Burka ban

Brown Bomber · 09-09-2013 11:07PM

robindch wrote: »

The following well-written piece is less about the burka and more about what it's like to be a woman in an islamic country.

The blog owner says that it's "very reflective of my friend Reem Abdel-Razek‘s life and experiences", so while fiction, I assume it accurately represents the feelings and thoughts of a woman recently arrived from an unpleasant patriarchal society, and feeling about for the walls she grew up with.

http://aveilandadarkplace.com/2013/07/01/what-it-is-like-to-be-a-muslim-woman-and-why-we-know-what-freedom-is/

Thank you Robin for informing us what it's like to be a woman in an Islamic country.

Might I also recommend "The Gay Girl in Damascus" blog as well for further insight.

And non religious unatic kills wife = lunacy.
Lunatic who is religious kills wife = lunacy religion.

Good argument.

Brown Bomber · 09-09-2013 11:15PM

Something got to do with something (somehow)
Defendant claims "demon" made him murder girlfriend

http://www.wmctv.com/story/16946282/memphis-man-who-said-demon-told-him-to-murder-ex-on-trial

MrPudding · 10-09-2013 07:48AM

I'm non-religious and do not support the ban

Brown Bomber wrote: »

Something got to do with something (somehow)
Defendant claims "demon" made him murder girlfriend

http://www.wmctv.com/story/16946282/memphis-man-who-said-demon-told-him-to-murder-ex-on-trial

Undoubtedly it has something to do with something, but it is hard to see the link between this story and the banning of a garment used to oppress women... Unless you are trying to run an argument that as the victim was at a dance, presumably in escorted and not covered up she somehow deserved to be stabbed to death and had she remained at home, covered up and not allowed out without a male relative, she would still be alive.

MrP

Banbh · 10-09-2013 08:40AM

I'm non-religious and do not support the ban

Google Translate hasn't got a Brown Bomber language.
What is this? "Something got to do with something (somehow)"

Brown Bomber · 10-09-2013 11:17AM

Banbh wrote: »

Google Translate hasn't got a Brown Bomber language.
What is this? "Something got to do with something (somehow)"

Personal attack and elitism, I'm shocked.

Banbh · 10-09-2013 01:48PM

I'm non-religious and do not support the ban

Could you just tell me and that elite group, the English speakers, what it means?
On second thoughts don't bother.

Piliger · 10-09-2013 10:54PM

I'm non-religious and do not support the ban

The Burka is a despicable erasure of a woman's identity, damning her to total anonymity and no civilised society should allow it. If another religion comes along and wants women to walk around in shackles, will that be ok ? will we be told by the politically correct that it is their freedom ? What hubris.

The Burka is also an insult to everyone around the wearer. It is preventing everyone from knowing who or what it is under the clothes. It could be a man or a woman, a pedophile or a murderer. It could be the person who claims they are or someone else. It is a deeply offensive thing to wear a burka in company of other people.

Ireland should have the guts to call it what it is and to stand up for women's and citizen's rights. Wear the Burka at home in the privacy of their houses - fine.

robindch · 19-09-2013 10:38AM

I'm non-religious and do not support the ban

From AI's fb page:

Michael Nugent will be discussing Muslim women wearing veils in public spaces, with Dr Yafa Shanneil of UCC, on Today with Sean O’Rourke on RTE Radio 1, at about 11 am, Thursday 19 September.

Brown Bomber · 19-09-2013 09:13PM

robindch wrote: »

From AI's fb page:

Michael Nugent will be discussing Muslim women wearing veils in public spaces, with Dr Yafa Shanneil of UCC, on Today with Sean O’Rourke on RTE Radio 1, at about 11 am, Thursday 19 September.

http://www.rte.ie/radio1/today-with-sean-o-rourke/

He'd do well not to being Maryam Namazie into the debate. A foaming propagandist pushing an anti-Muslim agenda and also a Communist who¨s views on Muslims are indistinguishable from the Far-Right.

robindch · 20-09-2013 12:01AM

I'm non-religious and do not support the ban

Brown Bomber wrote: »

He'd do well not to being Maryam Namazie into the debate. A foaming propagandist pushing an anti-Muslim agenda and also a Communist who¨s views on Muslims are indistinguishable from the Far-Right.

Funny you should mention Maryam. I had a long chat with her a couple of years back over several coffees -- she's a great woman: perceptive, intelligent, witty, warm and with enormous and sympathetic insight into how religion corrupts people and how it corrupts society, laws and states.

And she drew a mean pastel-crayon picture for my kid's "scrapbook for friends" too without foaming at the mouth even just once.

Dublin Red Devil · 20-09-2013 01:04AM

I'm non-religious and do not support the ban

I support a ban on Burkas because the face is covered and the identity of the woman is hidden from the public. The Hijab, head scarf is acceptable because it just cover the head and not the face

Brown Bomber · 20-09-2013 01:17AM

robindch wrote: »

Funny you should mention Maryam. I had a long chat with her a couple of years back over several coffees -- she's a great woman: perceptive, intelligent, witty, warm and with enormous and sympathetic insight into how religion corrupts people and how it corrupts society, laws and states.

And she drew a mean pastel-crayon picture for my kid's "scrapbook for friends" too without foaming at the mouth even just once.

If she was so intelligent she wouldn't be fighting against something that could never happen. Wish I could have 5 minutes with her and explain that for Shariah Law to ever become a reality in the UK then the Queen would have to be a radical Islamist. http://www.parliament.uk/about/how/laws/

Far more useful to the debate than a well-fed, middle-aged, middle-class, white man blathering on about something that he doesn't know about on the radio is this link, it's veiled Muslim women sharing their experiences.

http://www.independent.co.uk/incoming/the-faces-behind-the-veil-muslim-women-speak-out-against-ban-8812767.html

Brown Bomber · 20-09-2013 01:19AM

Dublin Red Devil wrote: »

I support a ban on Burkas because the face is covered and the identity of the woman is hidden from the public. The Hijab, head scarf is acceptable because it just cover the head and not the face

What right have you to demand to see a strangers face?

Piliger · 20-09-2013 03:28AM

I'm non-religious and do not support the ban

Brown Bomber wrote: »

What right have you to demand to see a strangers face?

So you have no problem if all the bank staff wear balaclavas, your doctor wears a balaclava, the people sitting at the bar beside you all wear balaclavas ?

Banbh · 20-09-2013 09:01AM

I'm non-religious and do not support the ban

At any moment there are thousands of human inter-actions going on - working, buying, selling, playing, and a tiny bit of hostility. We are a co-operative, social species and all this is possible because we have developed complex communication skills - language of course, body language and gesture and facial expression.

The deliberate exclusion of one gender from social interaction, by concealing them, is an affront to the whole of society and a great abuse of the rights of the women themselves.

And if I may say so, there is an aggressive attitude in your post BB, towards Maryam Namazie, Michael Nugent and those who oppose face masks in public, that might also be lessened by a willingness to communicate with other posters here.

inocybe · 20-09-2013 10:09AM

I'm non-religious and do not support the ban

I don't know if this is the right place, but I passed by a woman in London wearing what looked like a scold's bridle. A bit of googling tells me that it's called a batoola.
Found it very disturbing.

https://www.google.ie/search?q=batoola&hl=en&client=firefox-a&hs=K5l&rls=com.frontmotion:en-US:unofficial&prmd=imvns&tbm=isch&tbo=u&source=univ&sa=X&ei=Sv4NT8enEuXt0gHE472GBg&ved=0CDEQsAQ&biw=913&bih=516&gws_rd=cr

robindch · 20-09-2013 10:14AM

I'm non-religious and do not support the ban

Brown Bomber wrote: »

If she was so intelligent she wouldn't be fighting against something that could never happen. Wish I could have 5 minutes with her and explain that for Shariah Law to ever become a reality in the UK then the Queen would have to be a radical Islamist.

I take it you're unaware that sharia law is already fully up and running in the UK:

http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/b01rxfjt
http://www.gatestoneinstitute.org/3682/uk-sharia-courts

Do you want to tell the Queen, or should I?

Brown Bomber · 20-09-2013 11:24AM

robindch wrote: »

I take it you're unaware that sharia law is already fully up and running in the UK:

I take it you are aware that there is no more Shariah Law in Britain than there is boards.ie law in Ireland.

They are not "Shariah Courts". They are voluntary civilian TRIBUNALS. Exactly as the Dispute Resolution system is on boards.

robindch wrote: »

http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/b01rxfjt
http://www.gatestoneinstitute.org/3682/uk-sharia-courts

Do you want to tell the Queen, or should I?

:pac: The "progressive" atheist linking to a right-wing Judeo-Christian propaganda think-tank. Says it all really. I take it you are unaware that Anders Breivik's primary inspiration and contact Fjordman is on the staff there. Though what should it matter? There is little daylight between his and your views on Muslims as far as I can tell.

Forget the Queen. Let your Communist-agitator friend with the anti-Muslim agenda know that there is no Shariah Law in Britain and never will be (though if she was to admit this the donations might dry up) and while you are at it ask her why she has left the agunot behind.

Sarky · 20-09-2013 12:50PM

You really love your derogatory labels, don't you?

Banbh · 20-09-2013 01:01PM

I'm non-religious and do not support the ban

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Maryam_Namazie

Following from Michael Nugent's radio comments, I just had to google Maryam Namazie as I had not heard of her before She really is a remarkable woman. I wonder if she could be persuaded by Atheist Ireland or the Humanist Association to speak in Ireland?

Corkfeen · 20-09-2013 01:48PM

I'm religious and support the ban

I have no problem with people having the option of Sharia Arbitration as long as laws aren't broken in the process. However I also think Maryam Namazie is a fantastic individual and she does point to issues with Sharia arbitration such as community pressure and people under the false belief that the arbitration is legally binding.

BB, you're becoming as bad as other posters with this Anti-Muslim agenda stuff.

Banbh wrote: »

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Maryam_Namazie

Following from Michael Nugent's radio comments, I just had to google Maryam Namazie as I had not heard of her before She really is a remarkable woman. I wonder if she could be persuaded by Atheist Ireland or the Humanist Association to speak in Ireland?

Her articles are linked to on her site, enjoy.

http://www.maryamnamazie.com/

Piliger · 20-09-2013 02:29PM

I'm non-religious and do not support the ban

Brown Bomber wrote: »

They are not "Shariah Courts". They are voluntary civilian TRIBUNALS. Exactly as the Dispute Resolution system is on boards.

This may be the cas superficially. It may be fine for men, but for women, they have no real freedom and are under intense, life influencing pressure from their families to behave the way they demand and to accept judgement that they make. They know what happens to women who go against their families.

Brown Bomber · 21-09-2013 06:49PM

Banbh wrote: »

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Maryam_Namazie

Following from Michael Nugent's radio comments, I just had to google Maryam Namazie as I had not heard of her before She really is a remarkable woman. I wonder if she could be persuaded by Atheist Ireland or the Humanist Association to speak in Ireland?

Persuade? Write her a fat cheque and she'll be there. What would be the point though? A rabble of people having their prejudices reinforced by a speaker pushing a singularly anti-Muslim agenda.

On the plus side she could hand out signed copies of the Communist Manifesto at end.

Piliger wrote: »

So you have no problem if all the bank staff wear balaclavas, your doctor wears a balaclava, the people sitting at the bar beside you all wear balaclavas ?

What kind of an answer is the above to anything???

I asked you a very simple question. I'd still like you to tell me precisely what gives you the right to see a strangers face in public if they they don't wish to show you?

Piliger wrote: »

This may be the cas superficially. It may be fine for men, but for women, they have no real freedom and are under intense, life influencing pressure from their families to behave the way they demand and to accept judgement that they make. They know what happens to women who go against their families.

Honour Killings right? :rolleyes:

So correct me where I am wrong here - Women, and that's only Muslim women have "no freedom" in the UK, ALL are forced to go to these secret Shariah Courts and ALL must accept their decisions or something really, really bad will happen to ALL of them (probably by a Muslim man, with a suicide vest, beard and sandals).

Banbh · 22-09-2013 01:02AM

I'm non-religious and do not support the ban

Persuade? Write her a fat cheque and she'll be there. What would be the point though? A rabble of people having their prejudices reinforced by a speaker pushing a singularly anti-Muslim agenda.

Abuse is a poor substitute for reasoning. Some of the nicest people you can meet are rabble.

Mark Hamill · 22-09-2013 01:29AM

I'm non-religious and do not support the ban

Brown Bomber wrote: »

Honour Killings right? :rolleyes:

So correct me where I am wrong here - Women, and that's only Muslim women have "no freedom" in the UK, ALL are forced to go to these secret Shariah Courts and ALL must accept their decisions or something really, really bad will happen to ALL of them (probably by a Muslim man, with a suicide vest, beard and sandals).

I had a crack team of scientists, philosophers and spiritual gurus (and one pizza delivery guy, we got hungry) examine your response here but we couldn't figure out were the hell you are getting this from Piligers post.

Godeatsboogers · 22-09-2013 01:34AM

They'll be banning Guy Fawkes masks next, then Batman costumes, and Barney as well

MrPudding · 22-09-2013 08:56AM

I'm non-religious and do not support the ban

Godeatsboogers wrote: »

They'll be banning Guy Fawkes masks next, then Batman costumes, and Barney as well

In certain circumstances those things are already banned. Try filling up with fuel or getting served in a bank with a guy falkes mask.

MrP

Banbh · 22-09-2013 09:26AM

I'm non-religious and do not support the ban

I know it's a just a gag but the comparison often made between the burka and halloween masks etc don't take into account the fact that the burka denies a gender (females) access to society. It essentially denies them their personhood and keeps them as goods or lesser animals, which is the intention.

Piliger · 22-09-2013 07:13PM

I'm non-religious and do not support the ban

Banbh wrote: »

I know it's a just a gag but the comparison often made between the burka and halloween masks etc don't take into account the fact that the burka denies a gender (females) access to society. It essentially denies them their personhood and keeps them as goods or lesser animals, which is the intention.

Exactly. And all of those other items are worn temporarily ... at a protest, a party etc.
These women have their very identity wiped ALL the time. And we are subjected to this all of the time they are in public.

Scotty # · 22-09-2013 08:10PM

I'm religious and support the ban

Piliger wrote: »

And we are subjected to this all of the time they are in public.

Yea sure you'd be falling over them every time you walk out the door! How dare they subject us to it!!! Criminalise the lot of them!! And while we're at it... maybe there are a few more victims of oppression/abuse we can criminalise too?

Burka ban

Comments