"Irish" names on wikipedia

purplepanda · 05-09-2013 11:26PM

P. Breathnach wrote: »

There still are pockets in the Dingle Gaeltacht where Irish is truly the first language of the people (and others, including Dingle, where it hasn't been so for several generations). If she lives in a genuine Gaeltacht community and insists on using English, she is as much deserving of criticism as are those gaelgóirí who seek to impose Irish on people in the Galltacht.

She lives in Ballyferriter (don't ask me to spell that in Irish

) 2 of her daughters have degrees from UCC in Irish despite moving there as teenagers from overseas, her husband is fluent & from the area.

However I've noticed the local teenagers speaking Irish to visitors & family / neighbours but English amongst themselves. The younger local kids seem to speak Irish to their parents but maybe this changes as they get older.

My cousin has tried to learn with plenty of encouragement from her husband but it seems to me she can get on well enough without Irish.

I think Wibbs has it right there's more than enough English spoken there for her to get by fine.

Iwasfrozen · 05-09-2013 11:31PM

An Coilean wrote: »

There are many Historical Irish figures who are referenced in books, source material etc by their Irish name, even though the English version of their name might be more commonly used when discussing them today.

Michael Collins for example was commonly refered to and indeed signed stuff using the Irish version of his name though today it is quite uncommon to hear him refered to as anything other than Michael Collins today.

It may be the case that someone will come accross a historical figure who is referenced using the Irish version of their name and would then go looking up further information on them using that version, this being reflected in a wikipedia article about them is just common sense.

To be fair that does make a lot of sense. If the person in question was referred to by their Irish name then their Irish name should be given priority even.

shruikan2553 · 05-09-2013 11:38PM

I loved when irish teachers didn't know my surname in irish so made it out to be the holy grail and we must set off to discover it. I agree with the whole if your name is Frank then you are called Frank no matter what language someone is speaking. We dont turn Padraig into Patrick for English class so why do it in Irish class? Altering names for use where a certain sound doesn't work in a country makes sense but all Irish speakers can pronounce Patrick so there is no reason to do it.

feargale · 06-09-2013 12:11AM

Iwasfrozen wrote: »

To be fair that does make a lot of sense. If the person in question was referred to by their Irish name then their Irish name should be given priority even.

How many angels can be accomodated on the tip of a needle?

Iwasfrozen · 06-09-2013 12:52AM

feargale wrote: »

How many angels can be accomodated on the tip of a needle?

Depends on the size on the angels.

Insect Overlord · 06-09-2013 02:12AM

shruikan2553 wrote: »

I agree with the whole if your name is Frank then you are called Frank no matter what language someone is speaking.

Dheara, whisht now, Proinsias! :P

Iwasfrozen · 06-09-2013 03:05AM

Insect Overlord wrote: »

Dheara, whisht now, Proinsias! :P

That one always confused me. How did an F sound become P?

Davidius · 06-09-2013 04:46AM

Iwasfrozen wrote: »

That one always confused me. How did an F sound become P?

I would guess the F form probably appeared where a séimhiú/lenition would normally occur so the F was interpreted as a lenited consonant (Ph). Hence people would induce a base form beginning with a P.

Ex. "a Francis" -> "a Phroinsias" -> "Proinsias".

Insect Overlord · 06-09-2013 06:42AM

^ That would be my best guess too. The Tuiseal Gairmeach/Vocative Case of the name would have been very difficult to pronounce if it was taken to start with an F.

brimal · 06-09-2013 08:41AM

I saw somebody on this thread say John/Sean is a Christian name - it's not. John/Jonathan is a Hebrew name, meaning 'Graced by God'.

In fact a huge amount of names used in Ireland today are from Hebrew - John, Mary, Michael, Sarah, Daniel, Deborah, Nathan, Tanya, etc. etc.

It's worth checking out the origin of your name as the majority have their own literal translation too, which might be interesting to some folk.

Iwasfrozen · 06-09-2013 12:58PM

Davidius wrote: »

I would guess the F form probably appeared where a séimhiú/lenition would normally occur so the F was interpreted as a lenited consonant (Ph). Hence people would induce a base form beginning with a P.

Ex. "a Francis" -> "a Phroinsias" -> "Proinsias".

Ah so it's more like a grammatical construction? That makes sense thanks a lot.

Iwasfrozen · 06-09-2013 01:02PM

brimal wrote: »

I saw somebody on this thread say John/Sean is a Christian name - it's not. John/Jonathan is a Hebrew name, meaning 'Graced by God'.

In fact a huge amount of names used in Ireland today are from Hebrew - John, Mary, Michael, Sarah, Daniel, Deborah, Nathan, Tanya, etc. etc.

It's worth checking out the origin of your name as the majority have their own literal translation too, which might be interesting to some folk.

Christian name is just another way of saying first name.

Insect Overlord wrote: »

^ That would be my best guess too. The Tuiseal Gairmeach/Vocative Case of the name would have been very difficult to pronounce if it was taken to start with an F.

A Fhancias sounds really cool. Maybe that's just me.

My name is URL · 06-09-2013 01:10PM

So has the OP resurfaced with any examples of this happening yet?

Iwasfrozen · 06-09-2013 01:56PM

My name is URL wrote: »

So has the OP resurfaced with any examples of this happening yet?

Here

"Irish" names on wikipedia

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