Formula 1 2013: General Discussion Thread

Bugatti · 10-10-2013 11:46pm

flazio wrote: »

Thought Jordan had Works engines in 1999 when HHF had a decent outside shot at the Championship?

No, Jordan were using still using the Mugen Honda engine in 1999. BAR had the Works Honda in 2000 and Jordan got it in 2001!

Jordan 199 · 11-10-2013 1:31am

Bugatti wrote: »

No, Jordan were using still using the Mugen Honda engine in 1999. BAR had the Works Honda in 2000 and Jordan got it in 2001!

For 2000:

Jordan: Mugen V10's

BAR: Honda V10's

For 2001 and 2002:

Jordan: Honda V10's

BAR: Honda V10's

Honda were planning to enter a works team for 2000, so in 1999 Honda got Dallara to build them an F1 car which was designed by Harvey Postlehwaite.

The car was the Honda RA099

Myrddin · 11-10-2013 3:31pm

Just watching one of the press conferences there, & a question was asked about F1 possibly adopting 'Customer Cars', & how it would put some of the tech guys out of jobs & turn others into salesmen essentially...what the hell are customer cars??

Myrddin · 11-10-2013 3:35pm

OSI wrote: »

The teams wouldn't design and build their cars, they would instead buy them from dedicated manufacturers.

So a smaller team could perhaps buy essentially a Lotus car, & rebrand it accordingly?

Grim. · 11-10-2013 3:38pm

Eau Rouge 1909

RayM · 11-10-2013 3:39pm

Myrddin wrote: »

what the hell are customer cars??

Cars designed and built by one team and sold to another. It's an awful idea and would probably be the final nail in F1's coffin.

Myrddin · 11-10-2013 3:42pm

RayM wrote: »

Cars designed and built by one team and sold to another. It's an awful idea and would probably be the final nail in F1's coffin.

To the completely uninformed, would that not help in terms of bridging the gaps between certain teams & increase competitiveness of the lower teams by bringing them closer to the front?

TheChrisD · 11-10-2013 4:08pm

Myrddin wrote: »

To the completely uninformed, would that not help in terms of bridging the gaps between certain teams & increase competitiveness of the lower teams by bringing them closer to the front?

Possibly. It might be worth looking at CART in the mid to late 90's, and how the various chassis options affected the performance of teams from year to year. F1 customer cars would probably have the same effect.

RayM · 11-10-2013 4:15pm

Myrddin wrote: »

To the completely uninformed, would that not help in terms of bridging the gaps between certain teams & increase competitiveness of the lower teams by bringing them closer to the front?

It would give some of the smaller teams a short-term boost - if they could afford a Red Bull chassis - but it would completely ruin Formula One. Somebody still has to finish last. You could potentially have the top ten completely dominated by Red Bull and its customer teams, while constructors like McLaren and Ferrari can no longer even get out of Q2.

Myrddin · 11-10-2013 6:13pm

OSI wrote: »

I think the proposal is to allow the works teams to sell 2 chassis. So in affect you'd have 2 teams running a red bull chassis, 2 teams running a ferrari chassis etc etc.

I presume it wouldn't be the exact same as a Red Bull, ie it would be the chassis but not the bodywork/aero which is what makes the difference?

Bugatti · 11-10-2013 6:44pm

Hey everyone, just wondering if people are interested in taking part in my Formula 1 game! I adapted a concept for F1 which is similar to the Last Man Standing football game. How it works is you pick the winning team-mate from one Formula 1 team each race weekend. If the driver you choose finishes ahead of their team-mate you advance to the next race. Get it wrong and you're out of the game! Myself and my mates had been playing this for a while but I was just running it manually maintaining excel sheets. It's actually really good fun and gets very competitive when we're down to the last few people in a game!

Anyways I decided to create a website to run it on (which is finally ready!). I was thinking it might be something the Boards user would enjoy as well! It’s a change from the usual fantasy F1 tournaments. You can join the tournament by going to the following link: http://www.lastmanracing.com/?_module=page&_view=globalgames&id=global-games

I've also created a private tournament just for Boards users! To join that go to Private Games and search for 'Boards'. The passcode is 3033

Also let me know what ye think of the site and concept!

11-10-2013 7:13pm

Myrddin wrote: »

I presume it wouldn't be the exact same as a Red Bull, ie it would be the chassis but not the bodywork/aero which is what makes the difference?

I'd imagine it would be covered by separate contracts and agreements, similar to the current technical co-operation things. Also the engine and other pieces will be important for fitting the chassis and everything else around it.

user2011 · 11-10-2013 7:43pm

Not sure if posted before sorry if it was.

The leading speculation, posited by Racecar Engineering, is that Red Bull has managed to link the suspension in Vettel’s RB9 to the hybrid Kinetic Energy Recovery System (KERS) onboard. KERS has been around for a few years and gives drivers a power boost in short bursts, and because it’s an electric motor, the torque output can be tweaked on-the-fly — just like a traditional traction control system.

By linking the suspension to KERS, when the pressure in the shocks changes while going through a corner or over a bump, the RB9 could limit power when compressed and boost power when expanded, all without interacting with the ECU and running afoul of the FIA’s regulations.

But there’s a tell. A very loud one, in fact.

Former F1 team owner Giancarlo Minardi was at the race in Singapore and noticed something odd when Vettel’s car would accelerate out of the first set of tight turns on the street circuit. On his site, Minardi says, “The thing that surprised me the most was the RB1 engine’s output sound.” It was different than every other car going through the same section, with a low-end grinding noise emanating from the car.

http://www.wired.com/autopia/2013/10/red-bull-f1-traction-control/

I've lost interest in it since the split showing between BBC/Sky so I've no thoughts on it just thought i'd post for the interested.

Myrddin · 11-10-2013 8:07pm

By linking the suspension to KERS, when the pressure in the shocks changes while going through a corner or over a bump, the RB9 could limit power when compressed and boost power when expanded, all without interacting with the ECU

Wouldn't that be only KERS assistance/power that would be limited?

mickdw · 11-10-2013 8:24pm

Myrddin wrote: »

Wouldn't that be only KERS assistance/power that would be limited?

Yes but taking it a step further, if there is a link between kers controller and suspension travel, kers harvesting could also be taking place during the initial acceleration phase. It was generally thought that harvesting would only take place under braking as obviously generating power at any other time would take speed from the car. If however that harvesting can be controlled to take place at times when the wheel might be about to spin, you would have an engine Power deadening system which would be similar to traction control. Driver would still be calling for power via accelerator and there would be no electronics disrupting that process but if the engine is suddenly put under a load from electricity generation at the right time, you would have swerved the rules. I wonder if the engine map during harvesting could be radically different also.

Jordan 199 · 12-10-2013 12:41am

Brazilian GP to continue at Interlagos until 2020.

12-10-2013 2:25am

As I said in another thread, there's something different about Red Bull (mainly Vettel) through and out of the corners. Before he started taking the piss Hamilton mentioned it and others have said it. There's no way Red Bull have found a purely front-end or aero way to make it happen without anyone else seeing it, people have been trying for 30 years now.

12-10-2013 2:26am

The renovations at Brazil better be to the infrastructure around the track.

losthorizon · 12-10-2013 9:43pm

Deleted User wrote: »

The renovations at Brazil better be to the infrastructure around the track.

I hope so. Brazil is in my Top three tracks.

Jordan 199 · 13-10-2013 12:05am

Deleted User wrote: »

The renovations at Brazil better be to the infrastructure around the track.

Indeed. I'll be well peed off if they butcher the track layout.

Rascasse · 13-10-2013 9:46am

Interesting, EJ just said on the red button that his sources are almost certain that Hulkenburg will head back to Force India to be lead driver.

The expected extra power of the Mercedes engine influencing his decision? Perhaps Lotus too much of a risk financially and they may prefer Massa due to the rumoured Petrobras money.

Myrddin · 13-10-2013 9:58am

Rascasse wrote: »

Interesting, EJ just said on the red button that his sources are almost certain that Hulkenburg will head back to Force India to be lead driver.

Would that be Di Resta gone?

The expected extra power of the Mercedes engine influencing his decision? Perhaps Lotus too much of a risk financially and they may prefer Massa due to the rumoured Petrobras money.

Has Alonso been confirmed for Ferarri next year?

Rascasse · 13-10-2013 10:03am

Myrddin wrote: »

Would that be Di Resta gone?

I'd say Sutil would be gone. Di Resta faster, a Mercedes development driver and two German drivers may be a bit much.

Myrddin wrote: »

Has Alonso been confirmed for Ferarri next year?

BBC were asking Whitmarsh if he was still trying to get Alonso and he would just say that he has a contract for next year. Impossible to know if there's a break clause.

Jordan 199 · 13-10-2013 2:16pm

Rascasse wrote: »

BBC were asking Whitmarsh if he was still trying to get Alonso and he would just say that he has a contract for next year. Impossible to know if there's a break clause.

Ferrari might pay Alonso to sit the next season out. Alonso could then end up in McLaren for 2015.

cherryghost · 13-10-2013 5:34pm

Rumours today that Maserati are formally throwing their hat into the ring for 2014 soon.

Rascasse · 13-10-2013 5:50pm

Why??? Fiat not happy with only having Ferrari in F1? Madness.

SnowDrifts · 13-10-2013 6:07pm

Depressing to hear Hulkenberg's talent will be wasted for another year on a mid-field team if he does go back to FI. Rumour is that he will be at Ferrari the year after so that would make up for it.

losthorizon · 13-10-2013 6:33pm

cherryghost wrote: »

Rumours today that Maserati are formally throwing their hat into the ring for 2014 soon.

If FIAT were going to allow another FIAT company to take part in F1 I'm surprised it would not be Alfa Romeo.

_rebelkid · 13-10-2013 9:51pm

cherryghost wrote: »

Rumours today that Maserati are formally throwing their hat into the ring for 2014 soon.

Really? Any links? Didn't see anything on broadcasters or the depths of twitter....

I suppose it would be nice... in the same way it would be nice to see Brabham or Vanwall written on the side of a car...

Jordan 199 · 14-10-2013 1:50am

Going back to Interlagos, I saw they used to race on this layout below:

Interlagos%201973.gif

7.874 KM in length.

This is a clip of the 1980 Brazilian GP, which raced on the above layout and was held on the 27th of January.

Formula 1 2013: General Discussion Thread

Comments