What makes someone Irish?

Oranage2 wrote: »

White, Catholic and must know at least 3 lines of the national anthem.

Thats me off the hook

Ziphius wrote: »

Incest is also a requirement? :pac:

Hah! I mean on both sides....

Turtyturd wrote: »

Being born here.

Guy A is born in Ireland. Six months later his parents emigrate to Canada. He's raised in Canadian schools, with Canadian friends. He knows nothing of Ireland other than his parents used to live there once.

Guy B is born in India. Six months later his parents immigrate to Ireland. He loves Ireland as if it were his home. He is an Irish citizen, he pays Irish taxes, we watches Irish TV, eats Irish food, cheers at Irish sporting events.

I'd say Guy B is a lot more Irish than Guy A.

Just asked a older gentleman here at work. His answer:

Knowing how to foot turf, solo a ball, genuflect while doing a half hard blessing of yourself and, most importantly, 10 different ways to prepare spuds.

My ten cents, whatever floats your boat. If you want to count yourself Irish, learn the above and you're there

UCDVet wrote: »

Guy A is born in Ireland. Six months later his parents emigrate to Canada. He's raised in Canadian schools, with Canadian friends. He knows nothing of Ireland other than his parents used to live there once.

Guy B is born in India. Six months later his parents immigrate to Ireland. He loves Ireland as if it were his home. He is an Irish citizen, he pays Irish taxes, we watches Irish TV, eats Irish food, cheers at Irish sporting events.

I'd say Guy B is a lot more Irish than Guy A.

Guy A is Irish, because usually people are referring to ethnicity and not citizenship. Guy B and his children and children's children will never be Irish, because it's completely impossible. When referring to ethnicity and ethnic "heritage" for want of a description.

Guy A might also very well never have an Irish passport, never set foot in the place. After about 3 generations his kids will be "Canadian". That's simply how I look at it.

Some countries and citizenships are constructed out of economic constructs based on emigration - US, Australia, Canada, etc., . Most European, Asian and African countries are actually consisting of people with some common ethnic line.

Likewise, having a British passport doesn't make you English; but British is a common identity among English, Scottish, and other immigrantsetc., . There are definitely English people, as much as Welsh people, etc., There are Irish people and there are people who have assumed Irish citizenship.

Ireland may be unique in culturally not having a word for people who are not from here. Most likely because people speak English. What is the Irish word for people who are not from here but live here (e.g., Auslander, Buitenlander/Allochtoon, Gaikoku-jin and gaijin, Etranger, etc., etc., ). Virtually every country has one but always in the native language.

coimhthíoch?
eachtrannach?

I have no idea. Using the English word "Irish" will always lead to this argument because it's unsolvable. How do you refer to people who are not from here, in a language that itself has only one word to describe you and everybody here because the language itself is borrowed from another country.

poundapunnet wrote: »

I'm not sure I follow your argument, if it's about ethnicity then an Irish person could become Scottish for example? Is Denzel Washington American? What nationality are people who are ethnically Jewish? If someone is mixed race are they automatically the nationality that goes with the ethnicity of the non-Caucasian parent?

That's exactly the point. Some countries like the US, Canada, etc., are based on citizenship/nationality and on the other hand, countries not primarily founded on emigration from Europe, Africa or Asia are not.

When someone says are you Irish? That includes people ethnically Irish who are from Ireland, and also a different group of people who have assumed citizenship. The argument essentially boils down to people who want a US/UK type of dissociation from any ethnic heritage a country would have (i.e., anyone with a passport from Ireland is Irish) and the other group with people who are born, parents, etc. , from Ireland and being caucasian, being Irish.

As long as there is only one word, it will always lead to one or the other side. The reason I see it as, is because in English there is only one word to descirbe everyone in Ireland. The other countries of Africa, Europe, Asia, pretty much all have native descriptive words to differentiate someone ethnically from here, and someone who is not.

Fundamentally, it is impossible to see this if you can only view things from the perspective of one language. French people are all French if you view it from just English. But clearly, there are English and then there are British, there are Francais and Etranger, in Judeism there are Jewish people and Goyim. Israel is founded on people itself immigrating there. In fact I think it is the norm for any group of similar people to recongise this and have it in volcabuilary. But because we use English, it can never be solved in Ireland. Hence New Irish, Irish African, etc., But it doesn't fit and doesn't seem correct, because someone from Nigerian doesn't necessarily want to be "Irish". Nor someone from India to be English, but might have British citizenship. None of these other words other nations have such as gaijin, auslander, etranger, buitenlander, goyim are essentially negative. My point is that they simply exist because they just do. In ireland, as we speak English, we do not have this distinction. Therefore we end up with two sides arguing.

The lack of English vocabulary and use of English itself is the issue in Ireland.

Why are people from India in the UK not refered to as "Indian English" or the "New English". Because that is ridiculous, that is why. But in Ireland, "New Irish" or "Indian Irish" is what the media come up with, and it is ....ridiculous

I propose that the new blanket term for citizenship and nationality is "Oirish" to equate with British in the UK. You can be Romanian with Oirish Citizenship.

Turtyturd wrote: »

Being born here.

like those famous Paddies The Duke of Wellington and Francis Bacon?

Referring to the police force in any country whatsoever around the world, as "the guards".

Referring to any electricity supplier/network in any country whatsoever around the world, as "the ESB".