Do you support the Dublin Bus workers?

RayM · 05-08-2013 01:38PM

I support them in principle, but I think an all-out strike is a huge mistake. Instead, they should agree to drive the buses, but refuse to take fares from passengers. That way, they win the PR war. It would be up to the company to decide whether to suspend services and cause huge inconvenience to the public.

homerjay2005 · 05-08-2013 01:38PM

Boombastic wrote: »

Anyone got any figures of how much they are on?

report is above, total staff costs are working out at around 54k per drivers, which includes things like pension and psri that they dont see.

id expect that average salary is around 49k which is insane money for driving a bus.

mikemac1 · 05-08-2013 01:43PM

Sometimes when I'm downstairs people watching on the 40 there will be times of the day when there more people with DSP passes then fare payers getting on.

No wonder Dublin Bus are losing money if a large amount of their customers are not paying fares.

But that's for ministers like Joan Burton to sort out.

Dublin bus management and unions can't fix that

Sunnyisland · 05-08-2013 01:44PM

homerjay2005 wrote: »

report is above, total staff costs are working out at around 54k per drivers, which includes things like pension and psri that they dont see.

id expect that average salary is around 49k which is insane money for driving a bus.

From the link above, its not just drivers who have voted for this action,

maintenance and clerical staff. On average a member of the maintenance crew would earn nearly 28,000 a year, before tax.

DylanII · 05-08-2013 01:44PM

homerjay2005 wrote: »

report is above, total staff costs are working out at around 54k per drivers, which includes things like pension and psri that they dont see.

id expect that average salary is around 49k which is insane money for driving a bus.

Thats an average of €54k per employee at Dublin Bus. Including the management and all other staff not just drivers. I would say the drivers pay is a lot lower than that.

Boombastic · 05-08-2013 01:44PM

homerjay2005 wrote: »

report is above, total staff costs are working out at around 54k per drivers, which includes things like pension and psri that they dont see.

id expect that average salary is around 49k which is insane money for driving a bus.

Yep. Far too much. I'm surprised they aren't looking at more cuts . From rte....

The measures involve pay-cuts for executive and management grades, longer working-hours and cuts in annual leave for clerical staff and management.
There is no cut to core pay for drivers, but there are reductions to overtime rates, premium payments and changes to rosters, in particular to accommodate new summer timetables.
http://www.rte.ie/news/2013/0804/466289-dublin-bus-strike/

foxy06 · 05-08-2013 01:45PM

homerjay2005 wrote: »

report is above, total staff costs are working out at around 54k per drivers, which includes things like pension and psri that they dont see.

id expect that average salary is around 49k which is insane money for driving a bus.

I think you would suspect wrong

MurdyWurdy · 05-08-2013 01:48PM

becost wrote: »

Why is that? It's definitely an Irish thing like clapping when the plane lands.

No, it's not just an Irish thing - people in NZ shout "thanks driver" as they get off the bus all the time. Always amused me. Why on boards do loads of posters think common things are only done in Ireland? It's so insular

Jarrod · 05-08-2013 01:56PM

''Typical Irish, just bend over and take it from the government, someone should stand up to them, we're such a spineless bunch. Wait what, I can't get the bus tomorrow? Greedy feckers, sure everybody has to take a cut.''

There's a bit of a 'stand up to the government as long as it doesn't affect me' attitude among a lot of people out there. I usually get the bus to and from work and will have to make other arrangements now but I fully support the workers.

April O Neill · 05-08-2013 02:04PM

MurdyWurdy wrote: »

No, it's not just an Irish thing - people in NZ shout "thanks driver" as they get off the bus all the time. Always amused me. Why on boards do loads of posters think common things are only done in Ireland? It's so insular

Oh my gawd, THANK YOU!

The "Only in Ireland" guff not only comes off as self-flagellating, but also navel-gazing and strangely self-regarding.

homerjay2005 · 05-08-2013 02:08PM

Jarrod wrote: »

but I fully support the workers.

can you outline why you support them please?

homerjay2005 · 05-08-2013 02:10PM

foxy06 wrote: »

I think you would suspect wrong

go on.......where is the money being paid so? its all going to management i suppose?

if as above, other staff are on 28k, then it balances out - there are 3,000 drivers and each of them on average would be around 49k. some higher, some lower, but we can only talk about what we know.

DrumSteve · 05-08-2013 02:13PM

homerjay2005 wrote: »

here is the financial report for their last figures, total pay related costs are €181million a year - each member of staff costs over €54,000 for the company, which is just astounding for driving buses.

http://www.dublinbus.ie/PageFiles/2430/Dublin%20Bus%20AR%202011.pdf

as to how anybody can support them, especially people who need the service, ill never know.
how you going to get to work by the way?

So because they have inconvenienced me I should automatically be against them? Do you really think all drivers are on that wage?

They have to take a stand to prevent further erosion of their wages. I support that,granted an all put strike is a pain, but they are right to look out for themselves. No one else will.

Conmaicne Mara · 05-08-2013 02:16PM

No, I don't support them.

05-08-2013 02:16PM

I know someone on strike. He's not a driver.

47 years on the job, raised a family of four on a ~€30,000 salary. And now just as he's getting prepared for retirement he has to face these cuts.

Whether you agree with the cuts or not, surely a man has the right to strike?

My opinion: people saying the DB workers are greedy aren't actually concerned with the cuts, they're just put out that their bus didn't show up. If it was the cuts that were the issue, people would be talking about the cuts, but they're not, they're only talking about the cuts in relation to whether or not they think it was justified that their bus wasn't running.

Stereomaniac · 05-08-2013 02:24PM

I don't support them.

veryangryman · 05-08-2013 02:27PM

true-or-false wrote: »

I know someone on strike. He's not a driver.

47 years on the job, raised a family of four on a ~€30,000 salary. And now just as he's getting prepared for retirement he has to face these cuts.

Whether you agree with the cuts or not, surely a man has the right to strike?

My opinion: people saying the DB workers are greedy aren't actually concerned with the cuts, they're just put out that their bus didn't show up. If it was the cuts that were the issue, people would be talking about the cuts, but they're not, they're only talking about the cuts in relation to whether or not they think it was justified that their bus wasn't running.

On that salary and circumstances I have to say he was a fool not to seek employment elsewhere. I know I would have.

super_furry · 05-08-2013 02:28PM

Terrible poll options - they're either struggling freedom fighters battling an oppressive regime or they're greedy money grubbing scum who should all be fired and locked up.

The truth as always is much more nuanced than that.

Jarrod · 05-08-2013 02:33PM

homerjay2005 wrote: »

can you outline why you support them please?

Because I think that striking is justified given the circumstances. Dublin Bus workers took a pay cut in 2009 or 2010 if I'm not mistaken and if they feel that these new measures are a bridge too far then I think that they're right to go on strike.

Dyr · 05-08-2013 02:33PM

If I was the dublin bus workers I wouldnt give a f**k about what joe public thinks because joe public in Ireland generally doesnt give a flying f**k about anyone but himself.

ixoy · 05-08-2013 02:43PM

Ridiculous options. How about an option like:

"I understand the workers are annoyed but a strike is not the right way to solve the issues"

Anyway, no they don't get my support because their core pay is not being affected. So either workers are on significant amounts of overtime (which should not be allowed by anyone managing competently) or there's other things going on here that nobody is explaining.

It'll be interesting to measure any support here against support on Friday when some people will have shelved out a hundred euro of their own money in taxi fares to get into their own struggling businesses on salaries that have been hit far more heavily.

Almaviva · 05-08-2013 02:44PM

There is no such thing as a legitimate strike in Ireland these days.
The era of exploitation of poorly educated workers unprotected from abuses of contracts, working conditions, and health and safety is long gone.

Any strike will only be by those who have either lost touch with reality and are living in the past, or those who havent but are happy to armwrestle the best deal they can whether it is a fair deal or not.

Hang in there Dublin Bus and Leo. Just let them out there for however long it takes them to come to their sense and come back to work for the labour court recommendation as it is. They will still be on a deal that is too good for what they do.

mikemac1 · 05-08-2013 02:45PM

Happy taxi drivers on the streets of Dublin?

Never thought I'd see the day :pac:

Almaviva · 05-08-2013 02:46PM

Jarrod wrote: »

Because I think that striking is justified given the circumstances. Dublin Bus workers took a pay cut in 2009 or 2010 if I'm not mistaken and if they feel that these new measures are a bridge too far then I think that they're right to go on strike.

What if their feeling is wrong, and another pay cut is justified ?

mikemac1 · 05-08-2013 02:47PM

Almaviva wrote: »

There is no such thing as a legitimate strike in Ireland these days.
The era of exploitation of poorly educated workers unprotected from abuses of contracts, working conditions, and health and safety is long gone.

You haven't worked in Irish hotels in the last several years

Speak up and you won't be fired. They'll just cut your hours to one or two shifts per week and the new hire gets your hours. You can't live on that money and so you leave.

Remember that you were not fired.

MadsL · 05-08-2013 02:48PM

mikemac1 wrote: »

No wonder Dublin Bus are losing money if a large amount of their customers are not paying fares.

I wasn't aware that a public transport service was designed to make money.

hatrickpatrick · 05-08-2013 02:51PM

The company and the government are to blame jointly.
As someone over in the transport forum said, Dublin Bus have a monopoly in the capital city of Ireland for bus services. How they could be so unpopular and make such massive losses under those circumstances is mind boggling.

Almaviva · 05-08-2013 02:53PM

hatrickpatrick wrote: »

The company and the government are to blame jointly.
As someone over in the transport forum said, Dublin Bus have a monopoly in the capital city of Ireland for bus services. How they could be so unpopular and make such massive losses under those circumstances is mind boggling.

Costs are too high.

Jarrod · 05-08-2013 02:57PM

Almaviva wrote: »

What if their feeling is wrong, and another pay cut is justified ?

I said that if they feel these cuts are too much then they're right to strike. How could that feeling be wrong? I'm not being a smart ass by the way, I just honestly don't know how to answer your question.

HurtLocker · 05-08-2013 02:58PM

It'll be interesting who can last longer. A company with no money to give or the bus drivers with mortgages. I'm putting my money on DB.

Do you support the Dublin Bus workers?

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