Zlatan with some real talk about women's footy

Antifa161 · 27-12-2013 01:38AM #1

Players in the men's national football team deserve to get more recognition than their female counterparts in Sweden and people should stop whipping up a gender storm about it, striker Zlatan Ibrahimovic has said. His comments have sparked disappointment from Pia Sundhage, the coach of the Swedish women's national team, who branded them 'boring' and 'sad'.

http://www.theguardian.com/football/2013/dec/26/zlatan-ibrahimovic-branded-boring-sad-womens-football-remarks

Now I'm all for equal rights but the pandering to women's football of late has been quite pathetic/amusing. The BBC frequently try and trick people into reading stories about it by dressing them up as if it's the men's game and you see games televised that are miles behind Conference tier games in both quality and following.

That said, the woman who broke her respective scoring record does deserve some level of recognition and I can see why people might feel she was snubbed.

All Ibra's points are spot on though, and the women's coach makes a right arse of it with her closing comment there. "We're doing the exact same thing.... but don't compare us!".

Kerrigooney · 27-12-2013 09:34AM

Zlatan is a class A,gold plated troll. I wouldn't take anything he says too seriously.

Soft Falling Rain · 27-12-2013 09:53AM

Antifa161 wrote: »

you see games televised that are miles behind Conference tier games in both quality and following.

I don't know about that, I've seen some women run absolute rings around their male counterparts. I don't find it hard to believe at all that a good women's side would be able to put it up to a conference team.

I remember there being a thread in AH about whether Katie Taylor would able to compete with an amatuer male equivalent, it was an interesting read.

Too Tough To Die · 27-12-2013 10:09AM

I find him quite tiresome but can't really disagree with him on this issue.

Milkers · 27-12-2013 10:38AM

Most discussion of women's sport that involves comparison with the men's version is both stating the obvious and missing the point.

Oranage2 · 27-12-2013 10:47AM

Soft Falling Rain wrote: »

I don't know about that, I've seen some women run absolute rings around their male counterparts. I don't find it hard to believe at all that a good women's side would be able to put it up to a conference team.

I remember there being a thread in AH about whether Katie Taylor would able to compete with an amatuer male equivalent, it was an interesting read.

Not a chance, skill wise maybe, physically and athletic wise, men would destroy women every time in a game of football.

Chancer3001 · 27-12-2013 12:32PM

I got warned last time i said that me and my buddies would beat the best women's soccer team.

I'm not trolling and maybe I'm miles off. But that's what I believe.

I've watched a decent bit of women's soccer and the general standard is terrible.

The American team does have a class keeper though!

Xavi6 · 27-12-2013 12:40PM

Chancer3001 wrote: »

I got warned last time i said that me and my buddies would beat the best women's soccer team.

What standard are you and your buddies at?

If you're just a bunch of lads who enjoy a kick about on a Sunday then there isn't a chance you would.

Chancer3001 · 27-12-2013 12:42PM

Yeah decent Sunday league standard.one or two very good Sunday league standard.

That's about the level I've seen in the women's games I've watched.

9/10 of us would be faster stronger than all of them too.

Xavi6 · 27-12-2013 12:44PM

Decent Sunday league standard wouldn't be anywhere near good enough technically to match them, they would just pass and move around you.

Take it from someone who watches international women's players every second week and has played against them (I also play at a good Sunday league standard).

Chancer3001 · 27-12-2013 12:46PM

I don't know.

I've watched a good bit too and the technique always looks very very poor.

Xavi6 · 27-12-2013 12:47PM

I had the same impression as you until I played against some Australian internationals. They ran rings around the team I was on, and had no problem getting stuck in.

Try organise a game against one of Ireland's top club sides, see how you go

ush · 27-12-2013 12:56PM

I've seen some of the Swedish ladies team train at my gym. That is all.

Oranage2 · 27-12-2013 01:45PM

Xavi6 wrote: »

I had the same impression as you until I played against some Australian internationals. They ran rings around the team I was on, and had no problem getting stuck in.

Try organise a game against one of Ireland's top club sides, see how you go

Was this 5 a side or a full sized pitch for 90 minutes?

Xavi6 · 27-12-2013 01:47PM

Oranage2 wrote: »

Was this 5 a side or a full sized pitch for 90 minutes?

Both, though not 90 minutes. If anything, it would be more difficult over a longer period given they're semi professional athletes and fatigue would be more of a factor.

GreeBo · 27-12-2013 01:52PM

You see the same arguments in rugby, local team reckons they would destroy any top level ladies team.
Sure the men are stronger but the professional skill level means that you just don't get near the ball. They pass and run rings around you and you look like clowns.

27-12-2013 01:58PM

GreeBo wrote: »

You see the same arguments in rugby, local team reckons they would destroy any top level ladies team.
Sure the men are stronger but the professional skill level means that you just don't get near the ball. They pass and run rings around you and you look like clowns.

Sorry but no, in Rugby the physicality would win every time. They frankly wouldn't be quick enough to run rings around the mens team. In Football they could move the mens team around with quick passing etc. but not in Rugby.

Seaneh · 27-12-2013 02:06PM

GreeBo wrote: »

You see the same arguments in rugby, local team reckons they would destroy any top level ladies team.
Sure the men are stronger but the professional skill level means that you just don't get near the ball. They pass and run rings around you and you look like clowns.

As a teenager I played in games at training/ just for the mess against womens teams which included a few irish internationals and we, a bunch of 17 - 18 year olds all looked head an shoulders above the Irish international girls.

They had decent hands but that was about it. Some of them didn't even have that.

Seaneh · 27-12-2013 02:10PM

And, btw, everything Zlatan said is spot on.

Getting 147 caps for the mens team is far more of an achievement than getting 184 for the womens team.

Women often break into the first team at 16 or 17 and carry on playing until they are in their late 30's.

Men break in a lot later and retire a lot earlier in general and have far, far more and much higher standard competition.

Mars Bar · 27-12-2013 02:13PM

I'm not even going to bother!

Xavi6 · 27-12-2013 02:23PM

Seaneh wrote: »

And, btw, everything Zlatan said is spot on.

Getting 147 caps for the mens team is far more of an achievement than getting 184 for the womens team.

Women often break into the first team at 16 or 17 and carry on playing until they are in their late 30's.

Men break in a lot later and retire a lot earlier in general and have far, far more and much higher standard competition.

Not necessarily. Women tend to retire a lot earlier than men, most in their mid to late 20s because with age comes more responsibility. They aren't professionals so a career is important and many want to start families.

In the most recent Australia squad, as an example, there were only six players aged 25 or older out of 23. The domestic league follows a similar pattern in terms of the make up of teams.

While that's just one example off the top of my head, I think it's similar for most other countries too.

micks · 27-12-2013 02:41PM

Xavi6 wrote: »

I had the same impression as you until I played against some Australian internationals. They ran rings around the team I was on, and had no problem getting stuck in.

Try organise a game against one of Ireland's top club sides, see how you go

I have seen one of the top club sides in this country play against schoolboy teams over the last 4 years
Its been the same trend with different age group (of boys) against senior Ladies team with lots of current and past internationals
vs U14 Boys - Ladies win comfortably
vs U15 Boys - Close games either draw or goal either way
vs U16 Boys - Boys win comfortably

The boys teams would be decent schoolboys teams but by no means top

GreeBo · 27-12-2013 02:58PM

AdamD wrote: »

Sorry but no, in Rugby the physicality would win every time. They frankly wouldn't be quick enough to run rings around the mens team. In Football they could move the mens team around with quick passing etc. but not in Rugby.

Physicality doesn't win rugby matches any more than football matches, otherwise the islanders would be be best in the world.

Also, saying that women can't be quick enough run around men is just silly. Speed is speed, sure the world record is held by a man, but it's only 1s faster than the women's record.

GTR63 · 27-12-2013 02:58PM

"I was asked [by Swedish media] in the summer who was the better player, me or [Sweden striker] Lotta Schelin. You're joking with me, right? When I've broken all these records, this goal record, the goals in the national team, who shall I compare it to? Shall I compare it to whoever has the record, or the ladies?"

In fairness :pac: :pac: :pac:

Chancer3001 · 27-12-2013 03:14PM

I've seen u16 Gaelic football teams destroy the best women's gaa county teams.

Somebody else has seen it in soccer.

It's going t be the same in most team games.
Once lads get to 16/17 they're going to be ahead of the women's teams.

Even the women's World Cup isn't that high a standard.

I'm probably going to get banned, but just being honest!!

EuropeanSon · 27-12-2013 03:22PM

Chancer3001 wrote: »

I've seen u16 Gaelic football teams destroy the best women's gaa county teams.

Somebody else has seen it in soccer.

It's going t be the same in most team games.
Once lads get to 16/17 they're going to be ahead of the women's teams.

Even the women's World Cup isn't that high a standard.

I'm probably going to get banned, but just being honest!!

There's a vast difference between the best amateur players in a county and the best professional players in the world. Silly comparison.

Xavi seems to have actually seen good women's teams regularly, so I'll trust his opinion on this one.

Certainly I'd say the German national women's team would batter most non professional men's teams.

Chancer3001 · 27-12-2013 03:32PM

http://www.thelocal.se/20130116/45646

This might help some people see things clearer.

The aik club team, under17 boys team, 15 and 16 year olds,who took out a defender and played with 10 men, beat the senior women's national Swedish team 3-0.....that's a boys club team against a national team.

ArmaniJeanss · 27-12-2013 03:41PM

Chancer3001 wrote: »

http://www.thelocal.se/20130116/45646

This might help some people see things clearer.

The aik club team, under17 boys team, 15 and 16 year olds,who took out a defender and played with 10 men, beat the senior women's national Swedish team 3-0.....that's a boys club team against a national team.

Thats fairly meaningless though, in much the same way as Cardiff beating Man City a few weeks ago isn't a sign that Cardiff are better than Man City.

If the Swedish womens team play regularly against local U-X boys teams in a training set-up then they are occasionally going to get beaten and its this result which will hit the papers. And I assume they do play such games regularly (like the US womens team who play 20+ such fixtures a year) as it makes more sense than organising international friendlies most of which they'd crush.

Chancer3001 · 27-12-2013 03:43PM

American women team lost 8-2 to the u17 team...

They play against boys because they want to play against better opposition. Improve themselves that way.

The fact they are playing against 15 and 16 year olds tells it's own story.

ArmaniJeanss · 27-12-2013 03:50PM

Chancer3001 wrote: »

American women team lost 8-2 to the u17 team...

Like thats my point, you (or a like-minded individual) highlighted that 8-2 result during the last World Cup as proof of something or other.

Yet the US Womens team play such fixtures all the time, close to a weekly basis apparently, as otherwise their competitive games would be limited to neverending friendlies against Canada. But that 8-2 defeat is the only result that makes the papers. Which to me implies that its the serious outlier.

Xavi6 · 27-12-2013 03:52PM

Chancer3001 wrote: »

http://www.thelocal.se/20130116/45646

This might help some people see things clearer.

The aik club team, under17 boys team, 15 and 16 year olds,who took out a defender and played with 10 men, beat the senior women's national Swedish team 3-0.....that's a boys club team against a national team.

That's a team of future professionals. Indeed, some of them would be playing top level football within a couple of years.

Your claim that you and a group of other Sunday leaguers "would beat the best women's soccer team" is a million miles from that and simply not true.

Zlatan with some real talk about women's footy

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