How has your opinons on characters changed?

snausages · 17-08-2013 01:52PM

I'd like to see them go down the Jesse as informant route. The in-and-out of depression character arc has gotten stale. Make him a major player again even if it means collaborating with the DEA.

SweepTheLeg · 17-08-2013 02:03PM

D.Q wrote: »

Walt is definitely meant to be taken as a bad ass. Look at any of the pictures/promos for this season or 5p1. "Return of the king" etc etc.

snausages · 17-08-2013 02:13PM

See when I look at that promo the image of an empty, derelict warehouse just speaks another subtext altogether. As an image of empire and the culmination of Walt's effort it's pretty bleak. What has Walt's 'victory' brought him exactly? He's a dying man with no-one around him but his meth and money. It's not all too unlike that Ozymandias promo

SweepTheLeg · 17-08-2013 02:21PM

snausages wrote: »

What has Walt's 'victory' brought him exactly? He's a dying man with no-one around him but his meth and money. It's not all too unlike that Ozymandias promo

It's gained him power and respect. Every dealer from ABQ to Mexico and now Europe knows who Heisenberg is.

snausages · 17-08-2013 02:24PM

SweepTheLeg wrote: »

It's gained him power and respect. Every dealer from ABQ to Mexico and now Europe knows who Heisenberg is.

Which means nothing when he's lost the respect of his loved ones who, lest we forget, were the supposed motive of his 'breaking bad' in the first place. I think that image is supposed to problematise Walt's rise and his reasons for doing it. All he has now is a pseudo-empire built on death and human-suffering, an empire which is mostly just an idea rather than anything tangible. People fear him, but so what?

gustavo · 17-08-2013 02:32PM

Lot more sympathetic to Skylar , Jesse and Hank as the show has gone on. Walt less so

snausages · 17-08-2013 02:34PM

The other thing about Heisenberg is that it's the idea rather than the man that they fear. Heisenberg is a man that people don't know much about. If the flashforward is any indication then that's something that will soon change. This half-season will see the unwravelling of the Heisenberg myth and Walt's downfall.

Of course being Heisnberg he's probably going to do something in the 11th hour to cement his reputation forever. Because Heisenberg's uncertainty principle and all that, he's unpredictable

April O Neill · 17-08-2013 08:03PM

cloudatlas wrote: »

I think all the female roles are underdeveloped in breaking bad. Skyler doesn't have a character arc, jane died before she had a chance, lydia is one dimensional. Marie never really went anywhere. They are there to play second fiddle to the men.

And I guess that's OK. I think it's fair to assume that the drug trade is predominantly male, so it's OK to focus more on the men in the show.

I think, though, that Walt Jr. is the most underdeveloped character, but I think that's fine too. He's a teenager, doing teenagery things. I reckon they wanted to keep it like that, almost like he and Holly are the only untainted ones on the show.

cloudatlas · 17-08-2013 09:12PM

April O Neill wrote: »

And I guess that's OK. I think it's fair to assume that the drug trade is predominantly male, so it's OK to focus more on the men in the show.

I think, though, that Walt Jr. is the most underdeveloped character, but I think that's fine too. He's a teenager, doing teenagery things. I reckon they wanted to keep it like that, almost like he and Holly are the only untainted ones on the show.

Agreed at best the women just facilitate some of the plot at worst they are vilified like skylar, it works in some series when several characters have a story, like mad men but in this case I think the focus is fine.

Mardy Bum · 17-08-2013 09:25PM

cloudatlas wrote: »

I think all the female roles are underdeveloped in breaking bad. Skyler doesn't have a character arc, jane died before she had a chance, lydia is one dimensional. Marie never really went anywhere. They are there to play second fiddle to the men.

They are merely plot devices like most of the male characters.

April O Neill · 17-08-2013 09:58PM

Mardy Bum wrote: »

They are merely plot devices like most of the male characters.

Yeah, when ya think about, Mike and Saul are pretty one dimensional characters, so it's not like it's just the womenfolk.

April O Neill · 17-08-2013 10:01PM

gustavo wrote: »

Lot more sympathetic to Skylar , Jesse and Hank as the show has gone on. Walt less so

I feel sympathy for Jesse, but less so than for Hank And Skylar.

Jesse's life shouldn't be where it is, and it's his own doing that it is. He was from a comfortably well-off upper middle class family and would have had all the attendant advantages of that at his disposal.

Mardy Bum · 17-08-2013 10:06PM

April O Neill wrote: »

Yeah, when ya think about, Mike and Saul are pretty one dimensional characters, so it's not like it's just the womenfolk.

The show is plot driven rather than character driven (The Wire, The Sopranos). I think Oz(although it blurred the lines as it had some brilliant main character) and Twin Peaks (David Lynch stint to be more exact in Season 1 and a bit of season 2) was better plot driven show although it is very close and the three are the best plot driven shows compared with drivel like Prison Break which was also wildly popular. The only characters that are mildly interesting on any close inspection are Walt and Jesse. This was obviously Cranstons plan as well made plot driven shows are immediate money makers compared with character driven shows like the Wire and Treme. To give Cranston credit there is a decent aesthetic running through the show but very little depth of character.

snausages · 17-08-2013 10:09PM

Treme is a show that I think suffered by too much emphasis on character and too little on plot.

Mardy Bum · 17-08-2013 10:25PM

snausages wrote: »

Treme is a show that I think suffered by too much emphasis on character and too little on plot.

It was the most experimental shows (brought intertextuality to another level, the music was astounding and necessary, character's stories were heart touching and they developed in their own right, documented real life events very well, was aesthetically brilliant and denied the average viewer an easy ride) TV since Twin Peaks (although not as immediately successful but I think this is because of the imperious David Lynch) and it pulled it off very well with some phenomenal scenes (not many shows can get scenes from Waiting for Godot into them). History will judge it well.

April O Neill · 17-08-2013 10:43PM

Mardy Bum wrote: »

This was obviously Cranstons plan as well made plot driven shows are immediate money makers compared with character driven shows like the Wire and Treme. To give Cranston credit there is a decent aesthetic running through the show but very little depth of character.

Gilligan's plan, you mean?

Mardy Bum · 17-08-2013 10:46PM

April O Neill wrote: »

Gilligan's plan, you mean?

Yes.

The acting in the show is excellent which makes it imo.

Jimmy Iovine · 18-08-2013 12:31AM

I think most people's opinion of Walt could be summed up in this short gif.

It's Walt entering his house on three consecutive birthdays.

He goes from the lovable fool, to a person who we MAY be able to forgive, to someone who has become the complete villain. The difference is astounding.

Grimebox · 19-08-2013 07:25PM

S5E10 spoilers :

how do the Skylar haters feel about her now?

SweepTheLeg · 19-08-2013 07:26PM

Grimebox wrote: »

S5E10 spoilers :
how do the Skylar haters feel about her now?

Redeemed.

Wacker The Attacker · 19-08-2013 08:34PM

Jimmy Iovine wrote: »

I think most people's opinion of Walt could be summed up in this short gif.

It's Walt entering his house on three consecutive birthdays.

He goes from the lovable fool, to a person who we MAY be able to forgive, to someone who has become the complete villain. The difference is astounding.

I want him to win. Still.

Wacker The Attacker · 19-08-2013 08:36PM

Grimebox wrote: »

S5E10 spoilers :
how do the Skylar haters feel about her now?

I never disliked her to begin with. She was annoying at times but not the misery guts that some people had her marked out as

Mardy Bum · 19-08-2013 08:39PM

Wacker The Attacker wrote: »

I never disliked her to begin with. She was annoying at times but not the misery guts that some people had her marked out as

She is just a plot device who changes her mind to suit Walts new predicaments therefore making it impossible to say what she "really" is like.

Wacker The Attacker · 19-08-2013 08:54PM

Mardy Bum wrote: »

She is just a plot device who changes her mind to suit Walts new predicaments therefore making it impossible to say what she "really" is like.

Isnt every character like that to some degree

Mardy Bum · 19-08-2013 08:57PM

Wacker The Attacker wrote: »

Isnt every character like that to some degree

Yes in BB they are (apart from Walt and Jesse) which makes it a much lesser show compared with great tv like The Sopranos and The Wire where there are actually characters with arcs and traits. No depth at all to BB, just cardboard cut outs to keep the cliff hangers rolling.

Mr.Saturn · 19-08-2013 10:05PM

I'm still getting ramped for that moment when Jesse quits referring to Walter as Mr. White. Even at previous lowest between'em, when Jesse was on Gus' side, Jesse refused to address him as anything else. A given with how they met, but even after all's gone on, Jesse still keeps this slightly reverential level to their relationship.

Jesse's first 'Hello, Walter.' is gonna segue into something big, methinks.

snausages · 20-08-2013 01:08PM

This week's episode was a bit unusual in that it was BB's women that provided the ep with most of its dramatic energy. I think there's plenty of scope to develop characters like Marie without them feeling like they're just scenery to be wheeled out when needed. They needn't be wasted on frivolous kleptomania subplots that do nothing but test viewer's patience.

It's interesting comparing this with Dexter atm. Everything is coming to a head in BB whereas Dexter is practically in reverse gear.

April O Neill · 21-08-2013 07:24AM

Mr.Saturn wrote: »

Jesse's first 'Hello, Walter.' is gonna segue into something big, methinks.

I really hope this doesn't happen. So corny.

Snoopy1 · 21-08-2013 11:14AM

Ive gone from having sympathy with Walt, to really disliking him. He's become arrogant, and selfish. I reallly hope he gets his comeuppance.
Jessie i do like him, but im getting tired with the whole up/down days. Ive no sympathy with anyone that gets into drugs though.
Saul, think he's great and i did like Mike as well.

I actually cat wait for the show to end, purely because of my dislike of Walt.

SweepTheLeg · 21-08-2013 11:21AM

Snoopy1 wrote: »

.I actually cat wait for the show to end, purely because of my dislike of Walt.

Maybe you should start watching a different show then.

How has your opinons on characters changed?

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