Does anyone feel insulted by the abortion proposals?

iwantmydinner · 31-07-2013 08:07PM

Galwayguy35 wrote: »

Yeah but it seems some people want abortion on demand like next door.

It doesn't seem that way, it is that way.

Anyone should be able to end a pregnancy they are not prepared to carry to term, no matter the circumstance of conception.

I have always believed that, nothing will change my mind.

Galwayguy35 · 31-07-2013 08:08PM

lazygal wrote: »

Do you mean abortion on request? Savita requested an abortion.

If abortion on request wasn't available 'next door', what would happen to women in Ireland who wished to have abortions?

I suppose we just have different views on it, I won't change mine and neither will you.

Galwayguy35 · 31-07-2013 08:09PM

iwantmydinner wrote: »

It doesn't seem that way, it is that way.

Anyone should be able to end a pregnancy they are not prepared to carry to term, no matter the circumstance of conception.

I have always believed that, nothing will change my mind.

I'm not asking you or anyone to change their mind.

iwantmydinner · 31-07-2013 08:10PM

But are you seeking to impose your views on others who hold a different view?

Because I'm not.

lazygal · 31-07-2013 08:11PM

Galwayguy35 wrote: »

I suppose we just have different views on it, I won't change mine and neither will you.

But that doesn't answer my question.

If we didn't have the option of 'next door' taking care of abortion services, what would women in Ireland do with crisis pregnancies?

Aineoil · 31-07-2013 08:11PM

iwantmydinner wrote: »

It doesn't seem that way, it is that way.

Anyone should be able to end a pregnancy they are not prepared to carry to term, no matter the circumstance of conception.

I have always believed that, nothing will change my mind.

I agree

Galwayguy35 · 31-07-2013 08:13PM

iwantmydinner wrote: »

But are you seeking to impose your views on others who hold a different view?

Because I'm not.

No I'm not, I wouldn't agree with it which is just my opinion, thats not imposing anything on anyone.

Galwayguy35 · 31-07-2013 08:15PM

lazygal wrote: »

But that doesn't answer my question.

If we didn't have the option of 'next door' taking care of abortion services, what would women in Ireland do with crisis pregnancies?

It's a mood point because the option is there for them.

lazygal · 31-07-2013 08:16PM

Galwayguy35 wrote: »

No I'm not, I wouldn't agree with it which is just my opinion, thats not imposing anything on anyone.

If there was a vote on introducing abortion services similar to those available 'next door', would you vote in favour of it or against it? Voting against such a regime would indeed impose your opinion on others, but voting in favour of it wouldn't, as it would still be up to women to choose what was right for them rather than having to endure traveling 'next door'.

iwantmydinner · 31-07-2013 08:16PM

Galwayguy35 wrote: »

No I'm not, I wouldn't agree with it which is just my opinion, thats not imposing anything on anyone.

That's why I asked a question, rather than make an assumption.

I completely understand why a person would be against abortion - I just don't understand why they would campaign to make sure no one else could avail of one.

lazygal · 31-07-2013 08:17PM

Galwayguy35 wrote: »

It's a mood point because the option is there for them.

I would like you to tell me what you think would happen to women in Ireland with crisis pregnancies if 'next door' wasn't an option. Suppose Britain refused abortion service to those not resident there, and women in Ireland would no longer be able to avail of those services, what would they do?

Morag · 31-07-2013 08:17PM

Galwayguy35 wrote: »

It's a mood point because the option is there for them.

And what of those who can not travel to not having the money, the time off work, someone to mind the kids or being able to get travel papers or who are too ill?

Galwayguy35 · 31-07-2013 08:20PM

lazygal wrote: »

If there was a vote on introducing abortion services similar to those available 'next door', would you vote in favour of it or against it? Voting against such a regime would indeed impose your opinion on others, but voting in favour of it wouldn't, as it would still be up to women to choose what was right for them rather than having to endure traveling 'next door'.

I'd vote against it because to me if done for non medical reasons its killing a baby, I realise thats not a popular view around here but so be it.

Galwayguy35 · 31-07-2013 08:21PM

lazygal wrote: »

I would like you to tell me what you think would happen to women in Ireland with crisis pregnancies if 'next door' wasn't an option. Suppose Britain refused abortion service to those not resident there, and women in Ireland would no longer be able to avail of those services, what would they do?

No idea.

lazygal · 31-07-2013 08:25PM

Galwayguy35 wrote: »

No idea.

Really? You've no idea what women who can't access abortion services, despite wanting to, might do? You don't think back street abortions might be sought, or home abortions with who knows what implements, or dodgy doctors selling procedures might be on the go? Women with pregnancies that won't survive past birth having to remain pregnant, you don't think they might suffer?

Shocking lack of empathy there.

lazygal · 31-07-2013 08:26PM

Galwayguy35 wrote: »

I'd vote against it because to me if done for non medical reasons its killing a baby, I realise thats not a popular view around here but so be it.

So you would impose your opinion on others.

FYI, its not killing a baby, its terminating a pregnancy.

iwantmydinner · 31-07-2013 08:26PM

Galwayguy35 wrote: »

No idea.

Do you not think it deserves a little thought?

Aineoil · 31-07-2013 08:29PM

Galwayguy35 wrote: »

I'd vote against it because to me if done for non medical reasons its killing a baby, I realise thats not a popular view around here but so be it.

Fair enough, you are entitled to your view. My husband told me this was the response I would get.

Galwayguy35 · 31-07-2013 08:30PM

lazygal wrote: »

So you would impose your opinion on others.

FYI, its not killing a baby, its terminating a pregnancy.

Yeah and you would vote for it so thats you imposing your view on people who are against abortion.

Thats how demoracy works, if it was voted in then we would have to accept it.

Galwayguy35 · 31-07-2013 08:31PM

lazygal wrote: »

So you would impose your opinion on others.

FYI, its not killing a baby, its terminating a pregnancy.

No its a personal opinion, its not going to stop anyone getting an abortion now is it?

lazygal · 31-07-2013 08:33PM

Galwayguy35 wrote: »

Yeah and you would vote for it so thats you imposing your view on people who are against abortion.

Thats how demoracy works, if it was voted in then we would have to accept it.

If you're against abortion, you don't have one. If someone is against divorce, should they be allowed to deny someone else the ability to get a divorce? Voting in favour of abortion doesn't impose anything on anyone. People who don't want one never, ever have to have one. But you're happy to deny all women the option, because they can get it 'next door' (which makes it sound easy peasy to avail of and isn't a reason for not offering a standard medical procedure here), which is imposing your views on everyone, whether they agree with you.

eviltwin · 31-07-2013 08:34PM

Galwayguy35 wrote: »

No idea.

In other words don't know, don't care. Not your problem right?

Galwayguy35 · 31-07-2013 08:36PM

lazygal wrote: »

If you're against abortion, you don't have one. If someone is against divorce, should they be allowed to deny someone else the ability to get a divorce? Voting in favour of abortion doesn't impose anything on anyone. People who don't want one never, ever have to have one. But you're happy to deny all women the option, because they can get it 'next door' (which makes it sound easy peasy to avail of and isn't a reason for not offering a standard medical procedure here), which is imposing your views on everyone, whether they agree with you.

So you think if there was a vote I should go against my conscience and vote for something I don't believe in?

Aineoil · 31-07-2013 08:37PM

This is an emotive issue, no doubt.

I think a woman should have control over her own body.

lazygal · 31-07-2013 08:39PM

Galwayguy35 wrote: »

So you think if there was a vote I should go against my conscience and vote for something I don't believe in?

It's not about believing in it, its not the Tooth Fairy or God. Its about allowing women to access medical treatment. You, going by your user name, are male. You'll never need an abortion. Women in Ireland do. What do you think women with crisis pregnancies in Ireland should do? Go 'next door'? Again, what if 'next door' isn't an option because you don't have the money or means to travel, or can't get time off work, or you're too ill to go next door? There's loads of things I'd never do or avail of or buy, but it doesn't mean I don't think those who want those things should be able to access them.

eviltwin · 31-07-2013 08:40PM

Galwayguy35 wrote: »

So you think if there was a vote I should go against my conscience and vote for something I don't believe in?

I think sometimes that is the right decision, sometimes we have to accept the greater good of society is more important that what we would personally choose or want for ourselves.

Galwayguy35 · 31-07-2013 08:41PM

eviltwin wrote: »

In other words don't know, don't care. Not your problem right?

You don't know me or what I care about so theres no need tocome on here thinking you can read my mind just because I have a different opinion.

Politeness costs nothing.

I said i had no idea because I don't know the answer, not because i don't care.

Galwayguy35 · 31-07-2013 08:43PM

lazygal wrote: »

It's not about believing in it, its not the Tooth Fairy or God. Its about allowing women to access medical treatment. You, going by your user name, are male. You'll never need an abortion. Women in Ireland do. What do you think women with crisis pregnancies in Ireland should do? Go 'next door'? Again, what if 'next door' isn't an option because you don't have the money or means to travel, or can't get time off work, or you're too ill to go next door? There's loads of things I'd never do or avail of or buy, but it doesn't mean I don't think those who want those things should be able to access them.

So because I'm male unless I'm pro choice i should just shut up and say nothing is it?

lazygal · 31-07-2013 08:46PM

Galwayguy35 wrote: »

So because I'm male unless I'm pro choice i should just shut up and say nothing is it?

No, I'm saying that I don't understand why you want to deny all women in Ireland the right to access abortion. You said you have 'no idea' what women in Ireland with crisis pregnancies would do if they couldn't go 'next door'. Have you thought about that at all? What would your partner, or sister, or mother, or friend, or cousin, or colleague do if she had a crisis pregnancy and couldn't go next door?

It's not about 'believing in' something, its about why you think no one should be able to avail of something because you don't think its right.

eviltwin · 31-07-2013 08:47PM

Galwayguy35 wrote: »

You don't know me or what I care about so theres no need tocome on here thinking you can read my mind just because I have a different opinion.

Politeness costs nothing.

I said i had no idea because I don't know the answer, not because i don't care.

Maybe then you should follow through on that thought process, we're talking about a health care issue here, if women don't have access to abortion that doesn't translate into no abortions, sure some go to the uk cause its so easy to just find that kind of cash to take an unexpected trip not to mention the cost of the actual termination but what about the ones who can't? What about the women who import pills and take them without medical supervision putting their health at risk? What about the ones who look up dodgy websites telling them how to induce an abortion themselves? What about those who pay money to people who do abortions on a kitchen table? Maybe its worth thinking about the natural conclusion of preventing access to abortion.

Does anyone feel insulted by the abortion proposals?

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