Planning permission c2 & c3 never issued.

khards · 08-07-2013 03:44PM #1

hi,

We have been looking at a house built around 2001 which initially had planning refused.
A second application was subsequently made 2 weeks later. When looking online at the planning it has not been refused, HOWEVER there is no C2 or C3 commencement forms on the online planning portal.

Does this mans that the house is built without planning. Could the planning permission have been left in limbo for over 10 years?

sinnerboy · 08-07-2013 06:13PM

khards wrote: »

HOWEVER there is no C2 or C3 commencement forms on the online planning portal.

Sorry to answer a question with a question but what are these forms - as you understand it.

Commencement notices are a function of Building Control law and separate to planning.

khards · 08-07-2013 09:25PM

Looking through all the planning applications I can find online through the Galway online planning system shows that a commencement norice has been issued and is subsequently available to view online. Generally there are three forms available to view, a C2 commencement form, a planners report and a C3 commencement form.
The property that is for sale has none of these forms showing - it looks like the vendor submitted the forms and it got stuck in limbo. Could it be that the planning was granted and forms were issued, but tyey never got put into the online system?

Mellor · 09-07-2013 04:12AM

khards wrote: »

Looking through all the planning applications I can find online through the Galway online planning system shows that a commencement norice has been issued and is subsequently available to view online. Generally there are three forms available to view, a C2 commencement form, a planners report and a C3 commencement form.
The property that is for sale has none of these forms showing - it looks like the vendor submitted the forms and it got stuck in limbo. Could it be that the planning was granted and forms were issued, but tyey never got put into the online system?

Planning is granted before commencement notices are lodged. Soudns liek that are attached to the planning application online as a curtsey, but if the coucil never attached them, it doesn't affect the outcome of the application. The online portal is simply a copy of the decision that was made at the time, not the actually definitive decision.

If the owner never submitted commencement notices, thats a building control issue, and won't affect the actual planning decision.

There should be a document attached that contains the councils decision, ie the grant of premission. Failing that, there should be a details of the outcome of the application at the top with the other details. Where it normally says pending, refused, granted etc.

A link to the application might help.

sinnerboy · 09-07-2013 11:50AM

khards wrote: »

Looking through all the planning applications I can find online through the Galway online planning system ...Generally there are three forms available to view, a C2 commencement form, a planners report and a C3 commencement form.

I had a quick look. I am not used to the GCC site , I live in the East . These C2 + C3 forms are respectively the Decision to Grant (C2) and Grant of Permission (C3) . The Decision follows usually at the end of 8 weeks and there then usually follows a 4 week period for appeals. If no appeals then the Grant follows. In this case GCC are using the letter C to abbreviate for conditions of permissions , not commencement at all.

Having established that it seems odd that you have found a property which has been granted permission without all information available to view online.

So if interested you need to investigate further offline.

khards · 09-07-2013 12:08PM

Thanks for the reply, that has been really helpful.

It does seem that the following are missing:
Planners report
Decision to Grant
Grant of Permission

A link to the planning docs is located here:

http://www.galway.ie/ViewPlanningDocuments/ReposITPlanningDocs.aspx?RefNo=003991

If you look at the map level you can see that planning was refused about a month earlier and complaints were received.
The second application (linked above) it looks like they have tried to follow the planners recommendations from the refused permission.

Even then in the plans you will see that the drawings are for a house with a thatched roof, but the house was not built with one. I am not sure how this would affect compliance.

sinnerboy · 09-07-2013 12:29PM

Assume the worst , hope for the best but hire an architect or architectural technician now to have a look if you really want this one.

khards · 09-07-2013 12:39PM

Thanks, if my offer is accepted then I will get a full survey carried out as I never trust one off developments.

If the auctioneer gets back to us or the offer is accepted I will ask to see a copy of the Certificate of Compliance before proceeding as I don't want to shell out a lot of money to find that the house is not compilant or there really are issues wit hthe planning permission.

I believe that the seller should have a 'Certificate of Compliance' before attempting to sell the property.

sinnerboy · 09-07-2013 01:40PM

Before you commit any funds at all seek first

1. BER Cert
2. Opinion on Compliance - Planning
3. Opinion on Compliance - Building Control

Do not part with a penny until you get these.

Planning permission c2 & c3 never issued.

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