Child removed from Roma gypsies-This time in DUBLIN Mod Warning Post #1

Eight Ball · 22-10-2013 10:58PM

LionelNashe wrote: »

All we know about this Irish case is that a kid has been taken away from her family, but we don't know if she was taken away from her family by the Roma, years ago, or taken away from her family today by the guards while she was watching television.

I think the guards & the authorities showed good judgement in not charging anyone here, unlike the Greek case. If it turns out that the Greek kid was given to that Roma familiy by a Roma mother, for example, then there are no grounds for kidnapping accusations.

I wonder how many Irish people in this thread have one sibling or one child in their own family who is the only blonde haired blue eyed kid in the house - I'd say more than a few.

Then why lie about the childs birth date and place of birth?

cerastes · 22-10-2013 10:59PM

Duggy747 wrote: »

It really does have the possibility of something very big being uncovered, I imagine a lot of attention from authorities will be more focused on the Roma during this period.

And then it will all blow over

emo72 wrote: »

On a serious note. Any Roma holding girls like this will get really worried. Wonder will kids be dumped and turn up out of nowhere

dead or alive?

deseil wrote: »

What about any of the darker kids that they may have taken chances are they ll never be found.

exactly, why isn't this all checked when someone enters a port into the country shipping/airport

Nodin wrote: »

Neither of which is as of yet proven.

Id rather they err on the side of caution and were wrong, than turn a blind eye. At one point I couldnt find my childs birth cert, but there has to be a way that is acceptable to determine if a child is simply in the wrong persons care, even if there is nothing untoward happening as surely thats not legal anyway, but if they aren't in the care of their legal guardians or an authorised person, then its suspect that something else is going on, and not legit.

DebDynamite wrote: »

Well, there's a free GP service in Tallaght for them anyway

http://www.sundayworld.com/top-stories/news/free-gp-service

Christ on a bike, been to a GP once in about 5 years, cant afford to go and Ive needed to.

Eight Ball · 22-10-2013 11:00PM

ted1 wrote: »

A couple of billion euro in aid. Several hundred thousand jobs from FDI as a result of companies using Ireland to access the EU.

Remember that thing were a member if, it dies have its pros and cons

Cons is the right term to use when referring to the Roma alright.

Donaldio · 22-10-2013 11:01PM

Yeah of course in a few years they could get her pregnant and have her sit there on the street corner with a photo of here baby
then instant earner !

seamus · 22-10-2013 11:01PM

falan wrote: »

One father was pimping out his own 14 year old son...He'd stand on the corner watching as his son got into cars with strange men...
About time these people were sent home

That's an awesome solution, wash our hands of it.
Kind of fits neatly into my earlier post about how we arrest "normal" people for breaking the law but when it comes to the Roma we'd prefer to pretend they don't exist rather than intervene.

How's about we fnck the bastard into a prison to rot and take all of his children permanently into care, rather than sending them all away for some other country to deal with?

Frank Grimes · 22-10-2013 11:05PM

seamus wrote: »

How's about we fnck the bastard into a prison to rot and take all of his children permanently into care, rather than sending them all away for some other country to deal with?

Because that doesn't involve pitchforks and angry mobs.

Merkin · 22-10-2013 11:09PM

There's a multi layered complex and sinister underbelly to human trafficking, it's not just simply a case that one person is trafficked and it stops there. Also not as clear cut to assume these kids have been kidnapped. How do you know they're not the products of rape/prostitution to trafficked women locked up in rooms against their will? My suspicion would be that these poor kids don't have roots or family per se but have been brought into the world in a sinister and cruel environment and used for begging purposes until they in turn can be prostituted out or sold to paedophiles. They are merely a commodity to those who trade in humans, there to fulfil a purpose until they can be sold on.

What a terrible start in life for these poor little mites

cerastes · 22-10-2013 11:20PM

Merkin wrote: »

There's a multi layered complex and sinister underbelly to human trafficking, it's not just simply a case that one person is trafficked and it stops there. Also not as clear cut to assume these kids have been kidnapped. How do you know they're not the products of rape/prostitution to trafficked women locked up in rooms against their will? My suspicion would be that these poor kids don't have roots or family per se but have been brought into the world in a sinister and cruel environment and used for begging purposes until they in turn can be prostituted out or sold to paedophiles. They are merely a commodity to those who trade in humans, there to fulfil a purpose until they can be sold on.

What a terrible start in life for these poor little mites

I think you have it right, the only way to seperate these children from their caretakers/minders has got to be DNA, otherwise, what are they doing with them in their care?

Raking it in for what they can get at every level, social welfare, begging, theft, prostitution,
Im not saying all ,but people dont like to believe this happens

loubeelou · 22-10-2013 11:23PM

Merkin wrote: »

There's a multi layered complex and sinister underbelly to human trafficking, it's not just simply a case that one person is trafficked and it stops there. Also not as clear cut to assume these kids have been kidnapped. How do you know they're not the products of rape/prostitution to trafficked women locked up in rooms against their will? My suspicion would be that these poor kids don't have roots or family per se but have been brought into the world in a sinister and cruel environment and used for begging purposes until they in turn can be prostituted out or sold to paedophiles. They are merely a commodity to those who trade in humans, there to fulfil a purpose until they can be sold on.

What a terrible start in life for these poor little mites

This country has long ignored the issues surrounding human trafficking. One can only hope that this case and the case if the child at the GPO put enough pressure on our lawmakers to start taking these issues seriously.

Annasopra · 22-10-2013 11:29PM

josip wrote: »

Why would Pavee point be involved? Travellers and Roma are as different as Irish and Greeks.

Pavee Point represent travellers and Roma - In European definitions Roma is an umbrella group that includes travellers

Merkin · 22-10-2013 11:31PM

Interesting piece here

http://www.thejournal.ie/readme/human-trafficking-sexual-exploitation-pimps-ireland-1134297-Oct2013/

Galwayguy35 · 22-10-2013 11:33PM

ted1 wrote: »

A couple of billion euro in aid. Several hundred thousand jobs from FDI as a result of companies using Ireland to access the EU.

Remember that thing were a member if, it dies have its pros and cons

I don't think it's too much to ask that if foreigners come to this country they should at least make a worthwhile contribution to it.

Every country the Roma go to it's the same thing, begging on the street and stealing.

Munstermad · 22-10-2013 11:35PM

I wonder are we just at the tip of a massive child abuse iceberg? My apologies if this has already been said, I came in late in the discussion.. I have an awful gnawing feeling at the pit of my stomach that this is going to be huge... That we are looking at something pretty horrific... I really really hope I'm wrong.

Roger_007 · 22-10-2013 11:43PM

Munstermad wrote: »

I wonder are we just at the tip of a massive child abuse iceberg? My apologies if this has already been said, I came in late in the discussion.. I have an awful gnawing feeling at the pit of my stomach that this is going to be huge... That we are looking at something pretty horrific... I really really hope I'm wrong.

Don't worry......you're wrong.

MonsterCookie · 22-10-2013 11:46PM

Apart from the abductions, begging, drugs, firearms, and other forms of organised crime....what have the Roma ever done for us?:D

Slafella · 22-10-2013 11:47PM

mango salsa wrote: »

Pavee Point represent travellers and Roma - In European definitions Roma is an umbrella group that includes travellers

There was a woman on Prime Time tonight from Pavee point ,she received the usual soft spoken interview from Miriam O'Callaghan ,no hard questions,no challenges on any of her mealy mouthed PC statements and certainly no interruptions .
And of course she got to play the old race card for all it was worth

Annasopra · 22-10-2013 11:48PM

Slafella wrote: »

And of course she got to play the old race card for all it was worth

And rightly so. Roma people in Ireland face regular racial abuse.

Munstermad · 22-10-2013 11:49PM

Roger_007 wrote: »

Don't worry......you're wrong.

I'll be absolutely delighted to be wrong

.... Am rarely a negative nellie, and I wouldn't normally offer an opinion without knowing a lot more.....hopefully my radars well off course today..

whatdoicare · 22-10-2013 11:50PM

JAMM222 wrote: »

http://www.sundayworld.com/top-stories/news/roma-girl-s-family-says-it-will-be-all-okay-shell-be-home-tomorrow

According to this it's an "aunt" who's stating this. Doesn't mean it's actually going to happen - why would the Gardai call the family and tell them it's all okay but that they'll just hang onto the girl a little while longer for no reason at all? That doesn't make even a little bit of sense.

Slafella · 22-10-2013 11:52PM

MonsterCookie wrote: »

Apart from the abductions, begging, drugs, firearms, and other forms of organised crime....what have the Roma ever done for us?:D

They help keep the boys and girls from Pavee Point off the dole

Artful_Badger · 22-10-2013 11:52PM

Slafella wrote: »

There was a woman on Prime Time tonight from Pavee point ,she received the usual soft spoken interview from Miriam O'Callaghan ,no hard questions,no challenges on any of her mealy mouthed PC statements and certainly no interruptions .
And of course she got to play the old race card for all it was worth

Hard to avoid the racial angle though considering this was all brought about because the family was Roma and the kid didnt look like a Roma. Chinese kid with Irish parents and there's no report.

Thats not to say anyone was wrong though. Someone was concerned, the Gardai investigated and the mess was caused by the failure of the family to provide documentation relating to the child.

cerastes · 22-10-2013 11:57PM

mango salsa wrote: »

And rightly so. Roma people in Ireland face regular racial abuse.

Do they?
All Ive ever experienced is people trying to get away and stay clear of them

while Im sure there are some Roma here to work legitimately,
That doesnt seem to be the case for a lot of them, I'm sure I'll get pointed and shouted at as a racist, but my observation is thats all Ive ever seen.
There does seem to be the claim that you cant get access to social benefits if not employed here for 2 years in a legitimate manner?
So what employment roles do the Roma fill, I dont know?

dj jarvis · 23-10-2013 12:02AM

Roger_007 wrote: »

Don't worry......you're wrong.

you sound so sure - but yet it be widely reported that the roma have organized rings of child slaves who they force to beg and worse.

it does happen , not all abuse is sexual - i take it you did not watch the link i posted - Ireland is mentioned in the documentary

BlaasForRafa · 23-10-2013 12:03AM

mango salsa wrote: »

And rightly so. Roma people in Ireland face regular racial abuse.

Thieving and begging are intrinsic parts of the Roma way of life, it's no surprise that they aren't welcomed with open arms in pretty much any country in europe.

Gatling · 23-10-2013 12:07AM

BlaasForRafa wrote: »

Thieving and begging are intrinsic parts of the Roma way of life, it's no surprise that they aren't welcomed with open arms in pretty much any country in europe.

I hear Afghanistan is welcoming

Rabbo · 23-10-2013 12:08AM

Sky News were reviewing tomorrows UK newspapers earlier and the Daily Star, classy as ever, has the child's photograph and name splashed on the front page

Roger_007 · 23-10-2013 12:10AM

dj jarvis wrote: »

you sound so sure - but yet it be widely reported that the roma have organized rings of child slaves who they force to beg and worse.

it does happen , not all abuse is sexual - i take it you did not watch the link i posted - Ireland is mentioned in the documentary

There are whole sections of society where life is tough and successive generations follow in the footsteps of their forefathers and (foremothers). It is unfair to single out a particular racial group and make them the scapegoats for all the social problems and criminal activities. It's much more complex than that

Annasopra · 23-10-2013 12:14AM

cerastes wrote: »

Do they?

Yes
See these reports as a start

http://www.nascireland.org/wp-content/uploads/2013/05/NASC-ROMA-REPORT.pdf

http://www.eaea.org/oed-projekt/doc/rescources/Roma-Communities-in-Ireland.pdf

dj jarvis · 23-10-2013 12:18AM

Roger_007 wrote: »

There are whole sections of society where life is tough and successive generations follow in the footsteps of their forefathers and (foremothers). It is unfair to single out a particular racial group and make them the scapegoats for all the social problems and criminal activities. It's much more complex than that

hang on , the cops had a concern , they were correct , does not matter the ethnic makeup of the family
the fact that the Greek case happen a week ago probably peeked an interest , but they were correct in following up.

as i said - if it turns out that its a false claim , we should all be happy

BlaasForRafa · 23-10-2013 12:18AM

Roger_007 wrote: »

There are whole sections of society where life is tough and successive generations follow in the footsteps of their forefathers and (foremothers). It is unfair to single out a particular racial group and make them the scapegoats for all the social problems and criminal activities. It's much more complex than that

No-one is saying that Roma are responsible for all social ills, and trying to assert that people are saying that is just trying to deflect from the issues.

If crime is endemic in one section of society then we shouldn't just ignore it because of a desire to be politically correct.

Child removed from Roma gypsies-This time in DUBLIN *Mod Warning Post #1*

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Child removed from Roma gypsies-This time in DUBLIN Mod Warning Post #1