were 53,000. The rest, as they say, is history.

Yeah, nothing to do with the fans :rolleyes:

Dempsey · 18-01-2014 07:42PM

Jelle1880 wrote: »

You waited for McCann to step in with his money and then backed him.

That's not 'running spivs out of Celtic Park'.
The protests against the board by the Celtic fans resulted in the same as those at Ibrox: Not much.

http://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/sport/football/football-news/fergus-mccanns-battle-save-celtic-3013568

He pretty much did the same as what some of the Rangers groups attempted now (Blue Knights, McColl's group,...), with the difference that the board of Celtic back then completely misread his intentions. The ones at Ibrox are fully aware of how to keep other people out.

The 'obsessed' thing is not exactly because we were warned, it's because of what's clearly visible in this thread.

From the same article

By the time of Celtic’s AGM in October, White and Kelly had decided to vote Dempsey off the board, less than six months after he joined.

Dempsey went on to become the focal point for a campaign for change at the club.

Maybe you should do abit of googling on the role of Dempsey and how he galvanised the fans and helped bring down the old regime that was killing the club but you trot out the nonsense that is bolded

Jelle1880 · 18-01-2014 07:50PM

Dempsey, you seriously need to read what is actually said.

I never said that the Celtic fans didn't help in getting McCann in, which was ultimately the best move.

But they didn't 'run the spivs out', those decisions were made well above the head of any fan.

And since you asked so friendly *cough* I googled Brian Dempsey.

http://www.thecelticwiki.com/page/Brian+Dempsey

Dempsey had some strong supporters in the press (in particular the highly sycophantic Gerry McNee) which helped him, but his support amongst the club supporters seemed to decline.

He had made announcements that he would put bids to the board for the takeover, and if it failed he would walk away. They never did put any bids forward and never did walk away

Oh, and:

"Mr McCann is taking the club in the wrong direction. It is because of this that I have decided I will not be back at Celtic as part of the team for the future."