Would you support the reintroduction of the death penalty?

returnNull · 10-07-2013 09:50AM

I just think there is something inherently wrong with a state that executes its citizens.

Hitchens · 10-07-2013 01:40PM

TWO elderly brothers have been brutally beaten to death in their home.

The pensioners were attacked in their house during a botched burglary.

The bodies of the men, aged 69 and 76, were discovered in Castlebar, Co Mayo, at 7am today.

let us catch the people who did this and................rehabilitate them!

Jumboman · 10-07-2013 02:07PM

Princess Consuela Bananahammock wrote: »

And what is a human right for a start? Does the phrase "Human Right" have any value whatsoever if we can just take them away at will?

Somebody who commits an horrific crime should forfeit their human rights.

Do you really believe that someone like Harold Shipman or Anders Breivik
deserve human rights ?

osarusan · 10-07-2013 02:11PM

Jumboman wrote: »

Do you really believe that someone like Harold Shipman or Anders Breivik
deserve human rights ?

I do.

shane9689 · 10-07-2013 02:30PM

looking_around wrote: »

And what about those who are innocent? There have been many cases where everything proved they were guilty only for years later to be found innocent.
At least if they're alive, they can get some thing of their life back.

Also death penalty mostly punishes family of the criminal. Death is merely and end,.. not a punishment. They should be worked, and hard.

spot on...work em hard, death is too easy and if theyre eventually found innocent then we can still release them.

a dead man aint no good to anybody

Princess Consuela Bananahammock · 10-07-2013 02:57PM

Jumboman wrote: »

Somebody who commits an horrific crime should forfeit their human rights.

Do you really believe that someone like Harold Shipman or Anders Breivik
deserve human rights ?

This is the problem I've had with this element of the discussion: everyone just asks a question, "should certain people have human rights?", which doesn't answer anything: what is a human right, and should a government have the ability to take away a human right?

For the record:
Harold Shipman took his own life - how is giving him the death penalty any use? If you wnt him to suffer, you've failed - you're just giving him what he wants.

The Norwegians believe that Breivik SHOULD have human rights - what does this say about Norwegians?

Sir Humphrey Appleby · 10-07-2013 03:21PM

Jumboman wrote: »

I mean you will have do gooders calling for total scumbags such as child killers to be released in the name of "human rights".

We have already had a ruling from the european court of human rights which says locking someone up for life is in breach of their human rights.

Actually that is untrue. At present there are 37 prisoners in UK jails , the latest being Mark Bridger, who are serving whole of life sentences.
We have people in Ireland who have served well over 30 years and still have no prospect of release from prison.

JillyQ · 10-07-2013 04:02PM

We have people in Ireland who have served well over 30 years and still have no prospect of release from prison.[/QUOTE]

How many? i bet it is single digits

SkyBlooo · 10-07-2013 04:40PM

Yes and no.

Sometimes it is very hard to draw the line, but of course for crimes like rape it goes without saying.

Sir Humphrey Appleby · 10-07-2013 04:43PM

JillyQ wrote: »

We have people in Ireland who have served well over 30 years and still have no prospect of release from prison.

How many? i bet it is single digits[/QUOTE]

Based on our population single digits would be quite high anyway, as these people would be in prison since at least before 1983.
I can think of several, most notably John Shaw who is in his 37th year of a life sentence.

Amirani · 10-07-2013 04:49PM

SkyBlooo wrote: »

Yes and no.

Sometimes it is very hard to draw the line, but of course for crimes like rape it goes without saying.

I don't see why people include rape in here. Murder is absolutely a worse crime than rape. If you're taking the eye-for-an-eye mentality, then the death penalty is overkill for rape.

SkyBlooo · 10-07-2013 04:52PM

NiallSparky wrote: »

I don't see why people include rape in here. Murder is absolutely a worse crime than rape. If you're taking the eye-for-an-eye mentality, then the death penalty is overkill for rape.

I did not rank rape over any other crime.
I used rape as an example as murder can be self-defense.

Amirani · 10-07-2013 04:54PM

SkyBlooo wrote: »

I did not rank rape over any other crime.
I used rape as an example as murder can be self-defense.

Murder, by definition, can't be self-defense.

10-07-2013 04:54PM

SkyBlooo wrote: »

I did not rank rape over any other crime.
I used rape as an example as murder can be self-defense.

A killing in self defence isn't murder. At the most it's manslaughter.

Death penalty for rape will result in a lot of dead rape victims. Why leave a witness alive if the punishment is the same for rape as for murder?

Hitchens · 10-07-2013 04:55PM

Princess Consuela Bananahammock wrote: »

should a government have the ability to take away a human right?

but it wouldn't be the government in Ireland's case, it would be the people

Amirani · 10-07-2013 04:59PM

Candie wrote: »

Death penalty for rape will result in a lot of dead rape victims. Why leave a witness alive if the punishment is the same for rape as for murder?

Great point.

SkyBlooo · 10-07-2013 05:00PM

NiallSparky wrote: »

Murder, by definition, can't be self-defense.

Yep, was actually going to edit my previous post but the oul' UPC went down.

Leaving rape, murder and possibly even man-slaughter aside.
What else 'should' receive the death penalty? (If anything at all)

Amirani · 10-07-2013 05:06PM

SkyBlooo wrote: »

Yep, was actually going to edit my previous post but the oul' UPC went down.

Leaving rape, murder and possibly even man-slaughter aside.
What else 'should' receive the death penalty? (If anything at all)

Nothing in my opinion, including the above. Capital punishment is inhumane, and a negative reflection on the nations that engage in it. It's no coincidence that all the big basket-case countries around the World are happy to murder their citizens.

I'm all for incarcerating criminals if they pose a significant threat to society, for however long that may be (including the remainder of their natural lives). Killing them is sinking to their level.

end of the road · 10-07-2013 05:17PM

Hitchens wrote: »

but it wouldn't be the government in Ireland's case, it would be the people

who about 11 12 years ago got their say and voted to abolish it

SkyBlooo · 10-07-2013 05:57PM

NiallSparky wrote: »

Nothing in my opinion, including the above. Capital punishment is inhumane, and a negative reflection on the nations that engage in it. It's no coincidence that all the big basket-case countries around the World are happy to murder their citizens.

I'm all for incarcerating criminals if they pose a significant threat to society, for however long that may be (including the remainder of their natural lives). Killing them is sinking to their level.

Very fair point.

I do wonder though, if one of the above ever happened to you or a loved one would you feel the same way? (Unfortunately, it did for me I'll spare the details)

Would you sleep easy, knowing that person was laughing in a cushy prison with their feet up playing an Xbox? (This isn't directed at just you)

end of the road · 10-07-2013 06:14PM

SkyBlooo wrote: »

I do wonder though, if one of the above ever happened to you or a loved one would you feel the same way?

yes, i don't agree with it and i can't see anything changing that.

SkyBlooo wrote: »

Would you sleep easy, knowing that person was laughing in a cushy prison with their feet up playing an Xbox?

a lot easier then i would if i found out years later the man executed for doing that to my loved one was infact innocent of the crime

SkyBlooo · 10-07-2013 06:17PM

end of the road wrote: »

yes, i don't agree with it and i can't see anything changing that.

a lot easier then i would if i found out years later the man executed for doing that to my loved one was infact innocent of the crime

I seriously, seriously doubt that. This is where we agree to disagree.
Them possibly being innocent later on down the line is a strange angle to throw in as well.

end of the road · 10-07-2013 06:29PM

SkyBlooo wrote: »

I seriously, seriously doubt that.

good for you, i seriously seriously don't doubt that,, as i know me and you don't, i know how i feel about things and you don't know how i feel about things

SkyBlooo wrote: »

This is where we agree to disagree.

about what? you asked would one feel the same way if something happened to them or someone they know and i bothered to answer it with no as i don't agree with the death penalty and i'd know how i feel about things

SkyBlooo wrote: »

Them possibly being innocent later on down the line is a strange angle to throw in as well.

no it isn't, i'd rather that the person who did whatever to the person i know to be sitting in a prison for life playing an x box then finding out later on that the person was innocent and executed, very easy to get if one wants to, better to have someone in prison playing an x box rather then risking executing someone innocent, no technology is fool proof and never will be.

Amirani · 10-07-2013 07:01PM

SkyBlooo wrote: »

Very fair point.

I do wonder though, if one of the above ever happened to you or a loved one would you feel the same way? (Unfortunately, it did for me I'll spare the details)

Would you sleep easy, knowing that person was laughing in a cushy prison with their feet up playing an Xbox? (This isn't directed at just you)

It's difficult for me to say having not experienced such a situation, and I certainly sympathise with you for having to go through such an ordeal.

What I will say is that it's never really a good idea having those who are most emotionally involved deciding the punishment. People make uncharacteristic and illogical decisions when they or people they love have been harmed.

SkyBlooo · 10-07-2013 07:01PM

end of the road wrote: »

good for you, i seriously seriously don't doubt that,, as i know me and you don't, i know how i feel about things and you don't know how i feel about things

about what? you asked would one feel the same way if something happened to them or someone they know and i bothered to answer it with no as i don't agree with the death penalty and i'd know how i feel about things

no it isn't, i'd rather that the person who did whatever to the person i know to be sitting in a prison for life playing an x box then finding out later on that the person was innocent and executed, very easy to get if one wants to, better to have someone in prison playing an x box rather then risking executing someone innocent, no technology is fool proof and never will be.

Are you even reading my posts?
We have different opinions: "Let's agree to disagree" How is that hard to understand?

Let's say Mr Doe is in love with Mrs Doe.

Mrs Doe unfortunately gets raped and god almighty, both of them go on one of the most difficult and challenging roller-coasters of their lives. Now of course, it wasn't her fault but what happened to her alone, has latched onto Mr Doe's life like a cancer which is eating them up individually and as a couple. Now throw some sexual issues, trust issues, sleep issues on top of lots of expensive psychotherapy/counselling.

Now Mr Doe done nothing, but be supportive and loving for Mrs Doe.
Of course he did, he loved her and she loved him.

Unfortunately Mrs Doe thought the only thing that would ever stop the pain, was to take her own life. Now that's a whole different sob story there.

Now as for the rapist, he was guilty and he was charged and when he's out again he'll be in his mid-thirties like a free bird.

The sun could burn out tomorrow, that's hypothetical like the accused being innocent (which I'm aware has happened) which is why I think that point is irrelevant.

As the old saying goes:
to walk a mile in another man's shoes.

Princess Consuela Bananahammock · 10-07-2013 07:11PM

Hitchens wrote: »

but it wouldn't be the government in Ireland's case, it would be the people

Hmmm... I remember you as the guy that didn't know what 'deterrent' meant and then proceeded to troll me in order to hide this. Now it appears you're advocating anarchy...?

Pumpkinseeds · 10-07-2013 07:16PM

I would be in favour of keeping people in prison for life, literally until the coroner removed them in a bodybag. I wouldn't support the death penalty. I also think that all prisoners should be put to work in prison. Preferably 8 or 12 hour shifts.

Jumboman · 03-08-2013 08:52PM

I've a question for people who support human rights for scumbags,

If a member of your family was brutally raped and murdered by a savage criminal would you really care about their human rights or would you want justice ?

FGR · 03-08-2013 09:02PM

What should be brought back? Serving your actual sentence, without automatic remission/menus for meals/video games and tv and the re-introduction of hard labour as part of your punishment, too.

Norwesterner · 03-08-2013 09:07PM

FGR wrote: »

What should be brought back? Serving your actual sentence, without automatic remission/menus for meals/video games and tv and the re-introduction of hard labour as part of your punishment, too.

In some Latin American countries (leftist ironically), the families of the prisoners are responsible for bring food for the prisoner.
The State don't feed them.
People bring fruit, veg, meat etc during the visits.

Would you support the reintroduction of the death penalty?

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