Words of comfort for those who failed

wil · 14-08-2013 12:18PM

Guill wrote: »

3 people in my year got 600 points. Two of them own a chain of off licences and 1 of them is in jail for embezzlement moved to the states because the bank couldn't "ahem" afford him anymore.

Futured your post

Amirani · 14-08-2013 12:21PM

68Murph68 wrote: »

The notion of them "failing" in their academic endeavors because they weren't intellectual able enough is a serious erroneously interpretation of the circumstances.

Where did I say they failed because they weren't "intellectual able enough"?

I said no such thing. All I said was they didn't succeed in formal academic terms because they didn't complete their respective degrees, purely to highlight the fact that formal academic achievements aren't all they're sometimes cracked up to be - i.e. it's completely possible to be successful without them.

I've no idea why you decided to take my post so literally.

Lossagh · 14-08-2013 12:23PM

I would say, chin up, roll with the punches and give it another shot if the reason you failed was lack of study.

Also check out VEC's And other routes to certificate courses that can develop into degrees, there are routes to get a degree outside of the CAO framework. Also, if you return to college in years from now as a mature student, the leaving cert becomes less important and your experience, your attitude to life and your aptitude is far more important in the long run. Don't give up!

kippy · 14-08-2013 12:24PM

notnumber wrote: »

Thats the sort of advice that ensures a career in Australia when the next recession comes around.

Not if you're a mechanic from what I can tell.......

kunst nugget · 14-08-2013 12:26PM

Guill wrote: »

3 people in my year got 600 points. Two of them are working in off licences and 1 of them is working in the bookies.

Dats all da prof ya ned 2 no dat educaton is 4 loosers…

kunst nugget · 14-08-2013 12:35PM

NiallSparky wrote: »

Where did I say they failed because they weren't "intellectual able enough"?

I said no such thing. All I said was they didn't succeed in formal academic terms because they didn't complete their respective degrees, purely to highlight the fact that formal academic achievements aren't all they're sometimes cracked up to be - i.e. it's completely possible to be successful without them.

I've no idea why you decided to take my post so literally.

You said:

Some of the most successful people in the world of business and technology were abject failure in school or college.

Dropping out to set up your own business hardly makes you an abject failure in school or college. People like to use these examples to rubbish the notion educational advancement but these cases are really the exceptions that prove the rule.

JP85 · 14-08-2013 12:53PM

The LC was just a rediculous memory test, it doenst prepare you for 3rd level education or life, its not that important, there are many ways to skin a cat, i did a terrible LC and still have a great career, probably took me like a year or two longer tp get to where i am but hey thats life

notnumber · 14-08-2013 12:54PM

Cianos wrote: »

Of course it's ultimately up to you - but the school and the teachers play a massive part in that.

If you have teachers that don't actually teach, then do you still think that's of no consequence?

Or can you explain to me how a student with a great teacher is on an equal level with a student who has a terrible teacher?

My point was that if a student does badly, there's a good chance that they went to a bad school, and that if they genuinely want to get ahead then repeating is an option and is of the most value to those who went to a bad school because they're likely to see a much higher % increase in their second attempt than someone who went to a great school.

Student B goes to a great school and gets 400 points. Goes on to repeat, works incredibly hard and gets 500 points: 25% increase.

Student A goes to a bad school and gets 200 points in their leaving cert. Goes on to repeat, works incredibly hard and gets 400 points: 100% increase.

Do you see where I'm coming from?

Yes of course teachers are a variable factor but so are many other things such as your mates,your home life all I am is saying that failures will blame anyone bar themselves..but I do acknowledge your point.

Amirani · 14-08-2013 01:01PM

kunst nugget wrote: »

You said:

Dropping out to set up your own business hardly makes you an abject failure in school or college. People like to use these examples to rubbish the notion educational advancement but these cases are really the exceptions that prove the rule.

Some of the most successful people were abject failures though in college or school. I'm not including Gates and Zuckerberg amongst these, simply highlighting them because they're proof having a degree isn't fantastically important when you have other important attributes.

There's many people who have indeed failed rather than dropped out and still proved successful. They may indeed be the exception, I never claimed otherwise. I'm not negating the importance of education either (to do so would be retarded), and I've followed a traditional path through education, I'm simply pointing out that there is unconventional alternatives if today proved to be a **** up.

razorblunt · 14-08-2013 01:28PM

It's hard to describe just how little a care is given to the LC, 2 years after you've finished it.
Didn't get the college course you wanted? Repeat.
Unhappy with the results but still got your course, fock it, you'll have forgotten if after your first Tuesday night pints session when you get into college.

eviltwin · 14-08-2013 01:33PM

Well done to everyone getting their results today no matter what grades they got. If I could pass on any words of wisdom it would be that the whole world seems condensed right now to college and points but even if you don't get your first choice don't feel that's it. I missed out on what I wanted to do first time round and ended up doing a course that was my third or fourth choice, it wasn't my passion but I did well out of it, got a good job and met some people through it who will be friends forever. I eventually got round to doing what I wanted to do at the grand old age of 32 and tbh, if I could go back and change things I don't think I would.

Life throws curve balls all the time, now is the time to regroup, examine your options and see what path you can take from here. If you have your heart set on doing something for life then one or two extra years to get there aren't a waste.

Best of luck to everyone xx

Kur4mA · 14-08-2013 01:34PM

Don't fret. The leaving cert is a joke and a waste of time. You'll use almost nothing you learned in school in the real world anyway. I barely scraped a pass, skipped college and have a good job all these years later.

My main piece of advice would be to get your ass into college and get a degree. If I could turn back time, it's the one thing I'd make sure I did. I'm in college part time and working full time now.

As for the people talking about getting a trade. More than half of the lads doing my course are electricians, plumbers, tilers, or carpenters. Get yourself onto Springboard or whatever other options are open to you to get your ass into college and do a Business or Computing degree.

fryup · 14-08-2013 01:41PM

fryup wrote: »

I would tell them to forget about college its full of pretentious types anyway, instead get a trade...mechanic, plumber, electrician, carpenter etc there's plenty of opportunities out there

notnumber wrote: »

Thats the sort of advice that ensures a career in Australia when the next recession comes around.

like everyone else then,

as long as they increase their chances of employment, does it really matter where they get it

kunst nugget · 14-08-2013 01:41PM

My main piece of advice would be to always wear sunscreen.

playedalive · 14-08-2013 01:43PM

Consider ALL your options. There are different ways to skin a cat. There are such a multitude of PLC courses and other ways of getting into something you want. Definitely think hard.

As a college graduate now, I wished I had thought more about my CAO choices and what I was good at. While I have a degree that I reasonably enjoyed, I could have spent those four years studying/doing/working at something with better prospects career-wise. Also, there is a huge difference between studying in college and university. I'd figure many people who don't get the results they wanted, could succeed better in a less rigid learning system (i.e. college). I chose a subject in college that I loved in school (Modern Languages), but it wasn't what I thought it would be. Now, four years later, I'm like 'what next?'. So, College is not the 'be all and end all'.

There is always going to college a few years later. With work experience and other qualifications, it can only make your prospects a lot better.

womandriver · 14-08-2013 01:48PM

seamus wrote: »

After a year, nobody will ever ask you again how you did in your leaving cert.

After five years, you won't even remember.

That's how unimportant it is.

Unless you want to be an accountant, they still place a lot if emphasis on LC.

danniemcq · 14-08-2013 01:52PM

I failed my LC, well failed Math and Physics. Still got into college, failed 5 of 7 exams in the first year and never went back.

Im now doing quite well for an American insurance company working with Databases etc with a kinda fancy job title (senior research analyst)

Failure in exams does not mean a failure in your life prospects. It may make your dream job slightly harder to get but damn it'll make it so worthwhile when you do get it!

68Murph68 · 14-08-2013 02:00PM

NiallSparky wrote: »

Where did I say they failed because they weren't "intellectual able enough"?

I said no such thing. All I said was they didn't succeed in formal academic terms because they didn't complete their respective degrees, purely to highlight the fact that formal academic achievements aren't all they're sometimes cracked up to be - i.e. it's completely possible to be successful without them.

I've no idea why you decided to take my post so literally.

You mentioned 3 people, 2 of whom did exceptionally well in the US equivalent of the Leaving, the other who probably also did extremely success as part of what you would say to console people who had failed their Leaving.

All 3 of them did go to college/university (2 of them to one of the most prestigious universities in the world), but dropped out not because they weren't able for university but for other reasons; so while they failed to get degrees it was a wholly different type of category of failure to someone failing their Leaving Certificate. If all three had wanted to I have no doubts that all three would have the intellectual ability to complete a degree. I would have serious doubts about the intellectual ability of someone who failed the Leaving to complete a degree.

All three of Gates, Jobs and Zuckerberg achieved what they did because of extremely high intellectual ability and as such someone who failed their Leaving Certificate is extremely unlikely to be able to emulate them, no matter how hard-working or determined they are. Using these three as part of an effort to console those who failed the Leaving Cert which is primarily a test of intellectual ability is just so misguided I just felt forced to comment.

shopaholic01 · 14-08-2013 02:12PM

You'll live a charmed life if this is your biggest disappointment.

Repeat if you think you can honestly do better are motivated enough, chose a PLC relevant to your chosen career if you can't. Enjoy yourself now, working isn't all it's cracked up to be, it's a means to fund your lifestyle and time off work.

He Who Dares Wins · 14-08-2013 02:22PM

Its hard to find the words to say to somebody at a time like that when they are hoping for better. I didn't do too great in my leaving cert, went and done an apprenticeship as a bricklayer and after the arse fell out of the construction industry I went back to college and now have a computer science degree.

danniemcq · 14-08-2013 02:25PM

He Who Dares Wins wrote: »

Its hard to find the words to say to somebody at a time like that when they are hoping for better. I didn't do too great in my leaving cert, went and done an apprenticeship as a bricklayer and after the arse fell out of the construction industry I went back to college and now have a computer science degree.

I often find that saying nothing does fine, don't mention it to them. I hated people going on about my results to me. It felt really patronizing when I knew myself what it meant.

The best thing is often just getting their head off it for a while.

kunst nugget · 14-08-2013 02:36PM

danniemcq wrote: »

The best thing is often just getting their head off it for a while.

Getting off their head helps with that usually.

Amirani · 14-08-2013 02:40PM

68Murph68 wrote: »

All 3 of them did go to college/university (2 of them to one of the most prestigious universities in the world), but dropped out not because they weren't able for university but for other reasons; so while they failed to get degrees it was a wholly different type of category of failure to someone failing their Leaving Certificate. If all three had wanted to I have no doubts that all three would have the intellectual ability to complete a degree. I would have serious doubts about the intellectual ability of someone who failed the Leaving to complete a degree.

Did you read the thread title? What I wrote was an example of how I'd console someone who failed today, by underplaying the importance of a degree and highlighting people who have done well without them. Go with your method though, I'm sure it would work far better.

steddyeddy · 14-08-2013 02:41PM

Failing the leaving cert does not mean you're not academically minded. It could have meant you're not ready for it at this point in time. Personaly I think the leaving cert is a glorified memory test and not a measure of academic ability. There are phd students in college who failed the leaving cert and went in through other routes.

You can still be whoever or whatever you want to be so never lose sight of that.

silvervixen84 · 14-08-2013 02:42PM

One of my teachers once said to us:

There's life with a good Leaving Cert. There's life with a bad Leaving Cert. There's life with no Leaving Cert.

I was 10 points short of the course I wanted and was disappointed at the time but I still got a degree somewhere else and have been in employment since I graduated.

You just have to get on with it and decide your next move.

PhlegmyMoses · 14-08-2013 03:05PM

I got 500 points in mine and did a degree I ****ing hated and now work in a job that my LC and college degree had no bearing on me getting. I'm paid well enough (50% increase in the last year due to promotion) with good prospects for the future and it's a good job but I didn't need to put down my LC results to get it.

My girlfriend got substantially fewer points than me, dropped out of college after first year, got in at ground level in a job she grew to enjoy and now earns 50% more than me and is starting a degree relevant to her job this year.

The LC isn't for everyone and not everyone learns that way. Even those that do well may choose the wrong college degree or just not excel once they get it. At 18/19 or whatever, your life's not mapped out, especially in Ireland. Find what you enjoy and stick with it.

Canyon86 · 14-08-2013 03:21PM

A bit of advice for anybody looking at doing courses be it in uni or whatever,

Pick something that YOU are interested in,don t be a sheep and follow your buddies, trust me,

Anybody interested in I.T and Business have a seriously open field of opportunites available to them if they get courses done!,

I m in I,T at the mo and I have been called three times about other I.T roles,

Cee-Jay-Cee · 14-08-2013 03:23PM

It could be worse, you could be dead.

dizzywizlw · 14-08-2013 03:24PM

Do what you love, tell anyone who thinks different to do one. The system is pointless and you should treat it as such.

jimgoose · 14-08-2013 03:28PM

In the immortal words of Mr. Dave Chambers: This is what they never tell you in Secondary School - when you reach the age of 23, you become what's known as a Mature Student. You can apply for whatever college course you want, and the Leaving Cert. points mean fuck-all!

Best of luck, kids.

Words of comfort for those who failed

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