Parish Pump Mentality

mattjack · 25-07-2013 05:12PM

Duckworth_Luas wrote: »

Wait, a local politician is doing something for the benefit of the people in his locality? Go 'way! :eek:

I expected the mayor of Ballina to be mediating a peace agreement in Syria!

He's just waiting on the Luas to be built to take him to Syria.

BuilderPlumber · 15-11-2013 12:47AM

The term parish pump politics has a bad name and the concept of abolishing the parish pump mentality has often been touted as the way to go. But, be careful what we wish for!!

Sure, we do need to see the end of cute hoors pretending they care about their electorate, claiming everything from fixed potholes to the success of launches of events as their doing even though it never is! But, we need to be aware of other issues too.

What would the non-parish pump politician be?? Even worse, much worse actually. The affable cute hoor may claim they can give you everything but at the very least they would be approachable and may buy you a drink. The non-parish pumper will be aloof from the people, never accessible and will say he is a legislator who has no time for meeting with his/her electorate.

A very very dangerous attitude this would become and very dictatorial. I see this mentality developing in the current government and again it is more of seemingly giving the people what they want but taking more really.

The people may be sick of the cute hoor but they will hate the aloof legislator who does not even care one iota about being liked by his/her electorate. The solution is for politicians to engage more with the people and help the people achieve their goals. Less time in the Dail and more time down in their constituencies. Politics should deliver this:

Each county should also have the following: a minister (have 26 of them and less TDs), a hospital, a VEC, a few major employers the government can support, and be within easy reach of a third level college.
A true support of both rural and urban initiatives.
A willingness to listen to and engage with the people.
Build a level of trust and respect with the people.

At present, politicians are despised by and large by people. This should come as no surprise for those politicians who trample on our vote, continue on with negative and unpopular policies, and attempt no real initiates to tackle the problems. A gang of fat cats living at our expense is what we rightly see them as. A serious PR campaign is needed and the talentless, autocratic and liars need to be weeded out of Irish politics.

sabat · 15-11-2013 01:00AM

BuilderPlumber wrote: »

Each county should also have the following: a minister (have 26 of them and less TDs), a hospital, a VEC, a few major employers the government can support, and be within easy reach of a third level college.

There are more people within a square mile of my house in Dublin than in all of Leitrim. A far more progressive step would be to abandon the administrative divisions drawn up by Elizabethan settlers-they're a large part of the reason Irish people are so dumb.

the groutch · 15-11-2013 01:16AM

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cjl8OIZijjY

jobeenfitz · 15-11-2013 01:23AM

I know its only a mythical place but I still like Ballina. Drumsna is another mythical place close to me heart.

BuilderPlumber · 15-11-2013 09:19AM

sabat wrote: »

There are more people within a square mile of my house in Dublin than in all of Leitrim. A far more progressive step would be to abandon the administrative divisions drawn up by Elizabethan settlers-they're a large part of the reason Irish people are so dumb.

Whatever the reason, Ireland generally seems to be broken up into rich counties centred around the major cities (apart from one or two obvious cities where this is not the case) and poorer counties such as Offaly, Roscommon, Monaghan, Leitrim, Waterford and Kerry. Many of the poorer counties are often poorly represented by politicians.

Something needs to be done to destroy the unevenness of this country and why some regions have mass exoduses of people (Dublin is full of people from the so-called Border, Midlands and West region and indeed, non-Dublin people now outnumber Dublin people in much of the capital). Dublin cannot sustain everyone (think back to the 1970s when Tehran drew loads of poorer people into it because the rest of Iran too was a ghost town with little opportunity. This lead to a dangerous and harmful revolution and a war with Iraq that set Iran back 200 years in many ways). A capital city full of disillusioned migrants therefore is not healthy.

anncoates · 15-11-2013 09:25AM

jobeenfitz wrote: »

I know its only a mythical place but I still like Ballina. Drumsna is another mythical place close to me heart.

My heart will always be in Drumsbanbo, but.

anncoates · 15-11-2013 09:29AM

BuilderPlumber wrote: »

A capital city full of disillusioned migrants therefore is not healthy.

A cursory examination of the subhumans in Coppers or Flannerys would appear to readily confirm this analysis.

Grayson · 15-11-2013 11:05AM

BuilderPlumber wrote: »

Whatever the reason, Ireland generally seems to be broken up into rich counties centred around the major cities (apart from one or two obvious cities where this is not the case) and poorer counties such as Offaly, Roscommon, Monaghan, Leitrim, Waterford and Kerry. Many of the poorer counties are often poorly represented by politicians.

Something needs to be done to destroy the unevenness of this country and why some regions have mass exoduses of people (Dublin is full of people from the so-called Border, Midlands and West region and indeed, non-Dublin people now outnumber Dublin people in much of the capital). Dublin cannot sustain everyone (think back to the 1970s when Tehran drew loads of poorer people into it because the rest of Iran too was a ghost town with little opportunity. This lead to a dangerous and harmful revolution and a war with Iraq that set Iran back 200 years in many ways). A capital city full of disillusioned migrants therefore is not healthy.

This isn't brazil where we have half a million people living in shanty towns. Unemployment is actually better in dublin than it is in large parts of the country. Dublin can sustain it's current population. have you got any evidence that it can't?

We don't need a minister in every county. Then we'd be picking someone to be a minister because they're a kerryman. That's just dumb.

We do need fewer politicians in the dail. That would give politicians a larger constituency and would stop them from being so local in their priorities. national politicians should not be acting like local politicians. That's what county councils are for. We might end up with fewer publicans in the dail.

goose2005 · 15-11-2013 03:09PM

R P McMurphy wrote: »

The greatest ever parish pump politician is perhaps one of the most respected and was indeed Dublin based: Tony Gregory. I was in his constituency for many years and thought he represented the area to great effect and was a very affable fellow

In fairness his area was desperately poor. And it's often forgotten that most of the Dublin poor are only one or two generations removed from culchies - the farm labourers were no longer needed when mechanisation came, so they had to leave and the landowners stayed

15-11-2013 03:39PM

For Forks Sake wrote: »

You know what my area is lacking actually, that is an actual parish pump....where's my local TD???

Someone stole the pump down the road from me.

Davelarson · 15-11-2013 03:59PM

The amount of whinging I've heard from people from Connacht, especially Mayo, would make your head spin.

diomed · 15-11-2013 04:17PM

So we will shortly have a motorway between Ballina and Castlebar? Nice.

goose2005 · 15-11-2013 04:17PM

Davelarson wrote: »

The amount of whinging I've heard from people from Connacht, especially Mayo, would make your head spin.

Dublin population density: 1,380 per km2
Connacht: 30.

That's why dem up in dublin get evrytin

diomed · 15-11-2013 04:24PM

First a new motorway, then free cars so they will be able to use it.

Ghost Buster · 15-11-2013 04:40PM

snubbleste wrote: »

Ballina has a mayor?

Longford has two mayors (Town and County) and Granard (1 street village in county Longford) has its own mayor.:(

ShaneMc2012 · 15-11-2013 04:48PM

Construction of the M18 from Gort to Tuam is about to begin again, over time I think it will eventually lead up to Sligo-Letterkenny. Although I'm sure everyone would love a dual carriageway to their town, this project is the only somewhat justifiable way for a dual carriageway in Mayo..

Wolf Club · 15-11-2013 05:02PM

Davelarson wrote: »

The amount of whinging I've heard from people from Connacht, especially Mayo, would make your head spin.

Whinging about what exactly?

goose2005 · 15-11-2013 06:35PM

ShaneMc2012 wrote: »

Construction of the M18 from Gort to Tuam is about to begin again, over time I think it will eventually lead up to Sligo-Letterkenny. Although I'm sure everyone would love a dual carriageway to their town, this project is the only somewhat justifiable way for a dual carriageway in Mayo..

Why would it go to Letterkenny? Derry's much bigger

catallus · 15-11-2013 06:39PM

Isn't "parish pump politics" common to every country in the world, ever? It is the way politics works, I thought.

ScumLord · 15-11-2013 06:45PM

goose2005 wrote: »

Dublin population density: 1,380 per km2
Connacht: 30.

That's why dem up in dublin get evrytin

And as such our needs aren't that great, many people are going in the same direction and one motorway would solve the traffic nightmares that everyone in the west has to suffer through on a daily basis. They just waste money on pointless roadworks where they're not needed rather than doing the one thing that will go some way to making everybodies lives easier.

It's sickening to constantly hear that the rest of the country doesn't deserve modern amenities because we don't have the same population density as Dublin, even though Dublin's a tiny county. And it's attitudes like yours that enforces parish pump politics because I'll be damned if I'm going to vote for a major party just to have all our issues ignored so Dublin can suck up all our money.

goose2005 wrote: »

Why would it go to Letterkenny? Derry's much bigger

Because Derry is in another country.

chopper6 · 15-11-2013 06:58PM

ScumLord wrote: »

And as such our needs aren't that great, many people are going in the same direction and one motorway would solve the traffic nightmares that everyone in the west has to suffer through on a daily basis. They just waste money on pointless roadworks where they're not needed rather than doing the one thing that will go some way to making everybodies lives easier.

.

Which direction is that?

The road up to Dublin?

ShaneMc2012 · 15-11-2013 07:38PM

goose2005 wrote: »

Why would it go to Letterkenny? Derry's much bigger

Im not sure, this is the plan for it anyway? https://us.v-cdn.net/6034073/uploads/attachments/534256/280469.PNG

Davelarson · 15-11-2013 07:40PM

Wolf Club wrote: »

Whinging about what exactly?

They act like there's a conspiracy to keep them in third world conditions.

unfortunately · 15-11-2013 07:50PM

Part of the N13 connects Letterkenny to Derry, a very sort section of this (5km) is dual carriage way.

Wolf Club · 15-11-2013 08:30PM

Davelarson wrote: »

They act like there's a conspiracy to keep them in third world conditions.

Oh yeah? Where did you hear this? Was it from talking to people from Mayo? Hearing them on the tv/radio?

CrabRevolution · 15-11-2013 10:30PM

A lot of people here are saying we need to 'think nationaly' and that we need to elect politicians to serve the country as a whole.

That's all well and good, but generally i get the impression that thinking of the national interest means the same as 'give Dublin more things' to the people most passionately promoting the idea.

BuilderPlumber · 20-11-2013 01:07AM

catallus wrote: »

Isn't "parish pump politics" common to every country in the world, ever? It is the way politics works, I thought.

It is the system in all EU countries, all commonwealth countries, other European countries like Turkey, Russia, former Yugoslavia, Ukraine, etc. Also, the USA, Mexico and South America. It has taken hold in recent years also in Iran, most of Africa, Pakistan, India, China, Southeast Asia (Thailand, Vietnam, etc.), Iraq, even Afghanistan.

There are some non-parish pump politics countries and low and behold two of them are the worst dictatorships currently in the world: Eritrea and North Korea.

BuilderPlumber · 20-11-2013 01:15AM

CrabRevolution wrote: »

A lot of people here are saying we need to 'think nationaly' and that we need to elect politicians to serve the country as a whole.

That's all well and good, but generally i get the impression that thinking of the national interest means the same as 'give Dublin more things' to the people most passionately promoting the idea.

That's the problem and it ain't even 'Dublin' but it means giving all money to 'the nation' which is a vague definition. The money goes into some mystery pot never to be seen again.

While I stated that parish pump politics often has a bad name of having politicians who claim they are responsible for every good event in a town, the opposite type of politician is worse. The aloof legislator who does not care about being nice and approachable is a very dangerous type of politics and one that borders on total dictatorship. Ireland is already 60% on the road to dictatorship so any further move in that direction would be very very dangerous.

How many very nasty regimes sprung up by using a PR campaign of giving the people what they want but interpreting it very differently. I think this is what we need to remember.

-when the people speak of a desire to end parish pump, they mean an end to dishonest cute hoors. They want their politicians to work harder and deliver requests of the people.
-a government could instead interpret it as a way to make themselves less approachable and say they are concentrating of being 'legislators'. This would be much worse (politicians would not even be meeting people and could do what they like) than the affable lying Killinaskully style cute hoor.

Lapin · 20-11-2013 01:23AM

LivelineDipso wrote: »

Are people living west of the Shannon aware that they are citizens of a nation called Ireland and not their local GAA county colours?

That could have been funny if it weren't for the fact that Bertie Ahern was the ultimate parish pump politician whose dogged insistance that the national children's hospital be built on the Mater Hospital site in his constituency has resulted in prolonging anguish of hundreds of families in this country and genuine pain for their children.

Now he is gone and the Mater site has been deemed totally unsuitable,(something everyone else knew 10 years ago). Tens of millions of euro has been wasted and not a single brick has been laid in the consruction of a new hospital. :mad:

I could tell you where to shove your parish pump OP.

Parish Pump Mentality

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