milking parlour build

maxxuumman · 28-09-2013 1:27pm

mahoney_j wrote: »

I've all that bar out of parlour feeders ,20k seems excessively high.maby it was for new connection as well??

Same here ( just missing the pedos and the OPF, on the wish list), 20k sounds bananas. Mine was 3k, no 3 phase. Just about managing on single.

28-09-2013 2:31pm

jersey101 wrote: »

ah it was a savage parlor now alri. The cows all had pedometers and all tgere yeilds were recorded and then they were fed meal accordungly. He gad a zero grazer aswell and an out of parlour feeder for the dry cows

why spend more money on out of parlour feeders for dry cows , sure if you wanted to give them meal what the hell is wrong with a bucket it usually comes free , some lads get very carried away spending and cant see daylight

Sam Kade · 28-09-2013 2:42pm

Anyone know the price of a Dairymaster claw piece?

mahoney_j · 28-09-2013 3:40pm

delaval wrote: »

What's his SR?
What's his tonnes dm grown?
Sounds like more money than sense, out of parlour feeders went out with the arc!!!

Don't know answer to both above but it all obviously for a system just like mine is,spending money on things like this is far from frivolous spending.really can' really see all this low cost grass production model blowing up going forward as we have seen with weather patterns in last 2 years .supplementary feeding will get a lot more common and grass on its own just wont give enough of a punch.when feed is introduced you need an ainmAl that will give a return for its feed.ill say it again this is Ireland not New Zealand ,different country's ,climate what works over ther won't nessecarly here.we need to develop our own farming system to suit Irish conditions.low cost grass on its own just wont work

jersey101 · 28-09-2013 3:53pm

delaval wrote: »

What's his SR?
What's his tonnes dm grown?
Sounds like more money than sense, out of parlour feeders went out with the arc!!!

never asked that wasnt going to ask him all that when i didnt know the man. All i know is he's milking 165 cows and owns 300 ac. Has a diet feeder also.

jersey101 · 28-09-2013 3:57pm

6480 wrote: »

why spend more money on out of parlour feeders for dry cows , sure if you wanted to give them meal what the hell is wrong with a bucket it usually comes free , some lads get very carried away spending and cant see daylight

ye i thought meself it was very over the top. Ill never have anything that hi tech as long as i have a parlour thats reliable and quick to milk in and have a nice working enviroment ill be happy. And not slaving away to pay off big loans unless there for land

maxxuumman · 28-09-2013 3:59pm

jersey101 wrote: »

ye i thought meself it was very over the top. Ill never have anything that hi tech as long as i have a parlour thats reliable and quick to milk in and have a nice working enviroment ill be happy. And not slaving away to pay off big loans unless there for land

What price were the out of Parlour feeders?

delaval · 28-09-2013 4:03pm

mahoney_j wrote: »

Don't know answer to both above but it all obviously for a system just like mine is,spending money on things like this is far from frivolous spending.really can' really see all this low cost grass production model blowing up going forward as we have seen with weather patterns in last 2 years .supplementary feeding will get a lot more common and grass on its own just wont give enough of a punch.when feed is introduced you need an ainmAl that will give a return for its feed.ill say it again this is Ireland not New Zealand ,different country's ,climate what works over ther won't nessecarly here.we need to develop our own farming system to suit Irish conditions.low cost grass on its own just wont work

Well aware of where we are and don't have a problem with feeding cows and obviously higher fielders will require more dm supplement as grass can't always give it.

However I do have a problem with machine dealers, feed companies and other industries trying to turn people's heads regarding spending money.

They have their own interests at heart while licking your whole and don't realise that the customer needs to stay in business to sustain their business.

jersey101 · 28-09-2013 4:29pm

maxxuumman wrote: »

What price were the out of Parlour feeders?

havent clue what they cost think he's had em years

Timmaay · 28-09-2013 6:57pm

jersey101 wrote: »

never asked that wasnt going to ask m all that when i didnt know the man. All i know is he's milking 165 cows and owns 300 ac. Has a diet feeder also.

Delaval, his SR is low enough at the minute, and only 90cows milking at the second, but huge amount of replacements coming along. I'm not sure about ton/ha, but farm covers looked great, plenty of receeding, well kept paddocks. He has no diet feed Jersey, only sheargrab fed silage, and parlour nuts. Cows all about 1100-1300gls yield. He wouldn't give a straight answer about future SR or cow numbers, but thats more his personallity. I think the parlour was funded out of land sales from off farms, so no huge borrowings needed. All in all, a well setup operation for a big expansion of cownumbers in 2015. Not the typical farmer around at all, in that he has the land and money to expand I guess, as I said before I wouldn't be going down a similar route myself at all.

jaymla627 · 28-09-2013 7:40pm

Feed to yield and all that other fancy gear for 1100-1300 gallon cows really is overkill.
The all bells and whistles set-ups are the job for herds doing high yields and cows that need looking after, your typicial grass based spring calving dairy herd with 5000 litre cows has no need for fancy gear, id say the yearly service bill is pretty tasty on that type of parlour to and after 5-7 years all the little expensive electricial faults start to come through.

delaval · 28-09-2013 7:44pm

Timmaay wrote: »

Delaval, his SR is low enough at the minute, and only 90cows milking at the second, but huge amount of replacements coming along. I'm not sure about ton/ha, but farm covers looked great, plenty of receeding, well kept paddocks. He has no diet feed Jersey, only sheargrab fed silage, and parlour nuts. Cows all about 1100-1300gls yield. He wouldn't give a straight answer about future SR or cow numbers, but thats more his personallity. I think the parlour was funded out of land sales from off farms, so no huge borrowings needed. All in all, a well setup operation for a big expansion of cownumbers in 2015. Not the typical farmer around at all, in that he has the land and money to expand I guess, as I said before I wouldn't be going down a similar route myself at all.

Tim
I think that says it all!!

maxxuumman · 28-09-2013 7:51pm

jaymla627 wrote: »

Feed to yield and all that other fancy gear for 1100-1300 gallon cows really is overkill.
The all bells and whistles set-ups are the job for herds doing high yields and cows that need looking after, your typicial grass based spring calving dairy herd with 5000 litre cows has no need for fancy gear, id say the yearly service bill is pretty tasty on that type of parlour to and after 5-7 years all the little expensive electricial faults start to come through.

Mine in 12 yrs, no electrical issues yet. Still a joy to go into every morning

stanflt · 28-09-2013 7:53pm

jaymla627 wrote: »

Feed to yield and all that other fancy gear for 1100-1300 gallon cows really is overkill.
The all bells and whistles set-ups are the job for herds doing high yields and cows that need looking after, your typicial grass based spring calving dairy herd with 5000 litre cows has no need for fancy gear, id say the yearly service bill is pretty tasty on that type of parlour to and after 5-7 years all the little expensive electricial faults start to come through.

i do my own service on my parlour- its actually very simple if your computer literate

jersey101 · 28-09-2013 7:59pm

Timmaay wrote: »

Delaval, his SR is low enough at the minute, and only 90cows milking at the second, but huge amount of replacements coming along. I'm not sure about ton/ha, but farm covers looked great, plenty of receeding, well kept paddocks. He has no diet feed Jersey, only sheargrab fed silage, and parlour nuts. Cows all about 1100-1300gls yield. He wouldn't give a straight answer about future SR or cow numbers, but thats more his personallity. I think the parlour was funded out of land sales from off farms, so no huge borrowings needed. All in all, a well setup operation for a big expansion of cownumbers in 2015. Not the typical farmer around at all, in that he has the land and money to expand I guess, as I said before I wouldn't be going down a similar route myself at all.

My bad tim thought he had a diet feeder. He used to have alot of drystock and sheep didnt he??

delaval · 28-09-2013 8:09pm

maxxuumman wrote: »

Mine in 12 yrs, no electrical issues yet. Still a joy to go into every morning

Do you have a high yielding herd?

keep going · 28-09-2013 8:10pm

delaval wrote: »

Do any of ye try the speed test putting on cups in the Dairymaster stand at the ploughing.

The winner did 4 in 14 seconds. I managed it in 17 after a few goes at over 20 secs. To be fair hygiene or the cow weren't a consideration with the test. Great craic though

I transfer 10 clusters in 2 minutes which is 12 seconds per cluster-hard to see done any faster without pulling clusters off under vacuum.slowed down tonight as fractured a couple of ribs this morning soim well b#######d.ipresume that was just putting them on.

maxxuumman · 28-09-2013 8:13pm

stanflt wrote: »

i do my own service on my parlour- its actually very simple if your computer literate

Yes, theyre a lot simpler than people think. And they electrics end of them are a lot less trouble, and cheaper to fix/replace than people think.
I get mine services every 7 months. Annual cost for the milking parlour service, well and scraper service costs me €1400 including vat.
What is done in the service, I could myself except for the pulsation test. Think money spent on servicing, is money well spent

maxxuumman · 28-09-2013 8:17pm

delaval wrote: »

Do you have a high yielding herd?

Naa

jersey101 · 28-09-2013 8:17pm

maxxuumman wrote: »

Yes, theyre a lot simpler than people think. And they electrics end of them are a lot less trouble, and cheaper to fix/replace than people think.
I get mine services every 7 months. Annual cost for the milking parlour service, well and scraper service costs me €1400 including vat.
What is done in the service, I could myself except for the pulsation test. Think money spent on servicing, is money well spent

1400 bucks!!!!! All i ever get done is pulsation checked and i put all the new rubbers and all in myself. And the new parlour will be the same. 1400 for what? I remember being told when i was in kildalton that they did a service and it cost 5k they replaced all the soleinoids and sensors

mf240 · 28-09-2013 8:22pm

keep going wrote: »

I transfer 10 clusters in 2 minutes which is 12 seconds per cluster-hard to see done any faster without pulling clusters off under vacuum.slowed down tonight as fractured a couple of ribs this morning soim well b#######d.ipresume that was just putting them on.

Any of ye that were saying tillage farming is hard going just like dairying have a read of above post.

Out of parlour feeders are madness, if your feeding is correct you could feed as much as any cow needs in two feeds at milking.

Feed to yield has a place in high yielding herds where split calving may mean that you have fresh and stale cows that will need different feeding and also some cows may need/justify a further top up.

The most important thing is to focus on profit not Just yield, all to easy to spend a fortune chasing that last ten percent of yield and lose all sight of what its costing. And dont believe everything salesmen tell you.

delaval · 28-09-2013 8:25pm

maxxuumman wrote: »

Naa

Would you get much use from feed to yield. I feel that it has more to offer than TMR. We are considering upgrading our drafting to electronic and it can be added

delaval · 28-09-2013 8:27pm

keep going wrote: »

I transfer 10 clusters in 2 minutes which is 12 seconds per cluster-hard to see done any faster without pulling clusters off under vacuum.slowed down tonight as fractured a couple of ribs this morning soim well b#######d.ipresume that was just putting them on.

No it was just putting on to dummy udders and if in real parlour there would be more shyte than milk in the tank

stanflt · 28-09-2013 8:29pm

delaval wrote: »

Would you get much use from feed to yield. I feel that it has more to offer than TMR. We are considering upgrading our drafting to electronic and it can be added

I would never ever put in a parlour again if it didn't have feed to yield- no matter if it were spring calving or not-

Since we put in the new parlour 3 years ago we have priduced 2000 litre more per cow with the same total amount of meal used per cow

Calving interval has gone from 427 to 389 and will be below 375 next year
Feed to yield had increase BCS on all cows which has had a positive effect on ci

jaymla627 · 28-09-2013 8:30pm

stanflt wrote: »

i do my own service on my parlour- its actually very simple if your computer literate

id be more a vice grips and hammer kind of guy, you have to remember most acrs/electrical systems have a shelf life of 10 years before they need replacing/over hauling, worked for one guy who had a 50 bail rotary was 10 years old and just before i started all the acrs had to be replaced the 60 thousand euro bill he got was eye opening to say the least.

jersey101 · 28-09-2013 8:33pm

stanflt wrote: »

I would never ever put in a parlour again if it didn't have feed to yield- no matter if it were spring calving or not-

Since we put in the new parlour 3 years ago we have priduced 2000 litre more per cow with the same total amount of meal used per cow

Calving interval has gone from 427 to 389 and will be below 375 next year
Feed to yield had increase BCS on all cows which has had a positive effect on ci

theres awful lot of extra cost with them though you have to be recording yeilds in parlour and all that goes with it

stanflt · 28-09-2013 8:34pm

jersey101 wrote: »

theres awful lot of extra cost with them though you have to be recording yeilds in parlour and all that goes with it

Part of the package- you also know straight away when a cow is sick

jersey101 · 28-09-2013 8:42pm

stanflt wrote: »

Part of the package- you also know straight away when a cow is sick

father has a hankering for it alright but im not really interested in them

stanflt · 28-09-2013 8:44pm

jersey101 wrote: »

father has a hankering for it alright but im not really interested in them

Worth it if your selling 100000 litres per unit IMO

jersey101 · 28-09-2013 8:58pm

stanflt wrote: »

Worth it if your selling 100000 litres per unit IMO

will only be putting half that through it. But a different type of herd makes money in a different way

stanflt · 28-09-2013 9:04pm

jersey101 wrote: »

will only be putting half that through it. But a different type of herd makes money in a different way

profit per litre should be well over 20cent a litre this year

delaval · 28-09-2013 9:04pm

stanflt wrote: »

Worth it if your selling 100000 litres per unit IMO

Do you mean per milking unit?

stanflt · 28-09-2013 9:05pm

delaval wrote: »

Do you mean per milking unit?

yes

maxxuumman · 28-09-2013 9:11pm

stanflt wrote: »

Part of the package- you also know straight away when a cow is sick

Stan, is yours measuring conductivity. Mine is, and alarms if there is a change in it. It's a great indicator of being in heat ( or sick)

delaval · 28-09-2013 9:17pm

stanflt wrote: »

Worth it if your selling 100000 litres per unit IMO

We are selling just shy of 80k litres per unit. I never heard of it measured this way before

maxxuumman · 28-09-2013 9:51pm

delaval wrote: »

Would you get much use from feed to yield. I feel that it has more to offer than TMR. We are considering upgrading our drafting to electronic and it can be added

Feed to yield is a brilliant job. I'm not feeding hard at the moment ( super levy), but there is 4 different feed levels going on at the moment in the herd. 1st calvers, to be dried off, empty and rest of herd.
The control it gives is excellent. Take this spring, as cows calved and joined the herd, their meal was slowly ramped up, while the earlier calving cows could be getting 5kgs in the stall beside her. Too fat, thin,early, late, lame, sick, all getting what they should be.
With regards oopf's,I know you think they are gone with the arc, but once you have A system for identifying the cows , the actual oopf is cheap. It's only an aerial beside a feed hopper.
Ive been watching 2 farmers now that have them for the last two years and they are getting their cows into great condition in the few weeks before calving, and getting great yields from day one of lactation, with brilliant icr. Unlike TMR, the exact cow is getting exactly what she needs, when she needs it. Wouldn't touch TMR with a barge pole

bob charles · 28-09-2013 10:14pm

maxxuumman wrote: »

Feed to yield is a brilliant job. I'm not feeding hard at the moment ( super levy), but there is 4 different feed levels going on at the moment in the herd. 1st calvers, to be dried off, empty and rest of herd.
The control it gives is excellent. Take this spring, as cows calved and joined the herd, their meal was slowly ramped up, while the earlier calving cows could be getting 5kgs in the stall beside her. Too fat, thin,early, late, lame, sick, all getting what they should be.
With regards oopf's,I know you think they are gone with the arc, but once you have A system for identifying the cows , the actual oopf is cheap. It's only an aerial beside a feed hopper.
Ive been watching 2 farmers now that have them for the last two years and they are getting their cows into great condition in the few weeks before calving, and getting great yields from day one of lactation, with brilliant icr. Unlike TMR, the exact cow is getting exactly what she needs, when she needs it. Wouldn't touch TMR with a barge pole

I assume if say your cows are averaging 35l that you feed TMR for the first 30 litres and feed to yield after this. Cow at 35l get shag all and the cow at 45 ltrs get a good few bonus kilos. surely this is the most cost effective way of working. Considering your base can be grazed grass, silage, tmr, whatever you want

maxxuumman · 28-09-2013 10:25pm

bob charles wrote: »

I assume if say your cows are averaging 35l that you feed TMR for the first 30 litres and feed to yield after this. Cow at 35l get shag all and the cow at 45 ltrs get a good few bonus kilos. surely this is the most cost effective way of working. Considering your base can be grazed grass, silage, tmr, whatever you want

Ya, you can set it for "base+", so depending on your grass situation every cow gets Xkg amount + Ykg per litre over a certain yield. Stops the high yielders milking off their backs.

awaywithyou · 28-09-2013 10:51pm

maxxuumman wrote: »

Ya, you can set it for "base+", so depending on your grass situation every cow gets Xkg amount + Ykg per litre over a certain yield. Stops the high yielders milking off their backs.

what make of parlour you got??? is it one by my neighbours (dairymaster)

we're looking at a new parlour... and we will definitely get drafting... acrs.. meters, auto id and then feed-to-yield.... have to agree with whats said here already bout feed-to-yield... its a winner true and true...

ned harty of dairymaster was telling me farmers they have installed feed-to-yield for have on average cut there feed bills by 15%... and cows have done better as the feed is given to those cows who will turn it into loads of milk.... if you were looking for a good return on an investment... feed-to-yield is guaranteed to deliver a super return on your investment.... i sound like a dairymaster sales rep!!!

not all bells and whistles are bad...!!

maxxuumman · 28-09-2013 11:05pm

awaywithyou wrote: »

what make of parlour you got??? is it one by my neighbours (dairymaster)

we're looking at a new parlour... and we will definitely get drafting... acrs.. meters, auto id and then feed-to-yield.... have to agree with whats said here already bout feed-to-yield... its a winner true and true...

ned harty of dairymaster was telling me farmers they have installed feed-to-yield for have on average cut there feed bills by 15%... and cows have done better as the feed is given to those cows who will turn it into loads of milk.... if you were looking for a good return on an investment... feed-to-yield is guaranteed to deliver a super return on your investment.... i sound like a dairymaster sales rep!!!

not all bells and whistles are bad...!!

Fullwood.

freedominacup · 29-09-2013 5:33am

awaywithyou wrote: »

what make of parlour you got??? is it one by my neighbours (dairymaster)

we're looking at a new parlour... and we will definitely get drafting... acrs.. meters, auto id and then feed-to-yield.... have to agree with whats said here already bout feed-to-yield... its a winner true and true...

ned harty of dairymaster was telling me farmers they have installed feed-to-yield for have on average cut there feed bills by 15%... and cows have done better as the feed is given to those cows who will turn it into loads of milk.... if you were looking for a good return on an investment... feed-to-yield is guaranteed to deliver a super return on your investment.... i sound like a dairymaster sales rep!!!

not all bells and whistles are bad...!!

Feed to yield is fine up to around 5-6 kgs of meal per day, after that you are playing russian roulette with your cows health with 3 bullets in the the cylinder. Ketosos, acidosis and laminitis are the bullets. It's only luck rather than good judgement that avoids them above this level of concentrate feeding. The only way to feed high yielding cows is with a TMR/TMR buffer at grass. In the past we have had a 9000kg plus herd average feeding around 1.8 tonnes of concentrate per cow. A good bit higher than this with autumn calvers. No in parlour/straight concentrates whatsoever.

The guys feeding 15% less for the same milk yield were simply not doing a good management job before they put this task in the hands of a machine. That a machine can do it better than them only emphasises this point.

Trying to manage high yielders without a diet feeder is simply making a difficult job unmanageable. You will end up with good cows being culled for no reason other than deficiencies in management.

delaval · 29-09-2013 5:48am

Max
As a matter of interest for comparison, what's your yield and meal per cow?

keep going · 29-09-2013 6:09am

I suppose there's no chance of money coming into this conversation

delaval · 29-09-2013 7:54am

keep going wrote: »

I suppose there's no chance of money coming into this conversation

Is that not what it's all about?

jersey101 · 29-09-2013 9:05am

freedominacup wrote: »

Feed to yield is fine up to around 5-6 kgs of meal per day, after that you are playing russian roulette with your cows health with 3 bullets in the the cylinder. Ketosos, acidosis and laminitis are the bullets. It's only luck rather than good judgement that avoids them above this level of concentrate feeding. The only way to feed high yielding cows is with a TMR/TMR buffer at grass. In the past we have had a 9000kg plus herd average feeding around 1.8 tonnes of concentrate per cow. A good bit higher than this with autumn calvers. No in parlour/straight concentrates whatsoever.

The guys feeding 15% less for the same milk yield were simply not doing a good management job before they put this task in the hands of a machine. That a machine can do it better than them only emphasises this point.

Trying to manage high yielders without a diet feeder is simply making a difficult job unmanageable. You will end up with good cows being culled for no reason other than deficiencies in management.

how much is that 15% worth to you in terms of money saved from meal?? How long would it take you to get tge cost of the feeders back from saving that 15%?

bob charles · 29-09-2013 9:13am

jersey101 wrote: »

how much is that 15% worth to you in terms of money saved from meal?? How long would it take you to get tge cost of the feeders back from saving that 15%?

if freedom has 50 cows he saves circa 13.5t @ €280 = €3780
100 cows €7560 per year on meal costs.

Edit I didnt read back through the post as dont think Fredom said that in parlor feeders are saving 15% feed, what I taught he said having read you post. So discard my figures

delaval · 29-09-2013 9:20am

bob charles wrote: »

if freedom has 50 cows he saves circa 13.5t @ €280 = €3780
100 cows €7560 per year on meal costs.

Have had TMR for years and certainly didn't save me a cent!! Cost time and money.
Very good for incorporating beet or another forage or as a trailer to an out farm.
I accept that finishing cattle is another kettle if fish.

Any cow that requires this type of micro management has no place on my farm. This leads me to thinking feed to yield could suit me better though I'd say it may not happen here. Although if the figure if 15% meal saving is accurate I'd certainly consider it as it would be a massive saving here

bob charles · 29-09-2013 9:28am

delaval wrote: »

Have had TMR for years and certainly didn't save me a cent!! Cost time and money.
Very good for incorporating beet or another forage or as a trailer to an out farm.
I accept that finishing cattle is another kettle if fish.

Any cow that requires this type of micro management has no place on my farm. This leads me to thinking feed to yield could suit me better though I'd say it may not happen here. Although if the figure if 15% meal saving is accurate I'd certainly consider it as it would be a massive saving here

TMR doesnt save money on allot of farms if anything it cost allot of money. Case in point - local know all dairy farmer came into the yard 6 months ago enquiring about my feeder. I told him what he didnt want to hear and choose not to listen. The green salesmen had my for dinner and has a nice shinny feeder landed. He parting comments was that he wasnt going feeding a fancy diet like I have but was only going using it for incorporating straw in with the bales of silage. it was face palm stuff. Im delighted he bought it as a bigger B*****ks you couldnt met in a days walk

maxxuumman · 29-09-2013 9:43am

delaval wrote: »

Max
As a matter of interest for comparison, what's your yield and meal per cow?

Sr 2.3 (including 42% replacements on milking block)
Yield 6800L ( 40% 1st calvers, no cows over 4th lactation)
Solids 428kgs
Meal 1150kgs , no milk from silage
Cell count 98
Tbc 9
No cases of mastitis, 1

Costs per litre 22.5
Net profit/litre including depreciation, personal wages (28k), tax, leases, etc
6c/l

On the cost of the parlour,
Parlour bought 2002, 40k, shed self build 9.5k, concrete/elec/misc about 9k

Auto wash& drafting 2006 7k

Servicing costs 1400/year, but that includes scrapers(10) and well
I'd say 950-1000 is parlour

Chemicals (acid/alkaline/peracetic/teat dip and filters) €1350

I feel violated after that

Now Delaval, tell us, since we're all baring our souls how many you milking

bob charles · 29-09-2013 1:39pm

so maximum a net profit of €400 a cow. is this considered excellent, average or poor? is salary of 28k before tax?

milking parlour build

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