Zlatan with some real talk about women's footy

Chancer3001 · 27-12-2013 03:54PM

How do you know they happen every week??

Show me any other result!?

What really hampers women's soccer is having the same size goals. Hope solo , probably the greatest ever women's keeper is 2 inches taller than Messi...

Chancer3001 · 27-12-2013 03:55PM

Xavi6 wrote: »

That's a team of future professionals. Indeed, some of them would be playing top level football within a couple of years.

Your claim that you and a group of other Sunday leaguers "would beat the best women's soccer team" is a million miles from that and simply not true.

But they are 15 year old boys...size matters such a. Huge amount at that level that a much much worse group of 18 year old boys would hammer them.

Xavi6 · 27-12-2013 03:58PM

Chancer3001 wrote: »

But they are 15 year old boys...size matters such a. Huge amount at that level that a much much worse group of 18 year old boys would hammer them.

The 15/16 year olds would hammer your team too, by more.

I think you're putting way too much emphasis on strength/size and not enough on technical ability. Those academy teams aren't winning because they're bigger, it's because they are better footballers.

In a sliding scale - academy teams >>>>> the best women's teams >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> your average Sunday league teams

Chancer3001 · 27-12-2013 04:27PM

Nah totally disagree.

The 15 year olds wouldn't hammer us. We'd beat them.

A much much worse senior team will beat a kids team.

A kids team 15+ will beat a women's team.

Show me any example of a women's team doing well against boys teams?

ush · 27-12-2013 04:31PM

The conversation shouldn't be about the differences between the womens and mens game. Zlatan's comments were directed against fellow professionals.

Swedish media are saying that he was planning the comments for the past month. Anders Svensson received a car as an award for his cap record a while back. Therese Sjögran, who has most caps for the ladies, didn't. Thats the background.

Also there was an interview during last week; Swedish reporter Johanna Frändén interviewed Laurnet Blanc. Blanc patronised her about her knowledge of the game.

So maybe there's a bigger aspect to this. Zlatan is maybe trying to comment on Sweden's sense of gender equality. Which is unfortunate. He's bigger and more gracious than this. He's proven it plenty of times. I suspect he'll honestly regret this.

BNMC · 27-12-2013 04:35PM

You're wrong here Zavi6. I played LSL for a season, we played the Irish Ladies U21 team. We beat them 13-0 and that was only 30 minutes a half. They had that keeper that plays with Arsenal (Emma Byrne?) in goals and she was hopeless. They are so slow compared to men.

TBH I was actually shocked by how bad they were. To be fair though, they have a lot of skill but that's the only area they could compete with men.

Antifa161 · 27-12-2013 04:38PM

Soft Falling Rain wrote: »

I don't know about that, I've seen some women run absolute rings around their male counterparts. I don't find it hard to believe at all that a good women's side would be able to put it up to a conference team.

I remember there being a thread in AH about whether Katie Taylor would able to compete with an amatuer male equivalent, it was an interesting read.

Every time this argument ceases to be hypothetical, it is proved entirely wrong.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Germany_women%27s_national_football_team
The German women’s national team has played several exhibition matches against male teams, most notably losing 0–3 to the VfB Stuttgart Under-17 squad in preparation for the 2003 World Cup.

There's also several examples of seriously unfit, lowly ranked male tennis players absolutely destroying the best women's tennis players going.

If you want an even match up in soccer I think you seriously need to be pairing the best professionally coached women's teams with casual kickabout teams of men who don't play with any tactics or structure.

yohan the great · 27-12-2013 04:39PM

Soft Falling Rain wrote: »

I don't know about that, I've seen some women run absolute rings around their male counterparts. I don't find it hard to believe at all that a good women's side would be able to put it up to a conference team.

I remember there being a thread in AH about whether Katie Taylor would able to compete with an amatuer male equivalent, it was an interesting read.

Are you serious? You are really underestimating the quality of the conference I think. I wouldn't be surprised if a good Sunday league team beat a very good professional woman's team

Mars Bar · 27-12-2013 04:45PM

Why the need to even compare? It's bloody stupid. At no point will there ever be a meaningful game where women will take on men.

The only thing this kind of conversation does is hurt the pride of a few men who feel insulted that someone might think a woman is better at a "mans game" than them.

Antifa161 · 27-12-2013 04:50PM

Mars Bar wrote: »

Why the need to even compare? It's bloody stupid. At no point will there ever be a meaningful game where women will take on men.

The only thing this kind of conversation does is hurt the pride of a few men who feel insulted that someone might think a woman is better at a "mans game" than them.

lol I don't think it's that 'side' who have their pride hurt in these debates. Not when every piece of available evidence suggests that they are correct.

The point is not that men's football is better than women's, that is not really up for debate. The point is that this lame drive to overcompensate for this and pretend that people care about the women's game needs to stop. It's patronising women at the very least.

Skid X · 27-12-2013 04:59PM

Kerrigooney wrote: »

Zlatan is a class A,gold plated troll. I wouldn't take anything he says too seriously.

Nothing trollish about giving your honest opinion to a silly question

"I was asked [by Swedish media] in the summer who was the better player, me or [Sweden striker] Lotta Schelin. You're joking with me, right? When I've broken all these records, this goal record, the goals in the national team, who shall I compare it to? Shall I compare it to whoever has the record, or the ladies?"

Far more able bodied Males on the planet have played Football at some point in their lives than Females. Zlatan has got to the top of his profession against huge competition. Women's Football doesn't have anything like the same participation levels Worldwide. It is much easier for a talented female to become a World Class Player, purely on the basis of the amount of players she is competing against.

To claim he is only as good as his equivalent in the Womens' team is doing him a serious injustice.

Mars Bar · 27-12-2013 05:00PM

Antifa161 wrote: »

The point is not that men's football is better than women's, that is not really up for debate. The point is that this lame drive to overcompensate for this and pretend that people care about the women's game needs to stop. It's patronising women at the very least.

This is a waste of time.

ush · 27-12-2013 05:01PM

Antifa161 wrote: »

lol I don't think it's that 'side' who have their pride hurt in these debates. Not when every piece of available evidence suggests that they are correct.

The point is not that men's football is better than women's, that is not really up for debate. The point is that this lame drive to overcompensate for this and pretend that people care about the women's game needs to stop. It's patronising women at the very least.

Is that you Sepp?

ush · 27-12-2013 05:03PM

Skid X wrote: »

To claim he is only as good as his equivalent in the Womens' team is doing him a serious injustice.

Who made that claim?

enfant terrible · 27-12-2013 05:06PM

Xavi6 wrote: »

The 15/16 year olds would hammer your team too, by more.

I think you're putting way too much emphasis on strength/size and not enough on technical ability. Those academy teams aren't winning because they're bigger, it's because they are better footballers.

In a sliding scale - academy teams >>>>> the best women's teams >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> your average Sunday league teams

Not sure here is the comments of a coach of a boys team that played the USWNT

"I suspect that all the teams that were involved were asked to ratchet down the physicality as not to injure anyone. This undoubtedly was a good thing because in the handful of collisions that did occur the women more then not got the worst of it."

http://www.bigsoccer.com/community/threads/uswnt-vs-so-cal-boys-odp.929075/

This is against boys of course not fully grown men.

Mars Bar · 27-12-2013 05:07PM

Antifa161 wrote: »

Wow you're good at this, I can see why you're a mod.

Why would I waste my time? You clearly feel the women's game is a waste of time while I actively do work for women's football. You are not going to be converted and you are not going to help any drive to improve women's football. No matter what I say is going to change your opinion is it?

Antifa161 · 27-12-2013 05:12PM

Mars Bar wrote: »

Why would I waste my time? You clearly feel the women's game is a waste of time while I actively do work for women's football. You are not going to be converted and you are not going to help any drive to improve women's football. No matter what I say is going to change your opinion is it?

I don't think it's a wast of time at all, I guess you haven't been reading my posts.

Mars Bar · 27-12-2013 05:18PM

Antifa161 wrote: »

I don't think it's a wast of time at all, I guess you haven't been reading my posts.

Fair enough, you didn't say it was a complete waste of time. My apologies.

It just gets on my wick when this conversation pops up and turns in to "my pub team would be the German women's team".

As for the dressing it up more than it is is patronising? No it's not. The women put in such hard work while attending college or doing part time work (Niamh Fahey for example) and people think it doesn't deserve the air time are wrong in my opinion. We need more televised women's game and we need more publicity. We need more over the top praise.

The_Kew_Tour · 27-12-2013 05:26PM

If the German National team were to play in Ireland what standard would they be at?(bit of guess I know)

Seaneh · 27-12-2013 05:29PM

The_Kew_Tour wrote: »

If the German National team were to play in Ireland what standard would they be at?(bit of guess I know)

I'd say LSL would beyond them to be honest.

enfant terrible · 27-12-2013 05:32PM

Mars Bar wrote: »

Fair enough, you didn't say it was a complete waste of time. My apologies.

It just gets on my wick when this conversation pops up and turns in to "my pub team would be the German women's team".

As for the dressing it up more than it is is patronising? No it's not. The women put in such hard work while attending college or doing part time work (Niamh Fahey for example) and people think it doesn't deserve the air time are wrong in my opinion. We need more televised women's game and we need more publicity. We need more over the top praise.

They need to link it to the men's game like women's tennis do.

The standard of women's tennis is a lot lower than men's but once people get to know the players they become interested.

They should have the women play before the FA cup final etc.

niallo27 · 27-12-2013 05:39PM

enfant terrible wrote: »

They need to link it to the men's game like women's tennis do.

The standard of women's tennis is a lot lower than men's but once people get to know the players they become interested.

They should have the women play before the FA cup final etc.

Women's golf is huge as well. I think football is more of a common game if you know what I mean. It would be very hard to convert fans.

enfant terrible · 27-12-2013 05:42PM

niallo27 wrote: »

Women's golf is huge as well. I think football is more of a common game if you know what I mean. It would be very hard to convert fans.

Is women's golf huge I wouldn't know the name of one player.

niallo27 · 27-12-2013 05:44PM

enfant terrible wrote: »

Is women's golf huge I wouldn't know the name of one player.

In the states it is. It's not huge as such compared to men's game but gets a lot of tv time.

enfant terrible · 27-12-2013 05:49PM

niallo27 wrote: »

In the states it is. It's not huge as such compared to men's game but gets a lot of tv time.

One women's sport that's really taking off is women's MMA.

Ronda Rousey is making a fortune being the first women's UFC champion.

Mars Bar · 27-12-2013 06:13PM

enfant terrible wrote: »

They need to link it to the men's game like women's tennis do.

The standard of women's tennis is a lot lower than men's but once people get to know the players they become interested.

They should have the women play before the FA cup final etc.

The Olympics kind of did that which was great.

The FAI did the same with the FAI Cup Final.

enfant terrible · 27-12-2013 06:16PM

Mars Bar wrote: »

The Olympics kind of did that which was great.

The FAI did the same with the FAI Cup Final.

That's good but a FA cup, CL or World Cup final would be a different ball game.

ArmaniJeanss · 27-12-2013 06:24PM

enfant terrible wrote: »

That's good but a FA cup, CL or World Cup final would be a different ball game.

As in play the womens cup final at Wembley a few hours before the mens final?
That wouldn't be good for either game to be honest....
Fans of the mans game complaining about 10,000 tickets or whatever being unavailable for them. Meanwhile the fans of the two womens teams having to pay £80 or whatever a Wembley ticket would cost, and the game itself taking place in what would look a deserted Wembley.

Sir Gallagher · 27-12-2013 06:56PM

ush wrote: »

The conversation shouldn't be about the differences between the womens and mens game. Zlatan's comments were directed against fellow professionals.

Swedish media are saying that he was planning the comments for the past month. Anders Svensson received a car as an award for his cap record a while back. Therese Sjögran, who has most caps for the ladies, didn't. Thats the background.

Also there was an interview during last week; Swedish reporter Johanna Frändén interviewed Laurnet Blanc. Blanc patronised her about her knowledge of the game.

So maybe there's a bigger aspect to this. Zlatan is maybe trying to comment on Sweden's sense of gender equality. Which is unfortunate. He's bigger and more gracious than this. He's proven it plenty of times. I suspect he'll honestly regret this.

Ibrahimovic "gracious" really?

enfant terrible · 27-12-2013 07:00PM

ArmaniJeanss wrote: »

As in play the womens cup final at Wembley a few hours before the mens final?
That wouldn't be good for either game to be honest....
Fans of the mans game complaining about 10,000 tickets or whatever being unavailable for them. Meanwhile the fans of the two womens teams having to pay £80 or whatever a Wembley ticket would cost, and the game itself taking place in what would look a deserted Wembley.

Depends if you want the women's game to grow or not.

If you do then they're going to need help and even inconvenience others.

I'm sure the old stalwarts of the tennis game had no interest in watching women's tennis in the early 70's either.

Zlatan with some real talk about women's footy

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