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What's wrong with the Student Union this year?

2

Comments

  • #32
    isilidur1980
    Closed Accounts Posts: 120 ✭✭isilidur1980


    Lockstep wrote: »
    Really? There are posters all around campus and I've personally seen Declan Higgins do shoutouts to inform students about the march.

    I am in the university from about half eight each morning to eight in the evening. I attend most lectures and have missed very few so far this semester. I haven't seen Declan Higgins around the campus at all this semester. In fact, no student union member has even been in to one of our lectures telling us about anything that is going on so far this semester. They have not even got around to choosing class reps for our class or college. Amazing how you seem to be seeing high student union visibility and I see none!!


  • #33
    isilidur1980
    Closed Accounts Posts: 120 ✭✭isilidur1980


    WallyGUFC wrote: »
    When does complaining on a public forum ever achieve anything? How about you run in the next SU election, get elected and enforce change?

    I have no desire to run for a position in the student union. However, as I am a student of the university and in part finance Student Union activities, I have every right to complain and hold the SU accountable for their incompetence. Would you not agree?? Because I choose not to run for the Dail in the last election, does that inhibit my right to hold the government to account for what I perceive might be flawed policies and incompetence?
    Have you ever complained on a public forum Wally?? Do you not understand that situations such as the Arab Spring were started through interactions on public forums and through social media? I suppose not!


  • #34
    isilidur1980
    Closed Accounts Posts: 120 ✭✭isilidur1980


    @ Lockstep

    I see that you seem to agree with Wally that if we want to affect change, we shouldn't bother voting for representatives who promise this to us. We should just run ourselves. From what I read, I understand you are running for the Postgraduate position in the SU. If successful, will you tell people who come to you as their representative that if you want change to go out and do it themselves?
    What platform are you exactly running on so?


  • #35
    WallyGUFC
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,057 ✭✭✭WallyGUFC


    isilidur1980 wrote: »
    I have no desire to run for a position in the student union. However, as I am a student of the university and in part finance Student Union activities, I have every right to complain and hold the SU accountable for their incompetence. Would you not agree?? Because I choose not to run for the Dail in the last election, does that inhibit my right to hold the government to account for what I perceive might be flawed policies and incompetence?
    Have you ever complained on a public forum Wally?? Do you not understand that situations such as the Arab Spring were started through interactions on public forums and through social media? I suppose not!
    I would agree that if you have issues with the SU you raise them with them, not on a public forum where they seemingly have no members and are thus unable to respond. Also, I think it's fair to assume the vast majority of the college population have a Facebook account, certainly a higher proportion than those who have boards.ie accounts. Thus it makes perfect sense that that would be their platform.
    I wouldn't exactly call the Arab Spring a raging success either, given the absolute mess that is now Syria, Egypt, Tunisia etc. But that's neither here nor there. Why not email the President of the University? You're basically only complaining to see if anybody agrees. Clearly a thread with 30 odd posts after more than a day isn't going to lead to some sort of Arab Spring within the college where the whole SU is overthrown, kicked out of college and told to leave the city. Complain to people who 1) care and 2) can do something about it. There aren't many on here who satisfy either of those requirements.


  • #36
    isilidur1980
    Closed Accounts Posts: 120 ✭✭isilidur1980


    WallyGUFC wrote: »
    I would agree that if you have issues with the SU you raise them with them, not on a public forum where they seemingly have no members and are thus unable to respond. Also, I think it's fair to assume the vast majority of the college population have a Facebook account, certainly a higher proportion than those who have boards.ie accounts. Thus it makes perfect sense that that would be their platform.
    I wouldn't exactly call the Arab Spring a raging success either, given the absolute mess that is now Syria, Egypt, Tunisia etc. But that's neither here nor there. Why not email the President of the University? You're basically only complaining to see if anybody agrees. Clearly a thread with 30 odd posts after more than a day isn't going to lead to some sort of Arab Spring within the college where the whole SU is overthrown, kicked out of college and told to leave the city. Complain to people who 1) care and 2) can do something about it. There aren't many on here who satisfy either of those requirements.

    I've emailed the SU about this. I haven't got a reply yet.
    I used the comparison of the Arab Spring to answer your assertion that writing on a public forum is pointless. It is a perfect example of the power of social media and online forums. You reference this analogy out of context. I have read some of your replies and you use the Aunt Sally quite a bit!
    Can you not remember authoring a thread on "JEdward" on here? Out of nowhere you used this forum to ridicule them and complain they were a waste of oxygen, etc. What gives you the legitimacy to then come on here and say I shouldn't complain on this about something which I feel and I'm sure many others feel is a very relevant topic?
    Do you troll threads and tell people they have no right to complain on this platform. You don't seem to have any other argument. Some people on here agreed that the SU was poor this year. Some disagreed and said it was good. You on the other hand didn't really take a position. You merely said I shouldn't complain about it on this.


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  • #37
    Lockstep
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,026 ✭✭✭Lockstep


    isilidur1980 wrote: »
    I am in the university from about half eight each morning to eight in the evening. I attend most lectures and have missed very few so far this semester. I haven't seen Declan Higgins around the campus at all this semester. In fact, no student union member has even been in to one of our lectures telling us about anything that is going on so far this semester. They have not even got around to choosing class reps for our class or college. Amazing how you seem to be seeing high student union visibility and I see none!!
    Yeah, it is very surprising. Declan did a shoutout on the march to the 2pm PDE class last Wednesday (I know this as I was attending the class to do a different shoutout). I also saw him coming out of the Kirwan last Monday. Given he's not a student, it's a fair assumption he was doing a shoutout.
    I can't verify or deny your claims that you don't see him around in your 11+ hours on campus each day but it does mean that at least one person on the SU is going out there to get the word out.

    There's also posters around the campus. Last week, I saw ones beside Smokeys, outside the reading room, at the entrance to the college bar and all around the Áras na Mac Léinn.
    As for North Campus (where I'm based), on my way into the Cairnes today, I saw posters at the entrance to the Engineering Building and Áras Moyola. Feel free to check them right now as they were definitely there at 9:00 am.
    Do you stop to look at poster boards? It appears you don't. Granted maybe you're just not looking very hard, given you spend a lot of your time on this forum complaining about the SU.

    Also, did you attend the Class Reps Council last night?


  • #38
    Lockstep
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,026 ✭✭✭Lockstep


    isilidur1980 wrote: »
    @ Lockstep
    I see that you seem to agree with Wally that if we want to affect change, we shouldn't bother voting for representatives who promise this to us. We should just run ourselves. From what I read, I understand you are running for the Postgraduate position in the SU. If successful, will you tell people who come to you as their representative that if you want change to go out and do it themselves?
    The election was on last Thursday and I didn't get elected. Shame but not something to get worked up on.
    isilidur1980 wrote: »
    What platform are you exactly running on so?
    My manifesto was already posted in the SU Elections thread. Given you posted right after me, I'm guessing you saw it?


  • #39
    Ficheall
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,038 ✭✭✭Ficheall


    You seem to be side-stepping the valid point about representation, Lockstep.
    Commiserations anyhow - who got the position, Conor or the other lad? I can't find the info on the SU website.


  • #40
    Lockstep
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,026 ✭✭✭Lockstep


    Ficheall wrote: »
    You seem to be side-stepping the valid point about representation, Lockstep.
    Fair enough: if you need to bring something to someone's attention in the university, then emailing them is usually the worst way to do it. If I need to talk to my supervisor about something important, I ring him or arrange a meeting. If I'd been elected, I'd have done the same thing; that if someone had an issue, I'd try and sort it out in person or if the other person could not do so, I'd ask them to ring me and do it over the phone.

    If you want change, lobby the SU. If that fails, use outside pressure; SIN, Facebook, Galway media and so on. Of course, if you're entirely unhappy with how things are done and have been as critical of the SU for years (as Isildur has) then I'm quite puzzled as to why they don't run themselves.
    Ficheall wrote: »
    Commiserations anyhow - who got the position, Conor or the other lad? I can't find the info on the SU website.
    Conor Lane won the position. Surprised you're still paying attention to SU elections, given you're no longer a student.


  • #41
    isilidur1980
    Closed Accounts Posts: 120 ✭✭isilidur1980


    Lockstep wrote: »
    Yeah, it is very surprising. Declan did a shoutout on the march to the 2pm PDE class last Wednesday (I know this as I was attending the class to do a different shoutout). I also saw him coming out of the Kirwan last Monday. Given he's not a student, it's a fair assumption he was doing a shoutout.
    I can't verify or deny your claims that you don't see him around in your 11+ hours on campus each day but it does mean that at least one person on the SU is going out there to get the word out.

    There's also posters around the campus. Last week, I saw ones beside Smokeys, outside the reading room, at the entrance to the college bar and all around the Áras na Mac Léinn.
    As for North Campus (where I'm based), on my way into the Cairnes today, I saw posters at the entrance to the Engineering Building and Áras Moyola. Feel free to check them right now as they were definitely there at 9:00 am.
    Do you stop to look at poster boards? It appears you don't. Granted maybe you're just not looking very hard, given you spend a lot of your time on this forum complaining about the SU.

    Also, did you attend the Class Reps Council last night?

    No, I didn't attend the Class Reps Council. I did attempt to get in touch with our class rep; however, as yet none have been elected for our class. Also, no college reps have been elected. I suppose they are only back a couple of months so the SU will probably get around to it soon. I wonder what was discussed at this. I'm sure though if it was anything important our class reps will let us know...Oh wait!! Ah sure, the SU website will have the informat.....wait a second. They are only back since July. I forgot!
    I suppose they might have it on a poster. Better keep an eye out for them. I still haven't got a reply to the email I sent them. Not really surprised!:D


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  • #42
    isilidur1980
    Closed Accounts Posts: 120 ✭✭isilidur1980


    Lockstep wrote: »
    If you want change, lobby the SU. If that fails, use outside pressure; SIN, Facebook, Galway media and so on. Of course, if you're entirely unhappy with how things are done and have been as critical of the SU for years (as Isildur has) then I'm quite puzzled as to why they don't run themselves.

    Like i said in an earlier post, I am highly critical of the SU. And I have every right to be critical of them. That doesn't mean though that I am been critical due to a personal vendetta I have against anyone or the SU itself. My criticism of the SU has been the same, no matter who has been elected. I also vote all the time in SU elections. I actually think about what the candidates say and decide based on that.
    It doesn't get away from the fact that the visibility and the communication this year is the worst since I have been here. People might have different opinions on the achievements of last years president but one thing that can't be argued against was his visibility and interaction with the Student body. He hounded people in lectures at times. I haven't seen the SU president in any lecture so far. in fact, I've seen none of the SU officers in any of our lectures. They haven't even bothered to come in about class reps. Five weeks I'm back now!!
    If you were in my position would you be critical?? You seem to suggest that I'm been critical for the sake of it.


  • #43
    Ficheall
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,038 ✭✭✭Ficheall


    Lockstep wrote: »
    Fair enough: if you need to bring something to someone's attention in the university, then emailing them is usually the worst way to do it. If I need to talk to my supervisor about something important, I ring him or arrange a meeting. If I'd been elected, I'd have done the same thing; that if someone had an issue, I'd try and sort it out in person or if the other person could not do so, I'd ask them to ring me and do it over the phone.
    The worst way aside from dedicated internet fora, of course...

    If your supervisor won't communicate with you via email, then I would suggest there is cause for concern there.
    Not responding to emails as a preferred modus operandi is just a tad unprofessional, even if you are friends with everyone on Facebook.
    Lockstep wrote: »
    Of course, if you're entirely unhappy with how things are done and have been as critical of the SU for years (as Isildur has) then I'm quite puzzled as to why they don't run themselves.
    I don't really "get" this attitude. Is that how politics generally works? I know you've studied it in a more in-depth fashion than I have, but... really?
    I know democracy is pretty flawed, and I haven't held many positions as a "representative", but I can't ever recall thinking that the appropriate response to a complaint was "Yeah, well why don't you get elected to my position and fix things yourself?"
    Lockstep wrote: »
    Conor Lane won the position. Surprised you're still paying attention to SU elections, given you're no longer a student.
    I only pay attention to the ones in which I know the candidates, idle curiosity. They don't affect me any more or less than they did when I was a student.


  • #44
    Lockstep
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,026 ✭✭✭Lockstep


    isilidur1980 wrote: »
    No, I didn't attend the Class Reps Council. I did attempt to get in touch with our class rep; however, as yet none have been elected for our class. Also, no college reps have been elected. I suppose they are only back a couple of months so the SU will probably get around to it soon. I wonder what was discussed at this. I'm sure though if it was anything important our class reps will let us know...Oh wait!! Ah sure, the SU website will have the informat.....wait a second. They are only back since July. I forgot!

    Firstly, you don't need to be a Class Rep to go the Class Rep Council.
    Secondly, you're a Commerce student, right? The Convenor for Business and Law was only elected last week (noone ran last year) and it's the Convenors who are mainly responsible for ensuring Class Reps are elected for each department.
    At any rate, I'm very surprised by how passive you are. There wasn't a Class Rep when I was in my undergrad so a few people in my class went to the Education Officer (Emmet Connolly at the time) about getting one elected. He came in the next class, a Class Rep was elected and all was well.
    If you really want a Class Rep then ring the Education Officer or call up to their office.
    isilidur1980 wrote: »
    I suppose they might have it on a poster. Better keep an eye out for them. I still haven't got a reply to the email I sent them. Not really surprised!:D
    Why are you being so flippant about posters? You were giving out that you hadn't heard about the protest so I pointed out the posters all over the college. It was also mentioned on SIN, FlirtFM and on their Facebook page. It's not the SU's fault if you're not using these.

    Like i said in an earlier post, I am highly critical of the SU. And I have every right to be critical of them. That doesn't mean though that I am been critical due to a personal vendetta I have against anyone or the SU itself. My criticism of the SU has been the same, no matter who has been elected. I also vote all the time in SU elections. I actually think about what the candidates say and decide based on that.
    It doesn't get away from the fact that the visibility and the communication this year is the worst since I have been here. People might have different opinions on the achievements of last years president but one thing that can't be argued against was his visibility and interaction with the Student body. He hounded people in lectures at times. I haven't seen the SU president in any lecture so far. in fact, I've seen none of the SU officers in any of our lectures. They haven't even bothered to come in about class reps. Five weeks I'm back now!!
    If you were in my position would you be critical?? You seem to suggest that I'm been critical for the sake of it.
    I don't think you're being critical for the sake of it but I do think you have sort of axe to grind with the SU. If you're so keen to get stuff sorted then complaining on a low-traffic forum isn't gonna change much and you seem to expect to be able to sit around waiting for the SU to come to you or for emails. You'd be much, much better off heading to see them personally (they're there all day) or phoning them.
    The worst way aside from dedicated internet fora, of course...
    If your supervisor won't communicate with you via email, then I would suggest there is cause for concern there. Not responding to emails as a preferred modus operandi is just a tad unprofessional, even if you are friends with everyone on Facebook.
    Oh no, they do respond. But like with all emails, you can be waiting a fair while. If you want quick responses then emails are not the way to do it in case an email gets sent to Spam, overlooked or whatever.
    I don't really "get" this attitude. Is that how politics generally works? I know you've studied it in a more in-depth fashion than I have, but... really?
    I know democracy is pretty flawed, and I haven't held many positions as a "representative", but I can't ever recall thinking that the appropriate response to a complaint was "Yeah, well why don't you get elected to my position and fix things yourself?"
    That's how democracy works Ficheall. If you don't like how a representative is doing something, then your choices are either: Influence them to change things, put up with it, don't vote for them the next time around or run yourself.
    I only pay attention to the ones in which I know the candidates, idle curiosity. They don't affect me any more or less than they did when I was a student.
    Fair enough, I only paid attention to two elections last year as friends of mine were running. When I'm not a student in a university, I don't bother with them at all.


  • #45
    LOSTfan57
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 682 ✭✭✭LOSTfan57


    I actually see Declan around most days tbh...


  • #46
    isilidur1980
    Closed Accounts Posts: 120 ✭✭isilidur1980


    Lockstep wrote: »
    Firstly, you don't need to be a Class Rep to go the Class Rep Council.

    I've heard and actually been invited to one of these Councils before. I actually interacted quite a bit with the SU last year. It was mainly through the class reps but also called over to the SU office a few times. Never got any real hop of any of them. But they were at least more visible and organised than the current lot.
    Lockstep wrote: »
    Secondly, you're a Commerce student, right? The Convenor for Business and Law was only elected last week (noone ran last year) and it's the Convenors who are mainly responsible for ensuring Class Reps are elected for each department.

    Are Convenors part of the SU? I thought so. Hence one of the reasons I am critical about the SU in my post.
    Lockstep wrote: »
    At any rate, I'm very surprised by how passive you are. There wasn't a Class Rep when I was in my undergrad so a few people in my class went to the Education Officer (Emmet Connolly at the time) about getting one elected. He came in the next class, a Class Rep was elected and all was well.
    If you really want a Class Rep then ring the Education Officer or call up to their office.

    As I've said, I actually interacted quite actively with the SU through my class reps and personally last year. I also fail to see why I should run for election if I want change, do the SU conveners job or go to a Class Rep Council to bring up topics my, as yet, undecided class rep should do. Why do we have a SU at all if students just sorted all this themselves?

    Lockstep wrote: »
    Why are you being so flippant about posters? You were giving out that you hadn't heard about the protest so I pointed out the posters all over the college. It was also mentioned on SIN, FlirtFM and on their Facebook page. It's not the SU's fault if you're not using these.

    Let's not bring the discussion down to a level of flippancy about posters. You are already attempting to do that about posting about things on this site. I understand if you think the SU are doing a good job. Defend them on merit so. Lets not divert the main topic of the thread. It is something that is quite common on this thread so far. Why has the lift not been fixed? Why won't the SU respond to people on this? Why, after 3 months back, are the SU failing to update their website? Is the SU bookstore being updated?? Do you think this is acceptable??



    Lockstep wrote: »
    I don't think you're being critical for the sake of it but I do think you have sort of axe to grind with the SU. If you're so keen to get stuff sorted then complaining on a low-traffic forum isn't gonna change much and you seem to expect to be able to sit around waiting for the SU to come to you or for emails. You'd be much, much better off heading to see them personally (they're there all day) or phoning them.

    True, I have an axe to grind with the SU. Like I said I'm highly critical of them due to their incompetence.
    And no, I don't expect to sit around and expect them to come to me. You are assuming that I don't or haven't interacted with the SU before. That is a wrong assumption. I actually considered running as Class Rep this year but one of last years class reps advised me not to. He basically said to me that it was a waste of time. He was an excellent rep but rarely got any hop off the SU himself!


  • #47
    Lockstep
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,026 ✭✭✭Lockstep


    isilidur1980 wrote: »
    I've heard and actually been invited to one of these Councils before. I actually interacted quite a bit with the SU last year. It was mainly through the class reps but also called over to the SU office a few times. Never got any real hop of any of them. But they were at least more visible and organised than the current lot.
    Fair enough but given how much you claimed to care about your friend's welfare, I'm very surprised you didn't raise it at CRC

    isilidur1980 wrote: »
    Are Convenors part of the SU? I thought so. Hence one of the reasons I am critical about the SU in my post.
    The Convenor was only elected last week as noone ran for it last year so they had to have a by-election. You can hardly blame the current one for stuff he hasn't done, given he was only elected on Thursday.
    Also, the SU held an election and noone ran for it. That's hardly their fault.
    isilidur1980 wrote: »
    As I've said, I actually interacted quite actively with the SU through my class reps and personally last year. I also fail to see why I should run for election if I want change, do the SU conveners job or go to a Class Rep Council to bring up topics my, as yet, undecided class rep should do. Why do we have a SU at all if students just sorted all this themselves?
    If you've been quite active, then why did you sit around waiting for the SU to interact with you, instead of going to them and asking for help with getting a Class Rep elected? Given how critical you've been of successive SUs, I am surprised that you haven't decided to run yourself, given how unhappy you are with the recent SUs we've had.
    The SU doesn't rely on students doing things themselves but it does rely on students being active. The SU is a few people in a college of thousands of students. If you want stuff done, you need to show initiative. This isn't secondary school.


    Let's not bring the discussion down to a level of flippancy about posters. You are already attempting to do that about posting about things on this site. I understand if you think the SU are doing a good job. Defend them on merit so. Lets not divert the main topic of the thread. It is something that is quite common on this thread so far. Why has the lift not been fixed? Why won't the SU respond to people on this? Why, after 3 months back, are the SU failing to update their website? Is the SU bookstore being updated?? Do you think this is acceptable??
    Ah ok, it's flippancy to point out that your claims are bogus. You complained about not seeing information about the march. The fact you've said this when there were numerous posters around the place really makes it seem like you have some sort of axe to grind. Either that or it's there's none so blind as those who don't want to see.
    Given I'm not on the SU or deal with buildings, I personally don't know but as I've suggested, you'd certainly get a better response by contacting the SU directly, especially given how clearly urgent you seem to think it is.
    I've barely ever been on the SU website myself but having a look at it, it's been updated numerous times in the last few weeks such as the post about the upcoming SUSI clinic.
    have you looked at the Facebook page? here Check how often that's been updated.




    True, I have an axe to grind with the SU. Like I said I'm highly critical of them due to their incompetence
    Then once again, I would suggest you engage with the issue more constructively than complaining on a low traffic forum. I'm not saying you dont have the right to post or anything like that but I do question you genuine you are in your desire to get things sorted if your way of doing things is sending emails and expecting the SU to come to you. It's a big campus. Be proactive.
    And no, I don't expect to sit around and expect them to come to me. You are assuming that I don't or haven't interacted with the SU before. That is a wrong assumption. I actually considered running as Class Rep this year but one of last years class reps advised me not to. He basically said to me that it was a waste of time. He was an excellent rep but rarely got any hop off the SU himself!
    No, I'm not assuming what you have done in the past. I am however, highlighting that your current actions are fairly silly for someone who wants to get things done. If you're annoyed about your email being ignored, go up and see them in the office. If you're annoyed about the lack of a Class Rep, then go to the Education Officer and ask them to sort something out. Also, I'm struggling to see how you can complain about the lack of a Class Rep but still claim it's a waste of time


  • #48
    WallyGUFC
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,057 ✭✭✭WallyGUFC


    isilidur1980 wrote: »
    I've emailed the SU about this. I haven't got a reply yet.
    I used the comparison of the Arab Spring to answer your assertion that writing on a public forum is pointless. It is a perfect example of the power of social media and online forums. You reference this analogy out of context. I have read some of your replies and you use the Aunt Sally quite a bit!
    Can you not remember authoring a thread on "JEdward" on here? Out of nowhere you used this forum to ridicule them and complain they were a waste of oxygen, etc. What gives you the legitimacy to then come on here and say I shouldn't complain on this about something which I feel and I'm sure many others feel is a very relevant topic?
    Do you troll threads and tell people they have no right to complain on this platform. You don't seem to have any other argument. Some people on here agreed that the SU was poor this year. Some disagreed and said it was good. You on the other hand didn't really take a position. You merely said I shouldn't complain about it on this.
    I don't remember, maybe I was drunk, maybe it was a pisstake of a thread which was probably eventually locked, but I didn't get so worked up about it regardless.
    All I'm saying is that there is clearly numerous ways to get in touch with the SU, and you havn't exhausted all of them. Until you do and get no response from any of them, I don't think it's very fair to be so critical when they aren't here to respond. Have you called into their office in Aras na Mac Leinn by any chance?

    Also, my position regarding SU is that they do the best they can. I don't agree with all of their ideas e.g. the farcical plan last year to open the Kingfisher to everyone, but I believe they do a reasonable job. And I have absolutely no affiliation with them whatsoever and probably never will.


  • #49
    isilidur1980
    Closed Accounts Posts: 120 ✭✭isilidur1980


    Lockstep wrote: »
    Fair enough but given how much you claimed to care about your friend's welfare, I'm very surprised you didn't raise it at CRC

    I didn't go to the one on just last week. My interactions with the Union last year, through the rep and directly, has made me realise that it will make very little difference. The SU is too passive. They are going through a set of motions year in year out.
    Lockstep wrote: »
    The Convenor was only elected last week as noone ran for it last year so they had to have a by-election. You can hardly blame the current one for stuff he hasn't done, given he was only elected on Thursday.

    I wasn't aware that there was elections for Convenors last week. I would think that one of the first and most important issues would be to sort out class reps. Students are back 4-6 weeks at this stage.


    Lockstep wrote: »
    If you've been quite active, then why did you sit around waiting for the SU to interact with you, instead of going to them and asking for help with getting a Class Rep elected? Given how critical you've been of successive SUs, I am surprised that you haven't decided to run yourself, given how unhappy you are with the recent SUs we've had.

    I'll be honest. I probably wouldn't be a good candidate for the position of rep. It suits some people and not others. However, I feel that the people who do run for positions of this nature should understand what these positions entail and do the job in the proper capacity. I feel this is not been done. It seems to be more of a CV filler and that self interest is the biggest driving force behind most(not all) SU reps and officers. I don't mind self interest. I applaud it. But Union ideology focuses on the collective. That's one of the principles on which they run.
    Lockstep wrote: »
    The SU doesn't rely on students doing things themselves but it does rely on students being active. The SU is a few people in a college of thousands of students. If you want stuff done, you need to show initiative. This isn't secondary school.

    Believe me, I was in the SU office due to numerous reasons last year. My class reps were also sick of me asking to bring stuff up. I was never satisfied with the outcomes. I would also have liked for the SU election candidates to tell me to show initiative and do things myself before I voted in the elections. I am not the one who runs around the college at election time promising better representation and welfare. So it is simply not good enough to now say they are too busy and to sort it myself. A simple class rep would be nice.



    Lockstep wrote: »
    Ah ok, it's flippancy to point out that your claims are bogus. You complained about not seeing information about the march. The fact you've said this when there were numerous posters around the place really makes it seem like you have some sort of axe to grind. Either that or it's there's none so blind as those who don't want to see.

    Calling this bogus is surely subjective. You feel the SU are doing a good job. I feel they are doing a bad job. I didn't see the posters about the march. I don't read message boards. But I stand by my claim that no SU officer or Convenor has been near 3rd year commerce this year. No emails were received. No leaflets anywhere around smokies. And although you say that Declan was visible, I never on any occasion seen him. I actually marched with the SU on certain issues last year. One was hi-jacked by far left tools. We turned back once we reached Eyre Square. The legitimacy behind the march had been lost. I wouldn't blame the SU for this though. But I wouldn't march with them again.
    Lockstep wrote: »
    Given I'm not on the SU or deal with buildings, I personally don't know but as I've suggested, you'd certainly get a better response by contacting the SU directly, especially given how clearly urgent you seem to think it is.
    Lockstep wrote: »
    I've been on to disability support services. I got a spiel about how there is some sort of audit going on at the minute regarding some services and infrastructure and they will get back to me.

    I
    Lockstep wrote: »
    've barely ever been on the SU website myself but having a look at it, it's been updated numerous times in the last few weeks such as the post about the upcoming SUSI clinic.
    have you looked at the Facebook page? here Check how often that's been updated.

    I use it quite a bit. Mainly the SU bookstore and some other information that I find personally beneficial to keep updated on. There has been specific updates; however, much of the stuff is not been updated. It is actually quite a good resource if it was kept updated. I never found the need to complain about it until this year. It was always well kept.
    I'm not on Facebook. I might be in the minority but it would be a minority of about 20% or 30% of the student body. That might be hard to believe but I'd be comfortable with that figure. The SU website allows for greater ease and structure to deal with and keep updated on certain topics.





    Lockstep wrote: »
    Then once again, I would suggest you engage with the issue more constructively than complaining on a low traffic forum. I'm not saying you dont have the right to post or anything like that but I do question you genuine you are in your desire to get things sorted if your way of doing things is sending emails and expecting the SU to come to you. It's a big campus. Be proactive.


    No, I'm not assuming what you have done in the past. I am however, highlighting that your current actions are fairly silly for someone who wants to get things done. If you're annoyed about your email being ignored, go up and see them in the office. If you're annoyed about the lack of a Class Rep, then go to the Education Officer and ask them to sort something out. Also, I'm struggling to see how you can complain about the lack of a Class Rep but still claim it's a waste of time

    I've made a choice to not interact this year. That doesn't take away from my legitimate right to complain about the level of representation. We are forced to be part of the SU once we enter college, afterall.


  • #50
    isilidur1980
    Closed Accounts Posts: 120 ✭✭isilidur1980


    WallyGUFC wrote: »
    I don't remember, maybe I was drunk, maybe it was a pisstake of a thread which was probably eventually locked, but I didn't get so worked up about it regardless.
    All I'm saying is that there is clearly numerous ways to get in touch with the SU, and you havn't exhausted all of them. Until you do and get no response from any of them, I don't think it's very fair to be so critical when they aren't here to respond. Have you called into their office in Aras na Mac Leinn by any chance?

    Also, my position regarding SU is that they do the best they can. I don't agree with all of their ideas e.g. the farcical plan last year to open the Kingfisher to everyone, but I believe they do a reasonable job. And I have absolutely no affiliation with them whatsoever and probably never will.

    I was in the office many times last year. I won't go into why on the forum. They have put themselves in a position whereby they will be faced with criticisms. I have tried to support marches around the fees issue,etc as I am a student who was hurt by the current education grant cuts and fees. A little more creativity is needed though. People are laughing at the 6 monthly or yearly march!! The morale of the student body is shattered on this matter. It is either they don't care or have given up. We are living in a time where it should be easy to get attention on protests, etc. The failure to do this is a failure of leadership. Not a failure of the national student body and Irish people in general.
    I will agree somewhat with you in that I have met SU members and officers who I perceived to be fantastic in what they tried to do. But for the most part, I've be disappointed.


  • #51
    Lockstep
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,026 ✭✭✭Lockstep


    isilidur1980 wrote: »
    I didn't go to the one on just last week. My interactions with the Union last year, through the rep and directly, has made me realise that it will make very little difference. The SU is too passive. They are going through a set of motions year in year out.
    If you think they make very little difference, why are you complaining about their lack of engagement?
    And it's fairly ironic that you accuse others of being passive!

    isilidur1980 wrote: »
    I wasn't aware that there was elections for Convenors last week. I would think that one of the first and most important issues would be to sort out class reps. Students are back 4-6 weeks at this stage.
    How were you not aware about the elections? They sent emails out about the election on the 10th, the 13th, to 20th and the 26th of September. And it was on posters all around campus, their Facebook page and so on. If you didn't know the elections were on, you've noone to blame but yourself.
    The SU can't do much if noone ran for the position charged with getting Class Reps for Commerce and Law students. I'm really not sure how you can blame the SU for this one.
    Also, I'm struggling to follow how you can simultanesouly claim that one the most important issues is to sort out class reps while not thinking it was worth bothering with to run yourself. Or that you didn't consider that maybe you should contact the SU if you didn't have a Class Rep yet.
    From the SU email sent out on the 10th September
    Class Representatives
    Every class is entitled to a Class Representative to represent their class. If your class does not have a Class Rep your voice will not be heard. If you have any questions on the roles and responsibilities of a Class Rep contact the SU Vice-President/Education Officer Catherine Breslin at su.education@nuigalway.ie <mailto:su.education@nuigalway.ie> . Further information regarding the role of Class Reps is also available in the SU Council section of our website here. <https://www.mis.nuigalway.ie/exchweb/bin/redir.asp?URL=http://www.su.nuigalway.ie/site/view/95/>



    isilidur1980 wrote: »
    I'll be honest. I probably wouldn't be a good candidate for the position of rep. It suits some people and not others. However, I feel that the people who do run for positions of this nature should understand what these positions entail and do the job in the proper capacity. I feel this is not been done. It seems to be more of a CV filler and that self interest is the biggest driving force behind most(not all) SU reps and officers. I don't mind self interest. I applaud it. But Union ideology focuses on the collective. That's one of the principles on which they run.
    Fair enough. If you feel you wouldn't be any good then suggest that a friend runs. It's what I did for the full-time SU positions.

    isilidur1980 wrote: »
    Believe me, I was in the SU office due to numerous reasons last year. My class reps were also sick of me asking to bring stuff up. I was never satisfied with the outcomes. I would also have liked for the SU election candidates to tell me to show initiative and do things myself before I voted in the elections. I am not the one who runs around the college at election time promising better representation and welfare. So it is simply not good enough to now say they are too busy and to sort it myself. [/quote[
    They promise better representation but they're, what, a dozen people in a university of thousands? Like it or not, the SU relies on students showing initiative.
    isilidur1980 wrote: »
    A simple class rep would be nice.
    You've already said you decided you couldn't be bothered running for CR yourself so I'm not sure what your beef is here.


    isilidur1980 wrote: »
    Calling this bogus is surely subjective. You feel the SU are doing a good job. I feel they are doing a bad job. I didn't see the posters about the march. I don't read message boards. But I stand by my claim that no SU officer or Convenor has been near 3rd year commerce this year. No emails were received. No leaflets anywhere around smokies. And although you say that Declan was visible, I never on any occasion seen him. I actually marched with the SU on certain issues last year. One was hi-jacked by far left tools. We turned back once we reached Eyre Square. The legitimacy behind the march had been lost. I wouldn't blame the SU for this though. But I wouldn't march with them again.
    Hardly subjective. You were giving out that you hadn't seen any info about the march. Ignoring that there were posters literally all around college (which I verified myself on my way back to the Cairnes). If you don't read posters then that's your own problem and not something the SU can be blamed for, especially that they included info about the march in the weekly SU emails sent out to all students (one sent on the 20th of September, one sent on the 26th of September). If you haven't been checking your emails, that's not the SU's fault. I know you're just gonna say you never got the emails but they were sent out. If you haven't been getting them, then contact ISS and ask them why your emails are disappearaing.
    I'll happily forward you on the emails if you want and you can see them dated and all.

    Fair enough if you haven't seen Declan Higgins around. I can't confirm or deny where he's been in relation to you but I can confirm weekly SU emails were sent on as well as SIN and the poster boards. But it's not the SU's fault if you don't bother reading these.
    Nowhere did I state the SU were doing a good job. I'm pretty ambivalent about them myself (I do like Declan Higgins however)


    isilidur1980 wrote: »
    I've been on to disability support services. I got a spiel about how there is some sort of audit going on at the minute regarding some services and infrastructure and they will get back to me.
    Good man, I'm glad to see you're doing some constructive work on this.

    isilidur1980 wrote: »
    I use it quite a bit. Mainly the SU bookstore and some other information that I find personally beneficial to keep updated on. There has been specific updates; however, much of the stuff is not been updated. It is actually quite a good resource if it was kept updated. I never found the need to complain about it until this year. It was always well kept.
    Fair enough. I don't use the SU bookstore myself so I can't comment on this.

    isilidur1980 wrote: »
    I'm not on Facebook. I might be in the minority but it would be a minority of about 20% or 30% of the student body. That might be hard to believe but I'd be comfortable with that figure. The SU website allows for greater ease and structure to deal with and keep updated on certain topics.
    And Facebook is far more used by most students. In 2011, 90% of 15-24 year olds in Ireland use Facebook with two thirds of these using it daily. If you don't use Facebook, then grand but it makes sense for the SU to rely on it to reach students.

    isilidur1980 wrote: »
    I've made a choice to not interact this year. That doesn't take away from my legitimate right to complain about the level of representation. We are forced to be part of the SU once we enter college, afterall.
    You've made a choice not to interact but you seem to be doing very little about what you're complaining about. If you're gonna whine about the dark, don't be surprised if others suggest you light a candle.


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  • #52
    Manco
    Closed Accounts Posts: 178 ✭✭Manco


    isildur1980 = concern troll.


  • #53
    LOSTfan57
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 682 ✭✭✭LOSTfan57


    Isildur if you ain't satisfied with the class rep why dont you stop criticising them and run yourself? You said it wouldn't suit you but by your posting and critiqing of the current Class reps you clearly think you can at the very least do better than them! So why not run yourself and stop moaning


  • #54
    isilidur1980
    Closed Accounts Posts: 120 ✭✭isilidur1980


    Manco wrote: »
    isildur1980 = concern troll.

    I think my position has been pretty clear right through this thread. I started the thread! Stated my position and that's it!


  • #55
    isilidur1980
    Closed Accounts Posts: 120 ✭✭isilidur1980


    LOSTfan57 wrote: »
    Isildur if you ain't satisfied with the class rep why dont you stop criticising them and run yourself? You said it wouldn't suit you but by your posting and critiqing of the current Class reps you clearly think you can at the very least do better than them! So why not run yourself and stop moaning

    If you bothered reading the thread, you would have realised that I was not complaining about the class rep. I was complaining that there is no class rep.


  • #56
    isilidur1980
    Closed Accounts Posts: 120 ✭✭isilidur1980


    Lockstep wrote: »
    If you think they make very little difference, why are you complaining about their lack of engagement?
    And it's fairly ironic that you accuse others of being passive!

    No logic to this question. I do believe that they make very little difference. However, greater engagement and leadership could change this. Less engagement definitely won't.


    Lockstep wrote: »
    How were you not aware about the elections? They sent emails out about the election on the 10th, the 13th, to 20th and the 26th of September. And it was on posters all around campus, their Facebook page and so on. If you didn't know the elections were on, you've noone to blame but yourself.

    Completely irrelevant statement. I have not criticised the SU for not known about the election. I have stated that I wasn't aware of these elections; however, I would have thought that one of the major objectives of the Convenor would then be to get class reps elected. You have a habit of thrown in red herrings from time to time.
    Lockstep wrote: »
    The SU can't do much if noone ran for the position charged with getting Class Reps for Commerce and Law students. I'm really not sure how you can blame the SU for this one.
    Also, I'm struggling to follow how you can simultanesouly claim that one the most important issues is to sort out class reps while not thinking it was worth bothering with to run yourself. Or that you didn't consider that maybe you should contact the SU if you didn't have a Class Rep yet.
    From the SU email sent out on the 10th September.

    OK so, it is not the SU's fault for not sorting class rep's and convenors. Who's problem is it so? Also are you questioning the importance of class reps? It is not merely a claim. It is probably one of the most important positions in the link between the student body and the SU. More than just a claim.
    The student union have supposedly stated that they will represent student interests in the university. The SU officers state this at election time. I bet you stated this when you ran for election. Now you are saying that if the SU fails to do this, I should run myself.



    Lockstep wrote: »
    They promise better representation but they're, what, a dozen people in a university of thousands? Like it or not, the SU relies on students showing initiative.
    You've already said you decided you couldn't be bothered running for CR yourself so I'm not sure what your beef is here.

    Come on!! If the SU in Galway and the USI nationally can't get the student body interested in this economic environment, it is not down to student initiative. You might want to believe that but it is a ridiculous assertion. There is a clear divide between the SU and the student body. If you think it is just me, you are strongly mistaken.
    Should all the student body have to decide to run for CR just to have the right to better representation.



    Lockstep wrote: »
    Hardly subjective. You were giving out that you hadn't seen any info about the march. Ignoring that there were posters literally all around college (which I verified myself on my way back to the Cairnes). If you don't read posters then that's your own problem and not something the SU can be blamed for, especially that they included info about the march in the weekly SU emails sent out to all students (one sent on the 20th of September, one sent on the 26th of September). If you haven't been checking your emails, that's not the SU's fault. I know you're just gonna say you never got the emails but they were sent out. If you haven't been getting them, then contact ISS and ask them why your emails are disappearaing.
    I'll happily forward you on the emails if you want and you can see them dated and all.

    You are bringing this discussion down to my unawareness that a march was going on. It was much broader than that and questioned the visibility and communication of the SU this year. A failure to update websites. Failures to elect class reps. Complete failure in actual interaction with students. The farce with the disabled lift which the SU have no problem in highlighting was one of their achievements.
    Lockstep wrote: »
    Fair enough if you haven't seen Declan Higgins around. I can't confirm or deny where he's been in relation to you but I can confirm weekly SU emails were sent on as well as SIN and the poster boards. But it's not the SU's fault if you don't bother reading these.
    Nowhere did I state the SU were doing a good job. I'm pretty ambivalent about them myself (I do like Declan Higgins however)

    Again you seem to want to talk about the specifics of the election. I also voted for Declan. I don't know him personally but liked his passion when he came into lectures last year. I haven't seen him or any of the other officers this year so far though. That is a huge difference I have highlighted between this current SU and last years SU officers.
    I criticised the SU and stand by that criticism. You have clearly taking the position against this criticism. You stated in a previous post your neutral ground on the SU and in this post your ambivalence. You could have fooled me on both. It is quite clear you are strongly passionate about the SU. Just say that. Believe it or not, I am strongly passionate about it too.



    Lockstep wrote: »
    And Facebook is far more used by most students. In 2011, 90% of 15-24 year olds in Ireland use Facebook with two thirds of these using it daily. If you don't use Facebook, then grand but it makes sense for the SU to rely on it to reach students.

    I never said I had a problem with the SU using Facebook.

    Lockstep wrote: »
    You've made a choice not to interact but you seem to be doing very little about what you're complaining about. If you're gonna whine about the dark, don't be surprised if others suggest you light a candle.

    The suggestion that if the people who are representing you are not doing it well, you should run yourself is a little different to your nice analogy. Why would we even need an SU if everyone just looked after issues themselves?
    You seem to think that I am on here just to criticise the SU for no reason. Ask the student body of their feelings regarding the SU. Don't be surprised however to hear back the same criticisms I am stating.


  • #57
    LOSTfan57
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 682 ✭✭✭LOSTfan57


    Isildur seems to just be one of those who is never satisfied and always moaning. But yet refuses to actually do anything about it. Just a natural moaner


  • #58
    Lockstep
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,026 ✭✭✭Lockstep


    Isildur, your arguments are all over the place.
    You're claiming the SU is useless for not getting class reps but that class reps aren't important so you didn't see the point of going youself. You also criticise others for not being up to scratch while saying you don't run as you wouldn't be any good either.

    You also criticise the SU about information even though you don't bother availing of the information anyway on things like the SU marches and Aside from the fact you don't read poster boards, you also claimed that they should have been sending out emails with the relevant info. They already did so. Multiple times.
    The fact that you've done so makes it seem like either you are deliberately ignoring this information and ciriticising the SU anyway or else you're criticising them without even bothering to engage with what they send out.
    It's not the SU's fault if someone decides not to bother reading posters, SIN or their own feckin' university email account.

    I'm fairly meh about the SU but when people come up with such ridiculous criticisms it's fairly irritating.

    Which really makes it seem like you're someone with an axe to grind.


  • #59
    Ficheall
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,038 ✭✭✭Ficheall


    Lockstep wrote: »
    It's not the SU's fault if someone decides not to bother reading posters, SIN or their own feckin' university email account.
    I'll take it from the phrasing of the latter part of the line that you find it ridiculous that people don't pay attention to their emails, aye?


  • #60
    Fooker
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 292 ✭✭Fooker


    All I see is a load of keyboard warriors... How exactly is this going to reform the SU(if it does not reforming) or create a marxist utopia?

    Ye might be better served going out and being pro-active about things or actually addressing your concerns to the relevant bodies/individuals concerned.


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  • #61
    WallyGUFC
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,057 ✭✭✭WallyGUFC


    Fooker wrote: »
    All I see is a load of keyboard warriors... How exactly is this going to reform the SU(if it does not reforming) or create a marxist utopia?

    Ye might be better served going out and being pro-active about things or actually addressing your concerns to the relevant bodies/individuals concerned.
    A suggestion which was made to the OP, the one with the problem, and he/she said no.


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